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Combining Adventure Paths


Pathfinder Adventure Path General Discussion

Cheliax

Does anyone have any recommendations on what APs might combine well into one double (or even triple) sized result?

I ran CotCT and RotRL together a while back, and that worked more or less ok.

What about SD and SS? Don't they both deal with evil underground races. I must admit I don't know the plot sufficiently of some of the other APs to make a stab at this.

Richard

Andoran

I also ran a RorRL CoTCT a while back that worked out very well. Those seem the most favorable to joining, IMHO as they have natural crossovers.

I don't see SD and SS working, both had good parts but went off the rails in the second act, by most accounts. Particularly SD.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting Subscriber

Ciretose is right in that both SD and SS have issues (some bad plot/story points) but I think they could be combined with some (probably a lot of) work.

Here's one thought...

spoiler for SD and SS plot points:

Start by heading south to Garund. Run the shipwreck on Smuggler's Shiv from SS #1.
Have the PCs escape the Shiv and arrive in Bloodcove (I think it's a bit more Piratey than Eleder.) Then run SD #1.
Move the island in SD #2 off the coast of Garund. Run SD #2 (optional: have additional info on the location of the lost city of Saventh-Yhi here).
Run SS #2 and the overland race to Saventh-Yhi.
Change the elves in SD #3 to Mwangi Eku'Jae elves. Make the elf city one of the many ruins in the Mwangi. Have the PCs need the elves help to complete the final leg from Tazion to Saventh-Yhi so they need to help the elves retake the ruins. Run SD #3.
Run SS #3 as the PCs claim the lost city.
Run SS #4 where the PCs explore the vaults and operate the portal to the Darklands.

Here's where you really need to decide on your metaplot. SD has drow dropping a big rock on the land. SS has the serpentfolk trying to raise their god Ydersius. How are they related? You decide. Maybe the serpentfolk need a massive number of casualties/sacrifices to complete the ritual and rebond Ydersius' skull to his body. To do this, they're helping the drow bring about the Second Darkness.

In that case, run SS #5 as the PCs reach the serpentfolk city of Ilmurea and find out about drow involvement.
PCs go back to the Eku'Jae Mwangi elves and run SD #4 as the PCs infiltrate the drow city.
I would recommend skipping the train wreck that is SD #5, but I guess you could kinda sorta run it as is. Either have the PCs elfgate up to Kyonin or replace the Queen and the Winter Council with their Mwangi counterparts.
Then run SD #6 as they stop the drow from dropping the meteor and SS #6 as they raise an army and stop the serpentfolk from raising Ydersius.
Actually SD #6 and SS #6 could be run in either order. Your call.

Just some thoughts on how it might be done.

Cheliax

Thank you - that's excellent.

Do you think there are any others (apart from CotCT and RotRL) which would combine better?

Richard

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting Subscriber

I'm trying to think and honestly I can't think of any others that would be an easy fit.

DISCLAIMER: I don't own LoF and haven't read CC (I'm going to be a player in that next). I've also only skimmed JR thus far.

spoiler for some plot points:

I've heard some folks running JR and KM together. Running JR as is for books 1-3 and then starting KM in Tian with book 4. I think the maps would be generally usable, but the KM encounters would have to be reflavored for an Eastern/Tian feel (and bumped up in difficulty since you'd be running KM #1/2 after/during JR #4.)

Same with SS and KM. I've heard of groups running SS 1-3 as is, then once Saventh-Yhi is conquered in SS #3, using the KM books to start a kingdom there. The maps would have to be fiddled with (KM forests become jungles etc) and the encounters all reflavored for a jungle theme. Might be more work than worthwhile if you wanted to run those 2 full APs together.

Having only skimmed JR, I'm not sure if it would work with CoT or not. If there's a good large city around (like CoT's Westcrown) you might be able to run JR and CoT together. Travel to Tian, set up the new Jade Regent and then roll into securing another city or something.
This runs into the problem of having to really restructure the encounters too, since you'll be running the early adventures of CoT AFTER (or near the end of JR), so the encounter levels will be way off.

The only other feasible one I can see (without loads of work) would be SD and CoT. You can run CoT #1 and SD #1 in Westcrown then place the island in SD #2 off the coast somewhere in the Inner Sea. The problem would be where to put the fight with the elves v. drow in SD #3. That I'm at a loss for. Might just skip that one (which would be a shame 'cause it's a decent adventure). Then you can still teleport the PCs into the Darklands for SD #4, to Kyonin for SD #5 and back to Darklands for book #6; all from Westcrown.
Having NOT finished CoT though (we quit after a TPK in book 5), I can't tell you how to intertwine the metaplots of the drow in SD and the Council/Shadow creatures from CoT (I've been too lazy to go back and read book 6 myself).

Just some more random thoughts.

EDIT: Thought of one more. You might be able to mesh SD and KM.

spoiler:

Start off SD #1 in Port Ice (Brevoy) on the Lake of Mists and Veils.
After that, move into KM #1-2 as the PCs establish their fledgling kingdom.
Either call them back to SD #2 on an island in the Lake of Mists and Veils *OR* if you want to shrink things down, have SD #2 occur on Candlemere island.
Sometime during KM #3-4 (that you can run as is), have a nearby group of elves ask for help reclaiming some ruins. Run SD #3. This ruined city could be deep in the forests/rivers of the River Kingdom somewhere or even to the East in Iobaria. Have the elves willing to ally with the PCs kingdom in exchange for help.
SD #4 becomes the tricky one in this scenario. Why is the Ruler of the kingdom going to infiltrate the Darklands? I have no clue. Might have to have the drow (now below the River Kingdoms) kidnap a loved one of the ruler or something. Or the threat right below his feet forces him to take action.
KM #5 happens except it's the drow behind the war working with Nyrissa
This can happen before or after SD #5.
Then the PCs have to stop Nyrissa shunting the Stolen Lands to the First World (in KM #6) and the drow from dropping a meteor on the world (in SD #6). These can be in either order as well.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Dot

For when I'm cycled back into the GM seat in a Pathfinder capacity.


Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

Dotted for awesome

Cheliax

Thank you once again.

I've also been wondering how the forthcoming S&S and SS (oh dear, acronyms are dying), might dovetail in with SeSk for the former and the likes of JR (beginning) and SD for the latter.

I liked all your ideas, though.

Cheers

Richard

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I'm at the halfway point of running RotR/Kingmaker together. They've meshed together quite well.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting Subscriber
richard develyn wrote:

I've also been wondering how the forthcoming S&S and SS (oh dear, acronyms are dying), might dovetail in with SeSk for the former and the likes of JR (beginning) and SD for the latter.

Well I see S&S and SS following each other nicely but I'm gonna guess they can't be run together*.

S&S looks like it could potentially finish with the PCs as powerful players in the Shackles. Then you could pick up with a new set of PCs (PC's children? Henchmen? Thier old First Mates?) for SS.

SS spoilers:

Start SS #1 with the new PCs on a routine trip down to Eleder to pick up protection money going to the old PCs (the new PCs bosses) in the Shackles. They're also told to take a very influencial (and well-paying) passenger, Ieana.
BOOM! Ieana wrecks their ship on Smuggler's Shiv. Play SS #1 as is.
The PCs escape and go back to their S&S characters. The S&S characters send them off on a race to find the city - essentially becoming Kassata and the Pirate Faction from the book as written.
Play out SS #2-5 as is with the SS PCs, maybe with a bit of help from their S&S characters.
Then when the true danger of Ydersius rears his head (pun intended) in SS #6, maybe the S&S characters decide it's time to come out of retirement. They join the SS characters or you can do some mix and matching with them. Maybe some stay to run the war against the serpentfolk of Ilmurea while others attack Ydersius's temple.
Would depend how comfortable you and/or your PCs were at running two characters. Also note the difficulty would have to be ramped up a bit for the additional characters.

* When I think of run together, that's running the books "as is" (as close as possible), with the same characters, without having to completely redesign the encounters.
For example: If you were to run CotCT #1 after RotRL #3, you know you're going to be making major changes to the encounters. Even on slow advancement, by the time they finish RotRL #3, the encounters in CotCT #1 aren't going to be a challenge (they'll be 9th-ish level going through a level 1-3 adventure after all).
When I've been trying to look at combining APs, I've looked at keeping each book as close as possible to the same numbered books. That way there's a minimum of encounter redesign.

Cheliax

When I ran RotRL and CotCT, I basically tried to follow that idea.

We did R1 not including the last act, then C1, then R1 last act and R2, then C2 and C3, then R3, R4, then C4. Then they had a complete choice of which order to do R5 or C5 in (they did C5 first). Then it was C6 and R6.

It took a bit of tailoring, I have to admit, and the campaign lasted 18 months.

My main problem with the APs is that they progress too quickly up the levels for my tastes. I like a progression of 1 level every 6 sessions, whereas an AP modules goes at 3x that rate (for the first 3 parts, anyway).

My present campaign is based solely on Carrion Crown, and after 6 months they've only done part 1. Part 2 is coming along, and then we should be able to progress the AP with alternate levels because I note that this AP has a lower progression rate (you go to 1 AP for two levels from part 3 rather than part 4).

Next campaign I'd like to do two APs combined, because I basically prefer the quality of the AP modules. There is still the possibility of Greg Vaughn's Tsar to use as one of them, which I've been thinking about for some time. Tsar could combine well with SD maybe.

Richard

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting Subscriber

Yeah I could see advancement being a problem combining two APs. Even on the slow advancement track, they might level too fast. Especially in the early mods as you pointed out.
What you may look at doing is just doing away with XP and leveling them at story appropriate moments. I know several GMs on the board here use that method to good effects.
Just something to consider.


If running two APs at the same time (particularly on slow XP advancement), then remember to keep an eye on the party's wealth/treasure. Adventuring usually uses up consumables (potions, scrolls, wands, etc.), so it might be necessary to "drop" more of those. On the other hand, the party might be collecting too much of the permanent magical loot.


I'm meshing Kingmaker and Second Darkness right now, with an emphasis on Kingmaker.

I don't use XP in any of my games, I just set level up points in the game, by the recommendations of the GM's who have played through them and the guidelines in the adventure.

I've got an outline in the Kingmaker forums that I will be adding to over the next week or so. Or follow along with our group at,

Adventure Logs:
http://www.obsidianportal.com/campaigns/kingmaker-lures-of-majesty


richard develyn wrote:

Does anyone have any recommendations on what APs might combine well into one double (or even triple) sized result?

Richard

I'm about to start a campaign in which I want to combine the 3 original Varisia Adventure Paths. I'm doing CotCT, RoRL, and SD. I like to use the system where the entire party levels as one, and I have no problem delaying that as we go through the game so that everyone is more or less an appropriate level for the adventure we are currently on.

Anyone have any ideas on how to combine those 3 plots and hop back and forth between the various modules?

Knightingale


I am not combining them, but I am doing a mash-up of KM and CotCT. I am tweaking a lot of it to my own GM style though so it may not be a good example. I am also taking some bit parts from SD to throw into the game as well with a few other modules here and there (Conquest of Bloodsworn Vale, Realm of the Fellnight Queen, Carnival of Tears).

I have also considered a S&S / KM mash-up as well

Spoiler:
After getting a ship and exploring a bit then the players will start a colony in the Shackles. Conceptually that is the idea.

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Tales Subscriber

Someday I plan on combining CotCT and CoT with Shackled City and the first adventure in SD, (Acronymomania) to create a massive urban sandbox AP. Am I insane?

Definitely >:-D

Cheliax

Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I think Legacy of Fire & Kingmaker would work together well. You could certainly take the first half of LoF and then not have the start of part 4 happen and then go on a kingdom building spree in the area

Cheliax

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting Subscriber
Knightingale wrote:
Anyone have any ideas on how to combine those 3 plots and hop back and forth between the various modules?

Here's some of my REALLY rough brainstorms for ya. Just a quick stab that will need to be smoothed out but...

spoiler:

Have Sandpoint be another small town outside of Korvosa (on the edge of the Mushfens maybe). Optional: just move Sandpoint down there if you’re not too concerned about maintaining Golarion “as is.”
Drop the Golden Goblin in Old Korvosa (easy enough) and have the Blot appear above Korvosa. Putting the Golden Goblin in Old Korvosa makes the quarantine much more personal once they take ownership of it. Also solves the SD problem of having the PCs be too attached to Riddleport then yanking them out of it. The PCs SHOULD be attached to Korvosa.
Start in your small town outside the city (aka Sandpoint) and run RotRL #1. PCs can either be locals in Sandpoint or from the nearby “big city” Korvosa. Move Thistletop to outside town at the edge of the Mushfens. Find out the goblins are getting marching orders from someone at the Golden Goblin.
Head to Korvosa and run SD #1. Have them find out that Lamm is involved in the shady dealings at the Golden Goblin. Can intertwine CotCT #1 in here with SD #1. Finish up by finding out about the island off the coast of Korvosa and the tidal wave.
This leads them off to SD #2 on the island. Run that as written.
Returning to Korvosa run CotCT #2 and begin #3 as written. Can drop hints that the disease came from strange dark skinned elves if you want. Can also reveal that the Queen is possessed by a strange artifact of unknown origin (it’s actually a Thassalonian artifact in this scenario. One of Karzoug’s relics)
PCs are then summoned back to their starting town/Sandpoint for the first part of RotRL #2. Move the Magnimar portions back to Korvosa. Finish up CotCT #3 with the PCs fleeing the city.
PCs should have a hook that the elves up in Celwynvian might know more about the disease and what’s possessing the Queen and whatever was in the dungeons of Wrath below Sandpoint is also involved. Have them stop at Hook Mountain on their way across Varisia and run RotRL #3. Drop a few more breadcrumbs there that more dark skinned elves were seen with the ogres. Possibly sowing chaos across Varisia like they are doing in Korvosa (softening up strong points so that things really fall apart once the big rock from the sky hits or something)
Arrive in Celwynvian and run SD #3. Find out about the drow plan to drop a big rock on Varasia.
Make sure the PCs are friendly with the elves, because the stone giant attack of RotRL #4 occurs here. After helping the elves, they’re told about the Thassalonian artifact and sent off towards the Cinderlands. Trail the stone giants and finish up RotRL #4 (freeing up any prisoners that might have been taken or any additional motivators you want to give them) and head into CotCT #4. Run the fetch quests through the Cinderlands as written.
Can then run CotCT #5 and have them take on Scarwall or have them return to the elves and teleported into the Darklands for SD #4. They now have the sword and know that drow are involved… but how? Find out that the drow had worked with the Runelords in the past and apparently were doing so again. Have this revealed in SD #4.
In order to defeat the Queen’s artifact, the McGuffin sword from Scarwall (sorry, forgot the name) must be first taken to the Runeforge. Run RotRL #5.
Skip SD #5 or have the PCs teleported back to Kyonin for this. I’d recommend just skipping it though. I don’t much care for it.
Return to Korvosa and run CotCT #6. Kill the Queen free the city. Find out she was only a thrall of Karzoug’s artifact.
Run RotRL #6 and kill Karzoug. Find out that he was helping the drow bring about the Second Darkness so he could awaken and rise to power from the ashes left over. Unfortunately, the drow aren’t going to let Karzoug’s death stop them!
Run SD #6 as the PCs race to the Land of Black Blood to bring the threat to a close.
This is all obviously VERY rough but you’ve got a way that it could be done. Can smooth out the metaplot some but comes down to Karzoug and the drow are working together to bring the Second Darkness. Once all is in wreckage after the meteor hits, Karzoug will rise up unresisted. He’s using Illeosa as a pawn. Something like that.

Hope that at least gives you some ideas.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Am attempting a 4E (sorry) mashup of RotRL, Shattered Star and Jade Regent as a mega-campaign set in north eastern Greyhawk.

The problem I see at the moment is the journey to Tian Xia in Jade Regent either needs to be played as a single arc to its conclusion before a return to the Varisian locales to conclude the other two arcs or the locations of key dungeons need to be moved to where the PCs are, stretching credibility somewhat. A third option, I suppose, would be to play some adventures as flash backs during the journey but not sure whether that would work.

Would like to merge others into multiple arc campaigns so thanks for the ideas here.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Tales Subscriber

I'm in the midst of running our group through a combo Age of Worms, Darkmoon Vales Falcons Hollow series, and the Red Hand of Doom l. So far it's working really well.


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DM_aka_Dudemeister wrote:

Someday I plan on combining CotCT and CoT with Shackled City and the first adventure in SD, (Acronymomania) to create a massive urban sandbox AP. Am I insane?

Definitely >:-D

I actually have been thinking for a while in creating a mega sandbox urban AP by mixing most CoCT, a lot of Cot, maybe Shackled City (I've it, but never give it the read it deserves) and adding to them the Road of Revolution Campaign Arc from 0one Games and some of their urban adventures, all with various factions in the city, inspired also by A Song of Ice and Fire and the Watchman novels of Terry Pratchett.

So, what I mean is, if you're insane, Dm_aka_Dudemeister, you're not alone. :p


Medriev wrote:

Am attempting a 4E (sorry) mashup of RotRL, Shattered Star and Jade Regent as a mega-campaign set in north eastern Greyhawk.

The problem I see at the moment is the journey to Tian Xia in Jade Regent either needs to be played as a single arc to its conclusion before a return to the Varisian locales to conclude the other two arcs or the locations of key dungeons need to be moved to where the PCs are, stretching credibility somewhat. A third option, I suppose, would be to play some adventures as flash backs during the journey but not sure whether that would work.

Would like to merge others into multiple arc campaigns so thanks for the ideas here.

I think it would be best to change the locations, it seems to me as the easiest solution.

I would change a bit about Thassilon so it actually wasn't centered on actual Varisia, but on the Crown of the World. Well, it's been 10.000 years after that and the planet has changed a lot. So you could have most of Rise of the Rune Lords and Shattered Star up on the north (with some changes for them to happen in more inhabited areas) which could give some more Lovecraftian touch a la Beyonds the Mountains of Madness, and that's a plus for me. And finally, after finishing with that threat from the past, the PCS could get to solve the problems in Minkai. Also you could put some locales a bit more to the south, after all, Xin-Shalast already has more than a bit of asian flavour to it, in my opinion.

The main problem, could be how to keep the PCs equally motivated about the three (or two as RoRL and SS I think could be more entwined in motives) different things going on.

Hope that helps.

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