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And I will send a free... something... to anyone who can sell me on a new family of five logically related dragons. New colors need not apply. Mythical creatures preferred. One head only please.
Greek dragons, as guardians of sites of divine or mystical significance, with supernatural powers of perception and vigilance, could be neat, if five different types of 'site of power' could be generated, such as one type that nests in nexuses of ley lines, and another near portals to other planes, and a third in areas that have been corrupted / transformed by magical disasters (such as Alkenstar), or sites that have been touched by the presence or blessings (or cursings) of gods, etc. Since the game doesn't really have 'ley lines' rules or any sort of codified 'places of power' guidelines, as such, that might run into a wall.
For non-mythical creatures;
Dragons based on seasons (that's only four, but a fifth dragon representing five days outside of the year, or the year in it's entirely, or something wonkier could bring it to five)
Dragons based on terrain types (already done with Linnorms, really)
We've got dragons based on metals, colors and (non-OGL) gemstones, so why not dragons based on types of wood or plant? Thorn dragons, ash dragons, oak dragons, darkwood dragons, etc.
Dragons based on air, earth, fire and water exist already, but not so much dragons based on *state,* such as dragons of solidity (with a calcifying 'flesh to stone' breath weapon), or dragons whose form is fluid, or gaseous, or pure energy/plasma (equal parts electricity and fire). Still, once again, that's just four, unless Void or oblivion is counted as a 'fifth state,' with a dragon of pure negative energy that breathes out a dispel magic / disintegrate attack...
Dragons based on different views of supernatural manipulation of the world, with one dragon focused on divine magic, another on standard arcane magic, one on 'words of power' linguistic based magic, one on 'psychic' type magic and a fifth on manipuating ki energies.
Dragons tied to emotions, such as a dragon of fear and terror, and a dragon of joy and happiness, or a dragon of anger and rage and a dragon of love and affection.
The suggestion above of dragons tied to celestial phenomena, or even signs of the zodiac, sounds neat. Sun dragons, moon dragons, aurora dragons, void dragons, world dragons.
Mixing and matching some of these ideas could also work. The celestial dragons could also share some properties with 'state dragons,' so that the Sun Dragon and the Aurora Dragon are creatures of living flame or electricity, with no physical body, while the World and Moon Dragons have solid physical forms (albeit, highly mutable, for the size and shape-changing Moon Dragon!). Add in some powers from mythical dragons, such as the trail of fire left behind by some Bulgarian dragons of myth, to the Sun or Aurora dragon (leaving behind a wake of damaging energy in squares it passed through on the previous turn), and it might be the best of both worlds.
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And I will send a free... something... to anyone who can sell me on a new family of five logically related dragons. New colors need not apply. Mythical creatures preferred. One head only please.
I've got a potentially extremely stupid idea.
The more I think about the potential visuals, the more I think they'd be actual alien dragons.
Will try to post more when work isn't crazybusy.
Abaia / Acheri / Adze / Afanc / Alastor / Alp-Luachra / Ammit
Aniwye / Annihilation Bug / Antaeus / Anteros / Argus / Asag / Ashrai
Barbegazi / Batibat / Bauk / Bloody Bones / Buggane / Cactus Cat / Cacus
Calopus / Chagrin / Cherufe / Clurichaun / Djieien / Dobhar-Chu / Echineis
Empusa / Erlkonig / Fear Gorta / Filth Licker / Fossegrim / Gold Digger Ant / Grimalkin
Gulon / Harionna / Heikegani / Hyakume / Ichneumon / Jack in Irons / Jack o Lantern
Jubokko / Kamaitachi / Kampe / Kerkope / Kikimora / Kumiho / Ladon
Lavellan / Leanan Sidhe / Lelaps / Lou Carcolh / Maenad / Mahaha / Mamlambo
Mormo / Namazu / Narcissos / Nekomata / Ohdowas / Phooka / Puck
Pyrausta / Rat King / Rarog / Sandwalker / Sarlacc / Skinwalker / Symplegades
Tailypo / Teumessian Fox / Tooth Fairy / Tsemaus / Veo / Wild Hunt / Yale
Finally, the campfire needed to keep them warm during the cold swampy night was created, but what the adventures didn’t know was that this same campfire would later act like a beacon to attract the cause of their deaths.
Not much later, large flying, glowing creatures start appearing from everywhere, apparently attracted to the flames that also started to burn out of control, it looked like if the flames were coming alive!
“Fast! Put out those damned flames!!” Someone screamed, not knowing those same flames were the only thing that kept them alive for the moment, as they would become the next source of warmth the creatures would feed upon.
Adze’s are strange insectoid Magical Beasts that feed upon warmth like a vampire feeds on blood.
This warmth is collected inside the adze’s glowing body and used to fuel their energy and also their magical spell-like abilities over flame, light and heat, feeding on warmth also increases an Adze’s size, as normally they are normal size but after feeding they reach large size.
Wherever the Adze goes, flames seem to spring out of control and start to get a life of their own, but fire is also the best defense against them, because fire is warmer than your body and so the Adze are more attracted to the fire’s heat than that of your body’s, if no fire is available the Adze prey on warm blooded creatures body warmth, which is always fatal for the host-creature as they simply freeze to death.
Mythology Roots: The Adze comes from Ewe Folklore
Online Info:
Wikipedia about Adze
Pictures of the Adze
Adze-real life picture of fire fly
Adze from Final Fantasy Online
Adze Artwork
Other Names: If the name Adze isn’t good than don’t use the monster, or use something with firefly, fire, vampire or heat.
Possible CR: My guess on this is CR 5 or 6, not too low and not too high.
Creature Size: Adze are medium size, if they feed on warmth however they can grow up to large size, this size they won’t keep though, they will shrink again in time.
Alignment: Neutral Evil or Lawful Evil, they steal your body warmth so they can’t be really good or neutral.
Creature Type: While being a form of vampire, the Adze isn’t undead, it’s a magical beast.
Environment: Warm/Cold jungles or vast swamplands, they are often found where normal fireflies reside.
Special Abilities Thoughts: They can steal your bodies warmth so you freeze to death, even if they would rob you from your heath in the desert you will still freeze to death. Fire seem to come alive and becomes brighter and larger in the presence of Adze, it also is magnetically pulled toward the location of the Adze. Adze can spray a glowing yellow substance on a enemy, this substance will start to burn like acid and easily catches fire. The Adze can also use its inner light to blind enemies.
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The adventures stumbled into the seemingly distressed town.
If they ask the mayor what happened to his town he answers: “Our only river has run dry, so people die of thirst, and I send ten of my best men already to find the source of this drought, but they all haven’t returned yet, this is a small town so I’m running out of people to search for the cause.”
When the adventures later arrive at the lake they are disgusted by what they see, a giant dam blocks the river, the macabre thing is that this dam is made from Treant parts, but also from what seemed to be the boney remains of the people who went searching for the cause.
Afancs can be very creative with their food, even though mother told you not to play with yours.
Afancs look like a disturbing mix of deadly crocodile and monstrous beaver, they are extremely creative minds who use nature and their food to create all kinds of traps and mechanisms to distress local humanoids (their favorite food) and make them come to it out of pure frustration of what causing their lake to run dry or what causing the trees to fall randomly onto their houses.
The teeth of the Afanc can cut through wood, stone and bone with ease, some Afanc can even cut through steel and metals, although those Afanc are probably enhanced with magic.
Because of their creativity and ability to create dangerous traps and weapons, Lizardman, Orc, Hobgoblin and Bugbear leaders enjoy having Afancs around to create traps, weapons and even huts for them.
Afancs and Treants are natural enemies as Afancs enjoy the taste of young treants and dryads more than anything else, even more than humanoid flesh, they often use the parts they don’t like for their own dams in which they live, they think this Treant/Dryad wood is magical and stronger than normal wood.
Mythology Roots: The Afanc comes from Welsh Mythology
Online Info:
Wikipedia about the Afanc
Pictures of the Afanc
Afanc from Devil Summoner game.
Afanc made by artist on Deviant.
Another artist take on the Afanc.
Other Names: The Afanc are also known as Addanc.
Possible CR: Probably between 3 and 6, depending on its magical abilities.
Creature Size: Afancs can be small, medium, large or huge, having more beaver features would probably make it smaller and having more crocodile features would probably make it larger.
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral is my first bet, but can also be any form of Evil.
Creature Type: Magical Beast, Chimerae = Animal composed out of two animals.
Environment: Swamp area’s or wild rivers or lakes that have rivers attached to them so they can sabotage it.
Special Abilities Thoughts: They have very dangerous and sharp teeth that can cut through most substances with ease. They are extremely creative and can build complex things from wood, stone and bones, such as dams to stop rivers peoples water supplies, huts/houses to attract travelers that need a place to rest and dangerous and complicated traps to snare victims, when working for other evil masterminds the afancs can also create weapons for their allied forces.
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And I will send a free... something... to anyone who can sell me on a new family of five logically related dragons. New colors need not apply. Mythical creatures preferred. One head only please.
I apologize in advance for a poorly structured and fragmented text:
Aberrant dragons:
This family of dragons hails from a planet beyond the known stars or possibly even a different reality. Their skins have an alien translucence to them similar to that observed on small amphibians but noticable despite their large size. While similar in their basic body structure to chromatic and metallic dragons, the physique of all aberrant dragons displays unique andoften unnatural or downright disturbing features.
Lacune Dragon: This dragon's slender, grey, long-limbed body looks utterly twisted in the most literal sense, as if bones and spine were snapped an twisted around in several places. It lacks the usual draconic features such as horns and spikes and armored scales but its thinly wrapped skin pronounces the contours of its skeleton. Their empty white eyes seem to stare beyond the realm of what a mortal mind can comprehend. Lacune dragons are known for their ability to appear from and disappear through angles found in their environment, such as a corner where two walls meet.
The ability to travel through angles is an at-will supernatural ability that can be used as a move action and is resolved like Dimension Door. However when the lacune dragon is using it, it must be adjacent to or in a square that has an inwards angled feature (such as two meeting walls or the corner between a wall and the floor), the angle must be as wide as the dragon's occupied space. However not the entire length if this angle must be adjacent to the dragon. The exit point must fulfill the same requirement.
(this is just a rough draft of course to get the idea for the ability accross)
It should have spell-likes like teleport, possibly plane shift and other space-shifting related spells.
Breath attack: Line of cold
Devourer Dragon: This dragon has a dark discolored bluish green skin, it's most notorious feature is the mass of tentacles extending from its lower jaw which serve to feed victims into it's relatively narrow mouth, which sports an array of unsettling long, almost needle-like curved teeth. Its bloated body seems to be covered in opening and closing circular fanged maws which always seem to only appear in the bserver's peripheral vision but are gone without a hint or trace when looked at directly. Devourer dragons feed on the souls of other creatures, by devouring their body. Inside the dragon's bowels, the soul of the victim is extracted from the body, utterly destroying both in the process.
When a devourer dragon kills a creature and swallows it, or a creature it swallowed dies inside its body, the soul of the victim is destroyed and it cannot be brought back from the dead even with true resurrection. The dragon can then decide to immediately regain a number of hit points equal to the number of the victim's hit dice or regain a spell slot per day equal to half-the victim's number of hit dice-1 (rounded down).
Devourers should also get swallow whole from wyrmling age onwards.
Breath attack: Negative energy cone
Shapeless dragon: While generally maintaining the rough shape, and certain features of a typical dragon, this dragon's form constantly shifts in sickening and almost hypnotic ways. It's body seems to consist of a semi-liquid mass that constantly manifests different body parts. If it so wishes, the shapeless dragon can completely alter its form into any shape of roughly the same size.
Shapeless dragons can change their shape as an at-will supernatural ability. This is resolved like the polymorph spell, however the dragon can also take the shape of any object or an amorphous mass, in which case it cannot move but retains all of its normal abilities. The new shape must always have the same size category as the dragon (but may take the shape of something that is not usually this size, for example a huge shapeless dragon could polymorph into a huge goblin) and unlike the normal polymorph spell the dragon's body retains its appearance of a semi-liquid mass, merely mimicing the shape of something else.
Older Shapeless dragons also have the ability to maifest two additional natural weapons of any kind. These use the same damage dice as its wing buffet (not counting any feats) and are always secondary.
Breath attack: Acid cone
Void dragon: This dragon's mirror-like skin is smooth and featureless, it does not have scales or horns or even eyes, its claws and teeth are clear and colourless like glass. Void dragons can travel the space between worlds unprotected and do so frequently. They usually nest in empty space outside a planets atmosphere but stay close to the planet for their own mysterious reasons. Some scholars theorize that they use a planet's lifeforms as a food source, others assume they merely hunt living creatures on those planets for their own amusement.
Void dragons can fly into space and travel between planets the same way a Shantak does, but they can't grant their immunity to the erilous effects of space to other creatures.
Breath attack: Line of electricity
Warp dragon: This dragon's dark purple and black skin constantly shifts hues and and diplays fleeting patterns of bright colors, its outline seems to be not entirely solid, as though it weren't completely real. Warp dragons seem to exist partially outside reality, which grants them a limited ability to shape the space-time continuum around them to better accomodate their needs.
Warp dragons can as a swift action shift their presence on the material plane at will. They can not be entirely real or vanish complerely without risking losing the ability to do so. A warp dragon can choose a percentage between 10 and 90% depending on how far they want to vanish from the physical realm. This percentage value determines the miss chance that all attacks made by or against the warp dragons incur. Additionally all spells cast by or on the warp dragon have an equal chance of failing. If a spell is cast that only has the warp dragon as one of multiple targets or has it in its area of effect, the spell does not fail but instead simply does not affect the dragon. Spells that a warp dragon casts on itself can never fail this way, however if they have an area of effect or affect multiple targets, the effect may fail to apply to the other targets (roll once for all targets together). If one warp dragon attacks or casts a spell on another warp dragon, only one percentage roll has to be made, that is the higher of the two miss-chances.
Spell-like abilities it should have include time affecting spells like haste and time stop.
Breath attack: I don't really know. Maybe fire, we didn't have fire yet.
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Yeah as i said, this is pretty disjointed and just a few basic ideas as per the mechanics. And I'm not sure how these can be a dragon and an aberration at the same time. Maybe dragons with some aberration traits.
After miles of disarming impossible traps and fighting the strangest and most alien of monsters, Arak the notorious grave robber and his hired barbarian sidekick Ottis finally come to the room with the treasure they began this cursed journey for.
In the middle of the large and empty room stands an altar with on it a very large magical sword.
When Arak sees it he’s both shocked and excited about the sheer size of the thing. “This must have been the sword of an Ettin, or no, a Cyclops, make that a Hecantonkheires or Titan! I sure hope you can carry that thing Ottis, as that treasure is our ticket to fame and all kinds of riches!”
No one has heard of both Arak and Ottis ever again…
Never carry more than your body can take.
To unknowing onlookers the Alastor appears as the animated sword of a giant or titan, but scholars know better, this huge blades were the result of a curse/blessing of the God of battle named Gorum. Far back in the history of Golarion, Gorum blessed some of his favorite Orc warriors and turned them into large titans of pure war known as Alastors. He then blessed/cursed them with the ability to stay “alive” even after death, their huge magical weapons would simply absorb their souls and continued fighting.
Now many ages later most Alastors fought thousands of battles and some are still being controlled by Gorum if needed, but most of them lie dormant in ancient tombs, dungeons and castles, waiting for treasure hunters to come to them, or for a new task from Gorum.
Mythology Roots: The Alastor comes from Greek and Christian Mythology
Online Info:
Wikipedia about Alastor
Pictures of the Alastor
One form of Alastor
Alastor from Castlevania
Alastor from some game
Other Names: Avenger Blade, Possessed Sword, Cursed Sword, Nemesis, Ares Spirit, Deadly Sword, Spirit of War, Ghost Blade and the list goes on and on and on.
Possible CR: Alastor can be both a very powerful CR 18+ creature or a weaker creature from CR 8 or 10.
Creature Size: Alastors are the weapons of Titan sized creatures, so they are large to huge.
Alignment: Lawful Evil (probably)
Creature Type: A undead spirit which possesses a construct sword.
Environment: Any, mostly in forgotten dungeons or castles as most Alastors lie dormant after fighting for so many ages.
Special Abilities Thoughts: Alastors can animate, or create the poltergeist effect in other weapon-objects, this only works on weapons, shields, armor and other things of war, they often animate an entire suit of armor so it looks the armor is holding the Alastor.
Many Alastors have runic carvings on them which gives them special magical attacks, but this differs from Alastor to Alastor.
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Everybody in town is shocked to hear what happened to (fat) Tom Woodman the other day…
His extremely thin body was found in his own house leaning over what seemed to be a suicide note to his family.
Dear FamilyI don’t know what’s happening to me.
Everyday I get more hungry, and the strange voices in my head get stronger, telling me to never stop eating.
Sometimes it’s like something has invaded my body, making me only think about eating more and more food…It’s getting worse each day and I’m so ashamed of my gluttonous deeds, I stole from the reserve food supplies, and it even made me eat Oscar the mayors dog, as the voices are making me crazy… they are making me do bad things.
I wished somebody could help me, I can’t take this much longer, I think… I think I just end this all, I can’t live like this any longer, sooner or later it’s gonna force me to eat a hum
Tom never finished the letter as the Alp Luachra’s demands proved him fatal.
The strange Alp Luachra may look like some silly worm-like creature called a Olm/Proteus, but they can be fatal when they enter a victim’s body.
They enter the victim when they drink from rivers and lakes.
Alp Luachra’s are extremely greedy and gluttonous, but lacking any mouth to eat with of their own, they need to use other creatures for eating, they are the parasites from your nightmares.
Mythology Roots: The Alp Luachra comes from Irish Mythology
Online Info:
Wikipedia about Alp Luachra
Pictures of the Alp Luachra
A fairy-form Alp Luachra
The Olm, an amphibian I based my version of the Alp Luachra on.
Other Names: They are also known as Joint-Eaters, Just-Halver, and if that isn’t good enough something with greed, gluttony, olm, Proteus or Parasite.
Possible CR: The Alps aren’t that powerful, but they are hard to notice and see as they are invisible all the time, but they are probably around CR 3.
Creature Size: They can alter their size from Tiny to Medium, in tiny size they enter the human body and there they become larger when reaching the stomach.
Alignment: Chaotic Neutral or any Evil.
Creature Type: Maybe a Fey, Magical Beast or Aberration, everything would be possible.
Environment: Al Luachra’s live in rivers and often in the stomach of your best buddy who needs saving. :D
Special Abilities Thoughts: They can change their size at will, becoming extremely tiny up to medium size when growing from the backs of their victims. They can produce a pheromone that induces extreme hunger in its victims, they can also emit an aura that drains away food and potions. And of course they are most of the time invisible.
Last but not least, they can merge with flesh without causing pain to their victim, they often merge with the victims stomach and grow from his/her/its back so it can whisper all kinds of orders and suggestions into the victims ears, they are invisible to both the victim and other creatures so the infected person often thinks the Alp Luachra is just a voice in its head.
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And I will send a free... something... to anyone who can sell me on a new family of five logically related dragons. New colors need not apply. Mythical creatures preferred. One head only please.
One question, is it absolutely necessary that a new family of dragons MUST have five members? Sin/virtue dragons were suggested earlier in the thread, but it seems as if everyone immediately discounted the concept because that's 7 members instead of 5. Are we really going to throw away a great concept that fits in so well with already-established themes in Golarion just because it isn't a perfect fit with something that was fairly arbitrarily decided upon some 4 decades ago?
Yeah, the sin dragons occurred to me immediately, but I wasn't sure how to handle the 7 sins vs. 5 dragons deal. You could have five dragons that were all various combinations of the 7 sins, but that just gets weird.
Alternately, for several of the dragons, one sin could "mature" into another, thus giving only five dragons, even though each would have two stages of development.
That might be worthwhile anyways, since theoretically the sins are not all equal in power and this would allow for a definition of the relative power of the various sins. Then, the 'young' dragons would be the five weakest sins, and the 'mature' dragons would be the five strongest sins.
Of course, that's really 10 dragons, not five :)
i'm much more interested in the apocalypse dragons, war, pestilence, famine and death dragons would make much more sense than sleepy, fat, and sexual frustrated dragons, and the 5th could be the leader/combination of the 4 horseman-of-apocalypse dragon, much like the Jann is too the genies.
Yeah, the sin dragons occurred to me immediately, but I wasn't sure how to handle the 7 sins vs. 5 dragons deal. You could have five dragons that were all various combinations of the 7 sins, but that just gets weird.
Alternately, for several of the dragons, one sin could "mature" into another, thus giving only five dragons, even though each would have two stages of development.
That might be worthwhile anyways, since theoretically the sins are not all equal in power and this would allow for a definition of the relative power of the various sins. Then, the 'young' dragons would be the five weakest sins, and the 'mature' dragons would be the five strongest sins.
Of course, that's really 10 dragons, not five :)
Gluttony and Greed can be combined into Selfishness without too much of a leap. Lust and Pride can be combined into Vanity also.
Would it be too much to have a Bestiary that contained specific mythologica/folklore figures? Baba-Yaga comes to mind.
And than you have disposed of both greed and Lust... lust being a good thing but I rather see Envy go.
What kind of dragon would you guys make up with envy? its dragonbreath weapon makes players jealous on eachother so they won't share spells,buffs and items anymore?
And the gluttony dragon makes you so hungry you waste all your potions on eating frenzy?
And the lust dragon makes you so sexually frustrated that you attack your female teammates and the other way around?
And the Pride dragon makes you so vain that you turn into Vanity Smurf, only watching yourself in the nearest mirror you find? Or it makes you so proud that you take enormous risks?
I thought we already have a sleepy breath that makes you sleep, so the lazy sloth dragon is a waste of space.
All dragons are greedy, vain, pridefull, lazy, gluttonous and they don't share things between them.
I think the chromatic dragons have all sins in them, and the metallic dragons have all virtues, so they excist already. Next.
i'm much more interested in the apocalypse dragons, war, pestilence, famine and death dragons would make much more sense than sleepy, fat, and sexual frustrated dragons, and the 5th could be the leader/combination of the 4 horseman-of-apocalypse dragon, much like the Jann is too the genies.
Except Pathfinder already has the Four Horsemen, and so dragons based on them...would probably overlap too much and be repetitive. I also think DnD 4e had Cataclysm dragons which overlap broadly with what you propose
Would it be too much to have a Bestiary that contained specific mythologica/folklore figures? Baba-Yaga comes to mind.
James Jacob has hinted that Baba Yaga might get statted up with mythic rules in the last volume of Reign of Winter
And than you have disposed of both greed and Lust... lust being a good thing but I rather see Envy go.
What kind of dragon would you guys make up with envy? its dragonbreath weapon makes players jealous on eachother so they won't share spells,buffs and items anymore?
And the gluttony dragon makes you so hungry you waste all your potions on eating frenzy?
And the lust dragon makes you so sexually frustrated that you attack your female teammates and the other way around?
And the Pride dragon makes you so vain that you turn into Vanity Smurf, only watching yourself in the nearest mirror you find? Or it makes you so proud that you take enormous risks?
I thought we already have a sleepy breath that makes you sleep, so the lazy sloth dragon is a waste of space.
All dragons are greedy, vain, pridefull, lazy, gluttonous and they don't share things between them.
I think the chromatic dragons have all sins in them, and the metallic dragons have all virtues, so they excist already. Next.
This is the bestiary 4 wishlist, not the "Monsters Sincubus likes thread" I thought making Pyraustas into a new dragon type was silly, but I didn't slam you for suggesting it.
There are multiple ways you could work with Sin-based Dragons. It might be that the environmental effects of Sin Dragons are more prominent; i.e. when settles in an area and all the local populace go crazy with that particular sin. And that the nearer you get to a Sin Dragon, the harsher the effects. A gluttony dragon might turn a whole town into cannibals overnight. A envy dragon might lead to whole communities slaughtering each other to take each other's possessions. A sloth dragon just causes the population to become sedentary and waste away. A Pride dragon might just lead to everyone thinking they are right and should run things, leading revolts and anarchy. And so forth. The biggest issue I could see is I am not sure how to make a Lust Dragon that wouldn't cross Paizo's line on maturity level. A dragon that causes widespread orgies is not going to pass Paizo policies
Sin(and Virtue) dragons would be interesting and you could still have seven of them but they just couldn't be true dragons since and who says they have to be true dragons. In fact creatures based on a single sin or virtue would be interesting, not just dragons.
Also Sincubus, sloth is a spiritual or emotional apathy not just being lazy.
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Yeah, the sin dragons occurred to me immediately, but I wasn't sure how to handle the 7 sins vs. 5 dragons deal. You could have five dragons that were all various combinations of the 7 sins, but that just gets weird.
Alternately, for several of the dragons, one sin could "mature" into another, thus giving only five dragons, even though each would have two stages of development.
That might be worthwhile anyways, since theoretically the sins are not all equal in power and this would allow for a definition of the relative power of the various sins. Then, the 'young' dragons would be the five weakest sins, and the 'mature' dragons would be the five strongest sins.
Of course, that's really 10 dragons, not five :)
Or you could just let the Sin family of dragons have seven members and stop trying to force artificial symmetry onto the game.
Humans... I can't stand them, find out what's driving them and they are such a hypocrits it hurts me.
Farewell.
Ask James Jacobs, I remember him saying that they will only have 5 dragons per "family". Personelly if they ever break that rule I would like to have more primal dragons.
I also like the idea of creatures(not just dragons) based on the four seasons.
I would love some Zodiac beasts though, 12 monsters based on the signs of the zodiac like those talismans from Jackie Chan adventures.
I like the idea of dragons based on the cosmos like sun, moon, stars, planet, nebula, cosmic, etc.
We really need creatures from the positive energy plane, dimension of time, and the world of dreams.
Some outer planes dragons would be cool so we would have a dragon for chaos(CN), good(NG), evil(NE), law(LN) and neutrality(N).
Oni based on Catfolk, Merfolk, Troll, Cyclops, Goblin, Elf, Dwarf, Lizardfolk, Ratfolk, and Strix/Syrinx.
The five dragon rule does mean a lot of potentially good concepts get scrapped. I would like Planar Dragons for the Abyss, Hell, Abbadon, etc.
On the other hand, It's not like we don't have a plethora of dragons...so on one hand they are not something I feel a bestiary NEEDS to be published.
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Humans... I can't stand them, find out what's driving them and they are such a hypocrits it hurts me.
Farewell.
Dude, if you're going to criticize everyone's wish list when it doesn't align with yours, you're gonna have to expect some response. Myself and several other people have pointed this out to you before. I like some of your suggestions, and you've almost certainly been the biggest contributor to this thread. But that doesn't give you a license to crap all over other people's suggestions. If you can't deal with that, then I agree, you saying farewell to this thread is possibly the best course of action. But lay off the attempt at sympathy.
I'm not a fan of dragons, there were too many of them, any new type of dragon would have to be very original. Weirder types like chole, kodragon, nehaschimic, nexus, or void dragons.
More 0HD playable plant races would be nice.
Familiar options that are plants, oozes, aberations, etc. plus more fey, elemental, and magical beast familiar options.
Some mega fauna familiar and animal companion options.
Monstrous humaniod 0HD playable race.
I wouldn't mind seeing both a good and evil version of the Tooth Fairy.
Stats for Grendal and his mother.
More types of lesser dragons particularly ones from various cultures.
More eyeball themed monsters like flying eyeball fiends, animate eyeball undead, Argus, Eye of the Deep, etc.
More types of Drakes(storm, lava/magma, jungle, marsh, crystal, etc.)
I would like to see at least 5-10 new 0HD races, 3-5 new improved familiar options, 2-5 new animal companions.
More creatures and templates related to the first world.
New types of elementals like life, time, etc.
More crystal based creatures such as elementals, constructs, magical beast, etc.
More creatures that use light, sound, gravity, time, force, and positive energy.
Creatures who instill positive emotions(love, joy, etc.) but can still be dangerous.
More creatures from distant worlds, some more robots, greys, old school sci-fi and horror monsters.
Creatures that feed off of emotions, ki, knowledge, memories, magic, luck, sin, etc.
Some creatures from the dark tapestry.
Pre-dinosaur prehistoric life.
At least 20+ fey and 10+ elementals this time.
Agree, more 0HD races that aren't humanoid or Native Outsiders.
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...Valraven, from Danish folklore; a shapeshifting raven that gains power by consuming the dead, and acquiring their memories. It is said they they gain the power to take human form if they eat the heart of a child
They are also sometimes depicted as half wolf/half Raven monster.
As a piece of bonus information, the Danish word for the creature is valravn (without the "e"). :)
The five dragon rule does mean a lot of potentially good concepts get scrapped. I would like Planar Dragons for the Abyss, Hell, Abbadon, etc.
On the other hand, It's not like we don't have a plethora of dragons...so on one hand they are not something I feel a bestiary NEEDS to be published.
Hmm, how about purely alignment-based dragons as a version of that planar dragon idea?
A pure good celestial-themed dragon, a pure evil fiend-themed dragon, and of course a pure lawful, and pure chaotic. The idea could be rounded out to 5 Dragons if you make a pure neutral dragon as the fifth.
Not sure if that's the greatest idea there is for dragons in general, but the restriction of there needing to be 5 of them made it a bit difficult.
...They would also end up hitting every alignment that druids are capable of being, with none of the extreme alignments... Which would be slightly odd when you consider that the pure law and pure good ones would both be incapable of becoming paladins. They'd probably each need an innate smite [opposite alignment] ability. I don't know what they neutral one would get. Perhaps a choice of one type of smite, either determined at birth, or that could be changed around once in a while.
Gluttony, I already said the pure alignment dragons thing on my post earlier.
Everyone, fire your "lazors" against those evil ugly cliche "everything must be evil to be cool" creatures.
Well they don't have to be true dragons just a new type of "lesser" dragons like linnorms or drakes.
Anyone see the movie "Enemy Mines" because it had a couple of cool creatures in it that would be nice.
Yes more non-humaniod/outsider 0HD races such as fey, plant, monstrous humaniod, aberration, etc. but I still want outsider(plane touched) races for law and chaos(and the positive energy plane).
Gluttony, I already said the pure alignment dragons thing on my post earlier.
Everyone, fire your "lazors" against those evil ugly cliche "everything must be evil to be cool" creatures.
Well they don't have to be true dragons just a new type of "lesser" dragons like linnorms or drakes.
Anyone see the movie "Enemy Mines" because it had a couple of cool creatures in it that would be nice.
Yes more non-humaniod/outsider 0HD races such as fey, plant, monstrous humaniod, aberration, etc. but I still want outsider(plane touched) races for law and chaos(and the positive energy plane).
Ah, sorry I must've missed you saying that. I've fallen behind on this thread, and I've only really read this most recent page for my catchup.
I'd love more 0HD races. Hopefully enough that they'll eventually be able to justify an Advance Race Guide 2 (there's already 0HD races like the Android and the Lashunta that have been released since the arrival of the ARG after all).
Believe me, I would love an Advanced Races Guide 2 over anything other then another hardcover bestiary.
I get the impression that another hardcover bestiary (maybe not Bestiary 4, but possibly the eventual Bestiary 5) will be pushed back a year to make way for the almost-inevitable NPC Codex 2 (NPC Codex covers only the core classes. The base classes, as well as the UM and UC ones and the 3 alternate classes; ninja, samurai, and antipaladin, will need some love eventually).
On the other hand, Mythic rules might mean a need for more mythic/high CR monsters, which might improve upon the odds of Bestiary 4. Also I imagine they want to get an idea of how popular the NPC codex is before making plans for a second volume (which I imagine they would have to already be working on?)
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Familiar options that are plants, oozes, aberations, etc. plus more fey, elemental, and magical beast familiar options.
Heck yeah. GURPS allowed you to pretty much design your own familiar, and I had great fun making tiny versions of various monsters (miniature gryphon? miniature hystrix?) or sentient spell effects or whatever.
Some smaller elementals, and plant options, and even a few undead, perhaps, could be awesome. Little dragonets that spit globs of fire, acid, etc. (a few times / day, damage as alchemist's fire), instead of pseudo-dragons, would be very cool to this old-school Pern fan.
How about a mobile haunt as a familiar for a necromancer?
Stats for Grendal and his mother.
Ooh, good one. A troll, with DR instead of regeneration, would make a decent palette swap option for Grendel, but 'real' stats would be neat.
More types of lesser dragons particularly ones from various cultures.
Heck yeah. More sources of dragonhide, if nothing else! :)
More eyeball themed monsters like flying eyeball fiends, animate eyeball undead, Argus, Eye of the Deep, etc.
Swarms of flying eyeballs, that engulf people, and batter them unconscious (nonlethal damage), and then steal their eyes (to join the swarm) leaving them permanantly blind, barring a regenerate spell. Yikes!
I would like to see at least 5-10 new 0HD races, 3-5 new improved familiar options, 2-5 new animal companions.
Definitely more stuff that's not just usable by the GM, but also by a player! I was surprised that the Nexians developed a 0 HD plant race, instead of a 0 HD ooze race, given their sentient ooze colonies. But that's pretty setting specific and would fit better into an Inner Sea Bestiary 2, and not a generic Bestiary 4...
Creatures who instill positive emotions (love, joy, etc.) but can still be dangerous.
The dreaded joybringer, an aberration that resembles a gibbering mouther and is, literally, 'all smiles,' radiating an aura of joy, peace and serenity, and sits among it's complacent unresisting prey, sighing in contentment as it drains them of blood and warmth, leaving cooling dessicated smiling corpses in it's wake.
A parasitic monster that replaces a missing child and casts an glamer over the family it joins, so that they fanatically defend it, and refuse to see that it is a grotesque slug-like creature, reinforcing their familial bonds and protectiveness, and preying on their refusal to accept the loss of their true child.
Great suggestions, Dragon78! Very inspiring!
Glad someone agrees with me Set.
I do not want the Bestiary 4 to be mythic, they should leave that stuff in the Mythic book.
If they do another NPC codex next year instead of a hardcover bestiary I cancel all my subscriptions. I really wish they got up to Bestiary number 5 then started doing the NPC codexes.
Cheese Golems
Well...I didn't say it would be a mythic bestiary, just that I might expect some percentage of monsters to use mythic rules. I just don't see how the Mythic rule book will have room for Kaiju, Demon Lords, Archdevils, Horsemen, Lovecraftian Old Ones, plus any other mythic types of monster they decide to create, given most of those guys are going to need 2 page spreads to do them correctly.
Given the love for Distant Worlds/Numeria, I could also see volume 4 having more rules for robots, cyborgs, maybe some other more "sci-fi" esq monsters. I have a feeling a Numeria AP is likely in the near future.
All the lovecraftian creatures from APs 46 and 65 as well as some new ones.
All the Kami/Oni from the APs as well as new ones.
More sea creatures both monstrous and mundane.
As long as they don't use mythic rules I wouldn't mind some stats for Kaiju and Old ones. But I do not want stats for archdevils, demon lords, etc. I would prefer they get there own book.
Oozes that do use acid, maybe feed on magic, energy, mental energy/thoughts, some more intellagent ones as well. Also oozes that feed only inorganic materials like metal, crystal, etc.
More creatures who's treasure is there own body parts like gem like eyes, golden fleece, scales hard as steal and maybe even magical parts like a horn that fucntions as a magical weapon, crystal tears that act as a potion or scroll, etc.
Granfaloon like creature that is a aberration that covers it's flying form in a shell of corpses that when they take damage shed off and animate as undead.
A cyborg template would be nice.
As far as dragons go I would like to see a moon dragon, wether it is from the moon(or a moon), a creature from dreams, or just named that because it's scales looks like the itself moon I don't care as long as I like the creature itself.
They could have/make both a new Bestiary and a new NPC Codex.
hell, just specific Half-Celestial (Half-Angel, Half-Brijidine, etc) and specific Half-Fiend (half-Demon, Half-Erinyes, etc) could almost fit a bestiary/compendium by themselves, maybe with more variety for half-Dragons (half-Imperial, Half Linorn, etc) as well.
They could have/make both a new Bestiary and a new NPC Codex.
They probably will. The issue is just that they probably won't be released in the same year.
I ment to say Oozes that do not use acid.
Creatures themed on the Sun, the moon, the stars and other cosmic forces.
More non-standard types of swarms like plant, fey, construct, aberration, oozes, elementals, etc.
More types of Gigas, particularly the good, law, chaos planes versions.
Stats for the Leviathen as a CR20+ sea serpant or snake like dragon.
Grendel would be like CR8-10 while his mother(Hag?) would be like CR12-13 and also make them both Monstrous Humaniods.
Elementals that are 2 or more elements combined.
More types of multi-headed dragons and more tiny familiar dragons.
Monster under bed type creatures like monsters inc, where the wild one are, little monsters, etc. and make monstrous humaniods around CR6-9 range.
More plant creatures with forms that are humaniod, animal like, or just plain strange in form plus the giant sundew and giant pitcher plant.
Also more plant based familiars and "animal companions".
Paper based monsters would be interesting wether construct, outsider, undead or orther.
A first world simple template so you can summon animmals from there instead of the outer planes(celestial, fiendish, etc.).
Good aligned shadow/darkness themed creatures.
Some actually good aligned light themed creatures.
I ment to say Oozes that do not use acid.
Creatures themed on the Sun, the moon, the stars and other cosmic forces.
More types of multi-headed dragons and more tiny familiar dragons.
Monster under bed type creatures like monsters inc, where the wild one are, little monsters, etc. and make monstrous humaniods around CR6-9 range.
More plant creatures with forms that are humaniod, animal like, or just plain strange in form plus the giant sundew and giant pitcher plant.
Also more plant based familiars and "animal companions".
Paper based monsters would be interesting wether construct, outsider, undead or orther.
Good aligned shadow/darkness themed creatures.
Some actually good aligned light themed creatures.
+1 to these.
Hi, I don't know how this works? Can I make suggestions freely? Or must I have more posts or topics?
I really adored the earlier bestiaries, and i can't wait for more!
my list of creepy crawlers
- Creatures from english folklore. (buggane, water leaper, leanan sidhe)
- Creatures from numeria, such as the Annihilator and android.
- lovecraft creatures, especially nightgaunt
- Much and much much more plants! I really like plant creatures, I know of this creature from french which grows sheep instead of leaves, this could be a good monster, it creates prey animals to attract predators to eat.
- much and much more wishes for later, but this is enough for now.
cheers Kelly
Hi, I don't know how this works? Can I make suggestions freely? Or must I have more posts or topics?
I really adored the earlier bestiaries, and i can't wait for more!
my list of creepy crawlers
- Creatures from english folklore. (buggane, water leaper, leanan sidhe)
- Creatures from numeria, such as the Annihilator and android.
- lovecraft creatures, especially nightgaunt
- Much and much much more plants! I really like plant creatures, I know of this creature from french which grows sheep instead of leaves, this could be a good monster, it creates prey animals to attract predators to eat.
- much and much more wishes for later, but this is enough for now.
cheers Kelly
To answer your question. Yes, you can post freely.
I too would love to see the nightgaunt realized in pathfinder.I'd also like to see more Proteans, Inevitables, and Aeons. Too long have these catagories been ignored.
Hi, I don't know how this works? Can I make suggestions freely? Or must I have more posts or topics?
I really adored the earlier bestiaries, and i can't wait for more!
my list of creepy crawlers
- Creatures from english folklore. (buggane, water leaper, leanan sidhe)
- Creatures from numeria, such as the Annihilator and android.
- lovecraft creatures, especially nightgaunt
- Much and much much more plants! I really like plant creatures, I know of this creature from french which grows sheep instead of leaves, this could be a good monster, it creates prey animals to attract predators to eat.
- much and much more wishes for later, but this is enough for now.
cheers Kelly
The Annihilator and Android are both pretty awesome. I wholly recommend picking up the Inner Sea Bestiary to get your hands on those two (and quite a few other cool monsters).
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Definitely more stuff that's not just usable by the GM, but also by a player! I was surprised that the Nexians developed a 0 HD plant race, instead of a 0 HD ooze race, given their sentient ooze colonies. But that's pretty setting specific and would fit better into an Inner Sea Bestiary 2, and not a generic Bestiary 4...
I still recommend Alluria's Squole race to fill that gap. That lake was the first thing to pop in my head when I read that pdf. :)
Good aligned shadow/darkness themed creatures.
YES
More creatures who's treasure is there own body parts like gem like eyes, golden fleece, scales hard as steal and maybe even magical parts like a horn that fucntions as a magical weapon, crystal tears that act as a potion or scroll, etc.
This is something that's been largely missing from the game since 3.0, isn't it. You don't seem to see the "This creature's X is said to be able to cure Y" and such all that often these days.
Oozes that do use acid, maybe feed on magic, energy, mental energy/thoughts, some more intellagent ones as well. Also oozes that feed only inorganic materials like metal, crystal, etc.
Something I've wanted to see for a long time:
Complex ooze colonies, starting with a simple "root" at the beginning of a colony's life cycle and becoming more varied in nature, behavior, diet, etc. as the colony expands and converts more matter and organisms to its mass. And as the individual parts of the colony grow more advanced and intelligent, their nature might actually shift.
So you could have the odd situation of having a threat early on that does nothing but eat what it can reach. Then it stops devouring and begins converting people into near-mindless ooze-creatures serving the whole. And it continues to spread and grow in complexity until the ooze creatures' intelligence rises to something similar to what they had before. And then you might wind up with a colony of ooze-based life that might very well be relatively benign now that they've evolved into something more than mindless eating machines. Now how to reconcile that with the neighbors of the people they used to be...
How much of what they once were still lives within those new forms? And how much of a difference does that make to your PC, who may have very well been attached to some of them?
"We ate and changed the outside before we understood. We did not know we were doing harm. Now we wish to change only the inside, but we must understand the outside to learn how."
Could be a fun, entirely alien approach to alignment shifts.