New feat idea for unarmed characters

[northbrb]

so asthe title says i had an idea for a new feat, i dont have everything fully thought out just the idea of the feat and wanted to get some opinions.

the feat would allow you to add your unarmed damage when ever using punching weapons (gauntlets, cestas, punching dagger, ect) and improvised weapons.

i feel this would give some moreoptions for non-monks trying to utalize unarmed combat, what do you think?

[Name Violation]

BLAAAAARRGG OMG ITS OP BROKENZ KILL IT WITH FIRE!!!!!1!!!!11!!!

sorry, someones bound to say it.

I kinda like the idea actually. its not bad, dont let it multiply on a crit.

but then why dont daggers, and other weapons get it now. thats the slippery slope.

and once weapons are dealing d4+d3+str its on par with heavier weapons, but finessable.

so i like the concept, but it needs to be fleshed out a little more.

maybe make it an additional feat, and let them convert the weapon damage into non-lethal

[Orgavin]

The problem is it would really, really break monks. So you would have to make the feat unusable by monks as the very least.

[Tim4488]

Would it really break the Monk? Changes:

SLIGHTLY increased damage. (Most of these weapons do what, d4?)
More significant increase in crit threat range/modifier. (I admit this could be an issue, but if the damage doesn't multiply on crits, it's really not that big of a deal.)
Cheaper enchantments. (Generally considered a "Monk got screwed" rather than "Fair balancing point.")

And it costs a feat. If you're really worried, make it require Weapon Focus first, and it only applies to the weapon you have WF for. Weapon Focus (Punching Dagger) means you can't apply it to gauntlets, etc. That also keeps Monks from getting it until 5th level at least, due to the BAB requirement.

[Purplefixer]

It then becomes a "Why didn't you take...?" auto-feat-requirement. Better than any other option unless you're a combat maneuver specialist. Anyone who wants to be a striker and not a controller MUST take punching-dagger/cestus/etc to be competitive. Improved Crit at the later point, which most monks take for a 5% increase, raises to a 20-30% chance? That's pretty extreme. And with a monk's sheer number of attacks, you're looking at the Zen Archer all over again.

[northbrb]

i dont have a problem keeping monks away from this feat, they already get what they need out of not using weapons, this feat are for those who dont want to always go with the big weapons, this is for the characters who want to go down a path of using teir mits.

[Kaisoku]

Purplefixer wrote:

It then becomes a "Why didn't you take...?" auto-feat-requirement. Better than any other option unless you're a combat maneuver specialist. Anyone who wants to be a striker and not a controller MUST take punching-dagger/cestus/etc to be competitive. Improved Crit at the later point, which most monks take for a 5% increase, raises to a 20-30% chance? That's pretty extreme. And with a monk's sheer number of attacks, you're looking at the Zen Archer all over again.

Dice damage is not normally multiplied on a critical. Adding extra unarmed strike damage to the weapon damage roll would be adding damage dice, so the monk's unarmed damage would not be increased with the critical hit.

The monk getting the savings on weapon enhancements would then be stuck required using this weapon directly to get the effect, which means it can be stolen, disarmed and sundered. It comes with all the normal weaknesses.

As far as I can see, it gives anyone other than the Monk a little extra damage dice on an already pretty weak damage weapon, and for the Monk it gives him a little extra damage, trading his low crit range on high damage for extra crit range on lower damage, and cheaper access to weapon enhancements that can comes with all the normal weapon drawbacks.

I actually like this idea. I think it would fit best limited to a single weapon, so having it tied off Weapon Focus is perfect (it also makes this more ideal for a Fighter, as he'd qualify at 1st level, than the Monk).

[northbrb]

what about it playing off of imprvised weapons, i dont think it makes sense to have weapon focus broken bottle. i could go with it requiring weapon focus for a specific weapon and all improvised weapons, make it require weapon focus and catch off gaurd.

[Tim4488]

northbrb wrote:

what about it playing off of imprvised weapons, i dont think it makes sense to have weapon focus broken bottle. i could go with it requiring weapon focus for a specific weapon and all improvised weapons, make it require weapon focus and catch off gaurd.

If you wanted it to key off improvised weapons, then yeah, do Catch Off Guard or Throw Anything as the prereqs, and it applies to Melee OR Ranged depending which you choose. And of course the unarmed damage doesn't multiply on a crit. Sounds good.