Cannot quite understand Guarded Life Rage Power

[Robot GoGo Funshine]

Hey all,

I apologize if this is clear-cut, simple, and completely going over my head, but for some reason, I cannot seem to wrap my mind around the Guarded Life rage power (APG).

I have done some sleuthing of my own around the messageboards and I couldn't find any concrete definitions or answers as to how this rage power functions, plus it hasn't found a home on the FAQ page. I am currently playing a Dwarf Invulnerable Rager and I know that Guarded Life is definitely designed to work in concert with this specific archetype along with the Raging Vitality feat (also from the APG), but how? It seems to me as if you're still unconscious, so I'm having a difficult time understanding its intended purpose.

An example, an anecdote, or just a plain rules interpretation would be awesome. Thank you for your time and help!

[Platosbeard]

I think the intention isn't that you remain conscious but that you aren't dying and get back in better shape when healed.

For example: Say you are level 5 Barb with 50 HP and 45 lethal damage. You take a hit for 6 lethal.

Without Guarded Life - you fall unconscious and start dying.
With Guarded Life - you have 46 lethal damage (so 4 HP remaining) and 5 nonlethal. You fall unconscious but are not dying.

Furthermore, when you get healed it heals both lethal and nonlethal. Say you get healed for 6. That wipes our your nonlethal and heals 6 lethal - leaving you conscious with 40 lethal damage.

EDIT: I didn't take into account adjustments for losing your rage - just a rough example. Someone else can do the more detailed math.

[Bobson]

Guarded Life wrote:

Benefit: While raging, if the barbarian is reduced below 0 hit points, 1 hit point of lethal damage per barbarian level is converted to nonlethal damage. If the barbarian is at negative hit points due to lethal damage, she immediately stabilizes.

Platosbeard pretty much nailed it. It makes it so that you're in less danger and easier to get back up when you go down.

[Robot GoGo Funshine]

Interesting. It is now starting to make more sense. With the Invulnerable Rager archetype, though, they get a more advanced DR reduction, so at level 5 I have DR 2/-, which is doubled against nonlethal damage. Does that have any impact on the Guarded Life rage power?

I took the Raging Vitality feat so that if I do go unconscious I am still raging.

How would this feat work in concert with Diehard? Trying to figure out how to make the mechanics for the character work haha.

Thanks for your guys' input.

[DM Mathpro]

Robot GoGo Funshine wrote:

Interesting. It is now starting to make more sense. With the Invulnerable Rager archetype, though, they get a more advanced DR reduction, so at level 5 I have DR 2/-, which is doubled against nonlethal damage. Does that have any impact on the Guarded Life rage power?

I took the Raging Vitality feat so that if I do go unconscious I am still raging.

How would this feat work in concert with Diehard? Trying to figure out how to make the mechanics for the character work haha.

Thanks for your guys' input.

The DR wouldn't reduce the amount of non-leathal you take because you're not taking it from an attack you're just converting it, so you're DR would have already reduced the damage once.

As far as Die Hard is concerned the only benefit you would have from the feat is that you wouldn't ever go unconscious. You would stay conscious until you hit -con and then you would automatically be dead and Guarded life wouldn't save you.

[Robot GoGo Funshine]

Awesome! Thank you for guys' insight. I have finally left the cave and found myself in the light of understanding.

Guarded Life means something to me now. It can mean something for all of us now.

Thanks, guys!

[Wyrmfoe]

Unless I'm overlooking something, I don't think Diehard helps.

Even though the Diehard feat would let you choose to keep going below zero hit points, if a Barbarian uses Guarded Life, the Barbarian still falls unconscious due to having more nonlethal damage than current hit points (which would, at this point, necessarily be in the negative).

While Diehard prevents falling unconscious from having negative hit points (a single relevant trigger for unconscious), it does not seem to prevent falling unconscious from having more nonlethal than lethal damage (a different relevant trigger).

Am I overlooking something or is this accurate?

[Ciaran Barnes]

With guarded life you can still die. You convert damage to nonlethal before your rage hp are deducted. My barbarian has the rage power, and while it has saved him, there have been several times that a few more points of damage would have killed me anyway. Honestly I think my dm may have fudged damage rolls just because of it.

[Wyrmfoe]

If one takes the Raging Vitality feat, does Guarded Life (and Guarded Life, Greater) have more utility?

Given your experience, do you think there is much use in these, taken together? It seems to me that the only real benefit is being able to sacrifice oneself to take one big hit for the team, go into the negative with a stabilizing buffer of nonlethal damage available, and still hopefully survive as a raging, unconscious lump until healed.

With the feat and these powers, is that all there is, or do they offer more?

[Lab_Rat]

Guarded life is a weird rage power which is tough to estimate it's usefulness. Here is what we do know:

The non-lethal converted damage does NOT get reapplied to your DR vs non-lethal. This is because the damage has already been reduced by your DR before guarded life kicked in and that damage can not go through DR twice.

A lot of people thought that guarded life may be a rage power to take instead of raging vitality. I am not convinced that it's a good idea. You may convert lethal damage to non-lethal but you still fall unconscious (just not dying). When you fall unconscious you stop raging, loose a huge number of HP that is far greater than your Con score, and you die. The only way to prevent this is to still take raging vitality and rage while unconscious.

Can it save your life in some very rare occasion (where the amount of damage past the point of death is less than your barbarian level) ... yes. Is it worth a rage power slot....probably not considering all the really great ones out there.