Maximum hit points at 1st level. What about the 1st level of a multiclass?


Rules Questions


Characters get maximum hit points at 1st level, but what about the 1st level of a multiclass? Are those rolled or maximized as well?

This is largely to resolve an argument, so any officially quote rule would also help. Thanks!

Kolja


Those would be rolled. Only the character's very first level receives maximum hit points, not every "level 1" of a class that character takes.

Pathfinder PRD: Getting Started wrote:


Hit Points (hp): Hit points are an abstraction signifying how robust and healthy a creature is at the current moment. To determine a creature's hit points, roll the dice indicated by its Hit Dice. A creature gains maximum hit points if its first Hit Die roll is for a character class level. Creatures whose first Hit Die comes from an NPC class or from his race roll their first Hit Die normally. Wounds subtract hit points, while healing (both natural and magical) restores hit points. Some abilities and spells grant temporary hit points that disappear after a specific duration. When a creature's hit points drop below 0, it becomes unconscious. When a creature's hit points reach a negative total equal to its Constitution score, it dies.


You get max HP for your first character level not class level.

Quote:


When adding new levels of an existing class or adding levels of a new class (see Multiclassing, below), make sure to take the following steps in order. First, select your new class level. You must be able to qualify for this level before any of the following adjustments are made. Second, apply any ability score increases due to gaining a level. Third, integrate all of the level's class abilities and then roll for additional hit points. Finally, add new skills and feats. For more information on when you gain new feats and ability score increases, see Table: Character Advancement and Level-Dependent Bonuses.


Multi-classing means that you take different classes at different levels, not that you take more than one class each level. A first level character who plans to be a multiclass fighter/rogue is still just a 1st level rogue or a first level fighter, and is not multiclassed until she is at least 2nd level and chooses a second class. Thus at first level you are getting the maximum hit points for the class you choose to take your first level in.

You only ever get maximum hit points at first level, meaning character level, not class level. So, a fighter1/rogue1 is a 2nd level character, and if fighter was his first class, taken at first level, and his hit points for his first level of rogue, which is his second character level, is rolled, and is not set at maximum.

Multiclassing wrote:

Multiclassing

Instead of gaining the abilities granted by the next level in your character's current class, he can instead gain the 1st-level abilities of a new class, adding all of those abilities to his existing ones. This is known as “multiclassing.”

For example, let's say a 5th-level fighter decides to dabble in the arcane arts, and adds one level of wizard when he advances to 6th level. Such a character would have the powers and abilities of both a 5th-level fighter and a 1st-level wizard, but would still be considered a 6th-level character. (His class levels would be 5th and 1st, but his total character level is 6th.) He keeps all of his bonus feats gained from 5 levels of fighter, but can now also cast 1st-level spells and picks an arcane school. He adds all of the hit points, base attack bonuses, and saving throw bonuses from a 1st-level wizard on top of those gained from being a 5th-level fighter.

Note that there are a number of effects and prerequisites that rely on a character's level or Hit Dice. Such effects are always based on the total number of levels or Hit Dice a character possesses, not just those from one class. The exception to this is class abilities, most of which are based on the total number of class levels that a character possesses of that particular class.


Mabven the OP healer wrote:
You only ever get maximum hit points at first level, meaning character level, not class level. So, a fighter1/rogue1 is a 2nd level character, and if fighter was his first class, taken at first level, and his hit points for his first level of rogue, which is his second character level, is rolled, and is not set at maximum.


Thanks everybody. It is much as I thought, but your citations and reasoning will put to sleep this issue for my group. Much obliged.

Silver Crusade

Have you tried using half plus one hit points at every level past first?

This solves a lot of my players grief at rolling 1's or 2's for hit points.

The Exchange

Fewer HP hurt more than High rolls on HD help, which is why I allow players to take half+1 when rolling for hp, if they want to.


First Level Multiclassed Characters are called Apprentice characters..

Pathfinder never officially dealth with this... but here is a Thread about the issue

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderR PG/conversions/30ApprenticeRulesToPathfinder&page=1#8

Also there is a product for sale that is pretty cheap (couple of bucks) that has all the Core Classes,Base Classes, and the Ultimate Combat classes..


Lord Tsarkon wrote:

First Level Multiclassed Characters are called Apprentice characters..

Pathfinder never officially dealth with this... but here is a Thread about the issue

linkified

Also there is a product for sale that is pretty cheap (couple of bucks) that has all the Core Classes,Base Classes, and the Ultimate Combat classes..

Linkified, and entirely a house rule. Very interesting one, though.


Bobson wrote:
Lord Tsarkon wrote:

First Level Multiclassed Characters are called Apprentice characters..

Pathfinder never officially dealth with this... but here is a Thread about the issue

linkified

Also there is a product for sale that is pretty cheap (couple of bucks) that has all the Core Classes,Base Classes, and the Ultimate Combat classes..

Linkified, and entirely a house rule. Very interesting one, though.

Thanks for linking.. I"m horrible at that...

and Yes... for Pathfinder... Single Level Multiclassing is Entirely Houseruled..

Also that Paizo product is Here....

Link

For $2.95 its a decent deal.. I did not make the product or endorse it,ect... But for the other classes (Summoner, Gun Slinger,ect) and simple rules it can help people that make lots of multiclassed Single level characters(Apprentices)


Lord Tsarkon wrote:


Yes... for Pathfinder... Single Level Multiclassing is Entirely Houseruled..

Also that Paizo product is Here....

Link

Published by Tricky Owlbear Publishing, not Paizo.

I have no objection to the rules - I think they're quite interesting. I'm just trying to keep clear what's official rules and what's from third party publishers. Some GMs, myself included, only allow 3pp material after careful review. Some of it is quite good (I use the Book of the River Nations heavily), but some isn't well thought out or well balanced.


Pathfinder Maps Subscriber
thedarkelf007 wrote:
Have you tried using half plus one hit points at every level past first? This solves a lot of my players grief at rolling 1's or 2's for hit points.

I think I'm going to use the d4 method for hitpoints for levels after first the next time I run. Based on your hit die size, you get a fixed number plus a 1d4 roll.

d6 = 2+1d4
d8 = 4+1d4
d10 = 6+1d4
d12 = 8+1d4

Prevents the second level wizard who rolled max on his HD from having more than the second level fighter who rolled a 1 on his second (assuming equal con bonuses).

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