Is that all the artists, though? It seems like mostly WAR's design choice, and not everyone's.
Whoever it was that used to do a lot of the GameMastery art (not WAR) has a lot of illos in which the iconic fighter's swords, if made of steel, would have weighed at least 50 or 100 lbs apiece.
But it's not just the art. "Giant-er weapons are automatically awesome-er!" is hard-coded into the game rules and the whole culture.
I want to organize a field trip to a museum to look at actual swords and warhammers. All of the game designers and artists would be required to attend.
You're probably too young to remember, but in old editions of D&D magical weapons used to be magically light, which would explain all of the giant hammers and swords floating around.
Pfft. Newbs.
You're probably too young to remember, but in old editions of D&D magical weapons used to be magically light, which would explain all of the giant hammers and swords floating around.
I'm old enough to remember when +5 weapons were automatically assumed to be an "adamantite" alloy. But I don't remember anything about magic weapons being bigger because that's so much cooler. Then again, I'm hard-pressed to remember my own name, on some days.
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Incidentally, I also remember seeing some article comparing steel weapons to titanium weapons. It turns out that to maintain the same level of sturdiness in, say, a titanium sword compared to a steel sword, you needed to use a greater volume of titanium. It's just that titanium is light enough that the finished weapon is still lighter than the equivalent steel weapon. But it looks like a silly "anime" greatsword in the end.
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How are they being punished?I could swear that some time back there was a big stink about what happened to atheists on Golarion because after death they got stuck somewhere horrible and occasionally fed to something. Did they change that? If they did, then what's bugging everyone about them now?
According to canon, the souls of atheists are given to Groetus, who just kind of sits on them, nothing much happening until, we guess, the End Times. But they're like in some graveyard in some kind of oblivion-state.
Sure, that sounds horrible to us with our life-loving existences, but who's to say what the experience is like to a lifeless soul?
But it looks like a silly "anime" greatsword in the end.
There are issues of leverage, balance, and air resistance, not just weight and strength.
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I typically do not play pre-made settings, but as far as they go, Golarion seems okay. I don't see me running it anytime soon, but I like to gather the modules and some of the AP products, just to check out formatting and see what is going on. What's interesting is there is a lot of detail and a lot of history, but not a lot of atmosphere, with the Lovecraftian stuff and an occasional ghost-centric module as the shining exception. So I guess I would say it could use more atmosphere. But maybe they leave that open to the GMs to interpret.
What does chaffe my hide, but it's nobody's fault, is that I, too, had been working hard on a huge project wherein the setting had similarly suffered technological setbacks due to near-world-ending events. When I started to delve in, and saw how similar a lot of my ideas were to Golarion, it was kind of a bummer. But then, that idea is an old one (Thundar and The Dark Tower series spring to mind immediately), so what's one more, right?
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But it looks like a silly "anime" greatsword in the end.There are issues of leverage, balance, and air resistance, not just weight and strength.
Of course. Titanium is lousy for blade-making because the leverage is all off, it can't hold an edge like steel, and the density means it swings poorly. AND it'll break easily if you don't make it stupid looking and all off on balance.
I'm an incredibly powerful being, effectively immortal, able to warp reality at my whim. I have people who follow me and who I can grant powers to a select few.Am I a god?
No, of course not. Gods don't grant power to a select few. They can grant power to whoever wants it.
And a god, especially a true god, is not only effectively immortal, he is effectively invulnerable.
An elan psion would have to be ways into epic level before they could be confused with a god.
Of course, the "the gods are merely powerful creatures, they're not 'divine' at all!" View exists - it's the stance of a Golarion atheist, after all - but the difference in power levels between true gods and almost everything else is so vast that an atheist has to make a real effort to believe what he believes.
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I want to organize a field trip to a museum to look at actual swords and warhammers. All of the game designers and artists would be required to attend.
I helped lay out the foundations for THIS PLACE.
Give us a bell if you're ever in the area...:)
(I do believe Buhlmann's been, if you want a review).
Give us a bell if you're ever in the area...:)
Now you've got me wanting to plan a long-delayed trip to the UK, just when my wife announces that we need to fly to Boston this year. You may need to have a pint of your best on my behalf, in hopes that I get to make that trip during this lifetime.
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In a world with fireballs, sticks that can shoot fireballs, and traps that can mechanically emulate shooting spouts of fire, somehow a muzzle loading gun is a baffling and incomprehensible device.
You can read the magical script of a creature that doesn't even share the same language as you, but that musket just blows everyone's freaking mind.
In a world with fireballs, sticks that can shoot fireballs, and traps that can mechanically emulate shooting spouts of fire, somehow a muzzle loading gun is a baffling and incomprehensible device.
You can read the magical script of a creature that doesn't even share the same language as you, but that musket just blows everyone's freaking mind.
Ah, but it's not magic, you see... and that's the thing. Not magic = no traditional defenses against it!
The fact that elves are apparently aliens.
Very small number of gods and even smaller number of myths... Seriously, there is not even a hundred gods known around, what kind of divine wasteland is it?
Minor annoyance: Orcs are basically chaotic evil, more or less guaranteed.
Also, that the other thread still shows I've one unread thing when I have the post. Go figure. :)
Very small number of gods and even smaller number of myths... Seriously, there is not even a hundred gods known around, what kind of divine wasteland is it?
4e FR? :P
No, I do think there are more than 100 gods around. Maybe a lot more. They're just not widespread, well-known, or published yet.
(NOTE: I mean no offense, and don't wish to come off as sarcastic or mean, only wry and teasing and friendly. Please read as such!)
Very small number of gods and even smaller number of myths... Seriously, there is not even a hundred gods known around, what kind of divine wasteland is it?
Hahahahahahah!
...Wait, you were serious?
And that's not even mentioning all the heterodoxical elements... especially in the chaotic churches! And Vudra has a completely blown-off-the-top number of gods (supposedly "numberless" or in the millions). Tian Xia, much of Garund, and <NEW-WORLD STAND-IN I CAN'T RECALL> isn't covered, and even more - many deities died against Rovagug. Other gods exist, but haven't been detailed, or have been forgotten. The Azlanti pantheon consists of two deities - one a demon lord and one a moon goddess - that are completely unknown in modern circles. I think it's even been stated multiple times that the Big 20... are just that: the big 20, not the only 20 (in fact, there's quite a few). Plus the big gods are actually greater than they are in other games, to the point of being virtually untouchable by mortal hands (and supposedly most immortal hands). The big 20 have really just kind of pushed themselves into the public consciousness across the Inner Sea region... that's why they're the big 20. Minor gods are marginalized or ignored, or just simply too minor to get big mentions.
4e FR? :P
I might have said that before, but the terrible reduction of number of deities in 4th Edition was what I didn't liked in 4th edition FR the most - I hadn't problem with pushing the timeline 100 years in the future, I hadn't problem with returned Abeir, I hadn't problem with destruction of certain lands, only to replace them with other lands (actually I like getting rid of Mulhorand, Unther and Maztica and I like introduction of Tieflings and Dragonborn as separate races) but the removal of so many flavorful deities was wrong. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against good old godslaying, stealing divine power, backstabbing, intrigues againt them and so. But they did it so blandly, pointlessly and without real plot reasons other than "you are too stupid to handle more than handful of desities" or "we cannot manage to handle more than handful of deities ourselves so we cut them down"
Hahahahahahah!
...
Wait, you were serious?
Its a total of 20 major gods and a mere <60 minor gods and demigods, includinga few known Vudran and Tian Xia. Demon Lords, Archdevils and Empyreal Lords I don't count as they are something different from deities, even if they would like to be counted amongst the divine numbers.
And that's not even mentioning all the heterodoxical elements... especially in the chaotic churches! And Vudra has a completely blown-off-the-top number of gods (supposedly "numberless" or in the millions). Tian Xia, much of Garund, and <NEW-WORLD STAND-IN I CAN'T RECALL> isn't covered,
Yes, but they are not here, they may be counted when the more information will be available those parts of the world.
I might have said that before, but the terrible reduction of number of deities in 4th Edition was what I didn't liked in 4th edition FR the most - I hadn't problem with pushing the timeline 100 years in the future, I hadn't problem with returned Abeir, I hadn't problem with destruction of certain lands, only to replace them with other lands (actually I like getting rid of Mulhorand, Unther and Maztica and I like introduction of Tieflings and Dragonborn as separate races) but the removal of so many flavorful deities was wrong. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against good old godslaying, stealing divine power, backstabbing, intrigues againt them and so. But they did it so blandly, pointlessly and without real plot reasons other than "you are too stupid to handle more than handful of desities" or "we cannot manage to handle more than handful of deities ourselves so we cut them down"
We're very different people ;)
To be honest, I had MORE issue with them destroying the setting then I did the gods... (Truthfully I only heard the rumors about it, not sure who's left and who isn't.. I heard it was a bloodbath though.)
I thought it was less 'your too stupid to handle them'... then it was 'Too many gods are doing the same blasted thing...' The redundancy was astounding sometimes.
I kind of prefer the Golarion method of 'This is the god of blacksmiths...' Oh... and most of his followers are dwarves... but they don't HAVE to be.
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Almost always, Paizo depicts these spaces as TINY. The idea of interesting, dynamic and powerful people living in these spaces...ridiculous. More importantly, the idea of holding interesting combats in these spaces -- impossible.
Oh wow, I so agree with this. So many five foot wide corridors, in which any character other than the one standing in front are basically holding their cheese, and then there's one encounter in Rise of the Runelords where the squares in the room were two and a half feet across! What possible use is that? If the party consists of pixies, perhaps they could occupy quarter squares, but otherwise, it's just a pain in the butt!
Not *every* fight needs to be in a wide-open space with plenty of cover for the rogue, clear charging lanes for the barbarian, and well-lit to allow for sneak attacks, but still, the 5 ft. tunnels get a bit stale, since they only allow a single character to function, and this is *not* a solo game...
I generally double the size of all significant spaces in Paizo's modules and Adventure Path stories...and I generally add textures that complicate or enhance the encounter.
I like this latter bit about adding stuff to make it more interesting.
"Yeah, imagine this map, but twice as big, and these two squares are on fire, and it's spreading..." :)
The fact that elves are apparently aliens.
I expect it will be revealed that the crash site in Numeria will be a Void Stalker Class Battleship.
Or I'll run into Cutter and Skywise while roaming the Inner Sea.
Cities where Humans are the minority, and not evil-aligned cities, either. Humans have cities on the surface world, elves apparently have cities where they are 99% of the population, but no concentrated dwarven cities, gnome cities, etc. Not underground in the Underdark. Flourishing trade cities where dwarves make up 97% of the population, and humans have to learn to live a little like the dwarves to get along (not just bending over in the mining tunnels). Reverse the normal status quo that humans have lots and lots of cities where humans are accepted and all other races are in the minority, races who are either watched or easy to spot in a crowd. Halfling cities (5,000+) where halfling tradition is the norm. Places where half-elves are assumed Human, not shown to be more Elf than Human.
Cities where Humans are the minority, and not evil-aligned cities, either. Humans have cities on the surface world, elves apparently have cities where they are 99% of the population, but no concentrated dwarven cities, gnome cities, etc. Not underground in the Underdark. Flourishing trade cities where dwarves make up 97% of the population, and humans have to learn to live a little like the dwarves to get along (not just bending over in the mining tunnels). Reverse the normal status quo that humans have lots and lots of cities where humans are accepted and all other races are in the minority, races who are either watched or easy to spot in a crowd. Halfling cities (5,000+) where halfling tradition is the norm. Places where half-elves are assumed Human, not shown to be more Elf than Human.
Um...are not the cities of the mountain of 5 kings mostly if not all...dwarves?
As to the one thing that bugs me about Golarion....A little too much Lovecraft influence. I never enjoy his work...I care even less for the RPG based on his mythos...sure some of his ideas have inspired some good ideas...but meh.
I think Monte Cook is clearly wrong about this one. I just returned from a trip across Europe and North Africa and the internal spaces of castles, cathedrals, mosques, riyadhs, palaces and other structures were often enormous.
And these, obviously, were sized for humans who were, on average, significantly smaller than the humans of today.
Also, many of those spaces that are constrained were specifically designed to limit combat -- they are chokepoints and gateways...which is logical in real life, but crappy for game play.
What's more, Golarion obviously has elements of post-Medieval technology and conceptual thinking. The "mad scientist" Caromarc in Beast of Lepidstadt has just hired a team of engineers to refurbish his laboratory.
All this arguing aside, bigger spaces are more fun. They're more cinematic, more dynamic, and they allow for better game play.
--Marsh
Well to be fair... Lok around the house we live in TODAY... The average bedroom is like 10 x 9 or something... .A living room may be 20 x 12... and with furniture EVERY square would be hindering... So... Yeah, Living spaces were small back then, just like it is today.
But I think you really hit it on the head. There is a differnce between 'real life' and 'Fun game.'
Bigger is better
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Well to be fair... Lok around the house we live in TODAY... The average bedroom is like 10 x 9 or something... .A living room may be 20 x 12... and with furniture EVERY square would be hindering... So... Yeah, Living spaces were small back then, just like it is today.
My room: 2 x 3 squares... Mostly occupied by drawers, cabinets, table, desk and bed. And three armchairs. Actually there would be two and a half half-squares left leading from the door to the window.
The problems with combat grid squares is that most people are hardly aware how large are they - I had drawn a ship on the grid and one of the player said: how small... Then I told her its actual dimensions - with 20x6 squares it was 30 x 9 meters/100 x 30 feet. To compare, Christoph Columbus ships were a bit over 20 x 7 meters/66-74 ft x 20-23 ft.
As usual: fans of fantasy and sf have no sense of scale.
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Humans have cities on the surface world, elves apparently have cities where they are 99% of the population, but no concentrated dwarven cities, gnome cities, etc. Not underground in the Underdark.
Given the cool factor of the dwarven 'Quest for Sky,' I'm surprised that the darklands of Golarion don't have more (non-duergar) dwarves.
I'd be completely sold on a minimal surface presence of dwarves, tucked away in a mountain range, if the dwarves dominated a few sections of the the darklands the way humans dominate the surface world. The notion that the dinky little dwarven nation on the surface world is like a mushroom, the only visible part of something that is vastly larger (and possibly connected to other seemingly insignificant surface outposts...) under the surface, is kinda neat.
There's also the potential that there's a war going on underneath the surface, with the Five Kingdoms area being their equivalent of Lastwall or Mendev, that most humans don't even know is happening, and that the few dwarves seen on the surface are refugees, support crew growing crops and forging weapons to be 'sent below,' or even retired veterans of The Deep War, enjoying their 'golden years' in the 'retirement communities' that everyone else assumes are normal dwarven settlements.
That I don't yet rule it with a silk covered Iron fist of course. :)
You don't?
I thought you were already running things from behind the scenes. :(
That I don't yet rule it with a silk covered Iron fist of course. :)You don't?
I thought you were already running things from behind the scenes. :(That's exactly the sort of thing the secret master of the world would say...
Wait, someone else is already the secret master of the world? Bother, I'm late again!
Also, to the OP: mostly the bugs, really.
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But we don't get that. Instead, we get, "We won't tell you... yet." How and why did Aroden die? We know the truth. But we won't let you know until we're ready. That's metaplot seeping in on the edges of Golarion, and it's quite possible that it will harm the world in ways that will force campaigns to abandon the world as written.
Ummm... except they haven't said that at all. I just listened to the Secrets of Golarion GenCon panel via the good people of Pathfinder: Chronicles podcast. They actually say that the death of Aorden is something that they are leaving to individual DMs and that they will not officially weigh in on the topic.
Honestly I doubt that the powers that be are 100% sure what the cannon answer would be.
But continue to be irked by your own imagings.
They are, to some extent, regional deities. Even the 20 "core deities" are regional dieties. They originally come from a certain race or area but their faith has spread all over the Inner Sea Region, and sometimes beyond.
But not all of them are global or go even beyond. In fact, there are probably no deities that are global, let alone universal. There are corners of Golarion where they're not worshipped at all, not even with a different name.
Good stuff but not entirely accurate. I think the older bigger name gods are considerd to have a worldwide presence. In another part of the podcast they were talking about Tien gods and pointed out that everyone does in fact meet Phrasma in the end. Even on the other side of the world and when her clerics commune with her she informs them that her name is Pharasma and not some Tien version. Though they may apply other titles to her - an Andoran cleric of Phrasma might be surprised to hear her refereed to as Lady Moon (I'm making suff up now but whatever honorable titles gods have would be diffrent in other regions).
-Numeria. I haven't met anyone who likes this nation. This gets the most eye-rolling from folks who don't know the Inner Sea in my experience. I've seen art that I thought was a joke, then seen it published in the books. It straight out doesn't work. No UFOs in my fantasy please.
-Osirion. Not enough has been done to differentiate this nation from Hollywood Egypt. It's a cookie cutter approach that shows a lack of forethought by the writers about what this nation is about, aside from a paintjob that justifies multiple tombs/dungeons to raid.
Hello, my name is Matthew. I like Numeria.
Thats because it is Hollywood Egypt. Its the place where Joe Harrison can go raid him a lost ark. Whats wrong with a little ark raiding between friends?
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But continue to be irked by your own imagings.
This is the 'what about Golarion bugs you' thread, not the 'Hi, my name is Michael and you are wrong for not liking Numeria' thread.
I like Numeria, too. But there's another thread for that.
There isn't, to my knowledge, a 'make a snide insulting personal comment like "But continue to be irked by your own imagings."' thread.
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That I don't yet rule it with a silk covered Iron fist of course. :)You don't?
I thought you were already running things from behind the scenes. :(
Well of course I don't, if I did I would be the target of every adventuring party. Some day though, if those pesky kids and their gnome stop foiling my plans.
The lack of a Hobgoblin nation, one that is bent on conquest, and has a rigid military structure. I think I'm going to put one in my River Kingdoms. A Romanesque civilization, because for being highly organized militants, the only time I've seen a hobgoblin nation was in Eberron, and even then it was too savage.
Golarion is close though not there of having the same problem as Forgotten realms of having too many gods.
The lack of a Hobgoblin nation, one that is bent on conquest, and has a rigid military structure. I think I'm going to put one in my River Kingdoms. A Romanesque civilization, because for being highly organized militants, the only time I've seen a hobgoblin nation was in Eberron, and even then it was too savage.
Actually I guess we're getting one!!! In the Dragon Empire Campaign Guide. It was mentioned in the Secrets of Golarion panel at GenCon!
So while it won't be the Romanesque style one I was envisioning, can't wait to see it. Also they mentioned an Aasimaar nation.
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The lack of a Hobgoblin nation, one that is bent on conquest, and has a rigid military structure.Actually I guess we're getting one!!! In the Dragon Empire Campaign Guide. It was mentioned in the Secrets of Golarion panel at GenCon!
Oh, hawt! I vaguely remember those Japanese-looking hobgoblins from my first Monster Manual.
"Wow, those wicked samurai had really scary looking mempo!"
<fiddling with bodies>
"Oh, those weren't masks. Those were their faces..."
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8
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The lack of a Hobgoblin nation, one that is bent on conquest, and has a rigid military structure. I think I'm going to put one in my River Kingdoms. A Romanesque civilization, because for being highly organized militants, the only time I've seen a hobgoblin nation was in Eberron, and even then it was too savage.
I'm expecting Hobgoblin Mongols myself at some point. Even if they don't. I'm going to have them :-)