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When exactly can you take Extra Evolution?


Rules Questions


The feat Extra Evolution states:

You can gain Extra Evolution multiple times, but only once for every five summoner levels you possess.

Now, does that mean starting at level 5, then another at 10 (really 11), 15 and 20 (really not at all)? Consider Improved Natural Armor, another Eidolon-related option (though not a feat) and its wording:

An eidolon’s hide grows thick fur, rigid scales, or bony plates, giving it a +2 bonus to its natural armor. This evolution can be taken once for every five levels the summoner possesses.

Then immediately after that, there's the FAQ:

What's the minimum level for a summoner to take the improved natural armor evolution for an eidolon?

The description of the evolution says, "This evolution can be taken once for every five levels the summoner possesses." Unfortunately, that text is unclear. A summoner can select this evolution once for levels 1—4, again for levels 5–9, a third time at levels 10–14, a fourth time at levels 15–19, and a fifth time at level 20. This wording will be clarified in the next update document and print run for the APG.

So does this mean that I can take Extra Evolution at the same times as the Improved Natural Armor evolution, i.e. at 1st, 5th, 10th (really 11), 15th and 20th (really not at all)?

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

To make it a logical progression and not the product of poor wording, we use the following:

1-5 : Take 1 time
6-10: Take 2 times
11-15: Take 3 times
16-20: Take 4 times

*EDIT*
That FAQ makes for a very poor formula, seeing as the first set is 4 levels. We just use what I posted above until they get some better wording.


Shar Tahl wrote:

To make it a logical progression and not the product of poor wording, we use the following:

1-5 : Take 1 time
6-10: Take 2 times
11-15: Take 3 times
16-20: Take 4 times

When you say 'we use', is that your group or is that the official word? I agree with the practicality of the approach, but I want to be able to put together something where someone else doesn't come along and say 'that's not what the rules are'...


Shar Tahl wrote:

*EDIT*

That FAQ makes for a very poor formula, seeing as the first set is 4 levels. We just use what I posted above until they get some better wording.

The first option is four levels instead of five, yes - but it allows for the possibility of getting a fifth use out of it at level 20, and allows each iteration to be taken a lot earlier...

i.e. - in your example the earliest you could take the feat would be 1st, 7th, 11th and 17th, whereas with the FAQ, if it holds true, the feat could be taken at 1st, 5th, 11th, 15th and 20th. That's a pretty huge difference. For Improved Natural Armor at least... I'm still trying to figure out when I can officially take Extra Evolution.

Shadow Lodge

If there is no prerequisite then you can take it at first level. What makes the most sense is you can use it once plus once per five levels. So at 5th level you could take it twice, three times at tenth etc..


0gre wrote:
If there is no prerequisite then you can take it at first level. What makes the most sense is you can use it once plus once per five levels. So at 5th level you could take it twice, three times at tenth etc..

that was my thought as well, expecially with there being no way to take it at 20th level... was just hoping to find some sort of official word.


Mercurial wrote:
... expecially ...

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa............


Dang - just realized that I posted this in the advice section rather than the rules section. Flagging for it to be moved now.


Eben TheQuiet wrote:
Mercurial wrote:
... expecially ...
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa............

Ummm... thanks.


Sorry, couldn't help myself... i will do my absolute best to keep my (unasked for) personal pet peeves out of your thread from here on out. :)


Eben TheQuiet wrote:
Sorry, couldn't help myself... i will do my absolute best to keep my (unasked for) personal pet peeves out of your thread from here on out. :)

LOL - I didn't notice the 'x' until just now. Typo, my friend - trust me.

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Mercurial wrote:
Shar Tahl wrote:

To make it a logical progression and not the product of poor wording, we use the following:

1-5 : Take 1 time
6-10: Take 2 times
11-15: Take 3 times
16-20: Take 4 times

When you say 'we use', is that your group or is that the official word? I agree with the practicality of the approach, but I want to be able to put together something where someone else doesn't come along and say 'that's not what the rules are'...

We = the way our gaming group interprets it as a logical formula


Bump


It, like the ability you posted, lacks the usual language telling you how to treat it. So- absent them specifically clarifying it I'd just go with the reading of the ability that mimics the exact same language.

One would hope that they wouldn't go make the feat work differently than the ability given that they are worded identically as to when you acquire them.

-S

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