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What are some things about the Pathfinder rules that you think most people do not know?


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion

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Cheliax

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

But it's the BEST. That's how I remember to sound snooty when I pronounce it. It's much bester than any of the other bestiaries.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion Subscriber
oneplus999 wrote:
...you can take a 5' step at any point in the middle of the attack. Also, since there is no facing, these attacks can be against creatures in any direction from you.

This can make feats like Great Cleave very interesting. Take the following example:

ABCD
E# F
GHIJ

If the character with Great Cleave is the #, then he could (assuming he keeps hitting), start at C, B, A, E, G, H, I, <5' step>, J, F, D. This gets even more ridiculous if he has reach.

oneplus999 wrote:
Lastly, you get to decide this after the previous attack is resolved, so you can fire an arrow 100' in one direction, notice that you knocked that guy out, then decide to fire 100' in the opposite direction at a different enemy.


Jiggy wrote:

The text for magic fang specifically states that you must pick one individual weapon, and even lists "fist" as one of your options.

And those of us who didn't play 3.5 did figure it out on our own, so let's not start in with the "but the rules don't say" stuff.

don't try to make me feel bad for not figuring out the correct interpretation, Jason himself admitted that the wording on flurry was poor.

under the "incorrect" system, there was never a need to keep track of whether you had one fist enchanted or two, now you do, thats my only point. its something someone considering the possibly-revised rules might not have noticed as an additional implication yet. considering that GMF indicates you can get +1 to all NATURAL attacks, but doesn't offer that option for unarmed strikes, the reader can reasonably assume one explanation for this wording: you only have one unarmed strike enchantment level, and a single casting of GMF applies to all your UAS's. according to an skr post from the other day, thats not the case.

i don't want to get the thread off track again, but i figure i get one post to defend myself >_>

ps: i never played 3.5 and yet i had the "incorrect" interpretation myself. go figure.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

You do not have to drop the enemy to continue cleaving with great cleave.

Sczarni

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

If you start a full attack, you can choose to stop after the first one so that it's just a normal attack standard action, and then you can still take a move action.

Also, you can distribute the attacks in a full attack among any number of foes however you choose.


Pathfinder Maps, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Trinite wrote:

If you start a full attack, you can choose to stop after the first one so that it's just a normal attack standard action, and then you can still take a move action.

Also, you can distribute the attacks in a full attack among any number of foes however you choose.

Add to that that if you are taking iterative attacks (Not two or multi-weapon fighting), you can choose which weapon to use with any iterative attack at no penalty.

For example, if a half-orc monk had a bite attack, IUS, a +1 keen temple sword in his left hand, and a +1 ghost touch dagger in his right hand, he could use any or all of them in combination in a standard iterative attack.

If he were level 15 (+11 BAB), he'd have 3 iterative attacks, and could make any of the following legally...

Kick to an ogre, sword chop to a drow, and dagger to a ghost.
Sword chop to an ogre, sword chop to a drow, dagger to a ghost.
Bite to an ogre, sword chop to a drow, dagger to a ghost.
Kick to an ogre, bite to a drow, dagger to a ghost.

or any other combination, as long as the first attack was made at +11, the second at +6, and the third at +1.


That any spell can become permanent with the Permanency such as Gravity bow and Lead Blades. Enlarge person + Lead Blades

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/permanency.html#_permanency

Last sentence on the page.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Munkir wrote:

That any spell can become permanent with the Permanency such as Gravity bow and Lead Blades. Enlarge person + Lead Blades

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/permanency.html#_permanency

Last sentence on the page.

Of course, it relies on explicit GM approval.


I know most GMs would brush this off and say only the approved list but if you convince him with a well thought out build and even better RP purpose then you might just get that spell leeway that we are all looking for.

How fun is it to have a Titan Mauler with enlarge person and lead blades. I can tell you it makes you a one man army. Give me a meteor hammer and those to spells and i can effectively cover my squishy caster friends from almost anything.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Well, anything is possible with the GM's permission.

Qadira

I didn't notice until yesterday, but two small creature's can't share a square anymore. Creature size in 3.5 was medium centric: 1 medium creature per square, or two small, 4 tiny etc.

big and little creatures in combat: ( p195 )
Space Reach
Small 5 ft. 5 ft.
Medium 5 ft. 5 ft.

Tiny creatures and smaller still can share squares.

Also I didn't realize that creatures providing Soft Cover would protect against attacks of opportunity. Since cover for non adjacent creatures is determined like ranged attacks ( reach weapons, or monsters with reach ). ( p194-195 )

Quote:
Cover and Attacks of Opportunity: You can't execute an attack of opportunity against an opponent with cover relative to you.
Quote:
Soft Cover: Creatures, even your enemies, can provide you with cover against ranged attacks, giving you a +4 bonus to AC. However, such soft cover provides no bonus on Reflex saves, nor does soft cover allow you to make a Stealth check.
Quote:
When making a melee attack against an adjacent target, your target has cover if any line from any corner of your square to the target's square goes through a wall (including a low wall). When making a melee attack against a target that isn't adjacent to you (such as with a reach weapon), use the rules for determining cover from ranged attacks.
Quote:
To determine whether your target has cover from your ranged attack, choose a corner of your square. If any line from this corner to any corner of the target's square passes through a square or border that blocks line of effect or provides cover, or through a square occupied by a creature, the target has cover (+4 to AC).


The Fireball spell damages unattended objects and sets flammable objects alight. It could conceivably be used for battlefield control instead of just attack.


-That flat-footed enemies don't get to add Dex modifier to their CMD, so Shatter Defense and other feats like that, are really useful for high-level characters using combat maneuvers.
-That enemies that lose Dex bonus to AC might lose it also to CMD (though I'm not really sure about this, but according to this old thread it is plausible).

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Necro!

Don't know if this has already been brought up, but spreads (like the area of a fireball) don't actually expand to a pre-set volume when in a confined space.

They do wrap around corners and such to fill the prescribed radius (hence it being easy to mis-read, especially if you're remembering older editions), but they don't expand beyond the radius regardless. In fact, it even says to make sure you count the distance used up to turn a corner when determining the end of said radius.

Who knew?

Andoran

My PFS build runs into this misconception often...

The Two Weapon Fighting Feat (and its descendants) can be used with thrown weapons, not just melee.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

The Sweater Golem wrote:

My PFS build runs into this misconception often...

The Two Weapon Fighting Feat (and its descendants) can be used with thrown weapons, not just melee.

I assume you have Quickdraw, yes?


The Sweater Golem wrote:

My PFS build runs into this misconception often...

The Two Weapon Fighting Feat (and its descendants) can be used with thrown weapons, not just melee.

Something many players (conveniently) forget: You need quickdraw to get your full iterative attacks with thrown weapons.

Andoran

Jiggy wrote:
I assume you have Quickdraw, yes?
[QOUTE="darth_borehd] Something many players (conveniently) forget: You need quickdraw to get your full iterative attacks with thrown weapons.

I agree, this is also a commonly and conveniently forgotten rule. The character in question here though is throwing shuriken, so he is on the up and up. :)


Frogboy wrote:


Revan wrote:
Yes, you wouldn't be able to make a stealth check if you were visible. But, (and I know this is a fine distinction) you're not visible. You have total concealment. So you can make a Stealth check. Just like you could if you were standing ten feet away, nothing to hide behind, but its so dark that the other person can't see more than 5 feet in front of them.
SRD Glossary wrote:
A creature can generally notice the presence of an active invisible creature within 30 feet with a DC 20 Perception check.
Upon further investigation, you are correct. You do get to make a stealth check ... but you do take a -20 if in combat. This check would be to pinpoint their exact location. DC 20 will let you know that an invisible creature is about. If they move while invisible (+20) while in combat (-20) you end up with a straight perception vs. stealth. The invisible creature still gets total...

You should note that the -20 is only if they are sniping. If they want they can attack, lose stealth, then move and regain it with only penalties due to movement (-0 at half speed, -5 if greater than half speed). There is no "in combat" penalty to stealth.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

That the Game Master has final say on anything and everything in his/her campaign...don't argue with them, but suggestions/discussions are okay.


ive been playing for 15 years, here is something i didnt know...

you must have read magic active or you cannot cast a spell from a scroll.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Not quite. Read Magic can help you decipher a scroll so that you know what spell is on it. You need to know what spell is on the scroll before you can cast it.


Cheapy wrote:
Not quite. Read Magic can help you decipher a scroll so that you know what spell is on it. You need to know what spell is on the scroll before you can cast it.

ok, i was told otherwise, then i must have misread it. so i have been playing correctly.


JohnLocke wrote:
A simple one that I see all the time: the paladin's doubling of his smite damage bonus versus undead, evil outsiders and evil dragons only applies to his first successful attack on that target. Subsequent attacks with an active smite against the same target use the standard damage bonus (+ paladin level).

Wait what?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Quote:
If the target of smite evil is an outsider with the evil subtype, an evil-aligned dragon, or an undead creature, the bonus to damage on the first successful attack increases to 2 points of damage per level the paladin possesses.

It used to be all attacks, but that was toned down.

Osirion

A caster can cast a touch spell (Bestow Curse, for example), THEN walk up to someone, and Touch as a free action that doesn't provoke attacks of opprotunity.
So if you aren't already in their face at the start of your turn, you can completely circumvent the threat of attacks with your touch spells.

Part that I'm not so sure about:

Now from what I understand, you have to use that free action on the turn you casted. If you wait until your next turn, you have to use a Standard action to deliver it.

If someone can clarify/correct me on that, I'd be happy to hear it.


I did a quick search in this thread and didn't get any hits back... I was astounded, but please forgive me if this has been covered and it simply didn't show up.

Hero Points. No, it's not core, but it adds a HUGE dynamic to the game. I don't think 3.5 really had anything like that... and while they're similar to Action Points in 4e, they're MUCH more dynamic and precious in Pathfinder. As a DM (and a player, obviously) I LOVE the Hero Points concept.

Also, I think people just assume that pretty much all 3.5 monsters can also be found in Pathfinder material... but sadly, this is not true. My jaw dropped when I discovered that there isn't a Mindflayer in Pathfinder... or even an equivalent. I was disappointed, especially since I'm running a "Call of Cthulhu" adventure with Pathfinder... instead of just plugging the 3.5 entry, in the end I decided to make a few tweaks to the Spawning Cackler's stats and just use that for Star Spawn.

And now I'm just rambling...

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Companion, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Beholder, mindflayer and a few other are closed content as they are considered signature monsters of D%D and so a restricted property of TSR/WoTC/Hasbro.


I learn a lot of things in here... Specially for the enlarge person's spell and about the sneak attack on undead... Thanks folks :)

Well, I've got a little participation too:
- You can wear an armor without the feat if it doesn't have a malus on skill's checks. Yeah, I really like mithral and staff for my sorcerer... (Of course, there is a few chance to fail the spell, but it still nice!)


And Sinatar, I only can recommend you the Psionic Unleashed book, with a monster called the "phrenic"... I think he will be familiar for you and you Cthullu adventure...
(And scuse me for my english, I'm french^^)


Thanks, Lornis. It's a shame we have to resort to 3rd party publishing for that... but I'm not so sure about the "implant" thing with the Phrenic... Mindflayers didn't do that in 3.5, and it's on a different tangent of flavor than what I was looking for. But thank you - I wasn't aware of that monster. :)

Here is my personal take.

As you can see it has a modified version of a Mindflayer's "Mind Blast" and the Spawning Canker's "feeding"... just what the doctor ordered. My Star Spawn are not quite Mindflayers, and they're certainly not Spawning Cankers... but sometimes a DM borrows abilities from other monsters. I find myself doing that a lot, actually...

Oh. And that other monster... is the creator of the Necronomicon, an important intelligent item / artifact in my adventure. The Necronomicon summons that guy as a final spat of desperation when people whom the book doesn't like (pretty much everybody) successfully attune themselves to the tome. Fun times.


dot


I saw a couple of hits on this particular 'rule' but I am not sure it was fully explained...
An untrained knowledge check can be made by anyone as long as the DC is not greater than 10...unless...they have an extensive library at their disposal and a bit more time than usual.


The sizes of combatants can alter the penalty for firing into a melee from -4 to -2.


bugleyman wrote:
The sizes of combatants can alter the penalty for firing into a melee from -4 to -2.

Specifically:

Quote:
If your target is two size categories larger than the friendly characters it is engaged with, this penalty is reduced to –2. There is no penalty for firing at a creature that is three size categories larger than the friendly characters it is engaged with.


You need a 1'x1' hole in order to cast through a barrier. Anything smaller, and you do not have "line of effect". So no casting through keyholes, unless you don't actually need a line of effect for a particular spell.


VRMH wrote:
You need a 1'x1' hole in order to cast through a barrier. Anything smaller, and you do not have "line of effect". So no casting through keyholes, unless you don't actually need a line of effect for a particular spell.

...or through arrow-slits. Ouch.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

If you're grappling an enemy, when you maintain you do not have to pin them before you can tie them up. You can go straight for the tie-up, albeit at a -10 penalty to your check to maintain the grapple.


Effectively nothing happens if you cast darkness in bright sunlight.

Darkness does not create a sphere of darkness around you, it just lowers the light level by one step.

Also, reach weapons and creatures with reach resolve cover like a ranged weapon.

Andoran

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Card Game, Companion, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
bugleyman wrote:
VRMH wrote:
You need a 1'x1' hole in order to cast through a barrier. Anything smaller, and you do not have "line of effect". So no casting through keyholes, unless you don't actually need a line of effect for a particular spell.
...or through arrow-slits. Ouch.

"An otherwise solid barrier with a hole of at least 1 square foot through it does not block a spell's line of effect. "

Three things.

1) It blocks line of effect don't mean that the line of effect can't start or stop in that square, it mean that it can't pass through that square.

2) Most arrow slit width is less than 1 foot but they are generally way higher than 1 foot. The rule speak of a 1 square foot hole, not of a 1'x 1' hole. A a 8" x 5' is larger than a 1 square foot.

3) Fireball: "If you attempt to send the bead through a narrow passage, such as through an arrow slit, you must “hit” the opening with a ranged touch attack, or else the bead strikes the barrier and detonates prematurely."


Vehicles, unlike other objects, don't divide elemental damage dealt to them before applying hardness.


just a dot. love this thread.

Shadow Lodge

1) The Skeleton and Zombie templates provided in Classic Horrors Revisited may be used interchangeably between the two types of undead so long as "common sense" does not dictate otherwise.
<Stuff that Interests Me>
- Mudra Skeletons are not restricted to humanoid skeletons (I keep forgetting this)
- The Acid template allows for alternative types of energy damage (as to whether or not the alternate templates may be stacked isn't known to me...or what happens when you have a Burning/Frost Skeleton).
- Cursed Zombies with the -4 penalty to attack rolls, ability checks, and skill checks curse are not appreciated by GM's.
- Likewise, a 50% chance for a turn-loss will make the GM throw books at you.
- Nightmare Vapor Gasburst Zombies

2) By a strict wording, an Undead Lord Cleric can stack as many templates as it likes on an Undead Companion so long as its HD does exceed half its level.
<Stuff to Remember>
- An Undead Lord Cleric may not have a zombie Corpse Companion at level 1.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Please refrain from posting stuff that probably goes against how the rules were meant to work.


As far as I can tell, Animate Dead undead keep their spell-like abilities, though the DCs will be low due to 10 charisma.

Similarly, creatures that cast spells by nature of their type instead of class levels (Nymph) keep their casting, though can only use cantrips without an item.

Shadow Lodge

Unless you're against blunt English, Cheapy, there's nothing in my post that goes against how the rules were "probably" meant to work. My note on the Classic Horror templates is written in the entry and my note on the Undead Lord archetype is spelled out quite clearly (though, really, you're getting an undead which will never get feats despite new HD or, if it does, loses half of its HD space, meaning you'll have a 2 RHD/1 C Skeleton Lord at level 6).

----

A Skeleton or Zombie created via Animate Dead still applies the given template and, in the language of the template, all special qualities that are not Extraordinary (and improve either its melee or ranged attacks) are discarded. However, while there is wiggle room for the argument on casting, casting itself does not have a type and is generally considered to be neither Supernatural nor Extraordinary (unless otherwise specified in the specific entry).

Andoran

Please take debate about undead to another thread. If appropriate, post a link to the debate thread here.


I'm not sure if this has been updated, but looking at the last compilation of rules in the thread I found this...

Quote:
5. If failing on Use Magic Device with a natural 1, you cannot retry for 24 hours.

Which isn't entirely accurate.

The full rule is...

Quote:
Try Again: Yes, but if you ever roll a natural 1 while attempting to activate an item and you fail, then you can't try to activate that item again for 24 hours.

If your UMD is high enough for you to succeed on a 1, the "24 Hour" rule will not apply.

Qadira RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

Abciximab, take a look at the first quoted passage again, particularly at the second word...

Andoran

Chris Mortika wrote:
Abciximab, take a look at the first quoted passage again, particularly at the second word...

Yeah, it's good as is. Thx for the eyes, though, Abciximab.

I've been toying with updating the last compilation or maybe doing a compilation part two and subsequently merging them (easier).

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