[UM] Walter's Guide to the Magus


Advice

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Morely wrote:

Totally new to the boards and relatively new playing a magus.

I have been playing mine for about 10 sessions and still get pretty harsh looks when I roll my spellstrike attack after my initial melee.. They like that i kill things but I always catch them looking over the magus section of UM.. just to make sure that I am doing this right can someone give me a yea or nay:

Im a level 8 bladebound magus with 22 dex/ 22 int & dervish dance:

1) I roll to hit with my +2 scimitar and hit (+14) for 1d6+8.

2) I then decide to spellstrike with shocking grasp. If I am next to my target I roll concentration check or provoke (a DC17 which I have a +14 to succeed. I have Lunge and normally dont need to do this but..).

3) I roll to hit (at a -2, so +12) and when I hit I deal my blade 1d6+8 and shocking grasp damage at CL8 which is 5d6 PLUS any energy attunement dice.

4) If I crit on my spellstrike hit, I use my weapon crit range of 18-20x2 (or 15-20x2 if I was smart enough to keen out the blade) and then my damage is the 5d6+1d6x2+8..

5) I grin with a maximum one round damage of 58 damage (or 100 if I crit both attacks and roll all 6s - 80 if I crit on the spellstrike only rolling all 6s).

Is my math correct?

Is my attack progression correct?

Do I get a +3 to spellstrike with shocking grasp if my opponent is wearing/ wielding metal?

Since I am level 8 do I get another attack (melee/ spellstrike) now?

Thanks in advance, sorry for the newbish.

Almost Right

First You Declare you are going to use Spell Combat!

Example:

Your Go: I'm going to use spell combat ( I suffer a -2 on my first attack and I cast the shocking grasp Spell.

Your roll to hit with your first attack at -2
You cast you spell (don't forget concentration check if needed)
Then you make your Spell Strike attack (replacing the free touch attack with a Melee Attack) at -2

Done.

As for the +3 I think the general consensus is yes, but it would only effect your spell strike attack roll.

However some question has been brought up about the +3 from shocking grasp. So it is up to the GM.

So at 8th Level you should look like this with SpellCombat & Spellstrike

+4/-1/+4

Base Attack +4 (6-2=4)
Second Attack -1 (1-2=-1)
Spell Strike +4 (6-2=4)

Don't forget you get a +2 to concentration checks at level 8


And you still don't do the damage of a tricked out martial character.

These "my group dislikes me because im awesome" statements smile a little because it usually means they don't know what they're doing rather then anyone being particularly awesome. Why can't the whole group just be awesome?

Scarab Sages

Mr. Green wrote:


4) If I crit on my spellstrike hit, I use my weapon crit range of 18-20x2 (or 15-20x2 if I was smart enough to keen out the blade) and then my damage is the 5d6+1d6x2+8..

5) I grin with a maximum one round damage of 58 damage (or 100 if I crit both attacks and roll all 6s - 80 if I crit on the spellstrike only rolling all 6s).

Is my math correct?

...

Actually you critical hit with a spellstrike should be much more powerful, if I'm correct.

Your normal spellstrike is 1d6+8 plus 5d6 lightning.

If you critically hit, both the spell and attack are critical, so you would do: 2d6+16 plus 10d6 lightning.

I think you forgot to multiply the +8 dmg modifier as well.

So your maximum spellstrike crit should be: 82 dmg.
Crit on Spellstrike & Normal attack: 110dmg.

Relevant text:

"This attack uses the weapon’s critical range (20, 19–20, or 18–20 and modified by the keen weapon property or similar effects), but the spell effect only deals ×2 damage on a successful critical hit, while the weapon damage uses its own critical modifier."

Hopefully I have my crit math right...


Morely wrote:

Totally new to the boards and relatively new playing a magus.

I have been playing mine for about 10 sessions and still get pretty harsh looks when I roll my spellstrike attack after my initial melee.. They like that i kill things but I always catch them looking over the magus section of UM.. just to make sure that I am doing this right can someone give me a yea or nay:

Im a level 8 bladebound magus with 22 dex/ 22 int & dervish dance:

1) I roll to hit with my +2 scimitar and hit (+14) for 1d6+8.

2) I then decide to spellstrike with shocking grasp. If I am next to my target I roll concentration check or provoke (a DC17 which I have a +14 to succeed. I have Lunge and normally dont need to do this but..).

3) I roll to hit (at a -2, so +12) and when I hit I deal my blade 1d6+8 and shocking grasp damage at CL8 which is 5d6 PLUS any energy attunement dice.

4) If I crit on my spellstrike hit, I use my weapon crit range of 18-20x2 (or 15-20x2 if I was smart enough to keen out the blade) and then my damage is the 5d6+1d6x2+8..

5) I grin with a maximum one round damage of 58 damage (or 100 if I crit both attacks and roll all 6s - 80 if I crit on the spellstrike only rolling all 6s).

Is my math correct?

Is my attack progression correct?

Do I get a +3 to spellstrike with shocking grasp if my opponent is wearing/ wielding metal?

Since I am level 8 do I get another attack (melee/ spellstrike) now?

Thanks in advance, sorry for the newbish.

1) Sounds about right, unless you have feats like weapon focus/arcane strike and not counting the arcane pool to enhance your weapon

2) How did you get lunge at lvl 8??? You need BAB +6, which you can only get at lvl 8, and a straight magus does not gain more feats till lvl 9...

3) you probably know this, but the -2 will also apply to your first (non spellstrike) attack. Otherwise, you are good

4)not sure about the crits, to be honest. I thought you just took the total damage (5d6+1d6+8) and multiplied all that by 2. But I could be dead wrong, so don't quote me on that

Other answers
-You do get another melee attack at -5 that you can use in your full round, even with spellcombat/spellstrike

- the +3 for the spellstrike is something you'll probably have to talk to your DM about. I'm not sure I'd allow it, and if your party is giving you suspicious looks, it's probably not worthy to ask for that small bonus (IMHO)

EDIT: Some other people had responded already. This happens when I don't check for new pages :P. Still, your character having lunge is the only error I can see


Quote:
4) If I crit on my spellstrike hit, I use my weapon crit range of 18-20x2 (or 15-20x2 if I was smart enough to keen out the blade) and then my damage is the 5d6+1d6x2+8..

10d6+2d6+16. The spell crits along with the attack, I believe?


Hi,

Currently playing a 3rd level Hexcrafter magus in COTCT online PBP.

Here's my 20th level char build

Scores
Str 16
Dex 13
Con 12
Int 19
Wis 10
Cha 7
Favored Points go to HP.

1 Magus1 Arcane Pool +1, Cantrips, Spell Combat, Intensify Spell
2 Magus2 Spellstrike
3 Magus3 Magus Arcana (Arcane Accuracy), Extra Arcana: Familiar
4 Magus4 Hex Arcana- Slumber Hex
5 Magus5 Arcane Pool +2, Wpn Fcs: Scimitar, Extra Arcana: Accursed Strike
6 Magus6 Hex Arcana- Evil Eye
7 Magus7 Knowledge Pool, Medium Armor, Improved Familiar- Dust Mephit
8 Magus8 Improved Spell Combat
9 Magus9 Arcane Pool +3, Hex Arcana Misfortune or Cackle, Power Attack
10 Magus10 Fighter Training
11 Magus11 Wpn Spl: Scimitar, Spell Recall, Extra Hex: Ice Tomb
12 Magus12 Major Hex- Major Healing
13 Magus13 Arcane Pool +4, Heavy Armor, Split Hex
14 Magus14 Gtr Spell Combat
15 Magus15 Hex Arcana- Bane Blade, Persistent Spell
16 Magus16 Counterstrike
17 Magus17 Arcane Pool +5, Gtr Weapon Fcs, Extra Arcana: Quicken
18 Magus18 Hex Arcana- Retribution
19 Magus19 Gtr Spell Access, Extra Arcana- Maximize
20 Magus20 True Magus

Just want some advice if i can get some more synergy with Hexes.
Since they're a standard action they don't work with spell combat. I took HEXCRAFTER for resource management (plus they will have higher saves than my spells.
I pumped INT in my point buy so get DC's higher and get more Arcana Points to spam Arcane Accuracy. (eventually adding +10 to hit on full attacks.
The Familiar is gonna spam a wand of Ill omen to help me land save or suck spells I get from Accursed Strike.

I'm not sure I need Cackle or Misfortune. Misfortune is awesome but Ill Omen does the same thing for multiple rounds and no save. At 7 it won't cost an action cause the Familiar will cast it from a wand.
Cackle COULD be used to Keep Evil Eye going but I can't Spell Combat with it (Though Blade Dash spell will synergise).

I also think maybe Lunge would be better than Wpn Spec and maybe Improved Crit over Gtr Wpn focus?

Also would the alt racial Elf talent adding +1 to sleep effects work with slumber hex?

Any help would be great.


It was also my understanding that melee touch attacks don't require concentration checks because they don't provoke AoO, is this correct?


Taleek wrote:
It was also my understanding that melee touch attacks don't require concentration checks because they don't provoke AoO, is this correct?

The spellcasting provokes as normal. The melee touch, does not.

So, you cast and provoke and when you touch, you do not.


Morely wrote:

Totally new to the boards and relatively new playing a magus.

I have been playing mine for about 10 sessions and still get pretty harsh looks when I roll my spellstrike attack after my initial melee.. They like that i kill things but I always catch them looking over the magus section of UM.. just to make sure that I am doing this right can someone give me a yea or nay:

Im a level 8 bladebound magus with 22 dex/ 22 int & dervish dance:

1) I roll to hit with my +2 scimitar and hit (+14) for 1d6+8.

2) I then decide to spellstrike with shocking grasp. If I am next to my target I roll concentration check or provoke (a DC17 which I have a +14 to succeed. I have Lunge and normally dont need to do this but..).

3) I roll to hit (at a -2, so +12) and when I hit I deal my blade 1d6+8 and shocking grasp damage at CL8 which is 5d6 PLUS any energy attunement dice.

4) If I crit on my spellstrike hit, I use my weapon crit range of 18-20x2 (or 15-20x2 if I was smart enough to keen out the blade) and then my damage is the 5d6+1d6x2+8..

5) I grin with a maximum one round damage of 58 damage (or 100 if I crit both attacks and roll all 6s - 80 if I crit on the spellstrike only rolling all 6s).

Is my math correct?

Is my attack progression correct?

Do I get a +3 to spellstrike with shocking grasp if my opponent is wearing/ wielding metal?

Since I am level 8 do I get another attack (melee/ spellstrike) now?

Thanks in advance, sorry for the newbish.

Looks more or less correct to me, and yes, you get another attack when your BAB reaches +6. So you would have attacks at +6/+1 when just attacking normally and +4/+4/-1 when full-attacking with spell combat and spellstrike.


STR Ranger wrote:

Hi,

Currently playing a 3rd level Hexcrafter magus in COTCT online PBP.

Here's my 20th level char build

Scores
Str 16
Dex 13
Con 12
Int 19
Wis 10
Cha 7
Favored Points go to HP.

1 Magus1 Arcane Pool +1, Cantrips, Spell Combat, Intensify Spell
2 Magus2 Spellstrike
3 Magus3 Magus Arcana (Arcane Accuracy), Extra Arcana: Familiar
4 Magus4 Hex Arcana- Slumber Hex
5 Magus5 Arcane Pool +2, Wpn Fcs: Scimitar, Extra Arcana: Accursed Strike
6 Magus6 Hex Arcana- Evil Eye
7 Magus7 Knowledge Pool, Medium Armor, Improved Familiar- Dust Mephit
8 Magus8 Improved Spell Combat
9 Magus9 Arcane Pool +3, Hex Arcana Misfortune or Cackle, Power Attack
10 Magus10 Fighter Training
11 Magus11 Wpn Spl: Scimitar, Spell Recall, Extra Hex: Ice Tomb
12 Magus12 Major Hex- Major Healing
13 Magus13 Arcane Pool +4, Heavy Armor, Split Hex
14 Magus14 Gtr Spell Combat
15 Magus15 Hex Arcana- Bane Blade, Persistent Spell
16 Magus16 Counterstrike
17 Magus17 Arcane Pool +5, Gtr Weapon Fcs, Extra Arcana: Quicken
18 Magus18 Hex Arcana- Retribution
19 Magus19 Gtr Spell Access, Extra Arcana- Maximize
20 Magus20 True Magus

Just want some advice if i can get some more synergy with Hexes.
Since they're a standard action they don't work with spell combat. I took HEXCRAFTER for resource management (plus they will have higher saves than my spells.
I pumped INT in my point buy so get DC's higher and get more Arcana Points to spam Arcane Accuracy. (eventually adding +10 to hit on full attacks.
The Familiar is gonna spam a wand of Ill omen to help me land save or suck spells I get from Accursed Strike.

I'm not sure I need Cackle or Misfortune. Misfortune is awesome but Ill Omen does the same thing for multiple rounds and no save. At 7 it won't cost an action cause the Familiar will cast it from a wand.
Cackle COULD be used to Keep Evil Eye going but I can't Spell Combat with it (Though Blade Dash spell will synergise).

I also think maybe Lunge would be better than Wpn Spec and maybe Improved Crit over Gtr Wpn...

Sexy build.

I don´t know how many rounds combat usually takes, but one of the really big advantages of the magus class is action economy. Or it other words doing lots of stuff each round. Spending a standart action to use a hex seems like a giant waste of time, but I recently startet to play a hexcrafter too (with black blade).

Some random points:

While the Split Hex feat is awesome, your are not a level 10 witch and can´t take it.

Extra Arcana feat to get Quicken Spell or Maximize once per day seems expensive - get Spell Perfection instead and cast a quickend shocking grasp (or ill omen) every round (thus getting another spell, and another swing with your sword).

If you can find the feats somewhere (or squeeze in a level of monk)get Hex strike: evil eye or misfortune. Then when your attack bonus is all buffed up through arcane accurancy use one of your attacks to attack with an unarmed strike.


Could someone go through the attack sequence when you start the round in question with a held charge? Also, regarding spell combat + spell strike, spell combat references that all of the attacks either come first or the spell being cast comes first. I presume that means the "regular" non-spell strike (free) attack, is that correct?

Here's specifically the quote I am referencing;

A magus can choose to cast the spell first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.

I am concerned I've been short changing my action economy and could use a bit of clarification in general.


B0sh1 wrote:

Could someone go through the attack sequence when you start the round in question with a held charge? Also, regarding spell combat + spell strike, spell combat references that all of the attacks either come first or the spell being cast comes first. I presume that means the "regular" non-spell strike (free) attack, is that correct?

Here's specifically the quote I am referencing;

A magus can choose to cast the spell first or make the weapon attacks first, but if he has more than one attack, he cannot cast the spell between weapon attacks.

I am concerned I've been short changing my action economy and could use a bit of clarification in general.

Round 0: cast a spell that holds a charge like shocking grasp.

Wait

Combat round 1 (let´s start you start combat with your enemy in range:

Use spell combat (-2 to attacks). Resolve all your meelee attacks as normal once you hit your held charge discarges on the enemy.

After your attacks you can cast your spell, if its another spell like shocking grasp you get another attack with your weapon do deliver this spell.

If you level is high enough, or you can use a metamgic rod lesser quicken, you can cast shocking grasp as a swift action... and get another free swing with your weapon.

Round 2: Repeat ^^

Shadow Lodge

One thing I do not understand is how we can spell combat and Spellstrike in the same turn. How is that accomplished during a full-round action?


Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
One thing I do not understand is how we can spell combat and Spellstrike in the same turn. How is that accomplished during a full-round action?

During the playtest round there was wording to prevent that, now there isn't.

Also the devs (Jason irrc) said that this was an intented change.

Shadow Lodge

leo1925 wrote:
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
One thing I do not understand is how we can spell combat and Spellstrike in the same turn. How is that accomplished during a full-round action?

During the playtest round there was wording to prevent that, now there isn't.

Also the devs (Jason irrc) said that this was an intented change.

No, I mean, how am I supposed to actually do it in-game. My PFS Magus is 2nd level, and I see no way that it is possible, but I know it should be. Are we supposed to pre-charge spells?


Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
leo1925 wrote:
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
One thing I do not understand is how we can spell combat and Spellstrike in the same turn. How is that accomplished during a full-round action?

During the playtest round there was wording to prevent that, now there isn't.

Also the devs (Jason irrc) said that this was an intented change.
No, I mean, how am I supposed to actually do it in-game. My PFS Magus is 2nd level, and I see no way that it is possible, but I know it should be. Are we supposed to pre-charge spells?

If you have both spell combat and spellstrike (some archetypes give up one or the other) then oyu simply do a spell combat and after you cast the touch spell that spell combat granted it you you decide to use spellstrike to deliver it.


Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
leo1925 wrote:
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
One thing I do not understand is how we can spell combat and Spellstrike in the same turn. How is that accomplished during a full-round action?

During the playtest round there was wording to prevent that, now there isn't.

Also the devs (Jason irrc) said that this was an intented change.
No, I mean, how am I supposed to actually do it in-game. My PFS Magus is 2nd level, and I see no way that it is possible, but I know it should be. Are we supposed to pre-charge spells?

You need to declare it as your full round action and cast a touch spell (or if you have close ranged arcana you can use a ray spell). Spell combat is the fighting like your two weapon fighting component and spell strike is the free attack through a weapon for a touch spell (or ray if you have close range arcana) component.


Banpai wrote:
STR Ranger wrote:

Hi,

Currently playing a 3rd level Hexcrafter magus in COTCT online PBP.

Here's my 20th level char build

Scores
Str 16
Dex 13
Con 12
Int 19
Wis 10
Cha 7
Favored Points go to HP.

1 Magus1 Arcane Pool +1, Cantrips, Spell Combat, Intensify Spell
2 Magus2 Spellstrike
3 Magus3 Magus Arcana (Arcane Accuracy), Extra Arcana: Familiar
4 Magus4 Hex Arcana- Slumber Hex
5 Magus5 Arcane Pool +2, Wpn Fcs: Scimitar, Extra Arcana: Accursed Strike
6 Magus6 Hex Arcana- Evil Eye
7 Magus7 Knowledge Pool, Medium Armor, Improved Familiar- Dust Mephit
8 Magus8 Improved Spell Combat
9 Magus9 Arcane Pool +3, Hex Arcana Misfortune or Cackle, Power Attack
10 Magus10 Fighter Training
11 Magus11 Wpn Spl: Scimitar, Spell Recall, Extra Hex: Ice Tomb
12 Magus12 Major Hex- Major Healing
13 Magus13 Arcane Pool +4, Heavy Armor, Split Hex
14 Magus14 Gtr Spell Combat
15 Magus15 Hex Arcana- Bane Blade, Persistent Spell
16 Magus16 Counterstrike
17 Magus17 Arcane Pool +5, Gtr Weapon Fcs, Extra Arcana: Quicken
18 Magus18 Hex Arcana- Retribution
19 Magus19 Gtr Spell Access, Extra Arcana- Maximize
20 Magus20 True Magus

Just want some advice if i can get some more synergy with Hexes.
Since they're a standard action they don't work with spell combat. I took HEXCRAFTER for resource management (plus they will have higher saves than my spells.
I pumped INT in my point buy so get DC's higher and get more Arcana Points to spam Arcane Accuracy. (eventually adding +10 to hit on full attacks.
The Familiar is gonna spam a wand of Ill omen to help me land save or suck spells I get from Accursed Strike.

I'm not sure I need Cackle or Misfortune. Misfortune is awesome but Ill Omen does the same thing for multiple rounds and no save. At 7 it won't cost an action cause the Familiar will cast it from a wand.
Cackle COULD be used to Keep Evil Eye going but I can't Spell Combat with it (Though Blade Dash spell will synergise).

I also think maybe Lunge would be better than Wpn Spec and maybe Improved

...

Hex Strike seems awesome, layering a Evil Eye as part of a spell combat full attack (would it work with claw/gore/slams? I planned on using Gargoyle and later Calikang forms to add more primary natural attacks to spell combat) but using it consumes my swift action, so no Arcane Accuracy. :(

Not sure if Iit's worth it. A unarmed Strike will not benefit from Wpn enchant so it will not hit without some big spell buffs.

As to hexes being a waste of time. I use them to switch hit.

eg Start at range. Slumber or Evil Eye. Let them close (sacrificing their full attack), on my turn I full attack spell combat/Spellstrike with a Blindness spell


So assuming one uses the guide as a template, where do you go after level 11?

For instance, is the shocking grasp strategy worth continuing? I was thinking that taking the Quicken Spell feat and some other metamagic feat and taking spell perfection with shocking grasp might be powerful. If you took the Magical Lineage: Shocking grasp trait, you could drop quickened intensified shocking grasps with level 1 spell slots. If your other metamagic feat was Maximize Spell, in one round you could cast a maximized intensified shocking grasp and follow it with a quickened intensified shocking grasp, and then all of your attacks. Taking the elemental spell feat could also help against electricity resistant enemies.

The question is, is this a useful expenditure of resources? It would require a fairly significant feat investment. Any other ideas for 11+ builds?


I've seen the trick you mentioned used with cone of cold. Larger area and no extra attack though.

It takes a lot of feats but they're all good ones.

Intensify- always taken at 1.
Persistent- Better for a Magus than Heighten.
Quicken- High slot cost, but quickened spells can grant an extra Spellstrike attack, so good on Intensified Shocking Grasp
Spell Perfection- You just need to decide if you want an area spell or touch spell
Maximise- you went this far, might as well go all the way


Another idea: if you take Dimensional Agility you can use Dimension Door as part of Spell Combat. Dimension Door up to bad guy, cast quickened shocking grasp, unload on bad guy.

A question: If you have a metamagic rod, can you use it in spell combat? If you have a sword in one hand, and the rod in the other, it doesn't seem like you could cast a spell with somatic components.


OdinsBeard wrote:
A question: If you have a metamagic rod, can you use it in spell combat? If you have a sword in one hand, and the rod in the other, it doesn't seem like you could cast a spell with somatic components.

Which is why Hexcrafter with Prehensile Hair is so good!

Or a dip in Synthesist/Alchemist for Bonus Arms.

Also, I believe that its not the Somatic Components that get you here (IE, Still Spell wont help), its the fact that Spell Combat requires your offhand to be empty.


OdinsBeard wrote:

Another idea: if you take Dimensional Agility you can use Dimension Door as part of Spell Combat. Dimension Door up to bad guy, cast quickened shocking grasp, unload on bad guy.

A question: If you have a metamagic rod, can you use it in spell combat? If you have a sword in one hand, and the rod in the other, it doesn't seem like you could cast a spell with somatic components.

Hexcrafter magi can do it quite easily.


OdinsBeard wrote:
A question: If you have a metamagic rod, can you use it in spell combat? If you have a sword in one hand, and the rod in the other, it doesn't seem like you could cast a spell with somatic components.

A magus who decides to use rods could attack with a (keen spiked) gauntlet. You'd lose out on some crit range, but you'd be able to use rods and wands while keeping a hand free. (I think it should work with plain old unarmed strikes, too, but the Spell Combat flavor-text refers to wielding a weapon "in the other hand," so there could be issues. Which is a shame, because I love the idea of flaming kicks and electric headbutts.)


It's also worth noting that as far as wielding a rod while performing spell combat, there is a Magus Arcana which allows you to bypass the standard limitation of not being able to.


Great guide!!

BTW, You say Force Punch is a ranged touch attack, but it's a melee touch attack. A friend of mine is picking it up for his Magus. He likes it because force damage is almost never negated by resistance or immunity and that it has a high damage cap. He sees the possibility of pushing with it as a pure bonus.

Liberty's Edge

I've been going through the posts and I might have missed it, but I do have a question, and forgive me as I'm still very new to Pathfinder. In the guide toward the end under the Dervish build Level 1 I see that Weapon Finesse is the feat chosen. It also states that a Scimitar is being used but that "His basic attack is a +4 for 1d6+0". Where does the +4 come from? Weapon Finesse allows the Dex modifier to be used for light or natural weapons, however, the scimitar isn't a light weapon so what am I missing?

Shadow Lodge

Tom Nowicki wrote:
I've been going through the posts and I might have missed it, but I do have a question, and forgive me as I'm still very new to Pathfinder. In the guide toward the end under the Dervish build Level 1 I see that Weapon Finesse is the feat chosen. It also states that a Scimitar is being used but that "His basic attack is a +4 for 1d6+0". Where does the +4 come from? Weapon Finesse allows the Dex modifier to be used for light or natural weapons, however, the scimitar isn't a light weapon so what am I missing?

I think some other weapons (scimitar, rapier, elven curve blade) can be Weapon Finessed.

The Exchange

Whenever I make a Dervish from level 1, I start with a rapier, so I can at least hit things right off the bat. That's what I imagine is the case, although not specifically stated.

Liberty's Edge

Edgar Lamoureux wrote:
Whenever I make a Dervish from level 1, I start with a rapier, so I can at least hit things right off the bat. That's what I imagine is the case, although not specifically stated.

This is what I was thinking also, but being new I just want to make sure that I'm understanding everything and that I'm not missing something obvious.


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Here's a build for my Bladebound Kensai:

The ability scores are off the chart because he is a Azlanti Pure-Blood (25pt):
Strength 14
Dexterity 20
Constitution 16
Intelligence 16
Wisdom 10
Charisma 10

Favored Class -> HPs

Feat/Arcana Progression:
1 Weapon Finesse
1(Human) Extra Arcane Pool
1(Kensai) Weapon Focus (Scimitar)
3 Dervish Dance
5 Intensified Spell
5 Power Attack
6* (Arcana) Wand Wielder OR Empowered Magic
7 Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
9 Extra Arcana: Accurate Strike
11 Improved Critical (Scimitar) (I may drop this & replace with Greater Weapon Focus b/c of Keen)
11 Critical Focus
12* (Arcana) Critical Strike
13 Critical, Bleeding
15 Critical, Exhausting
15* (Arcana) Quickened Magic
17 Critical Mastery
17 Weapon Focus, Greater (OR Critical, Stunning)
18* (Arcana) Maximized Magic
19 Weapon Specialization, Greater

I built it to focus on critical hits. I know, he is probably a 1 trick pony - just thought it would be fun to see where it goes. Anyways, I posted this here to see what everyone's take was and to provide another option for a Magus.


Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
Tom Nowicki wrote:
I've been going through the posts and I might have missed it, but I do have a question, and forgive me as I'm still very new to Pathfinder. In the guide toward the end under the Dervish build Level 1 I see that Weapon Finesse is the feat chosen. It also states that a Scimitar is being used but that "His basic attack is a +4 for 1d6+0". Where does the +4 come from? Weapon Finesse allows the Dex modifier to be used for light or natural weapons, however, the scimitar isn't a light weapon so what am I missing?
I think some other weapons (scimitar, rapier, elven curve blade) can be Weapon Finessed.

The scimitar can't be weapon finessed.

Shadow Lodge

leo1925 wrote:
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
Tom Nowicki wrote:
I've been going through the posts and I might have missed it, but I do have a question, and forgive me as I'm still very new to Pathfinder. In the guide toward the end under the Dervish build Level 1 I see that Weapon Finesse is the feat chosen. It also states that a Scimitar is being used but that "His basic attack is a +4 for 1d6+0". Where does the +4 come from? Weapon Finesse allows the Dex modifier to be used for light or natural weapons, however, the scimitar isn't a light weapon so what am I missing?
I think some other weapons (scimitar, rapier, elven curve blade) can be Weapon Finessed.
The scimitar can't be weapon finessed.

Right, forgot that the rapier has almost the same stats.

Shadow Lodge

Once you get Dervish Dance at level 3 you get your Dex to hit and damage with a scimitar.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
OdinsBeard wrote:

Another idea: if you take Dimensional Agility you can use Dimension Door as part of Spell Combat. Dimension Door up to bad guy, cast quickened shocking grasp, unload on bad guy.

A question: If you have a metamagic rod, can you use it in spell combat? If you have a sword in one hand, and the rod in the other, it doesn't seem like you could cast a spell with somatic components.

Spell combat requires a FREE Hand. Which means a hand with NOTHING in it. It does not matter if the spell involved, has no somatic component.

Dark Archive

Hexcrafter seems to run counter to the action economy of the Magus class. I'm not sure that it really adds much in the way of power, but it does add some versatility. Prehensile Hair sounds useful, but it takes a standard action to turn it on, which means it doesn't really help with holding a rod -- unless you have a spare round to activate your Prehensile Hair before initiative is rolled.

There were some questions earlier in this thread about using Spellstrike in the same round as Spell Combat. It really isn't as complicated as it sounds. When you use a full round action to attack, you can use Spell Combat to cast a spell before or after your attack sequence. If the spell that you cast using Spell Combat is a touch spell (or ranged touch, if you have the Close Range Arcana), you can use your Spellstrike ability to deliver that spell attack through an "extra" attack with your weapon.


Xideus Delorne wrote:

Here's a build for my Bladebound Kensai:

The ability scores are off the chart because he is a Azlanti Pure-Blood (25pt):
Strength 14
Dexterity 20
Constitution 16
Intelligence 16
Wisdom 10
Charisma 10

Favored Class -> HPs

Feat/Arcana Progression:
1 Weapon Finesse
1(Human) Extra Arcane Pool
1(Kensai) Weapon Focus (Scimitar)
3 Dervish Dance
5 Intensified Spell
5 Power Attack
6* (Arcana) Wand Wielder OR Empowered Magic
7 Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
9 Extra Arcana: Accurate Strike
11 Improved Critical (Scimitar) (I may drop this & replace with Greater Weapon Focus b/c of Keen)
11 Critical Focus
12* (Arcana) Critical Strike
13 Critical, Bleeding
15 Critical, Exhausting
15* (Arcana) Quickened Magic
17 Critical Mastery
17 Weapon Focus, Greater (OR Critical, Stunning)
18* (Arcana) Maximized Magic
19 Weapon Specialization, Greater

I built it to focus on critical hits. I know, he is probably a 1 trick pony - just thought it would be fun to see where it goes. Anyways, I posted this here to see what everyone's take was and to provide another option for a Magus.

Weapon Specialization requires 4 levels of Fighter, which you won't qualify for as a straight Magus until level 10. Likewise, you wouldn't be able to start the Critial feats like Bleeding and Exhausting until level 15, because your BAB would be too low as a straight magus. Mixing in some fighter levels may alleviate these issues.

The Exchange

Taleek wrote:
Xideus Delorne wrote:

Here's a build for my Bladebound Kensai:

The ability scores are off the chart because he is a Azlanti Pure-Blood (25pt):
Strength 14
Dexterity 20
Constitution 16
Intelligence 16
Wisdom 10
Charisma 10

Favored Class -> HPs

Feat/Arcana Progression:
1 Weapon Finesse
1(Human) Extra Arcane Pool
1(Kensai) Weapon Focus (Scimitar)
3 Dervish Dance
5 Intensified Spell
5 Power Attack
6* (Arcana) Wand Wielder OR Empowered Magic
7 Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
9 Extra Arcana: Accurate Strike
11 Improved Critical (Scimitar) (I may drop this & replace with Greater Weapon Focus b/c of Keen)
11 Critical Focus
12* (Arcana) Critical Strike
13 Critical, Bleeding
15 Critical, Exhausting
15* (Arcana) Quickened Magic
17 Critical Mastery
17 Weapon Focus, Greater (OR Critical, Stunning)
18* (Arcana) Maximized Magic
19 Weapon Specialization, Greater

I built it to focus on critical hits. I know, he is probably a 1 trick pony - just thought it would be fun to see where it goes. Anyways, I posted this here to see what everyone's take was and to provide another option for a Magus.

Weapon Specialization requires 4 levels of Fighter, which you won't qualify for as a straight Magus until level 10. Likewise, you wouldn't be able to start the Critial feats like Bleeding and Exhausting until level 15, because your BAB would be too low as a straight magus. Mixing in some fighter levels may alleviate these issues.

These are legal, thanks to the Kensai Archetype.

D20PFSRD wrote:

Fighter Training (Ex)

Starting at 7th level, a kensai counts his magus level –3 as his fighter level for the purpose of qualifying for feats (if he has levels in fighter, these levels stack), but forfeits the benefit of such feats with weapons other than his favored weapon.

As well as:

D20PFSRD also wrote:

Critical Perfection (Ex)

At 9th level, a kensai adds his Intelligence bonus (minimum 0) on critical hit confirmation rolls with his favored weapon. In addition, the kensai may use his magus levels in place of his base attack bonuses to qualify for Critical Focus and any feat for which it is a prerequisite; these feats apply only with a kensai’s favored weapon.


Edgar Lamoureux wrote:
Taleek wrote:
Xideus Delorne wrote:

Here's a build for my Bladebound Kensai:

The ability scores are off the chart because he is a Azlanti Pure-Blood (25pt):
Strength 14
Dexterity 20
Constitution 16
Intelligence 16
Wisdom 10
Charisma 10

Favored Class -> HPs

Feat/Arcana Progression:
1 Weapon Finesse
1(Human) Extra Arcane Pool
1(Kensai) Weapon Focus (Scimitar)
3 Dervish Dance
5 Intensified Spell
5 Power Attack
6* (Arcana) Wand Wielder OR Empowered Magic
7 Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
9 Extra Arcana: Accurate Strike
11 Improved Critical (Scimitar) (I may drop this & replace with Greater Weapon Focus b/c of Keen)
11 Critical Focus
12* (Arcana) Critical Strike
13 Critical, Bleeding
15 Critical, Exhausting
15* (Arcana) Quickened Magic
17 Critical Mastery
17 Weapon Focus, Greater (OR Critical, Stunning)
18* (Arcana) Maximized Magic
19 Weapon Specialization, Greater

I built it to focus on critical hits. I know, he is probably a 1 trick pony - just thought it would be fun to see where it goes. Anyways, I posted this here to see what everyone's take was and to provide another option for a Magus.

Weapon Specialization requires 4 levels of Fighter, which you won't qualify for as a straight Magus until level 10. Likewise, you wouldn't be able to start the Critial feats like Bleeding and Exhausting until level 15, because your BAB would be too low as a straight magus. Mixing in some fighter levels may alleviate these issues.

These are legal, thanks to the Kensai Archetype.

D20PFSRD wrote:

Fighter Training (Ex)

Starting at 7th level, a kensai counts his magus level –3 as his fighter level for the purpose of qualifying for feats (if he has levels in fighter, these levels stack), but forfeits the benefit of such feats with weapons other than his favored weapon.

As well as:

D20PFSRD also wrote:

Critical Perfection (Ex)

At 9th level, a kensai adds his Intelligence bonus (minimum 0) on critical hit confirmation

...

My mistake, thank you for the clarification.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Taleek wrote:

Weapon Specialization requires 4 levels of Fighter, which you won't qualify for as a straight Magus until level 10. Likewise, you wouldn't be able to start the Critial feats like Bleeding and Exhausting until level 15, because your BAB would be too low as a straight magus. Mixing in some fighter levels may alleviate these issues.

Weapon specialisation Greater, a feat that only gives you 2 points of damage is not the kind of feat I'd pick for high levels. Remember as a magus your main damage is going to come from your spells and spellstrikes, think along these lines for an end-game feat.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
leo1925 wrote:
Ninjaxenomorph wrote:
One thing I do not understand is how we can spell combat and Spellstrike in the same turn. How is that accomplished during a full-round action?

During the playtest round there was wording to prevent that, now there isn't.

Also the devs (Jason irrc) said that this was an intented change.
No, I mean, how am I supposed to actually do it in-game. My PFS Magus is 2nd level, and I see no way that it is possible, but I know it should be. Are we supposed to pre-charge spells?

Example:

It's your round and you decide you want to cast Shocking Grasp in addition to your weapon strike.

You have the following options.

Option A. Hit with your normal weapon attack and cast shocking grasp and get the free touch attack which is part of the spell cast. with the normal crit range chance of 20x2

Option B. Hit with your normal weapon, cast shocking grasp and instead of the free touch attack, you opt for spell strike which means you make a second attack with your weapon, striking against normal AC instead of touch, and if you hit, the charge goes off. This time instead of the crit range of 20, you have the crit range of whatever weapon you're using. such as 19-20 for a longsword, 18-20 for a rapier. If you crit with the weapon you get the crit damage for both the weapon strike and the additional shocking grasp damage.

For both Option A and B.

Any negatives you take to hit in order to boost your concentration attack apply to all attack rolls.


LazarX wrote:
Taleek wrote:

Weapon Specialization requires 4 levels of Fighter, which you won't qualify for as a straight Magus until level 10. Likewise, you wouldn't be able to start the Critial feats like Bleeding and Exhausting until level 15, because your BAB would be too low as a straight magus. Mixing in some fighter levels may alleviate these issues.

Weapon specialisation Greater, a feat that only gives you 2 points of damage is not the kind of feat I'd pick for high levels. Remember as a magus your main damage is going to come from your spells and spellstrikes, think along these lines for an end-game feat.

I'm not sure with action economy there would be a better choice out there. 2 damage per attack (4 with a critical) seems to add up very well. Every bit helps. What feats would you recommend?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Dispelling Critical, Step Up,

Arcane Shield is something worth considering, one never knows when an immediate shield bonus might be handy.


LazarX wrote:

Dispelling Critical, Step Up,

Arcane Shield is something worth considering, one never knows when an immediate shield bonus might be handy.

I've seriously considered Arcane Shield and came to the conclusion that I would need to conserve my already limited arcane pool. I also considered step-up since Kensai gets a free 'combat reflexes'. Too many good feats ;)

This is the first time I really took a look at dispelling critical. It is definitely sexy looking. It'd require arcane strike and I'm not sure I would want to give up a feat slot for that - I'll look more into it. Thanks for the suggestion =)

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Xideus Delorne wrote:
LazarX wrote:

Dispelling Critical, Step Up,

Arcane Shield is something worth considering, one never knows when an immediate shield bonus might be handy.

I've seriously considered Arcane Shield and came to the conclusion that I would need to conserve my already limited arcane pool. I also considered step-up since Kensai gets a free 'combat reflexes'. Too many good feats ;)

You don't spend your pool to activate Arcane Shield, you spend prepared spells.

Shadow Lodge

Heh, got a boon for PFS which allows me to make a Tiefling character; Dervish Dancer Magus, here I come!


Hey, Check out the weaponwand spell from Inner Sea Magic.

Does this mean a magus can effectively get the Wand Wielder Arcana, via a 1st level spell?

It's not on the PFSRD yet but basically, you cast this spell to place a wand INSIDE a weapon (your scimitar).

Then 'The Wielder of this weapon is considered to be wielding the wand as well. You can attack with the weapon or use it as if it were the encased wand'

That sounds like it would work with spellstrike, which states when you cast a touch spell, you can deliver the spell via an attack with your weapon instead of a touch attack.

So with both of these up you effectively have the wand wielder arcana?

Buy a Wand of Shocking Grasp and you can Spell Combat or Spellstrike to your hearts content?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

No, it does not substitute for the arcana. Aside from puttng the wand into a container, (the weapon) it's no different than using the wand in the normal fashion. You're either casting the wand, or striking with the weapon.


Exactly.

You can ATTACK with the weapon normally.

OR you can cast from the wand.

MY POINT is in requard to Spellstrike.

Spellstrike says when you cast a TOUCH spell, you can deliver that spell via a weapon attack.

So. Use you Scimitar/Wand of Shocking grasp to Cast the spell.
Because shocking grasp is a touch spell it can be delivered via a free weapon attack, rather than a touch attack.

For other spellcasting classes it's either /or.

I see no reason why this doesn't work with spellstrike.

Liberty's Edge

STR Ranger wrote:

Exactly.

You can ATTACK with the weapon normally.

OR you can cast from the wand.

MY POINT is in requard to Spellstrike.

Spellstrike says when you cast a TOUCH spell, you can deliver that spell via a weapon attack.

So. Use you Scimitar/Wand of Shocking grasp to Cast the spell.
Because shocking grasp is a touch spell it can be delivered via a free weapon attack, rather than a touch attack.

For other spellcasting classes it's either /or.

I see no reason why this doesn't work with spellstrike.

Well first, you're not casting the spell, you're activating the wand. That aside, spell strike isn't the biggie, it definitely will not work with spell combat, because you're not casting the spell.

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