9 Blazing Months


RPG Superstar™ General Discussion

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Anthony Adam wrote:
I'll do some digging on this to see if I can find some examples of the use of "special" and when it is used and get back to you on this one.

Hey Curaigh, here are the results of my investigations... (I looked both for special and items to do with vehicles/mounts/travelling that were not normal pc slots.

Apparatus of the Crab, a vehicle you climb into rather than something you climb on, has - Slot none;

Same for a Folding Boat.

Broom of Flying - closer to a saddle and mount and you guessed it - Slot none;

Carpet of flying - something you get onto (synergy with saddle) - Slot none;

Figurines of Wondrous Power - all of them, even the mounts - Slot none;

Now it becomes muddy...

Horseshoes of Speed/Zephyr - Slot feet;

Here the wondrous item refers to the feet of the horse (the slot on the horse, not the PC).

So with a saddle, you could possibly argue it's a horse "body" slot item - I wouldn't say chest because the saddle, in encircling the horse's girth, having synergy with a robe - which uses slot "body". So this could be what you want.

Interestingly - half way through the items in the core book, not a single "special" yet encountered. So I may be changing my mind about special getting you dinged, but continuing on through the items...

Reaching the end of the core book, still no slot called special.

No "special" in the Advanced or Ultimates.

I'm now of the opinion you should not use special on a wondrous item (if you do, it should really, really be special) - I would go with "body" of the horse rather than "none" for the reason given.

Hope this helps some Curaigh.


Hey guys, I am late coming into the thread but would like to brainstorm for next year.

I am thinking about the new material coming out this year and how I may take advantage of that design space. A few books coming out this year include Advanced Race Guide and Ultimate Equipment.

Have any ideas for a low cost item?

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Thanks Anthony, I think I will go none, but body is a maybe ... will keep thinking on it.

speed66 wrote:

Hey guys, I am late coming into the thread but would like to brainstorm for next year.

I am thinking about the new material coming out this year and how I may take advantage of that design space. A few books coming out this year include Advanced Race Guide and Ultimate Equipment.

Have any ideas for a low cost item?

Since the winner will get a contract, collaberating on an entry item is not allowed. While it is encouraged to have people look over your work,* we cannae help you create one from scratch.

What we can offer, indeed what this thread is about, is writing practice. While the best I can promise is 'good enough for a book of magic items' we can still help the individual get passed all the immediate reject pitfalls, leaving your creativity to finish the job. :)

Spoiler:
insulan runes (just to restore balance)

That said throw out a practice item. We will be happy to play with it and give you feedback which should apply to your actual entry item. Just like all the feedback threads apply to everyone's item and not just yours.

As for cheap items... whiteboard, clothespin, paperclip, bookmark, tie fighter, pin, banana... just what I can see from my desk :)
*see the OP :)

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I think that's smart, Speed, but until we see the books, it'll be a bit hard to come up with ideas from them. I'd definitely think any new rules presented in ARG will be fertile design space, though.

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Yes with a new book, new rules it should be a good design niche, though it may be hard to stick out of the crowd as everyone goes with the same design niche. :)

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Ok all you lovely people.

Here is my next offering - for this I have tried

a) not to overthink too much - lol
b) stick with a single core idea (remaining with vehicles this time)
c) I havent finished the construction / pricing / aura yet.
d) king of cruddy names returns - the name may change, not sure yet as it's simple and gives an indication of function.
e) and the description is first draft and well - yeah - shows it :P

So this is the core of the item. Do let me know what you think :)

Enjoy

Limpet Driver
Aura to-do; CL to-do
Slot hands; Price to-do gp; Weight 4 lbs.
Description

This item resembles a one foot diameter wagon wheel, the rim of which is solid gold and filigree embossed with stylized images of exotic vehicles. Twenty steel spokes join the rim with a 3 inch diameter gold hub. On one side the hub appears much like a mushroom head, on the other side the foot of a giant sea anemone is clearly visible.

The foot can be removed from the wheel and will stick if held against any vehicle with independent free steering, i.e. one that does not run along rails or a fixed track. Once attached, the miniature wagon wheel assumes control of the steering of the vehicle.

The foot can also be thrown at such a vehicle, even if the vehicle is moving. In order for a thrown foot to stick, you must hit the vehicle AC including any and all driver based modifications in force. If you hit, there is a 75% chance that the foot will land with sticky foot pad touching the vehicle surface. If successful, steering control is gained immediately.

You steer a controlled vehicle by rotating the held miniature wheel in the direction you wish the vehicle to turn. The range of control is out to 1 mile.

To remove a stuck foot from a vehicle, either place the miniature wheel over the foot so that it becomes fitted to the item again or succeed at a DC 15 Strength check.

Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, to-do; Cost to-do gp

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Name needs some work. Limpet driver seems to be a person, not an item in my mind. "Appears much like a mushroom head" seems a bit wonky. And why a sea anenome when the item it patterned after a land based description of the rest of the item. If you had gone for a ships wheel, I could see the anenome. A gecko, frog, or another creature with suction feet would fit the rest of the flavour better.

Thrown range for the foot? Would a magical vehicle get a saving throw to negate the effect? What is the foot made of? Someone might want to sunder it or use a spell on it.

"To remove a stuck foot from a vehicle, either place the miniature wheel over the foot so that it becomes fitted to the item again or succeed at a DC 15 Strength check." needs reworded.

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speed66 wrote:

Hey guys, I am late coming into the thread but would like to brainstorm for next year.

I am thinking about the new material coming out this year and how I may take advantage of that design space. A few books coming out this year include Advanced Race Guide and Ultimate Equipment.

Have any ideas for a low cost item?

For all the furries lurking out there:

Cute Kitty Tail of Transformation
Aura moderate transmutation; CL 9th
Slot belt; Price 15,000 gp; Weight 3 lbs.

Description
The cute kitty tail of transformation appears to made from the tail of a humanoid with the catfolk subtype. Whenever the tail is worn by a humanoid creature, you appearance is polymorphed into the type of catfolk the tail appears to come from. You ability scores, size, and physical build don't change, but your senses, special qualities and racial skill modifiers are replaced by those of that particular catfolk.

If you already have the catfolk subtype, this tail will intertwine with your natural tail (if present). As a standard action, you can switch between your natural catfolk appearance and the one granted from the tail.

Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, polymorph, creator must have 3 ranks in the Craft (taxidermy) skill; Cost 7,500 gp

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Thomas LeBlanc wrote:
Name needs some work.

Yeah, the only bit that causes me trouble no matter how much I practice.

Quote:
...seems a bit wonky.

Yeah, my description is very first draft, i just wanted to get the base idea out there. Sort of a checkpoint on my previous attempts feedback to see if I'm learning from it or not.

I don't see why it wouldn't work on ships, basically it would take over the ship's rudder. A rowing boat might be more problematical as it doesn't have a tiller/rudder generally. So will definitely have to visit what types of vehicle exclusions apply again.

Quote:
A gecko, frog, or another creature with suction feet.

Aye, anemone foot was the thing that sprang to mind that was "round" and could easily be the center of a wheel hub. I will research more creature options to see if anything else "fits in a wheel".

Quote:
Thrown range for the foot?

Drat. Knew I was missing something obvious - nice catch. As it's a hand weapon, I will probably use the same as throwing daggers.

Quote:
Would a magical vehicle get a saving throw to negate the effect?

I don't think so, its natural stickiness rather than magical stickiness, but I might give the driver of the vehicle some sort of save to negate. I'll think about this.

Quote:
What is the foot made of?

"... the foot of a giant sea anemone is clearly visible"

It's that fishy rubbery gripping appendage on coral crustaceans. Admittedly a comma is missing in that sentence and some better wording would have helped. :)

Quote:
Someone might want to sunder it or use a spell on it.

Yeah, it needs some sort of hardness/hp specification. You are quite correct.

But as for the idea - was it "fun" enough, did it get you thinking about causing mucho mischief with it?

My focus at the moment is coming up with good entertaining ideas, so this feedback is invaluable.

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Cute Kitty Tail of Transformation

Very nice template use as always.

I would put a para break at the start of sentence 2 to break the evocative description from the effect. Makes it nicer for the judges (and players/voters) to read.

Also that same sentence, after the comma, it should be "your appearance" - you missed an "r".

"appears to come from" is fairly passive, make it stronger ...

"into the same species as the tail" (or something like that - i.e, don't use "appears to"

Next sentence (I haven't my books to hand so bear with me on this one), if these restrictions are the same for polymorph, don't duplicate them, just build into your description the qualifier "as per polymorph".

You also missed the "r" again at the start... "Your ability scores..."

It was to me quite spell in a can item until the switching cat forms last paragraph. That made it more interesting, but I suspect not enough to avoid the SAC ding.

Nice fun item though for practice purposes.

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Anthony Adam wrote:
I don't see why it wouldn't work on ships, basically it would take over the ship's rudder. A rowing boat might be more problematical as it doesn't have a tiller/rudder generally. So will definitely have to visit what types of vehicle exclusions apply again.

I didn't say it wouldn't work on ships. Just that the descriptive flavour was for a sea creautre's foot attached to an item that is described in terms of a wagon wheel and a mushroom(???, still not getting the mushroom reference).

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Anthony Adam wrote:
Very nice template use as always.

I just copied yours and filled it in quickly. Damn those pesky "r"s. Always unning away...

Anthony Adam wrote:
Next sentence (I haven't my books to hand so bear with me on this one), if these restrictions are the same for polymorph, don't duplicate them, just build into your description the qualifier "as per polymorph".

Just search the PRD. That's what I do at work. After reading polymorph, I should have just used alter self. I guess that is what I deserve from trying to choose a spell from memory. Would have also lowered the CL.

Next time I will try to spend more than 20 minutes on an item, but I was inspired by speed66's post.

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Thomas LeBlanc wrote:

For all the furries lurking out there:

Cute Kitty Tail of Transformation

*Agreed alter self is a better choice, Especially since the PF version grants (sort of) darkvision, low-light vision and scent. OUaT, to gain the properties required a much bigger spell.

**replacing racial X with racial Y will be a nightmare to track... is the duration permanent?
***whose appearance changes? :)

an inspired-by-your-item change: If the user already has the catfolk subtype, this tail will intertwine with his natural tail (if present). The tail grows to the length and strength of his arm becoming prehensile. It may wield weapons, items, used in certain skill checks, etc. This does not grant any additional actions per round but does allow and a hand to be free for while the tail is available (for disarming, retrieving items, somatic spell components etc. )

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Anthony Adam wrote:


Limpet Driver

*not sure what a limpet is (EDIT: dictionary.com is my friend :) and knowing that I would change from a wagon wheel to a ship wheel. As noted some of your imagery will clash, but I think the steering wheel is a modern invention I would avoid anyway :) (SKR #??)

**whoa this is actually two items? When did the mini wheel come in (this is related to a question about the hands slot... should it not be 'held' (none) as you will throw it most of the time anyway? I dinnae think one foot item is being worn like gloves will be). A suggestion: make the hub of the big wheel the miniature that shows up later?
*** "assumes control of the steering" These 5 words tell me what the object does, but with over 250 words in this item it gets buried. Control of a vehicle requires size and skills and accelerations and maneuvers, and we get... 5 words. This imbalance suggests you might have missed your goal a). However BY COMPARING this with other things I think you have done a good job of NOT overthinking it, especially knowing e) it is a first draft. Nice job. :)

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Curaigh wrote:
Anthony Adam wrote:


Limpet Driver

*not sure what a limpet is (EDIT: dictionary.com is my friend :) and knowing that I would change from a wagon wheel to a ship wheel. As noted some of your imagery will clash, but I think the steering wheel is a modern invention I would avoid anyway :) (SKR #??)

**whoa this is actually two items? When did the mini wheel come in (this is related to a question about the hands slot... should it not be 'held' (none) as you will throw it most of the time anyway? I dinnae think one foot item is being worn like gloves will be). A suggestion: make the hub of the big wheel the miniature that shows up later?
*** "assumes control of the steering" These 5 words tell me what the object does, but with over 250 words in this item it gets buried. Control of a vehicle requires size and skills and accelerations and maneuvers, and we get... 5 words. This imbalance suggests you might have missed your goal a). However BY COMPARING this with other things I think you have done a good job of NOT overthinking it, especially knowing e) it is a first draft. Nice job. :)

Cheers. The mushroom bit is basically to represent the axle that would go through the wheel and was capped, and the item consists of the remote wheel in your hands and the tagging device that gains control of the target.

Yeah, the description does need some work >.<

Funnily enough, I had already worked towards a ships wheel (I did consider using the term "wainwright's wheel" to avoid tying to a specific vehicle type. Not sure on that still, it's kind of clunky.

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My WotF short story is finished (even though I think the ending is tooOOoo far from the end :) so I decided to work on rewrites today.

Rime Bind Amulet

Spoiler:
Aura moderate transmutation; CL 6th
Slot neck; Price 11,000 gp; Weight
Description
Flowing tendrils of blue ice form the beard of this face-shaped amulet. Occasional puffs of air escape its mouth in all but the coldest conditions.

When activated frost-covered tendrils spread along the wearer’s arms and cover his body in an icy coat, reducing his move by half. Each round the tendrils grow an additional 10 feet giving the user a reach attack (maximum of 60 feet). The wearer may make touch attacks with the tendrils in place of his normal attacks. A successful tendril attack causes frost-ferns to flow across the opponent’s body. Wrapped in ice, these opponents move at half normal speed and gain the staggered condition. An opponent’s ice effect ends at the same time as the wearer’s. Activating the amulet is a standard action that is usable once per day. It lasts for six rounds.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, slow; Cost 5,500 gp

Rime Trap Amulet

Spoiler:

Aura moderate conjuration and evocation; CL 6th
Slot neck; Price 33,400 gp; Weight
Description
Feathery, white crystals flow from the diamond center of this amulet. Each forms a unique frozen shape, trapping brief flashes of white light.
Once per day, when activated the rime trap amulet’s crystals grow across the wearer’s body coating him in an icy rime. The feathery crystals trap cold energy, stitching wounds closed and slowing the loss of blood. These ice crystals absorb up to 12 points of cold damage each round (to a maximum of 60 points). These points are trapped in the coat for the user to cure 1d6 +5 points of damage to himself as a move action. This curing can never heal more points than the amulet currently has trapped. Activating the amulet is a standard action that lasts six rounds. Any cold points trapped at the end of six rounds are lost, when the icy coat melts away.
When not active the amulet functions like a minor ring of cold resistance.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, cure light wounds, draconic reservoir, resist energy, Cost 16,700 gp

No one asked, but the idea of this/these came from

Spoiler:
the magic immunity of a golem; in this case the ice golem. I struggled forever to get the electricity out that slows the critter, and it simplified the item considerably then the sharing idea hit and since waterbending was in a dozen other items I played with... well there you have it. :) In retrospect (and now rewrites) I needed to simplify even more. I hope they have the oomph necessary to become a great wyrm :)

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EDIT: This post was written after reading Curaigh's items and wondering why the seperate paragraph for the description.

Anthony Adam wrote:
I would put a para break at the start of sentence 2 to break the evocative description from the effect. Makes it nicer for the judges (and players/voters) to read.

While it may look nice, no item printed by Paizo does this. I like to make my items appear consistant with the official products. The first paragraph normally contains the appearance, how to use the item, and the major effects.

Additional paragraphs:
1) Detailed effects of the item. (bead of force)
2) Circumstance based effects (moon circlet)
3) Specific rules for the item (extradimensional spaces)
4) multiple types (lord's banner)

I find having the description being a seperate paragraph to be a waste of space. Especially when trying to fit multiple items into a constrained space.

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Curaigh wrote:
Rime Bind Amulet

Where is the ice effect coming from? Just listing slow covers the movement changes and the staggered condition. Maybe add frigid touch for flavor.

I think your price is far too low. See below about attacks and reach.

Touch attacks are a weak spot for many characters. This item lets you negate most of the action economy for alot of creatures with no save. Slow only lets you affect 1 target a level. By level 6 (based on CL), a PC with full BAB can make 4 attacks per round if they have Improved TWF. Or 2 per round with full BAB. That is a total of 4 creatures a round for 6 rounds. Or 2 per round for 6 rounds. Much more than slow.

Also you need to say what type of weapon the tendrils are. Are they an unarmed attack or count as a natural weapon? Do they count as light or 1-H weapons.

Also the reach at 60 feet seems excessive. You are increasing the burst of 30 feet on slow to about 120 feet.

Can the tendils be attacked? They are a physical manifestation of ice and if they are identified, an enemy would want to negate their range by destroying them.

Does being covered in ice affect creatures with a vulnerability to cold?

Curaigh wrote:
Rime Trap Amulet

Curious as to how you priced this. I would have priced it about the same as you, but my number was 31,000 gp.

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Also for the number of creatures that can be attacked doesn't count any AoO within 60 feet that you threaten when using the Rime Bind Amulet.

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Hey all, I'm back from the wettest week off in history in this country.

9 days consecutive holiday, 7 of them rained all day - and you guessed it - the two days that didn't were travelling to and coming home days >.<

Next time someone says, "UK? It just rains there...", I will simply nod sadly in agreement.

On the plus side, as it rained, I spent a lot of time checking out Diablo 3 and can happily say the essence of the early games is still present. Nice. Diablo 3 (Hell difficulty) is proving... interesting... to solo.

So back to my item - oh yes, the vehicle controller... some quite major reworking has happened in my subconscious, so fingers crossed I can translate it from brain to forum. Look for a post in the weekend, I'm still kind of holiday demob mode at the moment :)

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First change of my vehicle controller is name and construction.

"A silken hoop made from spun spiders thread surrounds the splayed carcass of a black widow spider."

Much easier than spokes and hubs etc, and at the same time accounts for throwing the central object at the vehicle as part of the item's useage. Plus I can now animate the spider on landing and have it scuttle about and into the vehicle steering mechanisms. Well creepy.

The name changes too as a result to something more evocative too.

Widow's Wheel

So what are peoples thoughts on this direction and name - I quite like it - so that means it's probably a complete meme of "oh dear god"-ness.

He he, my crown for bad names is retained :)

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much much clearer and like you said, visually works for a couple of things. It might need another word, but that is only by the established formula and does not necessarily mean it is needed.

Write it up, leave out the thought process, and let us at it :)

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Curaigh wrote:

much much clearer and like you said, visually works for a couple of things. It might need another word, but that is only by the established formula and does not necessarily mean it is needed.

Write it up, leave out the thought process, and let us at it :)

It's coming along very nicely, will be posting it soon - I'm just waiting for my games club feedback - for this item, I have gone the whole hog and treated it to the full "in competition" review body that I often use (of course, this is where I find out my games club lead me astray :P)

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Ew, definitely creepy. But I think you nailed both name and description. You picked some really good words -- splayed and carcass -- and I'm a big fan of avoiding "of the" in the name of the items.

A few thoughts, a couple of them slightly nit-picky:
* Do you need spider as the last word of the description? Isn't that what a black widow is?
* I think you want it to be spun spider thread, not spiders. Using the singular form makes it clear it's an adjective; otherwise I'd feel like you'd need an apostrophe in there and that could make it think the spun is referring to the spider (or spiders, depending where you put the apostrophe), and not the thread.
* Finally, I'd also probably lose the possessive in the name -- just make it widow wheel -- so no one thinks it belongs to/can only be used by a widow.

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Ugh, I can't believe I got so side-tracked I forgot to come back here for two months. That's waaay too long. I mean, it's not like I've been languishing, but it's no superstar practice.

So, let's review what's going on in here:
Rime Bind Amulet

review:
The name, "Rime Bind Amulet" immediately gives me some strange imagery. Does it bind the rime itself? Is it using cold to bind something down? I assume the latter, because that's a fairly classic trope, especially in video games, but it's not clear from the name.

And your description, it's great. Except for the bit about "occasional puffs of air", because while I (think I) know what you mean, you never do clairify that the item's breath is the frosty cloud of condensation you get while breathing in cold air. You should clairify it.

You're missing a comma after the second word of your powers descrioption "When activated, ". The power itself is kinda neat though. I like the idea of a tendril of cold wrapping you in rime. But the 60 ft range touch attack? That's something you could use to AOO with, and lock down everything in a 120 ft wide area - more than double most entire encounter maps. This range needs to be cut down to a maximum of maybe 20 ft. I understand the user is forfeiting mobility here and it takes six rounds to reach it, but what if you give this to a bard who doesn't need to get close? Or an archer? Or, hell, a level 1 commoner you keep around. Even with no modifier, 1d20 is enough to touch a good number high level creatures. And since you can use it to make AOOs (as you've gained the attack for the duration) it gets a little broken a little fast.

I think you really need to (A) make it a standard action to use the tentacles at any time, and (B) reduce the maximum range, but make it get there faster.

Rime Trap Amulet

review:
This name is a lot better. Rime Trap. It clearly absorbs cold damage and... well, let's see.

Okay, I get a snowflake implication in the unique feathery crystals, but what does "trapping brief flashes of white light" mean? I'd try and simplify this. I'm also not sure the wording on the crystals flowing out around the body really works. I like the imagery, but I'd say the wording is a little clunky.

I also think your cost is way too high for a once a day use. Even if it is six rounds at a time. But then, there's a lot of weirdness with action economy. 1d6+5 as a move action? At the level you're at, that's a pittance of healing (by the time I spend 33k on an amulet I'm pretty high level) but at least it's not requiring a standard action. And, come to think of it, that's really the crux of the issue - for 33k and six move actions, you can heal yourself at most 60hp. That is not worth it.

The item needs some serious rebalancing.

Widow's Wheel
I kinda like the naming, but it makes me think of Mothers Against Drunk Driving. Also, Alliteration doesn't always work in your favor.

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I've also got a collection of items I've been playing around with. This one, for instance, is inspired by a failed item from... three competitions ago, or so.

Ever-Beating Talisman
[Aura faint conjuration; CL 3rd
Slot neck; Price 1,000gp; Weight 1 lb.
Description
This blackened and shoveled heart, sewn into a pennant with a length of hair, immediately begins to beat when donned, rhythmically thrumming along with the wearer's own pulse. Once beating, the talisman will maintain the wearer's life force for up to three rounds after they are struck down, no matter how mangled or destroyed their body becomes. In effect, the wearer can be healed to a stable or living condition regardless of their hit point total.

Once the talisman sustains the wearer for a total of three rounds in a single day, it crumbles to ash allowing the wearer to pass away normally.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, stabilize; Cost 500gp

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RonarsCorruption wrote:
Ever-Beating Talisman

Quick edits:

Remove the additional bracket before Aura.
Needs a space in "1,000gp" for the Price
"shoveled" should be shriveled.
While thrumming works, maybe thumping is a better fit?
Remove own in "the wearer's own pulse".
Needs a space in "500gp" for the Cost.

Rules question:

RonarsCorruption wrote:
Once the talisman sustains the wearer for a total of three rounds in a single day, it crumbles to ash allowing the wearer to pass away normally.

So if a player only uses it for 2 rounds in a day it does not crumble? So they can take it off to use the next day. Or hand it to a fellow adventurer to use for 2 rounds that day, who in turn passes it to the next person.

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RonarsCorruption wrote:


Ever-Beating Talisman

*TL got the mechanics

**what does it mean 'struck down' Is this a trip attack, (j/k I think it is clearly not...) is it at 0 HP, is it at -HP? is it at -con? this will matter.
***what actions can I take while the heart sustains my life force? am I unconscious, staggered, disabled? Can I drink a cure potion, run to the healer, teleport home? (personally I like that a character can delay their action to stabilize up to three times, but that is mechanically suspect. Then again affecting a small rule such as a character "cannot use any special action that changes the initiative count" :) to delay character death could be seen as a good niche.

Nice niche and price seems about right for an I'm-helpless-so-save-me-now item.

Welcome back Ronars and congratulations!

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Both of you have commented on reach, so I thought I was doing some throwback to 3.5. However...

pathfinderprd wrote:
With a typical reach weapon, you can strike opponents 10 feet away, but you can't strike adjacent foes (those within 5 feet).

I will make the changes to make it more clear (and reduce the reach), but I do have a question. You do not threaten inside the circle of reach. I am not sure that is how I want it to work, but that is how I read it. Do you read it differently?

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Jacob W. Michaels wrote:

Ew, definitely creepy. But I think you nailed both name and description. You picked some really good words -- splayed and carcass -- and I'm a big fan of avoiding "of the" in the name of the items.

A few thoughts, a couple of them slightly nit-picky:
* Do you need spider as the last word of the description? Isn't that what a black widow is?
* I think you want it to be spun spider thread, not spiders. Using the singular form makes it clear it's an adjective; otherwise I'd feel like you'd need an apostrophe in there and that could make it think the spun is referring to the spider (or spiders, depending where you put the apostrophe), and not the thread.
* Finally, I'd also probably lose the possessive in the name -- just make it widow wheel -- so no one thinks it belongs to/can only be used by a widow.

Wicked feedback - especially on the name - that apostrophe didn't feel quite right and now I understand what my subconscious was trying to tell me. Really useful and eloquent feedback - many thanks.

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Here you go everyone.

The description and use is pretty much nailed down - not sure if I should italicize the vehicle states or not, but thought it made it clearer that these are defined in the vehicle rules by doing so.

I am now moving onto the construction now (assuming you don't find anything too major with the description).

Enjoy.

Widow Wheel
Aura to-do; CL to-do
Slot hands; Price to-do gp; Weight 1 lb.
Description

A silken hoop made from spun spider thread surrounds the splayed carcass of a black widow. By grasping and tugging the spider body, the spider separates from the silken hoop, its body begins to throb and its legs to twitch.

Placing the spider upon a vehicle releases it to scuttle into the vehicle recesses until it locates the steering mechanism in d4 rounds when it then embraces it. The spider can also be thrown, as a throwing dagger, at a moving vehicle. On a hit, the spider attaches as per normal placement.

Once the spider is in position, the hoop warms to the touch indicating vehicle control is possible.

Turning the hoop will now force the vehicle controller to make a Turn driving check to counter the turn, DC 15 + your ranks in Profession (driver).

On a failed check, the vehicle turns in the same direction that the hoop was turned. Failing by more than 10 results in the vehicle gaining the broken condition. If already broken, then it gains the wrecked or sinking condition as appropriate to the vehicle type. For wrecked wheeled vehicles, the driver must make a second immediate check with the same DC to avoid a sudden stop.

On a successful check, the driver retains control and becomes immune to further opposed control checks for one round per 5 points the check was cleared by.

The range of control is out to 1 mile, beyond which, the spider drops out and returns to its hoop in 1 day.

If the hoop is placed against the vehicle, the spider returns in the same number of rounds it took to locate the steering mechanism.

Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, to-do; Cost to-do gp

I will admit now, I wanted to give the spider some HP and hardness once attached to allow for attacking it to remove it from a vehicle but ran up against word count. Any suggestions gratefully received and acted upon.

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Anthony Adam wrote:

Widow Wheel

I clocked your item at 301 words. Auto-disqualifiaction!

You body formatting makes me want to challenge you to a fish slapping duel. Why do you seperate everything out so much? Take a cue from existing items.

Throwing dagger, Profession (driver), Turn, broken, wrecked, sinking, and sudden stop should not be italicized. If you want to practice on the Superstar, again look at the published materials for formatting.

The rule for wrecked already calls out the sinking condition, so you can save a few words. Why did you add a new rule to avoid a sudden stop? I think it should have been left out. By the rules if a vehicle is wrecked it comes to a sudden stop. You are adding the chance to avoid a sudden stop without entailing what the effects would be.

I liked your visuals though.

How I would rewrite:

Description
A silken hoop made from spider thread surrounds the splayed carcass of a black widow spider. The spider can separate from the hoop by grasping and tugging the spider body. The body begins to throb and its legs to twitch when separated. The spider must be attached to a vehicle for the widow wheel to function. The spider may be placed or thrown (range increment of 10 ft) as a touch attack onto a vehicle. Once on the vehicle, it scuttles into the steering mechanism in 1d4 rounds and embraces it. Once the spider is attached to the steering mechanism, the hoop warms to the touch indicating vehicle control is possible.

Turning the hoop will force the vehicle to turn. The vehicle’s driver may attempt a driving check to counter your control (DC 15 + your ranks in Profession (driver)). On a failed check, the vehicle turns under your control. If the check fails by 10 or more, the vehicle becomes broken. If already broken, it becomes wrecked. On a successful check, the driver retains control of the vehicle and for every additional 5 points the check succeeds against the DC, the driver is immune to further opposed driving checks for one round.

If the spider is destroyed, the widow wheel ceases to function. The spider has a hardness of 2 and 15 hit points.

The range of control is out to 1 mile, beyond which, the spider drops out and returns to its hoop in 1 day. If the hoop is placed against the vehicle, the spider returns in the same number of rounds it took to locate the steering mechanism.

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I definitely agree with Thomas on the whole "you need less paragraph breaks" thing. You have seven paragraphs and eleven sentences - getting pretty close to one sentence per paragraph. It's not *quite* as bad as never linebreaking at all, but it still breaks the item's readability a little.

The overall flavor of the widow wheel is excellent. However, you need to include what type of action it requires to place the spider on a vehicle. Probably standard, sure, but it needs to be stated.

Second, when you say the 'vehicle controller' in the fourth paragraph, I think you mean driver. Because at that point there's two controllers - the driver, and the wheel user.

I'm also not sure I like the idea about gaining the broken condition on a fail by 10. How exactly does that happen? Is it because the driver has pulled too hard on the compromised mechanism and it broke? Or is it because the wheels/whatever are going back and forth and undertaking lots of force? I don't get it.

In fact, you also fail to address what happens if the driver doesn't fight the control - would that be failing by 15+ranks? Meaning the driver *has* to try and control the vehicle or it breaks? Or would it simply be 'failing'?

And, actually, that just made me realize - this item relies on the user's skill check for it's power, which is a no-no. The better the driver, the more powerful the item becomes, which makes it impossible to price.

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Also, wow, that's a lot of typos I made on this item. Shoulda given it a read-over before I posted it. Here's the second draft, then.

Ever-Beating Talisman V2
Aura faint conjuration; CL 3rd
Slot neck; Price 1,000 gp; Weight 1 lb.
Description
This blackened and shriveled heart, sewn into a pendant with a length of hair, immediately begins to beat when donned, rhythmically thumping along with the wearer's own pulse. Once beating, the talisman will sustain the wearer's life force for up to three rounds per day after the wearer would normally have died in battle, no matter how mangled or destroyed their body becomes.

In effect, when reduced to a negative hit point total equal to their Constitution, the wearer doesn't die but immediately falls unconscious, triggering the talisman's effects. Until the end of the third round, healing received by the amulet's wearer can restore the character to a stable or conscious state no matter their previous total.

Once the talisman sustains a wearer for a total of three rounds in a single day, it crumbles to ash immediately ending it's effect and often allowing its wearer to pass away normally.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Item, stabilize; Cost 500 gp

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Anthony Adam wrote:

Widow Wheel

I like it. 1) good imagery 2) unfamiliar rules 3) simple idea.

*aura, price, etc are incorrect (but I am sure you knew that :) I think slot is 'none', not 'hands' (I can wear a pair of gloves and still drive )
**how big is a black widow carcass? 1/8 inch? 1/4? This loop is actually pretty small to be turned.
*** allows the user to make drive checks with a +X bonus, then let the drive rules take over for crashing etc. I am confused by driver and user conflict also. Maybe just require opposed checks? Breaking a vehicle or breaking the item. Seems to me a spider would be crushed by a wargalley :)

I suggest you look at the spider hook from year two and 2011's shadow falconer's glove.

For word conservation purposes be leery of 'if/then' statements.
Frex: "If the hoop is placed against the vehicle, the spider returns... ."
Similarly the word 'of' can be an indicator for cutting words. "The range of control is out to 1 mile, .... can be written as "the hoop has a 1 mile range..." Granted that only gets you 2 words, (and I re-added the subject) but 2 words is the difference between DQ and not. Prepositional phrases and multi-verbing in a single sentence are other targets.

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RonarsCorruption wrote:

Also, wow, that's a lot of typos I made on this item. Shoulda given it a read-over before I posted it. Here's the second draft, then.

Ever-Beating Talisman V2

Cool you fixed my concerns. Damage still has to be healed right (a cure light will not bring me to stable if I was at -30 right?) Second sentence borders run-on territory. I might consider 'it functions once lasting up to three rounds'. As written a character can be dropped three times if he's brought to positive HPs the same round. Three uses is much too good for a 1K gp item. (and could be complicated to track :) Nice job

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Thomas LeBlanc wrote:
Anthony Adam wrote:

Widow Wheel

I clocked your item at 301 words. Auto-disqualifiaction!

You body formatting makes me want to challenge you to a fish slapping duel. Why do you seperate everything out so much? Take a cue from existing items.

Throwing dagger, Profession (driver), Turn, broken, wrecked, sinking, and sudden stop should not be italicized. If you want to practice on the Superstar, again look at the published materials for formatting.

The rule for wrecked already calls out the sinking condition, so you can save a few words. Why did you add a new rule to avoid a sudden stop? I think it should have been left out. By the rules if a vehicle is wrecked it comes to a sudden stop. You are adding the chance to avoid a sudden stop without entailing what the effects would be.

I liked your visuals though.

How I would rewrite:

Description
A silken hoop made from spider thread surrounds the splayed carcass of a black widow spider. The spider can separate from the hoop by grasping and tugging the spider body. The body begins to throb and its legs to twitch when separated. The spider must be attached to a vehicle for the widow wheel to function. The spider may be placed or thrown (range increment of 10 ft) as a touch attack onto a vehicle. Once on the vehicle, it scuttles into the steering mechanism in 1d4 rounds and embraces it. Once the spider is attached to the steering mechanism, the hoop warms to the touch indicating vehicle control is possible.

Turning the hoop will force the vehicle to turn. The vehicle’s driver may attempt a driving check to counter your control (DC 15 + your ranks in Profession (driver)). On a failed check, the vehicle turns under your control. If the check fails by 10 or more, the vehicle becomes broken. If already broken, it becomes wrecked. On a successful check, the driver retains control of the vehicle and for every additional 5 points the check succeeds against the DC, the driver is immune to further opposed driving...

Overall I agree that the first few sentences are am improvement over Anthony's latest (though the item has also been vastly improved in that version already!).

Just a brief comment on the bolded sentence. Be particularly careful with nonfinite verb forms (participles like grasping, tugging). In your sentence the subject of these verbs is not expressed - the problem is that the unexpressed subject of those verbs is interpreted (by default) as the main clause subject - 'the spider'.

So it reads as if the spider is grasping and tugging its own body to free itself from the hoop, and it takes some effort to recognize that the intended meaning is that the user is doing the grasping and tugging.

I would rewrite that sentence more simply as:
Grasping and tugging the spider body separates it from the hoop.

or even:
Gently tugging the spider body separates it from the hoop.
(you can't tug without grasping, so the two verbs are somewhat redundant)

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Yeah, none of the construction/spells or pricing has been done yet. I had decided to concentrate on the core and worry about the mechanical / formulaic aspects once the core was down well.

This is a method I tried to try and help me avoid the technical style of writing and to work towards the fantasy style needed, and it stopped me trying to think too much and stay true to the core - I didn't get diverted from my base idea be discovering cool spells I hadnt noticed before :D

The general item and wording feedback from you all is awesome as always, I will rework (a little bit this time, not much - it's a much better second draft than I normally achieve, so I must be improving :) )

The reason I broke the item down is from some feedback this year, where I suggested paragraph breaks at description, main power, secondary power, etc to help the judges assimilate the content rather than replication of the more wall of text style.

A couple of judges replied saying it can make the judging a little less of a labour, so from this I assumed it was something to be encouraged. I will not do this going forwards as the general consensus seems to be not to.

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Breaking it up is useful, especially reading an item on the boards. Judges have said as much. Just limit it to idea changes (as you would normally for a paragraph break. :)
This is just my opinion of course, technically this is not needed (as TL noted).

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Rewrite
Tempest Saddle

Spoiler:

Aura moderate evocation and transmutation; CL 6th
Slot special; Price 32,000 gp; Weight 15 lbs.
Description
Electrum bolts burst from cyclones embossed on the seat of this dark, leather saddle. The saddle resizes with the peel of thunder when placed on any small or medium quadruped. The creature’s eyes flash lightning as a raging tempest gathers around it.
The tempest winds grant a fly speed equal to the creature’s normal move (average maneuverability) and it gains a +3 bonus to fly skill checks. Flying quadrupeds gain +10 feet to their fly. Raging clouds create concealment (20% miss chance in combat) for the creature. The saddle may be activated once per day and lasts for 6 minutes or until the creature lands.
The flying creature trails dark, whirling clouds. As a full round action the creature may circle an area to the length of double its fly speed (with the appropriate Fly checks for turning). Non-magical winds inside this area increase by one category. For every two rounds spent circling, the winds increase another step (maximum Windstorm). These winds do not affect the creature. Any spells with the air or electricity descriptor cast inside this tempest may deafen targets as with the Thundering Spell feat.

When not active, a rider mounting the tempest saddle partially turns into dark clouds. The creature may carry a cloudy rider its size or smaller even if it normally couldn’t. Attacking or casting spells with somatic components requires the rider concentrate to become solid (DC 20).
An animal with intelligence of 3 or less must be trained to use the saddle, requiring two weeks and a handle animal check (DC 25). This counts as two tricks.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Items, Thundering Spell, fly, gaseous form, wind wall; Cost 16,000 gp

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"By the rules if a vehicle is wrecked it comes to a sudden stop. You are adding the chance to avoid a sudden stop without entailing what the effects would be."

What I was attempting was to give the vehicle driver some sort of chance to avoid the sudden stop and to bring the vehicle to a halt gracefully. I felt that always being subject to a sudden stop might have been a bit much.

I agree with not needing the "sinking" - I wasn't sure whether to mention both but on re-reading the prd, you are right. It is unnecessary and falls into the restating the rules. Good catch thanks.

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Tempest Saddle

I like the idea here. However, not the way it's written. For instance, you say "The tempest winds grant a fly speed equal to the creature’s normal move (average maneuverability) and it gains a +3 bonus to fly skill checks. Flying quadrupeds gain +10 feet to their fly. " where it would probably read better as "The tempest wind grants the creature a fly speed equal to its normal move, with average maneuverability. Creatures that could already fly gain a +10 ft. bonus to their fly speed."

Notice that I left out the "+3 bonus to fly" bit. That's because I think that it should probably give the user a flat bonus to fly, something like "While wearing the saddle, the creature can make fly checks at the saddle's modifier of +10, or their own, whichever is better."

I also think that the storm clouds and miss chance are cool, but they begin turning this into the "everything storm related in a can" item. Especially when you add in the doubling wind speed in a cone and granting Thundering Spell to everyone within the area. Doubly so because the effect is based on the fly speed, which means really fast creatures get a much better bonus slow ones.

And then you have the wearer becoming kinda gaseous when they're not flying? And it requires training to use? ... Okay, I kinda like the training to use bit, but you've gone way overboard on this item.

Let's pare it down.

Clearly, your concept is flying like a storm. Stick with that - the saddle turns a mount into a flying mount, and keep the storm theme.

Then, pick *one* of the laundry-list of powers you have: fly skill/speed bonus; miss chance in flight; increasing wind; granting metamagic bonuses; turning the wearer incorporeal.

And cap it off with the training, left as-is.

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OK, catching up a bit:
Anthony: I think this was your best effort yet, by far. You're playing with a really interesting niche that hasn't been dealt with yet and could be a lot of fun in any campaign with vehicles. Imagine having this in S&S, and taking over some enemy's ship? I can't see anyone not thinking this would be a fun gadget, even if it's not one that gets used a lot. I might even see it as a low-cost consumable, in that you couldn't get the spider back. Once it's moved a mile away, it dies. Could save you some words. (Otherwise I would probably call for another d4 roll to get it back to the hoop, since no one's going to remember the earlier d4 roll and it just adds to the bookkeeping.)

Started going through it by line, but I realized you've already gotten a lot of excellent advice, so stopped after this paragraph. : )

"Placing the spider upon a vehicle releases it to scuttle into the vehicle recesses until it locates the steering mechanism in d4 rounds when it then embraces it. The spider can also be thrown, as a throwing dagger, at a moving vehicle. On a hit, the spider attaches as per normal placement."

It should be vehicle's recesses. Is that 1d4? I think usually you include that first number, no? Can I not throw it at a stationary vehicle (or place it on a moving vehicle, if it's going by me)?

Ronars: Second version of the ever-beating talisman is much better. Does it only work if killed in combat? What if I get hit by a massive trap? I don't think you need "in effect" to start the second graf. Still, you've got a lot of good imagery, and I could see anyone wanting one of these. Having it in the neck spot could make for some tough choices for a player, which is a good thing.

Curaigh: I think Ronars has some good advice, especially when he says the writing can be a little choppy.

It should be peal, not peel, of thunder.

You later write "The tempest winds grant a fly speed equal to the creature’s normal move (average maneuverability) and it gains a +3 bonus to fly skill checks." I'd put the maneuverability after fly speed, since that's where you'd usually find it. The "it" in the second part of that sentence is intended to refer to the creature obviously, but more naturally it refers back to the previous subject, which would be tempest winds.

If I were to simply rewrite it (and I have no problem giving a bonus to Fly), it would be: The tempest winds grant a fly speed (average maneuverability) equal to the creature’s normal move and a +3 bonus to Fly checks. (Simply capping the Fly indicates you're referring to the skill, as opposed to the movement type).

Man, I need to come up with something else to post here. I've got two ideas I like enough to be potential submissions, so I'm holding onto those for now. Should really go do another pass on my fetching stick at least.

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Jacob W. Michaels wrote:

OK, catching up a bit:

It should be peal, not peel, of thunder.

lol I had corrected that in the rewrite, (I usually have two copies going.) Somewhen I started making changes in the original. By the time I pieced everything back together, I must have missed something :) More proof on the necessity of reading things aloud. :)

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Bifurcating Belt

Spoiler:

Aura moderate transmutation; CL 5th
Slot belt; Price 18,000 gp; Weight 1 lb.;
Description
A grim face comprises the buckle on this belt of thick iron. When the buckle is closed the face splits into two profiles turned back to back. As a free action the wearer may split her upper torso into two copies for the round. The two halves are back to back on the same pair of legs and each wields whatever weapons or shield the wearer was holding at the time. Each copy counts as an ally for the purpose of any combat teamwork feats she may have. The multiple arms grant an additional attack when the wearer takes a full attack action (at her highest attack bonus). The dual heads grant a +4 bonus to perception and prevent the wearer from being flanked. The bifurcation can be used two rounds a day. They need not be consecutive.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Items, beast shape III, haste; Cost 9,000 gp

Spoiler:
es I am trying to predict this year's meme caused by Wrath of the Titans. :)
For what it is worth, only six months to go until the real deal starts :)

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Curaigh wrote:

Bifurcating Belt** spoiler omitted **

** spoiler omitted **For what it is worth, only six months to go until the real deal starts :)

Just a quick tea break pop in, so this is initial gut reaction feedback, use or ignore as you deem fit...

You have an extraneous semi colon on the weight entry.

"When the..." is one of those "If" / "action" type of phrases, try to avoid "when" (it's one of those things I have recently learnt) - I can't think off hand how to rewrite.

Loved the idea of Zaphod Beeblebrox-ing the whole upper torso - very creepy and fun.

Possible problem : Although you termed "additional attack", if I now have 2 sets of heads and hands, does that mean I can double cast spells?

You might want to clarify on this.

Melee (& possibly Ranged) seem ok on first instinct but double spell casting might be a step too far, so I think you mean "additional melee attack"?

Costing seems pretty appropriate but I haven't had time to check against like priced items, so I can only say that it feels right.

Hope there's a useful snippet or two in that for you.

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I have been thinking some more on that belt (over think alert), but I think it's worth asking.

You haven't covered disarming, if the "extra body" duplicates weapons, what happens if the duplicate is disarmed?

E.g.

Hold my Holy Avenger please...

Now do your split thing, ---- oooh two holy avengers - one original and one copy!

Duplicate, please drop your Holy Avenger.

There you go trainee serf paladin of mine, your own spare holy avenger.

If anyone else wants one, we will do it again tomorrow :)

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It does say it duplicates weapons, but you're right about what happens afterward. A line saying the duplicated items disappear when the "second" body does is probably necessary. Rules-wise, I'd also have to doublecheck to see if it needs anything about double-wielding. What if you've got a character with two daggers already, basically taking two attacks at -2. Would that give him 3 attacks at -2? 4 attacks at -4? And can I use all the attacks on the same opponent (which would seem odd considering the description but I think allowable per the rules)?

Still, you've got lots of extra words, I think, to deal with those issues.

Beyond that, I like the item a lot. Simple, but effective. I could definitely see adding this to my list of treasure and having it shock the crap out of the PCs if I pulled it out on them when they were flanking an NPC. Even the name works well, I think. It'd look good on a character sheet as Clark likes to say.

Haste seems like a slightly odd choice of a spell, IMO, though I imagine you're using it to cover the change to action economy? I'm not sure if there's another spell you could use that would be appropriate level. Maybe not use anything and just price it as if you were using haste, though that's a bit odd.

Speaking of which, I think the pricing probably works. It gives you a lot of bang for the buck -- especially activating it as a free action; I'd make it a swift action, I think, though I could see even that getting a ding from the judges -- but on the other hand you can only use it for two rounds. I think I might try to get the number of rounds up per day a little higher (maybe more like 3-6 in a day?) even if that would add to the cost. (Though again -- and I realize I'm being wishy-washy, I do like that this could be effective at almost any level as is...)

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Thanks for the suggestions. I know how to fix them but will wait for any other comments. (hint: it is in a different part of the item :) I get more feedback on the rewrites than I am on the original write so far.

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Curaigh wrote:
... I get more feedback on the rewrites than I am on the original write so far. ...

He he, I so feel your pain.

Although I do wonder if what is happening is that our first drafts don't need so much feedback due to both an overall improvement on first draft quality and possibly the number of flaws being reduced, whereas rewrites tend to need more feedback to provide that detailed polish for the final draft.

Does that make sense? It did when I typed it.

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