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What class(es) would you like to see more material for?


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Back when I played 2nd Edition, some of my favorite sourcebooks were the Complete Handbooks for the various classes. Paizo has done a wonderful job with releasing lots of material for the classes with the APG and the Ultimate books, but I am sure a lot of people would like to see more material for their favorite class to play.

So my question is if class specific books were released, what order would you like to see them released?

Would you like to see a similar book for multi-class characters?

Similar books for the prestige classes?

The Exchange

4 people marked this as a favorite.

I'd buy the Multi-Class character and PrC minibook. It would be worth the money.


I'd like/buy something like Complete Scoundrel for PF.
The book was a gold mine of good ideas and class alternate class features (called Archetypes in PF).


Pathfinder Modules Subscriber

Multiclass. Multiclass multiclass multiclass. Give us archetypes for multiclassing where abilities can synergize. I miss being able to make a same level/same level character, like Ranger 10/Cleric 10. In some ways, I actually preferred how AD&D handled this. I realize that prestige classes were supposed to bridge the gap, but they tend to homogenize such multiclass combinations instead of accentuate them--and they take away most of the base classes' abilities.

Barring that, wizard. They get the short end on archetypes, school powers are decidedly underwhelming, and most of the discoveries are on the "meh" side of the mechanics scale. I understand that all of this keeps them balanced, but it also tends to make them less interesting compared to, say, sorcerers with all of their wonderful bloodlines.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'd like to see more substitutions for class features like Bravery and Trap Sense. Choices of more or less equal power but personalized.


5 people marked this as a favorite.

I want the oracle to have more curses.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Arcane Trickster. I would frankly love to see that class get the Magus treatment, and turn into a 3/4 BAB caster with (decreased)sneak attack progression that caps out at level 6 spells, and gets rogue talents maybe every 3rd or 4th level.

It worked with Eldritch Knight to Magus. How about Arcane Trickster to Daggermage?


Oracle. Cavalier too.

It would suit also suit me just fine if there were no feats or spells in any book for a while.

We could use more items though.


Monk caster combo. 3.5 had Enlightened Fist for combining arcane casting with Monk abilities and Sacred Fist for divine casting and monk abilities.

It was a good combo for PrC's.

THe 3rd Party Psionics book for PF has a Monk/Psionic PrC.

Marathon Voter 2013

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Rite has the Enlightened Scholar on this site which I believe is a monk / caster type.


More alchemist stuff could be nice.


Scott Andrews wrote:

Back when I played 2nd Edition, some of my favorite sourcebooks were the Complete Handbooks for the various classes. Paizo has done a wonderful job with releasing lots of material for the classes with the APG and the Ultimate books, but I am sure a lot of people would like to see more material for their favorite class to play.

So my question is if class specific books were released, what order would you like to see them released?

Would you like to see a similar book for multi-class characters?

Similar books for the prestige classes?

Commoners!

Nah, seriously...I'd probably prefer to see some prestige classes that are nice and well thought out, that focus on stuff you do, rather than various "special" requirements. Niche stuff. Mainly because I've grown very, very dissatisfied with the archtype system.

Scarab Sages

A book dealing with the Rogue and other skill-heavy classes, could focus on new uses for skills, which, IMO, are underdeveloped.

sunbeam wrote:
It would suit also suit me just fine if there were no feats or spells in any book for a while.

Hell yes. Especially spells for classes who get every spell on their list anyway, like clerics, druids, paladins and rangers, as compared to spells for fixed list casters like sorcerers or oracles, who will never end up taking 90% of the list, because of the opportunity cost involved.


I would like to see a more exhaustive set of Generic NPCs stated out than what is in the game mastery guide. A book that really gets into making the NPC classes more important and common than how most campaigns handle it. I mean how often does your average party even come across an adept, expert, or warrior?

The title for this could be the "Complete Hirelings and Follower guide".
Gives better and more in depth about the care, acquisition, and maintenance of minions and cohorts. Maybe have rules for running a stronghold, and how to manage the large numbers of hired help.

Not exactly the most exciting fodder for many people, but I really like idea behind the kingmaker rules, and rules that are reasonably balanced for simulation style gaming might be nice.

Sczarni

I want to see more material for Barbarian's and Ranger's

Silver Crusade Star Voter 2014

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules Subscriber

Monks.

And holy/celestial/BigDamnGood-themed options for all classes.

(as well as chaotic/lawful exemplar options for appropriate classes)


Witches - more spells, and a serious review of what should make their spell list eg. Murderous Command WTF! What a perfect witch spell!
Summoners & Alchemists
Sorcerers - something besides piles and piles of bloodlines

Scarab Sages

pad300 wrote:
Sorcerers - something besides piles and piles of bloodlines

Ooh. Indeed! Bloodlines are cool, but they tend to be all or nothing. You either *are* that Bloodline, or it's utterly irrelevant to your Sorcerer. More options that *any* (or at least many) Sorcerers could benefit from, regardless of Bloodline, would be interesting, such as modular class abilities that replace a bonus feat or something, or the ability to swap out spell slots for extra uses of bloodline abilities (or bloodline abilities for extra spell slots, which might be very nice for a higher level Sorcerer who might have much more use for an extra 1st level spell slot than for a use of elemental ray or claws!).


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

So taking a quick glance at the thread, it seems people want more options for prestige classes and multi-classing, here a break down of post mentions so far:

4 Prestige Class
3 Rogue/Ninja
3 Multi-class
2 Barbarian
2 Bard
2 Monk
2 Sorcerer
2 Alchemist
1 Fighter
1 Ranger
1 Wizard
1 Oracle
1 Summoner
1 Witch
0 Cleric
0 Druid
0 Paladin
0 Cavalier/Samurai
0 Inquisitor
0 Magus
0 Gunslinger


Monk and Magus. Multi-class.

Sczarni

Somebody did mention the cavalier.

I'd add my vote for more Rogue goodness, especially for skill usage. Maybe once they figure out how they're revising Stealth, they could publish it along with some alternative uses for the other common Rogue skills.

And also for multiclassing. There's not enough upside to multiclassing in PF currently, which sometimes seems to make character design a little uncreative.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion Subscriber

I'd like no more class-oriented material. Bloat is bad.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Trinite wrote:

Somebody did mention the cavalier.

Oops, you are correct!


Another Samurai archetype or two would be nice.


I think we have enough spells out there now, I love spell casters, but there is a limit until there is too much. It's subtly taunting spontaneous casters.

Set wrote:
A book dealing with the Rogue and other skill-heavy classes, could focus on new uses for skills, which, IMO, are underdeveloped.

Ultimate Skills is a good title for a book.

pad300 wrote:
Sorcerers - something besides piles and piles of bloodlines.

SGG came out with a book called Beyond Bloodlines, I recommend it.

Gareshra wrote:
Arcane Trickster. I would frankly love to see that class get the Magus treatment, and turn into a 3/4 BAB caster with (decreased)sneak attack progression that caps out at level 6 spells, and gets rogue talents maybe every 3rd or 4th level.

Prestige classes is a 3.5 thing, not Pathfinder, so more archetypes to recreate old favorite prestige classes would be cool. The Shifter from 3.5 would be great for the wild shaping druids.

More oriental themed classes/archetypes would be awesome to develop Tian Xia more.


A better system for Crafting.
Including a system for non spellcasters to be able to craft something other than +x weapon/armor.


What I would like to see is for the Paladin and Cleric to be revisited. This doesn't necessarily mean more material for them, but more of a review of existing material.

For example, the Paladin's Divine Bond, if chosen as a weapon bond, is just terrible. Compare how that ability works to how the Magus's works, or how the sorcerer's bloodline abilities work. More uses, smaller intervals, and not a standard action.

Many Cleric domain abilities are just laughable. They offer nothing besides confusion. Several abilities allow you to touch a creature as a standard action to provide a bonus to them for 1 round... in other words, the cleric can never use this ability to help themself. Why aren't these abilities treated as Lay on Hands--Swift for self, Standard for other?

And then there's channel energy, which releases a burst of energy in a 30' radius. Yet for some reason, you have to choose between healing and harming. If you are releasing a burst of energy, it should simply affect everything in that burst. Also...why does your alignment dictate what type of energy you can channel? Just because you're lawful good doesn't mean that you can't be aware that a destructive force is needed to counter evil...

So revisions to those two would be what I want to see. And if more archetypes are released, I never, EVER want to see another one that trades Divine Grace for the ability to speak Celestial (see Empyreal Knight).

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion Subscriber

Yeah, 'cause PF Paladin and Cleric are weak classes that need any help they can get. /sarcasm


Gorbacz wrote:
Yeah, 'cause PF Paladin and Cleric are weak classes that need any help they can get. /sarcasm

That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. As far as I'm concerned, when a magus stands on equal ground as a paladin versus an evil target and a fireball from a sorcerer takes down more undead than a cleric's channel energy, there's a problem.

The Exchange Marathon Voter 2013, Marathon Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

Cavalier, samurai, witch

More Golarion specific stuff, everything should represent Golarion stuff.


Ashiel wrote:
Nah, seriously...I'd probably prefer to see some prestige classes that are nice and well thought out, that focus on stuff you do, rather than various "special" requirements. Niche stuff. Mainly because I've grown very, very dissatisfied with the archtype system.

I second this. The current archtypes are nice but I really miss prestige classes. They would have to progress some of the nice bonuses though that have been added to classes.

Rogue Prestige class = progress rogue tricks
Cleric Prestige class = Progress channeling and/or domain powers
Sorc prestige class = Progress bloodline
Wizard prestige class = Progress school powers
Barbarian prestige class = Progress Rage powers

ect, ect.

The base classes in Pathfinder are set up to discourage prestige classing, so for you to have a successful Prestige class book you would have to progress some of these nifty abilities they added... not enough to make it a no brainer to prestige (like in 3.5), but enough to make it a situation where you weigh the pro's and cons.

I have seen far to many Prestige classes so far that give up way to much and gain too little in return. Nitch is ok... Gimp is not.


I'd agree that the cleric needs little to no "buffing". Those domain powers are for low level games before he can call out the Wrath of God on every kobold in the land.

Also since those are standard actions, I'd allow them to follow through to the next round. I'm not sure they were meant to be self buffs though. I think clerics are supposed to use them on other characters to show his divine gifts and help to win converts.

It's not like the cleric is lacking for battle buffs. His spell list is likely 50% buffs that can target self.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

More oracle curses, more skill uses and skill tricks, and BETTER rogue tricks. I would have no problem with Paizo releasing a book that had an entire section of rogue tricks that were better than every single current one.

Let's have a rogue that we can be proud of, eh?


AerynTahlro wrote:
Gorbacz wrote:
Yeah, 'cause PF Paladin and Cleric are weak classes that need any help they can get. /sarcasm
That's your opinion and you're entitled to it. As far as I'm concerned, when a magus stands on equal ground as a paladin versus an evil target and a fireball from a sorcerer takes down more undead than a cleric's channel energy, there's a problem.

I see alot of complaints about channel energy. I have a cleric in game going Prestige Paladin (My homebrew conversion from Unearted Arcana) and his channel ability has had a big impact so far. Its single handly saved them several times. Of course he has invested two feats into it.

I allowed him to take Augment Healing from 3.5 (+2 HP per dice on healing) and ruled it worked on his Channel when he healed. At 9th level thats what... an extra 10 points of healing each channel. He also took quicken turning (expend 2 attempt to channel as a swift).

So far it has really been a game changer for the group. Its not broken, and hasn't given me a fit as a DM. But it has helped the group when things get bad.

I dont see it. Maybe the Augment Healing is skewing what a normal PF channel can do in my eyes but I think its balanced as is.


I think some people miss the old "auto eradicate undead" that older versions could do.
I personally think that burst healing more than makes up for turning zombies to dust.


Dragonamedrake wrote:
I dont see it. Maybe the Augment Healing is skewing what a normal PF channel can do in my eyes but I think its balanced as is.

My issue comes from the logic behind the ability. You are unleashing a burst of positive (or negative) energy that extends to a 30' radius. Why/how should you have to choose between healing living and harming undead? A burst is a burst. The way it currently works is like asking to cast the Daylight spell so that it only helps creatures with normal vision but doesn't blind those without it (or vice versa, blind those affected by bright light but not increase the light step for those with normal vision). It just doesn't make sense.

And in regards to the domain abilities, I was referring to things like the Strength Domain.

D20PFSRD wrote:

Granted Powers: In strength and brawn there is truth—your faith gives you incredible might and power.

Strength Surge (Sp): As a standard action, you can touch a creature to give it great strength. For 1 round, the target gains an enhancement bonus equal to 1/2 your cleric level (minimum +1) to melee attacks, combat maneuver checks that rely on Strength, Strength-based skills, and Strength checks. You can use this ability a number of times per day equal to 3 + your Wisdom modifier.

See my problem?


I agree that it should effect everyone in the room whether its Undead or Alive from a logical stand point. But I can also see why the developers did it the way they did. It would make fights with Undead almost trivial. Clerics would be the auto "I Win" Button in those cases. You would be both damaging foes and healing allies with the same repeatable action.

As for domain powers... yes several are very lack luster and 1 round abilites should be longer. But then the same can be said for several Bloodline abilities, Rogue tricks, Rage powers, ect.

Standard Action 1 round effects need to be looked at for ALL classes.


I don't care how it comes about, but I want to see a Wild Shape focused Druid archetype/prestige class. I have an assumption that it will require Diminished Spellcasting, but I don't care.


alchemist with a very different direction of flavour, so perhaps feats that let him be better at using the heal skill or something.

rogue, some nice feats that have a prerequisite trapfinding so those dirty asian dudes can't get their hands on it.

The Exchange

I would like to see a Summoner Archetype that focused on the Summon part of his abilities, and gave up his Eidolon. It would set up what I actually picture when I hear Summoner.

Or, what would be nice is a book dedicated to one class that has all the updates, all the archetypes, A small list of what it could PrC into, etc. that way, I don't actually have to spend $80+ for a series of books when all I want is to play ________.

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

Commoners need more love.

Marathon Voter 2013

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
LazarX wrote:
Commoners need more love.

They're already the most common class in the world. They don't need any more lovin', trust me.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I really want more material for all classes. How about an 'Advanced' book for each class. Not the length of the current advanced book, maybe 36 pages like some companion books. These book would include updated basic class features along with archetypes, and a break down for making a custom archetype similar to how the advanced races broke down race creation. They could also include a small section of pre-build npc's with a variety of flavors.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I know its already been said that they didn't want to see more feats/spells for awhile, but looking through the books there may be room to add some more feats for the Bard class. Especially compared to some of the other classes who've gotten the love recently. Give Bards the Love!

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 , Star Voter 2014

blahpers wrote:

Multiclass. Multiclass multiclass multiclass. Give us archetypes for multiclassing where abilities can synergize. I miss being able to make a same level/same level character, like Ranger 10/Cleric 10. In some ways, I actually preferred how AD&D handled this. I realize that prestige classes were supposed to bridge the gap, but they tend to homogenize such multiclass combinations instead of accentuate them--and they take away most of the base classes' abilities.

Barring that, wizard. They get the short end on archetypes, school powers are decidedly underwhelming, and most of the discoveries are on the "meh" side of the mechanics scale. I understand that all of this keeps them balanced, but it also tends to make them less interesting compared to, say, sorcerers with all of their wonderful bloodlines.

Just on the off-chance you haven't found us yet, check out the Multiclass Archetypes group: http://mcarchetype.wikispaces.com/Multiclass+Archetypes+Master+List

Silver Crusade

Mikaze listed most of my interests to some degree, but I'll just explicitly spell them out:

- More Sorcerer material. The bloodline mechanic is an amazing storytelling hook and I want to see it explored even further. Would like to see more options for how certain bloodlines integrate with other groups... Faiths of Purity really dropped the ball on discussing how Celestial Sorcs interact with some religions, for example.

- Alignment Variant Paladins. I want to see a CG Paladin and so on.

- More options for exploring the use of Charisma as something other than a dump-stat in martial characters. Reasons to give a Fighter a Cha score above 7, etc. It doesn't have to be optimal, perhaps running a Cha 7 Fighter will always be better, but I'd like to explore some options for a Cha 12, 13, 14 Fighter and not feel completely foolish for it. Yes, there are Paladins for this purpose... but sometimes I don't want an extremely religious character (despite just talking about how I wanted more options for said).

Broadly, "Give me ways to use Cha."


Pathfinder Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
LazarX wrote:
Commoners need more love.

I thought you typed "Communists need more love."

Scarab Sages

Celestial Pegasus wrote:
Faiths of Purity really dropped the ball on discussing how Celestial Sorcs interact with some religions, for example.

Interesting observation. Similarly, Faiths of Corruption probably could have had a few sentences on how Abyssal or Infernal Sorcerers function within the various evil faiths / heirarchies, and Faiths of Balance could have had a few words on whether or not Axiomatic or Proteanic Bloodlines exist / how they operate.

Quote:
- Alignment Variant Paladins. I want to see a CG Paladin and so on.

Even if such critters never exist in Golarion, there's no reason why a setting-neutral book couldn't detail them.

Quote:

- More options for exploring the use of Charisma as something other than a dump-stat in martial characters. Reasons to give a Fighter a Cha score above 7, etc. It doesn't have to be optimal, perhaps running a Cha 7 Fighter will always be better, but I'd like to explore some options for a Cha 12, 13, 14 Fighter and not feel completely foolish for it. Yes, there are Paladins for this purpose... but sometimes I don't want an extremely religious character (despite just talking about how I wanted more options for said).

Broadly, "Give me ways to use Cha."

A refinement of how skills like Bluff (to feint), Intimdate (to demoralize) or Diplomacy (to taunt?) could be used to affect the game mechanically could go a long way toward making Charisma less of a martial class dump stat. Without feat X and rage power Y, demoralize is quite often a waste of an action, and feint also is far more useful for classes with sneak attack, than for classes with a bunch of iterative attacks going to waste if they spend an action on it.

Something coldly mechanical like a 5% reduction in the price of purchased goods per point of your positive Charisma modifier (and a 5% increase in said prices per point of your negative Charisma modifier) could serve to make the dumping of Charisma a bit less of a no-brainer, since the martial classes are often the most gear-dependent...

If your Cha 7 results in 10% less WBL, that adds up pretty quickly at the higher levels.

Still, I'd prefer that Cha improvements are handled under Interaction skills. Mutants & Masterminds, which is nominally based off of d20/D&D, has some pretty effective uses of interaction skills to feint, share the effects of a feint with allies, demoralize or even daze or fascinate others via Bluff/Diplomacy/Intimidate.

That's partially a genre thing (Batman wouldn't be Batman without the 'criminals are a cowardly and superstitious lot' thing, after all), but Conan should be able to be just as pants-wettingly-terrifying as Batman...


Tirq wrote:
I'd buy the Multi-Class character and PrC minibook. It would be worth the money.

Sounds good to me.

I'm grateful for the work done on the core/base classes.

I wan the same effort for PrCs and multi-class archetypes.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 , Dedicated Voter 2013, Star Voter 2014, Star Voter 2015

Feats that help customize class abilities, like alchemist bombs & mutagens, bardic music, rage, challenges and orders, channel energy, wildshape, judgements, arcana, ki powers, curses, mysteries, and revelations, divine bonds and smites, favored enemy and terrain, rogue talents, alternate bloodline powers, evolutions, hexes and patrons, alternates to bonus wizard feats, etc. etc.

Also, feats or prestige classes to enhance multi-class options.

EDIT:

Vis-a-vis Set's concern about Charisma being a dump stat, maybe PCs can get a number of daily luck re-rolls or action points or hero points equal to their Charisma modifier +1. Charisma measures a character's personality, personal magnetism, ability to lead, and appearance. It also affects supernatural power.

RE-EDIT:

Maybe give PCs a number of traits equal to 2 + their Charisma modifier.

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