Glad to see you come back, Nick. I hope I'll be seeing more stellar work from you in the future - or at the very least some lively banter on these boards like in the good old days.
Well I'll be damned. Nick Logue is back. All us folks here in Buffalo have missed you quite a bit and I for one am glad to see you back. Man. Seems like you've had it rough. I can understand that. I've been there. I'm glad you got through it OK. I ain't even mad about the money. It's just not a big deal to me. I know I can't come to Piazo Con since I'm an East coaster but I hope I see you at GenCon, maybe even at Iron GM.
You see, I played in this game one time at a little con in Buffalo called UBCon with you and it showed me how I wanted to play games. In fact I was just hanging out with Daina and Kevin Burke today and they even remember me saying I want to run games like Nick Logue. Since then I've been involved in Iron GM and came in second one year, got beat by Steve Helt, got to write a little for WotC, (I know that's a bit sacrilegious round these parts, sorry) have a blog and podcast about gaming, and am one of the partners putting on a gaming convention in Buffalo at the Buffalo Niagara convention center this year. Nick. I never would of done any of this if I hadn't played in that game of yours. I wouldn't of looked around and realized how much more there was to gaming and how rewarding it could be beyond my home game. We have a community of over 300 gamer's spanning all of Western New York and including three colleges that I helped build and it really all started with just that one game. The friendships it created for me and ideas it put into my head inspired me. All this is worth way more than the few dollars I lost at Sinister Adventures. Also, the knowledge that you're actually still alive and kicking makes me feel better too. I hope to game with you sometime this year and maybe you'll let me run a game for you using nothing but a warehouse map, six pregens, and no prep, because that's how you taught me to roll.
Chris!
Thanks for the warm and wonderful post. I remember my UBCon experience with great and thriving joy. I really enjoyed that session with Daina, Kevin and yourself. Wild good times! Thanks for the kind words, and I'm glad to hear the Buffalo gaming scene is booming - thanks to the efforts of people like yourself. Keep up the amazing work. I look forward to throwing the dice with you again next time I shuffle back to Ole Buffalo.
Nick
Greetings Nick.
Hope you still have my email on your list.
Hi Radavel!
Just to be sure, hit the addy in Lou's original post on this thread.
I will be pleased as punch to hopefully shake your hand at paizocon Mr. Logue, as The Hook Mountain Massacre drew me and my friends fully into Pathfinder. I hope that if you never write anyhting again and open a used car lot, you will be able to at least be able to look back on this time fondly as you relieve yourself of these troubles.
Welcome back Nick! As i said in the other thread I'll keep my preorder for RC. I'll even push a few more dollars towards Sinister by finally picking up those indulgences here on paizo.
Good luck with the freelancing!
Welcome back Nick. I'll add my voice to those that are happy to hear from you and glad that things are looking up for you personally. That, in my mind, is far more important than the book(s). Hopefully this will be the beginning of many more good things to come for you.
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Welcome back Nick!
Depression is a serious illness and it takes a lot of energy to crawl from that dark place back into the light.
Now that you are back, do not look back in shame but look forward to all the depraved and sick stuff you can inflict upon unsuspecting players.
Also Pett needs some verbal spanking. To cocky for his own good!
Kristian
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I will be pleased as punch to hopefully shake your hand at paizocon Mr. Logue, as The Hook Mountain Massacre drew me and my friends fully into Pathfinder. I hope that if you never write anyhting again and open a used car lot, you will be able to at least be able to look back on this time fondly as you relieve yourself of these troubles.
The Internet is a big place so I've started a new policy of only skimming messages since people write way too much for simple concepts. Your post is my first attempt at this and so far I think the technique is working splendidly. That all said, I'm now ready to reply to you.
Glutton, you've got anger-management issues and you're not a trustworthy friend. I suggest less caffeine and more marshmallows.
<Grin>
"One of the primary issues preventing this is recovering the art from Nick's crashed hard drive and/or getting his artist's to resend it, years later."
Two things, if the art work is the hold up could we just forgo the art and just have the product?
I have also pre-ordered and I have not asked for a refund, is there a way to verify that I am still on the list. I am worried with the way it was stated that the records may not be all there.
"One of the primary issues preventing this is recovering the art from Nick's crashed hard drive and/or getting his artist's to resend it, years later."Two things, if the art work is the hold up could we just forgo the art and just have the product?
I have also pre-ordered and I have not asked for a refund, is there a way to verify that I am still on the list. I am worried with the way it was stated that the records may not be all there.
Read the very first post in this thread. It tells you which email address to send your query.
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"One of the primary issues preventing this is recovering the art from Nick's crashed hard drive and/or getting his artist's to resend it, years later."Two things, if the art work is the hold up could we just forgo the art and just have the product?
I have also pre-ordered and I have not asked for a refund, is there a way to verify that I am still on the list. I am worried with the way it was stated that the records may not be all there.
Hi there - sorry it took me a bit to get back to you. I've been busy
/BEGIN SHAMELESS BIT OF PROMOTION
hooking up some more conventions for Iron GM and helping my brother Shirak get his kickstarter off the ground.
/END SHAMELESS BIT OF PROMOTION
Here are the answers to your questions:
1. Regarding putting out the book without art -- if something happens, and Nick can't get his artists to find and resend the print-ready art, I'll talk to him about this. No promises, but its certainly an option. Am I saying RC is coming out? No.
However, the outpouring of support from the community has been overwhelming. There are offers of free art, free cartography, free (award-winning) layout and even an uber-generous cash gift to offset some of my expenses in sorting through things. You people are amazing, and I'm proud to be part of this community. Very proud.
I'm taking all this into consideration and working hard to do what can be done to get you folks the product you deserve. Am I committing to publishing RC now? No.
I just don't want to promise anything I can't 100% deliver. I'm sure anyone who has been following this saga understands why.
Let me get people's money back -- or at least have that process kicked off and in train -- and then I'll assess where everything is at and report back. Probably put up a website to chat about things, so I don't keep clogging Paizo's airwaves.
2. z28camaro90, if you (or anyone else) wants to confirm they are on the list, but is still deciding about whether you want your money back or not, then Dark Sasha had it write -- just email your request to bgmcubed@gmail.com, and we'll respond with answers (or refunds) in the order queries are received.
Thanks again, everyone. Paizoans are just the best.
PS Anyone figure out what bgmcubed means? :)
PS Anyone figure out what bgmcubed means? :
"Better give me my money."
or...
"[REDACTED], give me my money." (In true ODB style.)
>Sing-song<
"Baby, Ah got your money.
Ah said, oh, hey, hey.
Baby, Ah got your money."
-Ben.
(And now you cannot unsee this post. ;) Side note, I mailed this answer to the address last week, so you can confirm it there. Subject: Accolades )
Lou: What else is there to say? You're a prince among men and a grade A friend.
Nick: Glad to see you in the online world again. While I never pre-ordered RC I DID reviews on the Indulgences for Renaissance Magazine (Which I THINK my Editor there published them, He also ventures into Luddite territory, still to this day sends blank emails then asks if I understood what he said in them... *Shudder*) and was planning to review RC when it came out. Crap happens, I'm glad to hear you're getting your feet under you again on things. I've always enjoyed your writing and you gave me advice on monsters more than once. I doubt you remember but you liked one I did so much you planned on using it in RC I think. The Ghouid (Ghoul-squid combination still gives my players nightmares.) The fact you liked it that much was a highlight for me. You're a great game designer, writer and a Gentleman to stand up and publicly say what you have in this thread. Were I wearing a hat I would tip it to you sir.
-Michael-
All of your help is much appreciated Lou. I received a refund notice today for the pre-order of Ebon Shroud and Gamemaster's Cookbook. I'm still holding out that the RC will see the light of day. I think it will be an awesome resource.
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I got a paypal receipt saying "Here's your refund as requested." and then it was immediately followed by another email saying "A PayPal payment to you has been canceled" - is there something I need to do or not do at this point?
Hey DitheringFool, nope nothing you should do or not do at this point. I accidentally refunded you the same amount 2x. The canceled message is about me canceling one of those instances. Please check your Paypal account. You should have your refund, now.
Got my email, and just transferred the money back to my bank. Thank for the refund.
If you guys ever decide to publish something like Ebon Shroud, please let me know, and I'll buy it.
-- david
Papa.DRB
Wow, just wow. I recently cancelled my backing of the Midgard Tales due to Nick being announced as involved. I am a great fan of Nicks work, and pre-ordered the Cookbook and RC (and have most/all of the rest of his stuff). When I found out it was not happening, I was saddened. When I didn't get a refund I was annoyed but I was angered by never receiving an apology.
But now Nick has come on here, and laid it all out, and the community has reacted. Hell we are all human and it was never the money I cared about just the lack of an email saying "sorry I can't fulfil my promise". So thanks for coming back, Nick, and fessing up. It must have been a hard few years and a hard post to write.
I am glad to see you back, and (although I will ask for a refund) if RC does come out I'll be in with bells on. And I have rejoined the Midgard Kickstarter and this thread has made my weekend.
To Lou, just wow what a guy.
Cheers
Scott
I'll be holding out for the Known Universe Gazetteer and Razor Coast, oh and Fire as She Bears. Speaking of FASB any news on thta front? Pricing, page count, when can I order it etc.
Welcome back,
Your dreams were your ticket out.Welcome back,
To that same old place that you laughed about.Well the names have all changed since you hung around,
But those dreams have remained and they're turned around.Who'd have thought they'd lead ya (Who'd have thought they'd lead ya)
Here where we need ya (Here where we need ya)Yeah we tease him a lot cause we've got him on the spot, welcome back,
Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back.
My regrets for the sappiness. I just know what its like to make a mistake and want to come home again.
@ Nick,
I haven't said nuthin' bro, because you don't owe me any money. It's good to see you again. And for awhile I didn't know what to say. But I read your post today and I remembered the good times. I remember you cheering me up when I was too scared to talk to somebody because I had screwed up. I rememeber ranting and raving at you for three pages in Blood of the Gorgon, and you diffused it with perfect good cheer and aplomb. I remember you cheering me up at GenCon, when I was too skeered to talk to a certain 3PP we both know. It was partially because of that conversation that I actually (eventually) dusted myself off and kept trying. I would still make mistakes, but I learned to deal with them instead of balling up in the fetal. It's good to see you again old friend.
While you were gone I grew up and wrote some stuff. I'd love to tell you all about it.
I'll be at PaizoCon too. Looking forward to seeing you.
Jim
EDIT: Sorry, I forgot the full version. Amazingly the lyrics synch very well, because they're less about a schoolteacher than an actor.
And I smile when I think how you must have been
And I know what a scene you were learning in
Was there something that made you come back again
And what could ever lead ya
(what could ever lead ya)
Back here where we need ya
(back here where we need ya)
Yeah we tease him a lot cause we got him on the spot
Welcome back, welcome back, welcome back, welcome back
Welcome back, welcome back
I'm out of the loop on the Sinister debacle, but I do know Nick does good work and it's good to have him back.
And judging from the monster of an apology post on the first page, I'd have to say well on that good sir. That takes some sheer guts.
I just got my refund as well.
Thanks and cheers!
I have received my refund as well. I am a much happier person, and I really hope to see more work from Nick in the future. I hope I get the opportunity to get RC in the future
Thanks very much Lou and welcome back Nick :)
I've gotten my money back for the AGC, and I'm sticking it out for RC, so we'll see how that goes.
-Ben.
I'm of the feeling now that, as I can afford to lose the money, then I'm happy to wait and see.
If I receive the product (PDF, book, whatever) then great. If not, then Lou deserves some compensation for the work he's put into trying to keep this project afloat.
I'd also like to point out that this is a great gesture on the part of Nic and Lou. I should note that other publishers have not been so forthcoming. My pre-order for 2320AD from Quiklink ended in nothing. I ended up having to pay again to buy the PDF from Drivethru.
I received my refund for Ebon Shroud. Many thanks to Nick and Lou for arranging it. I'm still holding out hope for a release of Razor Coast some day though.
It's great to see Nick back and getting this sorted out. I just hope he appreciates how much Lou has done in helping out as much as everyone else does.
If I receive the product (PDF, book, whatever) then great. If not, then Lou deserves some compensation for the work he's put into trying to keep this project afloat.
Preach it!
And I'm optimistic > looking forward to RC when it hits the shelves in 2013!!! :)
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Hey Nick
I speak for the whole Shackleton clan (or Shacklefolk as Buhlman likes to call us) when I say we are immensely happy to see you back on your feet again. As someone who has many loved ones who suffer or have suffered from depression I know how much strength you had to find to come out and tell everyone what happened.
Thrilled to see you back! Don't take on too much too soon. A healthy life is even (dare I say it) more important than gaming.
If you need a source of strength and power I understand cigarettes will give you that! I have it on good authority from a superhero friend I once knew.
Glen Shackleton
Hey, if RC actually does come out, I'd be more than happy to play whatever the asking price is for that. I LOVE me some dark, gritty pirating and wereshark cultists.
Just a bump; I emailed you on April 10th.
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Hi BenS,
I do have your email requesting a refund on April 10th. I will refund your money. Regrets for the delay, but I can process your refund faster if you can find and email your Paypal receipt to bgmcubed@gmail.com
The same goes for anyone who has not yet received a refund and did not submit a Paypal receipt. Not that I asked you to do so.
ORIGINAL NOTION
===============
The original notion was simply to repay people in the order they requested a refund. This remains the case if you can also email in a Pay Pal receipt. Everyone else has to hang in there a little bit, until I can finish sorting through a few thousand Pay Pal emails (or more accurately, until the person I hired to do so finished sorting through them).
WHY?
================
Here's why: Nick's Pay Pal account keeps 3 months of records. Period. If it kept 3-4 years of records, I could simply look up everyone's requests and repay them in the order of receipt. No such luck. Until we finish culling all the Pay Pal emails from their various folders, then turning them into a master spreadsheet of every order, cancellation, re-order, sales tax, currency conversions, etc. etc. -- I have two categories of refunds to process.
TWO CATEGORIES - WHICH AM I?
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1. Send in a Pay Pal receipt (transaction #s alone aren't enough) with your request, and I can use Nick's account to refund you in the order of the request.
2. Can't find your Pay Pal receipt, changed emails, only have a transaction number, have a particularly complicated transaction, etc. and I can use Nick's account to refund you but only after we finish manually processing those email transaction receipts into a master list.
BOTTOM LINE
===========
Sorry for the delay, but we are working on your request and will refund your money as soon as we can.
Thanks Lou. I did a print screen from my PayPal account (it was May 2008) and emailed it to you.
Just a bump so I can keep track of this thread.
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I've gotten the art from all but one artist. We're in communication but are still hashing through some rights issues. Unfortunately, he made a LOT of very key art. Will definitely post more when I know more.
Meanwhile, about 75-80% of the refund requests have been honored. I will refund the others as soon as we finish reconstructing the books.
In the meantime anyone who requested a refund and has not recieved it? I can process your request more swiftly if you can email your original PayPal receipt to bgmcubed@gmail.com. Otherwise I'll still see you are refunded, it'll just take longer.
Thanks for your patience,
Lou
Ah, good news, I had missed this thread! As someone who did a bunch of free copyediting on this thing I want it to come out just so it's out...
I won't say I'm not griped by how all this was handled and I don't think "all is forgiven" is quite my opinion, but I counted my order as a sunk cost long ago so eh. But props to Nick for apologizing and coming clean.
And I love Nick's writing and will be happy to buy more of it, so long as it's an actual delivered product in stores I can put in my hand before plunking down money on it.
And lastly, super props to Lou for working to make sure good triumphs for no real good reason except to do it.
Thanks Lou. I did a print screen from my PayPal account (it was May 2008) and emailed it to you.
Not much more I can add to this, which was May 20th.
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Hey BenS,
I received one pay pal receipt on May 20th from a person who has the real world initials of MP, and I issued them a refund. Refund requests before that came in on May 17th and May 8th. Requests after that came in on June 11th and 12th.
If MP is not you, then I never received your receipt. Please recheck the email address to which you sent the request. It should have gone to bgmcubed@gmail.com. It's possible a typo is the culprit.
Thanks,
Lou
I will refund the others as soon as we finish reconstructing the books.
Lou, this is what I'm interested in. Where would be the best place to keep updated on the reconstruction of Razor Coast? This thread?
Thanks!
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oops - sorry. I feared for this interpretation after I posted it, but had the thought too late to correct it. Sinvel, I meant the accounting books, as in what a bookkeeper tracks.
At this time I have _no_ updates to make on former Sinister products, but if and when I do I will post in threads specifically for those products.
Regrets for the confusion.