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Addressing problems with Monks


Suggestions/House Rules/Homebrew


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Addressing problems with Monks

The monk is a good class, let me make that clear at the outset, but it is a class that suffers from some fundamental problems. While monks can be effective, they have real problems performing in some arenas. Fundamentally, the monk is a combat class that has major problems dealing damage to foes at the mid-to-high range of the CR spectrum. They are also MAD classes, requiring several good ability scores to work effectively.

There have been a lot of suggestions for ‘fixing’ monks, such as arminas’ monk here. However, they all seem to require re-writing the class in some way. I can’t see this happening for a long time yet, so when DeathQuaker pointed out the issues the monk faces I came up with easily implementable ideas based on some suggestions from Skull.

Leaving aside the currently undecided matter of exactly how flurry-of-blows works, they can be summed up as follows:

At mid-level and onwards, monks have difficulty hitting and damaging many CR-equivalent foes. The issue is due to a combination of factors:


  • Monk weapons deal very little damage, typically having poor threat/critical qualities and dealing on average 1d6 per hit. If the monk uses weapons, he has to add ki focus to be able to use any of his special abilities through the weapon. The monks ¾ BAB means that he qualifies late for feats that can enhance damage. As MAD classes, monks tend to have less outstanding ability scores, so upping damage that way is not easy. The agile weapon property helps, but costs a +1 equivalence the monk can ill-afford (see below).

  • Unarmed strike delivers more damage, but lacks any enhancement bonus. This means that by level 20, the TWF fighter has +5 to hit over the monk, with Weapon Focus feats and weapon training on top of that again. In addition, he has weapon qualities that add to his damage still further. The Amulet of Mighty Fists is not a solution for the monk, having three major problems of its own: it is very expensive, is limited to +5 equivalence, and it takes up the amulet slot that the monk needs to keep pace with the combat classes’ AC. If the monk uses an AoMF to close the gap some way on hitting, he then loses on damage and AC.

  • Damage resistance. Overcoming DR is done in several ways, either deal more damage or use weapon properties that bypass it. A fighter with a +5 mithral holy sword will chop through most things. A monk’s unarmed strike does get past magic, lawful and by 16th level adamantine, but DR/magic isn’t challenging, DR/lawful is incredibly rare, and by 16th level adamantine arrives a little late to be of much use. Using an AoMF runs into the problem outlined above. As far as dealing more damage is concerned, also see above.

  • Just plain hitting the target: A monk’s ¾ BAB is limiting in other ways. While flurry-of-blows has the monk almost on parity to hit, the enhancement bonus on weapons (which are not very good) will suffer if the monk wants to do anything but hit the target.

  • Maneuvers: Some effort has been made to equalize the monk in terms of maneuvers. Unfortunately, the monk is still going to be behind the curve with ¾ BAB, when a fighter with a reach/trip weapon can also apply the weapon bonus, and his other abilities to CMB that the monk does not have. In short, whatever the monk does, the fighter will always be a lot better.

Now I don’t think we can fix all of these issues, and as the monk has a lot of other abilities I am not entirely sure that we should want to fix them all either. That said, there is a lot we can do to bring the monk up some so that they can be effective in combat while still leaving the dedicated combat classes ahead of the curve. Here are some ideas for ‘fixes’ in the form of feats and items that can make the monk better without unbalancing the game in their favor.

Monk Feats:

Ki Focused Strike
You can deliver damage that bypasses your foe's normal defenses.
Pre-requisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, ki-pool.
Benefit: When you expend a point of ki, your unarmed blows (or blows with a ki focus weapon) can for that round ignore any damage resistance a single target may have.

To be sure, the ki strike (adamantine) sort of goes here, but doesn’t at the same time. By requiring ki and focusing on DR rather than hardness, this is not the same ability. Instead the monk is attuning the ki to the creature’s vulnerabilities. Ki is a shallow resource, and this ability addresses one of the monk’s major disadvantages, particularly with unarmed strike, as the AoMF does not bypass any DR.

Improved Ki Focused Strike
You can deliver an attack that bypasses most of your target's defenses.
Pre-requisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, ki-pool, ki Focused Strike.
Benefit: When you expend a point of ki, your next unarmed blow (or blow with a ki focus weapon) is resolved as a touch attack, also ignoring any hardness or damage resistance. For the rest of your turn your blows (or blows with a ki focus weapon) may ignore any damage resistance a single target may have.

Some martial arts masters are reputed to be able to burst internal organs by focusing ki to flow past the defenses of the target and into their bodies. This simulates that, allowing the monk to ‘get in a good one’ on a target. However, as noted ki is a limited resource. A wise monk will save this for very high AC foes they would otherwise have problems striking.

Ringing the Gong
You deliver your unarmed strike at a distance.
Pre-requisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, ki-pool, ki Focused Strike, Improved ki Focused Strike.
Benefit: By expending a point of ki you may deliver one unarmed strike as a ranged touch attack on any target you can see within thirty feet.

An extension on the theme above, this isn’t really here to address a flaw so much as to complete the set.

Enhanced Ki Strike
You can amplify the benefits of your ki strike.
Pre-requisites: Improved Unarmed Strike, ki strike class feature.
Benefit: Your unarmed strikes (or strikes with a ki focus weapon) gain an Enhancement bonus to hit. For every four monk levels that you have, your unarmed strikes gain a +1 enhancement bonus to hit, to a maximum of +5.
Alternate Wording:
Benefit: Your unarmed strikes (or strikes with a ki focus weapon) gain an Enhancement bonus to hit. For every ki feat that you possess, your unarmed strikes gain a +1 enhancement bonus to hit, to a maximum of +5. ki feats are any feats that mention ki in their title (Extra ki, ki Throw, etc) or require ki to be expended to work.

This addresses the monks major issue of hitting the target at all. It does not replace or stack with magical enhancements, as it is only an ehancement bonus to hit, but it does help close the gap with the combat classes using magic weapons. It could be combined with the AoMF using the latter to supply weapon properties rather than enhancements to hit if so desired.

Items:

Gloves & Tabi of Striking
Aura feint evocation CL 5th
Slot Hands & Feet Price Enhancement bonus squared x 2,500gp.
DESCRIPTION
These gloves and tabi can only work if the set is worn in both hand and foot slots. The provide an enhancement bonus as a weapon to unarmed strikes, and may possess weapon qualities. The maximum enhancement equivalent is +10.
CONSTRUCTION
Craft Magic Arms & Armor, greater magic weapon, creator’s caster level must be at least three times the amulet’s bonus, plus any requirements of the melee weapon special abilities; Cost bonus squared x 1,250gp.

This item is not going to replace the AoMF – for one thing, while half the price it takes up two body slots, not inappropriate for an item enhancing the whole body. For another, it does not enhance natural weapons, only unarmed strikes.

Item Property:

Greater Ki Focus: As ki focus, a monk with these weapons can apply their ki abilities that they would normally focus through an unarmed strike through a weapon with this quality. Furthermore, the monk may substitute their unarmed strike damage for the damage dice of the weapon if they wish. This weapon quality is equivalent to a +2 bonus.

This is a biggee, it allows the monk to use a weapon AND get the advantage of their unarmed strike damage. On the flip side, they lose out on +2 worth of enhancements. That can be worth +2d6 damage, which makes the replacement of 1d6 with 2d10 at level 20 a lot more palatable. The biggest advantage of this feature is that a weapon can have a higher threat range than an unarmed strike, although using such a weapon usually requires another feat from the monk for the proficiency…


+10.


High Crit Weapon: Threat Range (18-20) OR High Crit Weapon: Multilplier (x3, x4) + Keen OR Improved Critical + Greater Ki Focus + Monk's Robe = Crazy.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Detect Magic wrote:
High Crit Weapon: Threat Range (18-20) OR High Crit Weapon: Multilplier (x3, x4) + Keen OR Improved Critical + Greater Ki Focus + Monk's Robe = Crazy.

High crit weapon = weapon proficiency feat

Greater ki focus = +2 equivelant

Plus, you almost certainly cannot flurry with it, so 3/4 BAB is your base (although this may work with another feat). Crazy, if you hit, if you confirm, if you can afford it and if you have the feats to spare. And if you have spent that much to do it, well, you deserve it. Bear in mind what other combat classes on full BAB will be doing at the same level...that +2 could be another 2d6 damage, and the multiplier will enhance their greater strength bonus and their other static bonuses. Even if the monk can out-damage them (unlikely given lower chances to hit) they still have equal Ac, better hit points etc.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules Subscriber

I wholeheartedly support the "fairly-priced +10-capped multi-slot full-body enhancement" approach here.

Really hoping someone working on Ultimate Equipment feels the same.


I think creating feats to fix the class is the wrong way to go about it. This would require my unarmed monk to get feats to make him viable instead of taking feats to give him a distinct flavor. Now, I whole heartedly agree that the monk needs magic weapons for their unarmed strikes (that allows a monk to use their unarmed strike damage) and hope in the next book they finally get handwraps or something to fix this problem.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
GM Kyle wrote:
I think creating feats to fix the class is the wrong way to go about it. This would require my unarmed monk to get feats to make him viable instead of taking feats to give him a distinct flavor. Now, I whole heartedly agree that the monk needs magic weapons for their unarmed strikes (that allows a monk to use their unarmed strike damage) and hope in the next book they finally get handwraps or something to fix this problem.

Unfortunately, Pathfinder 2.0 is still years away, so I am going for a 'quick fix' as opposed to a 'ground up re-write'. For one thing, if everyone agrees the feats are necessary for the monk to function, they will probably be incorporated into the next version of the monk having been thoroughly play-tested...


Well done, Dabbler. Well done.

Master Arminas


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Thanks. Darn, I must have done something right because no-one is suggesting changes or amendments or claiming it's broken...


I was under the impression that monks were supposed to deal with magic welding opponents due to having all good base saves. Also, when confronted with a fighter, ranger, (anti)paladin, etc... they could utilize weapons to trip or disarm their enemy. Furthermore, doesn't stunning fist create a more level playing field? Also, could brace knuckles solve the weapon problem? If you want to use special monk abilities such as stunning fist one could just kick the opponent instead of using the knuckles.

Personally, I think monks are pretty cool as is, but I do think these new feats are cool as well.

I played with a DM who didn't like monks. He thought they were too powerful.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
The Albatross wrote:
I was under the impression that monks were supposed to deal with magic welding opponents due to having all good base saves.

Sadly, the argument is, "how does your monk deal with a flying invisible wizard behind a wall of force?"

Yes, monks are decent mage-bashers when they can catch them. But then so are any of the fighting classes.

The Albatross wrote:
Also, when confronted with a fighter, ranger, (anti)paladin, etc... they could utilize weapons to trip or disarm their enemy.

Sadly the fighter is better: for example he can take a reach tripping weapon like a lucern hammer, and add the weapon's bonus AND his weapon training as well as Greater Weapon Focus to his CMB. The monk just gets basic, plus an amulet of mighty fists if he can afford one.

The Albatross wrote:
Furthermore, doesn't stunning fist create a more level playing field?

It has three problems:

1) it requires a fortitude save, so any combat class you are fighting is playing to it's strength.
2) You need to hit with it. As mentioned, with the cost of the AoMF you are behind the hitting curve.
3) you need a ki-focus weapon to use it with a weapon to overcome point 2.

The Albatross wrote:
Also, could brace knuckles solve the weapon problem? If you want to use special monk abilities such as stunning fist one could just kick the opponent instead of using the knuckles.

Brass Knuckles were ruled to NOT use the monk's unarmed damage when a monk uses them. They are just another sub-standard weapon the monk can use. Kicking comes back to hitting at all, and again we are back to the cost/problems with A0MF.

The Albatross wrote:
Personally, I think monks are pretty cool as is, but I do think these new feats are cool as well.

Thank you!

The Albatross wrote:
I played with a DM who didn't like monks. He thought they were too powerful.

I have heard a few people say that. I think it comes down to monks being hard to kill rather than being powerful. If a monk flees, he is hard to stop and hard to track. Good saves makes it hard to enspell him, and a conventional fighter cannot catch him without haste. He is quite self-sufficient, yes, but can he do anything to the foe? If he has to go up against an equal threat, say an equal level fighter, what are his chances?

A rogue can hide and sneak-attack, and use hit-and-run tactics. A monk can run, but his problem is in hitting.


I've banged my head against this particular wall myself. I did it trying to hit every problem at once. :(

http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz5042?Fixing-the-Pathfinder-Monk-with-1-new-arch etype#21

My thoughts on what you've done here:

Monks don't have a problem with maneuvers from their 3/4 BAB, thanks to Maneuver Training at level 3. They have a problem with terrible feat support FOR their maneuvers, caused by BAB requirements and prerequisite feats. As for the feats you listed, Ringing the Gong should probably affect all attacks in the round, just because at high levels you'd be burning a LOT of Ki for up to 7 attacks depending on the situation.

Otherwise: You're entirely correct. As always, monks just HITTING a target is the big weakness.

I like what you've done here. ;D Awesome.


I have always looked at the AMF as a way of adding abilities to monk (and druid) attacks and just used G. magic fang for the enhancement bonus. The price of the AMF makes more sense this way because its assuming it's adding to already enhanced, by magic fang/g. magic fang, attacks.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
ReconstructorFleet wrote:
Monks don't have a problem with maneuvers from their 3/4 BAB, thanks to Maneuver Training at level 3. They have a problem with terrible feat support FOR their maneuvers, caused by BAB requirements and prerequisite feats.

Agreed.

ReconstructorFleet wrote:
As for the feats you listed, Ringing the Gong should probably affect all attacks in the round, just because at high levels you'd be burning a LOT of Ki for up to 7 attacks depending on the situation.

Yes, but then you'd be putting the Zen Archer out of a job. This allows you to make one attack and move. After you have moved, you'll be in a position to FoB next round.

ReconstructorFleet wrote:
Otherwise: You're entirely correct. As always, monks just HITTING a target is the big weakness.

Just so. The most viable monk builds I made in 3.5 were combined with psychic warriors and used Unavoidable Strike to get hits in and buff up.

ReconstructorFleet wrote:
I like what you've done here. ;D Awesome.

Thank you.

BlueAria wrote:
I have always looked at the AMF as a way of adding abilities to monk (and druid) attacks and just used G. magic fang for the enhancement bonus. The price of the AMF makes more sense this way because its assuming it's adding to already enhanced, by magic fang/g. magic fang, attacks.

According to the new suggested ruling (final ruling pending) Greater Magic Fang can only provide a +1 to all of a monk's unarmed strikes, or a multiple bonus to one of them (no more than half your attacks). Plus, you need somebody to cast it. Yes, if your party has a friendly druid, great. If not, you have a problem with having to expend a lot of money on expendable resources.

If you use AoMF to provide abilities, you just lost out on actually hitting the target without that caster. If you have to rely on somebody else for your character to be effective, then your character isn't effective.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

An idea spawned by another thread I'll repeat here:

Craft Magic Tattoo
You can create tattoos that confer a permanent magical effect.
Pre-requisites: Caster level 5th or Master Craftsman [Craft (tattoo)]
Benefit: You can craft magical tattoos.

Magic Tattoo:
Magical tattoos occupy body-slots as conventional magic items do. They occupy a body-slot appropriate to their function - hence a magic tattoo that enhances vision will occupy the 'eyes' slot and will appear visible there. Normal items worn in these body slots will not function unless the magic tattoo is de-activated.

Some magic tattoos can be activated or deactivated, and to do say requires a non-equivalent action, much like drawing or sheathing a weapon.

Kinds of Tattoos:
A magic tattoo can emulate any type of magic item that can be manufactured by other means, as long as the other requirements for spells, caster level etc. are met, as follows:

Armour: This must occupy the body slot, and does not stack with worn armour - treat as if it were bracers of defence.
Weapons: Only natural weapons and unarmed strikes can be enhanced with magical tattoos. Each natural weapon has to be supported by a tattoo on that body part. Claws may be enchanted at a 150% weapon cost to include two claws. Unarmed Strikes may be enchanted for 200% of the price of magic weapons, treat as a double weapon for purposes of properties; unarmed strikes take up both the hand and foot body slots.
Potions: Magic tattoos cannot emulate potions, they must instead emulate 'unsloted' magic items with charges or uses per day.
Rings: Magical rings can be emulated, but only those that would belong more appropriately in other body slots.
Rods: Rods occupy the arm body slots. Rods that function as weapons cannot be emulated.
Staves: Staves cannot be emulated at all.
Wondrous Items: Any item normally worn on the body can be emulated, even if it does not occupy a body-slot (nor does the tattoo). If it does occupy a slot, the tattoo usually occupies the same slot.

Special Tattoos: There are some kinds of tattoos that are quite unique, treat these as new magic items as regards pricing. Other tattoos may be made that can only work in the presence or contact with another tattoo - in these cases, reduce the cost of the tattoo by 30%.


Dabbler, just one question and one observation.

a) What's this got to do with Monks (i.e. why not create a new thread for this)? Is your goal here to provide a light, unencumbering magic item? What if my monk doesn't believe in "scarring" the body? :P

b) There is a supplement for "d20 Fantay Roleplaying" produced by Alderac Entertainment Group called "Mercenaries". I'm sure many here have seen it. I know I've been introduced to it by others and it contains the concept of the Tattoo Mage and also introduced the ideas of merc group tattoos as a way of binding indebted mercs to the merc company.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

It cropped up in another thread on Monks, that they have magic tattoos that emulate magic items - specifically for enchanting unarmed strike as a weapon. This was my response, and I posted it here because in that respect it is relevant.


Yeah, I just caught up in that thread. Thanks for the explanation.


While the foot and hand slots are likely the least utilized slots, I don't think it's fair to ask the monk to give up two just to be on par with everyone else that uses weapons.

I would simply recommend instead an "Monk's Meditation Beads of Mighty Unarmed Attacks," that is priced exactly like a weapon, that only work for unarmed attacks (not all natural attacks), which would also apply for some combat maneuvers.

Monk's Meditation Beads for all intents and purposes act like a weapon (can be made of exotic materials, can be sundered, disarmed, etc). These beads can also be applied to a monk's combat maneuvers as though they were a weapon of the appropriate type, but only one type of combat maneuver, selected at creation.


What if a DM house-ruled d10 HD/full BAB monks?

Taldor

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/item-creation-feats/inscribe-magical-tattoo-i tem-creation


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Takamonk wrote:

While the foot and hand slots are likely the least utilized slots, I don't think it's fair to ask the monk to give up two just to be on par with everyone else that uses weapons.

I would simply recommend instead an "Monk's Meditation Beads of Mighty Unarmed Attacks," that is priced exactly like a weapon, that only work for unarmed attacks (not all natural attacks), which would also apply for some combat maneuvers.

Monk's Meditation Beads for all intents and purposes act like a weapon (can be made of exotic materials, can be sundered, disarmed, etc). These beads can also be applied to a monk's combat maneuvers as though they were a weapon of the appropriate type, but only one type of combat maneuver, selected at creation.

I would agree with a single slot-item, except that there is a point that the monk has more flexibility with their unarmed strike and flurry-of-blows than other classes get. There is also the point that Paizo don't want the Amulet of Mighty Fists made redundant. This option then costs more than a single weapon, less than the AoMF, but takes up two body-slots. So the AoMF still has advantages, the monk still has to part with more resources, and (hopefully) everyone is happy.

It's a compromise, of course, but hopefully one the devs will like.

Rune wrote:
What if a DM house-ruled d10 HD/full BAB monks?

That would solve some minor problems, but not all. It still would not address the important point that the monk has few enhancement options, though. Flurry-of-blows is already at full BAB, as are maneuvers, so there's really no huge change save in qualifying for feats and making single attacks - and having more hit points.

@Nezthalak, I am having problems finding that page, the link does not seem to lead where it should. I knew there was already a system for making magic tattoos, but couldn't find it to reference it. I'd rather expand on an existing system than replace it.

Taldor

I believe its more geared towards the Varisian tattoos and the tattooed sorcerer archetype. Most info came out from Inner Sea World Guide Campaign setting.

varisian tattoo

Item creation feat - inscribe magical tattoo

I would think that Paizo could provide new tattoos with martial applications in the upcoming UE guide.


I think we should summarize all of the problems that have been determined for monk somewhere. Either here or the thread I started. I think it's a project that needs doing. XD


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I agree, RF. I don't have time to do that today, though. We also need to link to this thread where they can play-test some of our ideas if we ask them nicely?

Nezthalak, that description of magic tattoos is nearly perfect! All we actually need is a clarification on it being able to act like Craft Magic Weapons & Armour when applied to a monk's unarmed strike, and that it will take up two body-slots.


@Dabbler

When and why were the brass knuckles ruled not to use the monk's unarmed damage? Is there a link you can point me to?


The Albatross wrote:

@Dabbler

When and why were the brass knuckles ruled not to use the monk's unarmed damage? Is there a link you can point me to?

Here ya go.


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Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Here's a suggestion that just occurred to me regarding the monk's ability at 'skirmishing'. Well, two suggestions actually:

One is to allow, at a certain level, the monk to get a 'short flurry' as a standard action. Say two attacks at 8th level, and three attacks at 15th level.

Alternatively, have the monks, enhanced speed allow to make a longer '5'step', so that at 6th level they may move 10' instead of 5', at 12th level they may move 15' instead of 5', and at 18th level they may move 20' instead of 5'.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Building on that idea:

Ki Flurry
You can launch multiple attacks in a standard action.
Pre-requisites: Flurry of Blows class feature, monk level 8th.
Benefit: At 8th level monk, you may expend a point from your ki pool to make a short flurry of blows as a standard action; you may make two attacks, as if the first and third attacks of your flurry of blows. At 15th level, this increases to three attacks, as if the first, third and fifth attacks from the flurry of blows.
Normal: You may only normally expend a ki point to gain an extra attack on a full attack action.


Dabbler wrote:

Here's a suggestion that just occurred to me regarding the monk's ability at 'skirmishing'. Well, two suggestions actually:

One is to allow, at a certain level, the monk to get a 'short flurry' as a standard action. Say two attacks at 8th level, and three attacks at 15th level.

PHB2 had a pair of feats that allowed a second and third attack when using Spring Attack (at -5 and -10, like other iteratives), which you could take at BAB +12 and +18. I could see the "short flurry" trigger for monks at level 12 and 18.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I used 8th and 15th because those are points where the monk gets extra attacks from FoB.


Dabbler wrote:

Here's a suggestion that just occurred to me regarding the monk's ability at 'skirmishing'. Well, two suggestions actually:

One is to allow, at a certain level, the monk to get a 'short flurry' as a standard action. Say two attacks at 8th level, and three attacks at 15th level.

Alternatively, have the monks, enhanced speed allow to make a longer '5'step', so that at 6th level they may move 10' instead of 5', at 12th level they may move 15' instead of 5', and at 18th level they may move 20' instead of 5'.

I like that suggestion a lot!

It keeps very much with the spirit of the monk as being fast and agile.


Dabbler wrote:
Alternatively, have the monks, enhanced speed allow to make a longer '5'step', so that at 6th level they may move 10' instead of 5', at 12th level they may move 15' instead of 5', and at 18th level they may move 20' instead of 5'.

Something I was thinking of was, instead of the Monk's normal Fast Movement class feature, allow the Monk to take a 5-foot step even if they've moved through other means starting at level 3. From the 6th level and every three levels after that, the Monk can take an additional 5-foot step each turn. This will end with a Monk that's slower generally in sheer speed, but can move quite a bit during a flurry of blows.

I don't really know if it'll end up being overpowered or anything however.


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

In my own redesign I opted for the 'short flurry' on expending a ki point, I think it keeps it simpler.


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I had this idea in another thread, and thought I would add it in here where it belongs:

Ki Mysticism
You are able to use your ki to achieve effects that others can normally only achieve through magic.
Pre-requisite: Ki Pool class feature.
Benefit: Choose one 0-level and one 1st-level spell from any spell list. You may now manifest the effects of these spells by expending ki. You must expend one point of ki for the 1st level spell effect, and you may manifest the 0-level spell effect as many times as desired as long as you have ki in your ki-pool. The time taken to do so is the same as the casting time of the spell, and requires only a somatic component and any material components costing more than 1gp. If the time taken is one standard action or less it does not provoke an attack of opportunity. The casting level of the spell is always equal to your monk level -3. This feat also adds a point to your ki-pool.
Special: You may take this feat multiple times. The second time you take it, you may select one 0-level and one first level spell, or one second level spell activated with two points of ki. Selecting this feat a second time adds two points to your ki. The third time you may select a third level spell, manifested with three points of ki, and adding three points to your ki pool, and so on up to fourth level spells. You may not at any time have access to manifest more of a higher level spell than you have of the level below it.
This feat may be selected as a monk bonus feat available at sixth level and onwards.


Dabbler wrote:

I had this idea in another thread, and thought I would add it in here where it belongs:

Ki Mysticism
You are able to use your ki to achieve effects that others can normally only achieve through magic.

I like this idea a lot. The spells available should be specific for the campaign, though. Some campaigns might allow only spells affecting the monk internally (bull's strength and similar, no fly nor even enlarge person), while others might be more lenient and still others might even allow flinging fireballs (or only allow elemental spells).

As a side effect the feat Extra Ki should be improved (at least to +4), otherwise there would be no compelling reason to take it over Ki Mysticism.


Hmm Ki Mysticism + Chill Touch + Flurry... Me likes!


Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Thank you! It kind of pushes the monk further into the utility of a caster rather than keeping them as a pure class. It also means you do not have to be a special archetype to use this kind of ability.

I confess I was inspired by the Forbidden Knowledge feat for paladins. I do agree, the spell effect should be agreed by the DM as appropriate.

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