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MMO wish list


Pathfinder Online

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Cheliax

First I can’t believe that that no one made this thread yet. So what do you guys wish to see?
My wish list is as follows:
1-Have the ability to make any of our classic characters we are used to. All our oracles, inquisitors, monks of the 4 winds, ect. All the core and base classes with all the archetypes.
2-Lots of content for low levels, and with each update to have some more for low levels, this is key to keep the game fresh for everyone
3-Quick travel, at all levels, nothing kills the enjoyment of the game than having to spend 3 hours running from place A to B.
4-Ability to play with any alignment, I’d like to see as player options clerics of Asmodeus and Zon-Kuthon, play anti-paladins and so on.
5-Have the ability to gain some templates after hard and higher level quests, things live vampire, werewolf, skeleton champion and lich all come to mind
Well that’s my wish list, what are yours?


1 person marked this as a favorite.

A sensible crafting system! You have no idea how silly it seems in so many games the amount of stuff it takes to produce decent items for your own level. I understand that Blues and Purples need to be really rare, or it kills the meaning. I'm more talking decent average items to Greens, with the ability to upgrade items. A simple Masterwork version would even be nice, so that you have the standard longsword, and then the upgraded MWK variety.

Honestly, I wouldn't mind if it worked like it did in the book, where you would need a caster with a certain spell and casting level, it would help casters in making money, as well as getting people to interact more outside of combat. That would be great, or if we could even have crafts work essentially like they do in tabletop, with the ability to just put ranks into it, and altered by your stats.

Player-run shops/stalls, houses- I loved FFXI housing, though I do wish there could have been an outside to it,with the ability to paint/redecorate it. Make sure to let players show off their houses to the party.

Kingdom building rules in- I would love so much to see people trying to forge their own kingdoms, with player-run cities, with each kingdom being it's own faction. It would be better than the most awesome endgame ever, because the players would be able to keep going. No more "Alright guys, time for the weekly Zul-Gurub raid!" Instead it's, "Those bastards to the north have broken the peace treaty! Rally the Troops!"

Multi-Classing- Yes, I know this can cause trouble, but seriously, sometimes you get a different feel as you go along.

Character Creation- I would love to have a very unique characters, with the ability to customize my the look/color of my clothing.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

No levelling Grind and a sensible crafting system.
Properly structured PvP, none of that "battleground" nonsense seen in almost every mmo released.

Cheliax Goblin Squad Member

My wish as discussed in this thread: Nocticula for heiress apparent.

I want to be a follower of Nocticula, gain followers for her and work on making her a full-fledged deity. Sure I might not achieve making her a diety, but I want to be able to try :P With this I agree with "wish 4" as without access to evil alignments this will be greatly restricted.

Goblinworks Founder

3 people marked this as a favorite.
ulgulanoth wrote:

First I can’t believe that that no one made this thread yet. So what do you guys wish to see?

My wish list is as follows:
1-Have the ability to make any of our classic characters we are used to. All our oracles, inquisitors, monks of the 4 winds, ect. All the core and base classes with all the archetypes.
2-Lots of content for low levels, and with each update to have some more for low levels, this is key to keep the game fresh for everyone
3-Quick travel, at all levels, nothing kills the enjoyment of the game than having to spend 3 hours running from place A to B.
4-Ability to play with any alignment, I’d like to see as player options clerics of Asmodeus and Zon-Kuthon, play anti-paladins and so on.
5-Have the ability to gain some templates after hard and higher level quests, things live vampire, werewolf, skeleton champion and lich all come to mind
Well that’s my wish list, what are yours?

1 - For Goblinworks to stay true to their vision.

You have a vision. If you didn't I wouldn't be here typing up a wish list. Keep that vision and don't let the naysayers turn this into another wow-clone.

2 - Lots of content for low level players
So many games forget this nowadays. Endgame means a game has an end, it contradicts the very meaning of playing in a persistent world. If a new player decides to start the game numerous times until they find the class they enjoy, they don't want to be doing the exact same zones in the exact same order every time. There should always be lots of things to explore.

3 - Don't limit a characters crafting or gathering professions
A player should be able to cook, fish, brew potions, craft weapons and armor, mine, prospect, pick flowers, grow vegetables, skin and tan, fletch, chop wood, thread a needle, pick his nose, track animals, scratch his bum all on the one character.

4 - Remember the lowly thief
It's hard playing a thief, not as hard as it was when we had 1d4 hit points and -10 penalty to offhand, but it's still hard. Most CRPGs these days have completely removed the thief from existence (Elder scrolls being an exception).

I don't want to be the super ninja assassin duel wielding scimitars dripping with poison. I want to be the wily thief, the crafty little bugger that sneaks into a lair, disarms all the traps, opens all the locks, steals the bosses best handkerchief and pocket watch and then blames it on the stupid barbarian when he gets caught.

5 - Climbing
I'm not sure how hard it is to have climbing in an MMO. An example of how not to do climbing would be Age of Conan. An example of good climbing would be Assassins Creed, Tomb Raider, Grand Theft Auto IV, Splinter Cell.

6 - Spears, Spears and Shield, two-handed spears
The most under-rated weapon in the history of computer RPGs. Name one computer RPG game that has them... I can't. Animations would be so easy to do. The best idea would be to be able to use the same spear in one or two hands AND be able to throw it (disarming yourself in the process unless it has returning quality)

7 - Mage tanks
In the event that PFO follows the dreary holy trinity mold. Give cloth wearing mages an ability to tank if built right. Stoneskin, Ironskin, Globe of Invulnerability, it is definitely possible.

8 - No offhand weapon bonus
I'm sick of being typecast into playing a dual wielding rogue. I would really love to see some kind of benefit to just using a sword or dagger with your offhand free.

9 - Invisible stealth
I've never liked it. Mages cast spells of invisibilty, thieves and rogues should sneak and flank, not have outright invisibility. I've played a Rogue since they had 1d4 hit points and 10% chance to hide in shadows, hiding in shadows does not make you invisible. Misdirection and distraction is the key to stealth.

10 - Make crafting complex
I don't mean make it expensive and simple either. Ideally if you want to cater to casual craftsman and hardcore craftsman then have a diet craft for people that feel they have to do it but don't enjoy it.
If weapons and armor have durability, allow those with the appropriate class the ability to repair them. By making things like this player driven, it also fuels the economy.

Goblin Squad Member

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Elth wrote:
Ideally if you want to cater to casual craftsman and hardcore craftsman then have a diet craft for people that feel they have to do it but don't enjoy it.

You brought up a bunch of good points, and though I agree with most (and disagree with some), I felt I actually needed to speak out about this one: Personally, if I'm reading what the developers want to do correctly, I would much rather they *not* have a "diet craft" for people who "feel they have to do it but don't enjoy it."

Crafting in a skill-based MMO should be left to those who do want to do it. That way, you ensure that people don't just power-level crafting and become totally isolated and self-sustaining without detriment. If you want to be a blacksmith - learn the blacksmithing trade and merchant and crafting rules. If you don't like them... don't be a blacksmith. Let the player who actually enjoys such rules play it - they'll enjoy the game more for it, and (presumably, at least,) you'll still benefit from it because you can buy stuff from them.

Goblinworks Founder

Archmage_Atrus wrote:
Elth wrote:
Ideally if you want to cater to casual craftsman and hardcore craftsman then have a diet craft for people that feel they have to do it but don't enjoy it.

You brought up a bunch of good points, and though I agree with most (and disagree with some), I felt I actually needed to speak out about this one: Personally, if I'm reading what the developers want to do correctly, I would much rather they *not* have a "diet craft" for people who "feel they have to do it but don't enjoy it."

Crafting in a skill-based MMO should be left to those who do want to do it. That way, you ensure that people don't just power-level crafting and become totally isolated and self-sustaining without detriment. If you want to be a blacksmith - learn the blacksmithing trade and merchant and crafting rules. If you don't like them... don't be a blacksmith. Let the player who actually enjoys such rules play it - they'll enjoy the game more for it, and (presumably, at least,) you'll still benefit from it because you can buy stuff from them.

Well I am personally more interested in a complex crafting system. I would hate to see something as mundane as world of warcraft, rift or warhammer onlines crafting. I want to see crafting made for crafters, not crafting made to give raiders something to do.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Elth wrote:


6 - Spears, Spears and Shield, two-handed spears
The most under-rated weapon in the history of computer RPGs. Name one computer RPG game that has them... I can't. Animations would be so easy to do. The best idea would be to be able to use the same spear in one or two hands AND be able to throw it (disarming yourself in the process unless it has returning quality)

Mount and Blade. Also glaives, scythes, halberds, and some sort of hammer-on-a-stick thing which I can't remember the name of.

Which brings up one thing I'd like to see, mounted combat.

Cheliax

1 person marked this as a favorite.

crafting wise what would be awsome would be to be able to make custome things by using different ingredients and prossess, have sliders, so if you make a sword, you will know its your sword, it has that orange jewel in the middle and swirls, so not complicated per se, but more advanced than "you make sword +1"

Silver Crusade Goblin Squad Member

7 people marked this as a favorite.

Might be my third time saying this but, it really needs to be said: user created dungeon building client, with player ratings. I want players to generate PvE quests. PvP doesn't interest me a lot (for someone to win someone has to lose afterall) except in Pathfinder where everyone can win. So let your users generate quests and dungeons, the quests that get higher ratings will get played more, while weaker quests will fall by the wayside. If there's a GM option, for GMs to temporarily possess monsters or NPCs in their custom instances all the better. :-)

You need this interaction to truly capture a smidgen of the tabletop's charm.

Cheliax

+1 to player based content, though i'd like if it wasn't just dungeons, so players could for example make a series of quests making a whole story arc hopefully with unique NPCs made by the players

Shadow Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

You know, tournaments that involve both PCs and NPCs could be fun, especially if the 'champion' is a strong NPC for the character's level.

Visual properties that make sense. In NWN a dragon disciple got... little tiny wings. What the heck?


Endraca wrote:
I want to be a follower of Nocticula, gain followers for her and work on making her a full-fledged deity. Sure I might not achieve making her a diety, but I want to be able to try :P With this I agree with "wish 4" as without access to evil alignments this will be greatly restricted.

Personal opinions aside, I don't think that should be possible unless all other demon lords have the same chance of becoming elevated and/or have the chance to be killed by the heroes. After all, evil has a considerable advantage in Golarion to begin with that and that's already enough reason for me to think that evil characters should just be outright not allowed in most cases.

(I'll make a more detailed list of reasons why evil characters should be discouraged at best when I'm not busy at work.)

And really, if they do implement that kind of mechanic, I will gladly make a Demoniac of Pazuzu and gouge out your character's eyeballs after some level grinding with a few good bloodbaths and the feeding of pet avians in the name of the epic birdman demon guy so he can get one step closer towards the day when he finishes his fight with Lamashtu and kills her off for good.

Cheliax Goblin Squad Member

Icyshadow wrote:


Personal opinions aside, I don't think that should be possible unless all other demon lords have the same chance of becoming elevated and/or have the chance to be killed by the heroes. After all, evil has a considerable advantage in Golarion to begin with that and that's already enough reason for me to think that evil characters should just be outright not allowed in most cases.

(I'll make a more detailed list of reasons why evil characters should be discouraged at best when I'm not busy at work.)

And really, if they do implement that kind of mechanic, I will gladly make a Demoniac of Pazuzu and gouge out your character's eyeballs after some level grinding with a few good bloodbaths and the feeding of pet avians in the name of the epic birdman demon guy so he can get one step closer towards the day when he finishes his fight with Lamashtu and kills her off for good.

Haha the idea started because I do not like Lamasthu :P I know Nocticula is disturbing and evil, but she is better to look at than Lamasthu (and most of the other demonic lords).

I am expecting paladins to come my way and people preferring Calistria's lust to Nocticula's depravity. But its a challenge, as not only good fights evil, evil fight each other too, as illustrated by your Pazuzu example.

PS: Did you delete a post on the other thread? I was in the process of replying. Oh well :)


I felt that the post on the other thread was a bit too caustic, and decided to delete it. Anyway, I will make a post with some reasonings to why I would wish against playing an evil character being an option in a Golarion/Pathfinder MMO.


Elth wrote:


6 - Spears, Spears and Shield, two-handed spears
The most under-rated weapon in the history of computer RPGs. Name one computer RPG game that has them... I can't. Animations would be so easy to do. The best idea would be to be able to use the same spear in one or two hands AND be able to throw it (disarming yourself in the process unless it has returning quality)

Lotro has spears with shields. Don't really agree with the whole "disarming yourself" philosophy in an MMO.

Goblin Squad Member

3 people marked this as a favorite.

A button to turn off dueling

Please, Its one of the things I most dislike about WoW, duel spam.

Cheliax

6- could we have animations for quests, making it more interactive and even have the quest change given the player interactions with the NPC

Goblin Squad Member

Mounted combat: Without it,you might as well not even include the cavalier as a choice. Sure you could make it a ground based "pet" class but that just seems wrong in various ways.

The spear was available a weapon choice in Ultima Online also.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Some things I would really love to see:

1) Crafting advancement. If I want to be a master craftsman and make the finest blades in Golarion, why do I have to grind levels in the local dungeon to get there? In comment to previous posts, I agree that the craft system in place should be there for those who want to craft and not watered down for those who are only slightly interested. I like artificers (from Eberon) and the whole crafting process and would like to see reward for my efforts as a craftsman. If you want the +5 Long Sword, vorpal, either take the time to gain all the necessary feats and skill ranks or buy it from someone who has.

2) PvP punishment. I know that there are those that live to do nothing more than kill other PCs. Murder is murder even in a fantasy world. If all you are going to do is kill PCs that are just trying to make a living, there should be penalties. Bounties places up the PKers, increase chance of losing possessions when killed if you go overboard with the PKing, etc. It might even be nice to see a prestige class type of order that hunts down such individuals. I am in no way saying that all PvP should be stopped. In a real world there are evils that would do such things and this should be no different. There are also punishments.

3) Don't limit the players' concepts. If I want to play evil, so be it. As with the PvP statement above though, there should be penalties. If you are sacrificing babies at an alter to Asmodeous, bind your soul to a phylactery, or raise zombies from the local graveyard, you really don't want the locals to get wind of it.

4) Character builds. If not multiclassing then maybe feat trees that allow players to build across class options. Take a couple feats as a fighter and then start taking rogue abilities, for example.


Evil characters? No thanks.

Why?

Here are some good reasons I picked up while thinking about it.

1. Playing an evil character in Pathfinder/Golarion is sort of missing the point of the game. The world after Aroden's death is a place filled with dark forces either slowly waking up or actively wreaking havoc on Golarion, and the main assumption for the story is that the player group at the table is a group of "heroes", mostly good-aligned with maybe a few neutral ones setting out to even the odds for the otherwise doomed world.

2. Evil is not a joke in Pathfinder. Evil characters WILL murder children in the name of fiendish patrons, rape women (and men sometimes) to satisfy their sick pervesions (or pay homage to some crazy demon) among other truly horrific things. If you want to play an Evil character just because you think "evil is cool", then go play City of Villains. Also, this is why I liked the fact that World of Warcraft story-lines had clear shades of grey when it came to the whole Alliance vs. Horde issue.

3. Picking up from the "evil is cool" example from section two, I fear that allowing evil as an option will cause the same kind of problem as the whole "Alliance vs. Horde" one in World of Warcraft, mainly that there will be such deep-seated hate for the opposing side that even real-life events are affected by this with comments like "f*** the good guys" or the developers themselves starting to favor one side over the other.

4. I should have said this earlier, but here's actually a question. If you want an evil character so badly, how far will that evil go? Will your character just cackle maniacally while casting spells with the "Evil" descriptor, or is he/she/it a literal monster in humanoid form? The problem I see with this is that the evil guys either have to take the evil to the NPCs, or then they will try to make it so that your evil character can attempt to subdue and rape my Cleric of Sarenrae just because I lost a battle.

Now, is there anyone here who wishes to debate this with me? And how many of you actually agree with these notions?

Lantern Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
ulgulanoth wrote:

First I can’t believe that that no one made this thread yet. So what do you guys wish to see?

My wish list is as follows:
1-Have the ability to make any of our classic characters we are used to. All our oracles, inquisitors, monks of the 4 winds, ect. All the core and base classes with all the archetypes.
2-Lots of content for low levels, and with each update to have some more for low levels, this is key to keep the game fresh for everyone
3-Quick travel, at all levels, nothing kills the enjoyment of the game than having to spend 3 hours running from place A to B.
4-Ability to play with any alignment, I’d like to see as player options clerics of Asmodeus and Zon-Kuthon, play anti-paladins and so on.
5-Have the ability to gain some templates after hard and higher level quests, things live vampire, werewolf, skeleton champion and lich all come to mind
Well that’s my wish list, what are yours?

1. MMO's have to deal with a simplified rules set, gaming online simply is not as granular as paper and dice.

2. yes, but who'd ask for little to no content?

3. Part of what makes a world real and expansive to me is the time it takes to travel to different parts of it. After all you do have teleport spells, but too much quick travel and the game world might as well be one room.

4. Alignment isn't a factor in computer games, it's not policeable. You can have people who are absolute jerks online still playing paladins. In other words, you'll be playing YOUR alignment, the alignment of the player.


Lazar has a good point when it comes to the alignment thing. Though I think it would be funny to see a Paladin suddenly losing his powers for trolling people. Then again, said player would start to whine and cry about that afterwards.


I would like to see the ability for players to teach each other languages and maybe other skills as well, similar to SWG pre-NGE.


The problem here is that, if PFO were made as the game I want to play, few other people would be interested: it would be too specific in some areas, too general in others, and would probably just be entirely too darned hard to code. With that said, though, here are some ideas.

1. Make the game accessible for casual players.
I am a grown-up, sad as it makes me to admit it, and one of the reasons I do not play MMOs is because I cannot hope to be involved on the same level as my 10 year old nephew. I cannot be significant in that light, so why be involved at all?

2. Implement some truly intelligent combat.
My gamers are probably groaning right now, but did anyone else ever play Vagrant Story on the PlayStation? The combat system was amazing. The length of your weapon in 3D space enabled you to do some really impressive things; short weapons attacked faster, longer weapons could strike areas shorter weapons could not reach. Facing comes back into play, along with dirty tricks, tactical awareness, called shots, parries and feints!... Button mashers can play barbarians, but intelligent players can gain significant advantages by playing intelligently.

3. Social skills.
The greatest example I have of why I hate CRPGs comes from playing in the Temple of Elemental Evil. The party has made an initial foray into the moathouse, succeeded at subduing the occupants, but taken quite a beating in the process. A remaining bandit broke into our rooms back in Hommlet and stole our stuff; my bard had the only means in the entire party to earn us coins to outfit us in the most basic of equipment in order to continue. For a game to be great, my performer must be able to utilize his Perform skills to entertain a crowd and solicit coins; he must be able to supplement Perform with Acrobatics and spell use in order to truly be great at social opportunities.

4. Graphics.
Ugh.
If the game looks like WoW, I will not play it. That's a cartoon. Look to Guild Wars for visual inspiration, please.

5. Golarion organizations.
If I want to play a class based on a religious order, like a cleric or inquisitor, shouldn't I have to... receive training in a church?
If I want to be a member of the Pathfinder Society, don't I have to be brought in and indoctrinated?
Aren't barbarians a product of barbarian cultures?
In other words, let's actually involve the characters in the story and involve the story in the characters.

Additionally, I want to second some of Ulgulanoth, DragonStryk72, and especially Elth's points:
•I know PFO isn't going to have a class system, but maximum character customization, please, both in terms of skills and in appearance, and if I want to build my inquisitor, have archetypes built in to guide me in that regard.
Low-level content has to be plentiful: 0-level NPCs live here, so if dragon incursions are random and common, humans should be extinct. However, if you wander out into dangerous territory... well, the woods ain't safe `round these parts, and that should be pretty clearly marked.
Alignment. What a slippery slope... Alignment needs to reflect a character's actions in the game and should not be set by the player. When alignment-restricted characters offend their gods, they should lose their powers, and some evidence of a character's earned alignment - by way of reputation - should be visible to players (at least to those who should hear such things).
A player- and character-run world in which the value of a thing is set by those willing to pay for it - not by the State-run outlet - is a nice idea and one I'd like to see truly, fully implemented. Of course there have to be NPCs, but their numbers should be kept to an absolute minimum: have PCs dole out quests on behalf of their organizations.

I'm going to quit there, but... I fear this thing. There is so insanely much potential here, but for every possible win, there are a thousand potential pitfalls. I hope this game becomes something I can invest in, but well, I'll always have my dice.


For the love of all that is holy in the world of Golarion, either create a roleplay server or randomize character names.

I will not play a game where I can run into Sephiroth666 or a minotaur character called Beef Steak. I just won't.

Goblin Squad Member

Wishlist:
Priority Order:

1: True D20 mechanics. Your game is so beautiful. Make the game run the same way here as it does the way we're used to. 21 levels, with Epic 21 play being possible only with a truly epic questline-unlock. Make it a hidden system, like the one used for Jedi in SWG.

2. MORE THAN JUST COMBAT! For crying out loud, please... please... please... I can't stress this enough, so I'm going to make a separate post for it but please... Mini-games, even as transparent as a rail shooter mini-game, should be available to give us other interaction with the world. Look at puzzle-pirates and the way they handle crafting and ship building and... Let anyone click a button to make a sword. Let that sword take a full minute to be knocked out. And make sure there's a deep economy around that sword (iron and some generic 'flux' unless you want to get specific and leather strips/straps whatever) to make the player economy run. Then pound out the sword, which takes no input from the player at all... until he wants to make masterwork. Masterwork should be a mini-game all its own, and should be different for armor, weapons, and ANYTHING ELSE. Three different thematically themed games that are more than 'button one... button two... button one... button three... finish.' Bubble popping, logic puzzles, anything interesting with scalable challenge. Look how popular angry birds is! Want to make Cold Iron? Now you're looking at Difficulty #2. Mithril? Difficulty #4. Adamantine? Difficulty #10... which should be HARD. Give us bar games! Give us jousts and arena competitions! (With the appropriate buildings, of course) And give us bardic competitions! Make music playing and composition an ACTUAL THING. Make them stored client side, they don't have any game effects, and let the bards play them on demand and be able to trade them... These things would make this game INCREDIBLY long lived... they give people something more to do than grind. Any game I can play on an iPhone should be inspirational enough to get your attention here... This is a critically overlooked niche in MMOs that you shouldn't deny your fanbase.

3: The Expert Class. I want a viable Expert class who can literally chop wood, research, craft, and profession my way to success. An ALTERNATE XP system for crafting isn't entirely necessary, but would be nice. Expert levels should offer perks or recipe advancement not available to adventurers. I would dearly love to see 200+ items that one can specialize in, with only a single specialty available at level 5, 10, 15, and 20, and only available to Experts. This means you'd have to have dozens of experts just to be able to cover the hundreds of specialties. A specialist should be able to make a single item BETTER than anyone else. Bow specialist? Arrow specialist? Wall/Bulwark/Door/Shield/Armor/Longsword/Backpack specialist? You should be able to do it.

4. A DM function with an 'Architect System' style dungeon creator and adventure tool. The River Kingdoms are nice and all, but Golarion is -GINORMOUS-. Let us have some mutability and control over the world.

5. Monster Function. Let us build our own dungeons. Let those dungeons be set as attackable, and once they are, let them attract monsters, bandits, and worse. Minecraft with Pathfinder.

6. Make retraining available, but -expensive-. If Rhotogar is going to change from Barbarian to Wizard, the journey needs to have impact and be powerful.

7. FULL social support, from clans, last-names, marriages, and alliances. Build this in from the start, and let factions be able to be mined for alliance even in the NPC sphere. If I want my evil township of BlackGuardia to have a hidden temple to the Mantis God and the lovely red troubleshooters that comes with, I should be able to have a way to unlock it.

8. State religions, npc population, settlement alignment, government mechanical effects... give us the tools to differentiate one settlement from another, and give us at *LEAST* ten different styles of architecture.

9. The Aristocrat. Like the Expert. But focused on ruling. Plus, bonus martial weapon proficiency. :D Unlike Experts though, quest-management should allow troubleshooting and 'quest boards' and 'tavern recruiters' to be set up to keep your settlement safe. Sycamore needs defenders, but the ruler should benefit from having at least one level of Aristocrat... maybe more. You may need to -create- class features for the Aristocrat, and the Aristocrat should be able to level up with the quests and issues their settlement is facing being solved, NOT necessarily through solely combat.

10. Magical Magic: Yes, okay... we want the named spells we know and love. But make them LOOK cool. Animations for fighters should be fluid and powerful, animations for rogues should be quick, furtive, very to-the-point. Animations for mages should be grand, sweeping, and culminate in a fireball that makes you wet your chair. Or turn down the settings to just 'neat'.

11. Guarded Economy: Please make certain there are NPC traders who make all crafting materials available somewhere in the world, even if they can only be purchased in player-owned trading houses. These set-price vendors will make the costs constant in the world.

12. The power of Magic: Magic crafting is obviously only really going to be available to PC wizards, clerics, druis, etc., who take the feats. If you make the crafting too easy, it will spiral out of control. Make enchanting (and possibly disenchanting) complex and interesting.

Goblin Squad Member

That Old Guy wrote:


...
4. Graphics.
Ugh.
Ugh.
If the game looks like WoW, I will not play it. That's a cartoon. Look to Guild Wars for visual inspiration, please.
...

I would not mind Toon or Realistic.

What could be done is having the option for one or the other,
by having a Realistic Shader and a Toon Shader for the game that
is applied to the characters and the world.
Thus satisfying both groups.

Goblin Squad Member

@Daniel36: /agree. Though Beef Steak is an entirely appropriate name for a minotaur who runs with a group of crude human bandits.

Policed names and an RP ENFORCED server are highly desired... even if it's only a One World Server. Which would also be cool... (EVE Online, I'm lookin at you.)

Goblin Squad Member

Daniel36 wrote:

For the love of all that is holy in the world of Golarion, either create a roleplay server or randomize character names.

I will not play a game where I can run into Sephiroth666 or a minotaur character called Beef Steak. I just won't.

I don't think control over the names will be possible.

Since Character names are unique,
I am willing to bet that a few names will be used up very quickly.
And can you come up with every race/class/name combo that is a joke, no.

Goblin Squad Member

I would like to second the intelligent combat. I would love a game that actually put more emphasis on player skill, and less on raw stats, even a nice combination. Like say if dex/dodge were a factor, actually make the player have to move to get out of the way instead of mindlessly standing still and holding down the attack button watching the "dodged" text pop up. A good combination would make sense as well (say higher dex/dodge bonus means you move further/faster when you try to dodge). This would also enable players to participate in things they would normally be too low level for.

An alternative could be heightened use of tactics. Too much mindless tank n spank in MMO's these days, your average MMO instance is more and more. OK have the tank spam his agro gaining skill, nukers nuke healer spam heal on tank. Actually scouting ahead and coming up with a plan even on the first run through is almost unheard of outside of very specific end game situations. I for one would love if a game actually rewarded the occasional sneak past enemies in a room that rewards you rather then eliminating the XP and loot rewards.


Purplefixer wrote:

2. MORE THAN JUST COMBAT! *snip* And give us bardic competitions! Make music playing and composition an ACTUAL THING. Make them stored client side, they don't have any game effects, and let the bards play them on demand and be able to trade them...

One of the best ideas I've seen for this game so far. +Infinity

Andoran RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16

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Onishi wrote:
I would like to second the intelligent combat. I would love a game that actually put more emphasis on player skill, and less on raw stats, even a nice combination. Like say if dex/dodge were a factor, actually make the player have to move to get out of the way instead of mindlessly standing still and holding down the attack button watching the "dodged" text pop up. A good combination would make sense as well (say higher dex/dodge bonus means you move further/faster when you try to dodge). This would also enable players to participate in things they would normally be too low level for.

I strongly hope this is not how combat is implemented. I know I won't play if it's an action game. I don't want a MM FPS, I want an MM RPG. They're two completely different types of games. I do want more intelligent combat than just clicking attack, and then getting better attacks that do more damage, but I want the intelligence to come from tactical options, whether that be moving to set up a flank, combat maneuvers like trip, disarm, etc. choices like power attack, combat expertise, reach weapons and attacks of opportunity, etc. I know not all of these can be directly translated from the RPG rules, but equivilents would be possible (like reach allowing to attack targets at longer range before they can hit you with short swords, to address attacks of opportunity, etc.)

I also don't want to have to constantly rotate my character to press attack when my enemy circles around me and never be able to hit because I'm slower using my mouse than they are (or than the computer is for NPCs).


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I would love to see some social based quests that could actually be failed, and not "lol drop quest and retake". And properly sized towns. 3 buildings out in the forest is not a town.

Hmm...what else...

I would really like the option for user created dungeons / quests. It'd be pretty epic to have the Guild Leader GMing custom storylines for the rest of the guild.

Annnnnnd, another vote for pure RP servers. I believe that is all.

Goblin Squad Member

Quote:


I would really like the option for user created dungeons / quests. It'd be pretty epic to have the Guild Leader GMing custom storylines for the rest of the guild.

Yep. Just said that. If NOTHING else, it's infinite content that never runs dry.


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Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I want there to be unique items in the world that aren't necessarily artifact-level power. Meaning, there is only one "Sword of Goodwill" and when I find it my character is the only one who has such a thing.

I want what I do to affect the world. If I burn down a building I want other players to see it burned down and then if some farmer rebuilds it later, I want the NPCs to remember that it was burned down. I don't want everything to reset, and I want the state of things to be consistent.

If I decide to become a duke/lord/baron/whatever, I want to "own" a piece of land and have serfs. I want to be able to pay other adventurers to kill stuff on my land.

I want there to be unique monsters or NPCs in the world and if something happens to them as a result of an interaction with myself or another player, ie, they get married, they get sick, they die, they (whatever) then that is shown to all. This will make me feel like the world is internally consistent and believable. If I encounter a unique monster and kill it, I want it to be dead. For good. That's it. I don't want it to just respawn for the next players because then I'm just playing another video game. I want what I do to have a permanent impact on the world.

Mind you I'm not an MMORPG player. I've never played WOW or DND Online, or Evercrack, or any of them. However, I've watched others play them and heard their stories, and none of it appeals to me because they all seem to be lacking the things I mentioned above. I really don't want to waste my time playing "just another video game" so if PFO can address my "wants" above, I might give it a shot.

Goblin Squad Member

Thanks all - great thread.

Goblin Squad Member

I don't have any idea exactly how to go about implementing this, but the main thing that has bored me away from every other mmo I've played or tested has been the lack of a GM. Perhaps user-created content is the way to implement this, or something else. I only know that, minus that element, a certain chunk of player base wanders off relatively quickly, and I've always been in that crowd. It just gets boring, and lacks the main thing that makes RPGs so much fun.

No, I've never expected an mmo, or any pc game, to take the place of tabletop gaming. However, if there is a way to include something like a GM, or the experience of having one, it makes one's experience unique, makes the player feel involved in the world in a way that crafting, housing, etc., never really will.

The usual reason given for not having something along those lines is that it's a manpower issue, or that people will complain about their experience in-game being inferior to someone else's due to DM times, or what have you. I won't pretend to havea fix for that, but mybe something along the lines of a private server option, something similar to NWN persisitent worlds, or... I don't know. Anyway, I'm certainly eager to see what comes about regardless, but to me that's always been the thing I've felt mmos are missing as far as really keeping my interest.


I must vote for relistic art work over the cartoon type art work seen in World of Warcraft and Starwars the Old republic.

Some tech side things I would like to see built into the game engine would be able to be viewed in 3d, and dx11, full multithread suport for cpu/gpus along with SLI/crossfire.

One last thing I would love to see build into the game is the xyz axis for flight spells, flying mounts, and others like dragon attacks.

So far I like what I have read about Pathfinder Online project and hope you can pull it off with a major AAA game.

Lantern Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
acornia wrote:

I must vote for relistic art work over the cartoon type art work seen in World of Warcraft and Starwars the Old republic.

Some tech side things I would like to see built into the game engine would be able to be viewed in 3d, and dx11, full multithread suport for cpu/gpus along with SLI/crossfire.

Here's the major issue with that. Blizzard realised way early in the game is that if you target only the systems with thousands of dollars with gaming hardware, you do the following

1. Make the game an absolute drag fest when lots of players gather together

2. Extremely limit your target audience.

Now what WOW did do was limit the graphics bar to an acceptable level early on to keep the admittance gates wide and then add on advanced texturing for ultra rigs once the game had launched and proven itself viable by generating income.

Goblin Squad Member

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My Wish List:

1 - Playing a rogue / thief is fun, perhaps they could be able to steal certain things from vendors with enough skill under the right conditions?

2 - Underwater content - much fun.

3 - Solo content - at times I don't want to deal with real people - let me get experience without grouping up.

4 - Organizations - make it mean something to belong to an organization. If you act out of character, you get questioned by the council or exiled for a period of time.

5 - Shipbuilding / sea travel: Can you imagine how cool it would be to spend time gathering materials to build a ship and eventually sail it across a river or bay? Even better - let a char call the ship his / her home and place housing objects in it. Harbors, paying for slips, hauling goods, etc...

6 - Let us place crafting faclities in our housing - or place a certain type of crafting shed behind our main house in the yard. Very cool.


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Not sure if anyone mentioned this, but. An Appearance tab would be nice. along with a ton of vanity items for said tab

Goblin Squad Member

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A community feedback system to rate fellow players.

- Like how Ebay allows rating buyers and sellers.
- Except other players rated with an alignment (good, evil, lawful, chaotic)
- which is visible to other players and,
- which affects how NPCs and the environment react(Like algined NPCs become friendly, opposed become aggro).
- Vendors, questgivers and guards define regions friendly or hostile to players of a given alignment rating, creating opposed friendly/enemy alignment faction regions for each alignment faction
- player created content set by the players, allowing players to define zones friendly or opposed to a given play-style.
- Encouragining those with simmilar play styles to congrigate with like-minded players, enabiling in-game communities, giving players fair notice of players with opposing play styles, and thereby harnessing those differences to create a synergy between the PvE and PvP elements of the game.

Goblin Squad Member

Your players and fans are a great asset. Let us playtest and see if the feedback can be incorporated into the game. Let your fans use your tools or create content. Who knows they may create such great dungeons and campaigns that you incorporate them into your world design. Even if you can’t incorporate those into the general world why not use a witch gate or some other portal where at least those players with the key from the creator can access their extra dimensional dungeon or campaign space. They may not be able to bring back items into your core world, but allow them to use your engine to have a great play experience.

I hate most crafting systems. It is usually a crazy grind time sink to prolong the game experience and therefore collect more monthly fees. I'm looking at WoW and several others here. However, I also realize some people love this stuff and they should be rewarded for their efforts. Please make common crafted goods and supplies common and available from merchants. Sure a magic sword and materials should be hard to get but iron ingots should not require hours of mining or require hours of grinding the skill in order to be able to mine the ore. Larger cities and vendors should have more expensive and exotic goods that crafting classes can use. I'll gladly pay a PC who is a grandmaster blacksmith to make me some nice items, but I don't want both of us have to grind for a week to collect the materials.

I don't play evil characters, but if people want to that is their choice. However, as you kill lawful and good NPC's, and PC's then bounties, penalties, and alignment adjustments need to apply. Likewise an lone pally in a bad neighborhood can expect not so nice things from the local crimelords.

I played WoW for a long time and the art direction was a wise choice. Seven years ago PC power was nothing like it is now and trying to render realistic graphics would have been difficult for most mainstream computers. But now even inexpensive systems can swing some good graphics. I don’t want some cheap console port graphics job. I don’t know what your development timeline is, but if it is more than two years you have to figure that today’s graphic leading edge systems will be mainstream. Multi-monitor resolutions and 3d support should be baked in now and not an add on late in the development cycle. Even smart phones and tablets will have 4 cores in the future so please support multithreading and SLI-Cross fire.


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I have to be fast (university stuff to do), but I'd like to mention a few.

1. Environmental dangers, and weather
Things like a Sandstorm within a dessert, an eruption near an active volcano, or a cyclone within the sea, fatigue due to heat, or frostbite due to cold, lowered vision due to lack of light, storm, snowfall, differences between night, afternoon, dawn, day. Even crazy stuff etc...

I want these things to matter, not only as eye-candy (pretty maps and special effects), but mechanically too, if I am within a volcano, and didn't care to come with special protection I should suffer the consequences of extreme heat, If i am walking on top of Ice i should slide and have a hard time controlling my movement, all these things should affect a certain number of parameters and be affected by a character's parameters as well. (someone with a good level of mastery in acrobatics, could have an easier time while walking on ice). Spells, and abilities should interact with said features (Control Weather, or Survival, for example).

I have programmed small games in the past, I know some of these are hard to achieve, but they are possible, sure to take a lot of hardwork, but worth the effort.

2. LANGUAGES
Make the Angel talk in abyssal, the Darkfolk in Undercommon, etc... Each player should know a certain amount of languages just like one would in the PnP version, he should have the ability to trigger a translator for when he writes (so whatever he writes is automatically translated to say elven when he presses enter). The reverse method should also be available, whenever, someone else talks in another language a character knows, or maybe a book written in said language, the trigger buttom should inform the character the message i written in said language, and that he can translate it.

3. Character Customization to the max
Every player should have the ability to make unique characters, looks, skills, spells, feats, abilities, ability scores, even elemental specialization, resistances, play-style, etc... However, i do expect a limitation, as I don't want to play a master of all trades.

4. Many Skills, Many Spells, Many Feats, Many Special Abilities
Do not reduce the amount of option available, the stuff from the PnP is great for character customization, and classification within ability types.

5. Smart fights, and excellent AI[b]
I don't want every fight to be the same (different only in name, statistics, and skills), I want to see well developed AI, I want to see interactivity with the world around me, I want different moral, and fighting styles among monsters, bosses, and important NPCS, I don't want to fight just another bunch of high stated data and call that a fight.

[b]6. Awesome Items
By that, I mean, cool stuff, not only the sure-to-be and necessary +X bonus to Y Stats.

7. Traps, Haunts, Awesome Dungeons, puzzles, secret doors, ...
Deadly, Confusing, and Beautiful ones.

8. Tons of Interactivity
Did i cast Fire Ball over a Grease?, Make them interact, did i Just cast Freezing Sphere on a Lake?, turn the lake into Ice, Did I rage and used that rage power that breaks the ground?, likewise.

9. Organized PvP
Wars, Battlegrounds, and the like.

10. Camping
Really Important option to have available with mundane items, and, specially with spells like Rope Trick and the like.

Osirion

ulgulanoth wrote:


Well that’s my wish list, what are yours?

Mine is simple really and melds with those of many others I would appreciate a pathfinder society equivalent in the game rather than seemingly random quests to get loot. Having a society lodge or some other similar sorts of adventure hubs can act to spawn adventures, then as "ulgulanoth" noted quick travel ie you agree to the quest and can start it now rather than traveling for hours/even half hours through a massive map to begin the quest only to run out of time to take on the adventure before you even get there and have to start all over again. I played DDO quite a bit and found this to be quite annoying along with the limited number of quests I could partake in that I had to repeat to get high enough leveled to reach the next quests that I would have to repeat endlessly and so on.

Please no Craft the most destructive weapon in the world with little game balance. I don;t want to be a super hero I want to play Pathfinder online. I guess that means I want player deaths to be well... deaths too or cap how may respawns you get (maybe make it cost you all your worn gear and some cash or xp or something.
There my ramble complete haha


The ability to smell, taste, and feel my environment. :D
Sure, with the right graphic design I can see the gnome village I walk into.
And with the right audio design, I can hear a dwarf sing a drinking song.
But can I smell the rose garden the halfling planted?
Can I taste the fresh bread the half-orc baker made?
Can I feel the elven pros- uh, we won't go there... :D

In seriousness, though, I want a world which eventually has NO NPCs. Players take ALL of the roles typically performed by NPCs. Obviously, this wouldn't apply to nonsapient monsters or *maybe* monsters where the race is too powerful (like demons or giants), but anything that COULD be played by a player, is.

Paizo Employee CEO

Thanks to everyone for all the ideas! There are some cool things in this thread!

One thing I do want to address: We are not using the OGL for this game. Legally, doing so would be a bit tricky, and we think the potential risk it presents isn't worth it... especially since the requirements of an MMO dictate that many of the mechanics need to be different anyway.

What that means is that we won't have the ability to use any of Wizards of the Coast's copyrighted or trademarked material. But keep in mind that copyright law protects only specific expressions of ideas; most of the concepts you'll find in the Pathfinder RPG are not (and cannot be) owned by anyone. (And of course, we'll be able to use anything we ourselves have created for Pathfinder.)

Our goal is to keep the FEEL of the Pathfinder RPG intact. So we won't be using fireball as a spell that causes 1d6 points of fire damage per caster level over a 20-foot radius... but magic users will still be able to cast fireballs at stuff.

We've done some initial brainstorming that has given us some cool ideas about how to make sure the game feels like Pathfinder. But if you want to play a game that precisely mimics the rules of D&D, you'll have to do that through an officially licensed D&D game.

Pathfinder Online will take place in our world, and it will feel like Pathfinder.

-Lisa

Silver Crusade Goblin Squad Member

I want to be rewarded for being familiar with Golarion. I've been running Kingmaker for about 2 years now (yikes!) and my players are very familiar with the River Kingdoms. I'm sure they would like to have those "Aha!" moments when exploring the lore.

Make the Lore Matter. When a character travels to Mivon, they should hear about Brevic politics, when they reach the crumbling glory of Pitax then they should hear about the rise of

Spoiler:
Irovetti
.

Big Monsters/Epic Battles As a faction gains power they should draw the attention of powerful beasties, I know a big part of the content will be PvP, but an attack from a Colossal Dragon or Jabberwock on the PC's cities should not be out of the question.

Look to Monster Hunter That game became popular for a reason, and that reason is that explorer and collector player types are richly rewarded for trying to take on tough challenges. The River Kingdoms should be home to the most classic of monsters and a Legendary version of some of the game's most popular creatures should be huntable, in remote and dangerous locations.

I play video games because the story matters, because the lore interests me and because I like to talk to my friends about the cool sh## that happened last time I gamed.

So far no MMO has provided me with that experience, and I appreciate you're trying to dynamically generate that experience with the PvP focus, but defeating RedBandit88 (a 20th level rogue) doesn't have the same moment of awesome as:

An Elder Black Dragon landed on the Temple of our City, our highest level champions raced to the temple to fight the beast. I was crafting at the time, and despite being only 6th level I raced in to help. Damn near got my butt handed to me before the Paladin channeled a quick heal. I threw one last dagger before beating a hasty retreat. It was awesome.


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When choosing and customizing game engine and world physics, please make sure that creatures are "tangible" - i.e. no running through creatures like they were phantasms.

Consider adding some sort of plane mirroring the mundane world (either Plane Of Shadows or First World or even both if possible) and some pocket planes to visit. Maybe even possibility of groups of very powerful mages creating demiplanes for their guilds.

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