A concern that has been baffling me: Can the Fast Healing evolution be used properly on a Synthesist Summoner? Furthermore, is there any method of healing the eidolon, or do you just have to wait until it dies and resummon it 24 hours later?
I agree that the text does not make this clear, and I'm not sure that RAW my interpretation holds up, but I would say that a healing spell or effect could affect either the synthesist's or the eidolon's HP (synthesist's temporary HP), as long as either of them would have been a valid target. Further, I would say that the Restore Eidolon spell set would not be able to affect the summoner's ordinary HP, but could restore the synthesist's temporary HP up to a maximum of the Eidolon's full HP (essentially healing the Eidolon). This does not seem, strictly speaking, legal, as one cannot heal temporary HP.
On fast healing specifically, I would say that during each round, either the synthesist's HP or the Eidolon's HP get the healing; even though they both have the evolution, they are still only one creature so I don't think the healing should double up.
Some developer clarification would certainly help.
healing effects work normally I am sure once the summoner starts sacrificing his own hp to keep the eidolon temp hp up. I'd allow the specific eidolon healing spells to get the temp hp back but I'm not sure if that works by raw.
I think part of the balance is that there is no easy way to restore the eidolon's HP as they are treated as temporary HP for the synthesizer (hah!). Keep in mind that at full HP the synthesist has a bigger HP pool than a con-specialist raging barbarian. The price you pay is in the durability of your HP.
As I understand it, Fast Healing will only work on the summoners HP, temporary HP are never healed. Given, however, that the summoner can use Fused Link to ensure that temporary HP gets damaged last, it isn't that much of a problem in practice (since usually damage always hurts temporary HP first).
Please try not to be generous to the summoner - it's not a class that needs help being awesome.
For a synthesist there is no distinct eidolon - it exists as a separate entity in its home plane, but not when summoned by the synthesist. When fused the two are one for pretty much all purposes. The eidolon's hit points are added onto the synthesist's as temporary hitpoints. Temporary hitpoints cannot be healed. Though if the eidolon is killed, it can be resummoned with half-hitpoints a day later.
This seems pretty adequate and balanced to me. I fail to see difficult beyond this point.
the problem is that what's the purpose of having the eidolon's full HP exist when it's just going to be perpetually halved at best. Since it says doesn't change the fact that the eidolon's health doesn't recover naturally, that kind of ruling makes a good chunk of it not used. Also don't forget a summoner could pretty much do the exact same thing with the standard eidolon, as it could still drain down the summoner's hp, and it would even get 2 actions(Eidolon+summoner) instead of just one. So the eidolon can always have the hp of the summoner and eidolon combined effectively, whether it's the synthisist or not.
I do support that the eidolon only healing spells should heal the "Eidolon" health and I think if they where the only things that could, it could be okay.
Step 1: Stab yourself until you reach 0 temp HP
Step 2: Sacrifice all but 1 of your normal HP to restore your Temp HP
Step 3: Get your Cleric to begrudgingly heal you to full
It probably won't give you all your temp HP back if only because of the difference between your d10 Eidolon and your d8 Synthesist, and getting your own HP too low makes sleep/banishment a potential death sentence if the CON disparity between Synthesist and Eidolon is large enough and you can't get healed fast enough, but hey, it works. Kinda.
Actually, I think the summoner has it pretty good here. With rejuvenate eidolon (lesser and otherwise), they can heal their own eidolon better than a cleric could in any case (1d10+1 point per level,rather than 1d8+level). Are folks missing that?
I think it's not so much that they're missing that as they are not so sure it works that way. For one, even though the spell says you heal your Eidolon, you cannot specifically target the Eidolon. Since the Eidolon and Synthesist are essentially the same creature, I'd wager that using the spell heals the Synthesist since one of the main points of temporary hit points is that they cannot be healed. You can get more through various spells, but you can never "heal" it in the way that a cure spell does.
Unless they errata the temp HP to be recoverable through certain spells, my bet is that you can't.
I do not like the idea that you cannot heal your eidolon even though it is fused. This leads to silly situations where you will want to kill your eidolon if its hp ever drop below half just to get it back to half hp. And you do this by smacking yourself. And you can never get it back to full hp. Ever. This is just plain idiotic. Especially for an archtype which is extremely flavorful and gives such a deep sense of immersion.
Suggested Solution:
I think the problem here is the word "temporary" in temporary hp. A fix which may work is to remove the word "temporary" and replace it with "additional". But as is pointed out earlier this would give a summoner more hp than a raging barbarian (which is just wrong: nothing has more hp than a raging barbarian). So I suggest the additional fix of having these additional hp always be half of a standard eidolons hp. (e.g. standard eidolon of 40hp would give 20 additional hp to the Synthesist summoner. Which is still substantial but not silly.)
I would be in favor of the eidolon healing spells to only repair the additional hp and the cleric will have to do the rest. Though, flavor-wise the eidolon healing spells (and normal healing spells) should heal both summoner and eidolon since they are fused and the summoner chooses how to split the healing.
Thoughts?
Please try not to be generous to the summoner - it's not a class that needs help being awesome.
I will have to contest that.
Just looking at the list of summon monster spells, which you would have to use any time you couldn't have your pet, such as getting hit with a sleep spell.. night time ambush.. and many more favorites..
At levels 1-2, you get to summon a chiwawa to fight owlbears. Or richard simmons, however he is very docile and cannot use his hooves. Of course you could also summon flipper.. not the amazing one on TV but the one that some hobo named flipper.
Next you can summon a hyena... totally gonna get you laughed out of the circle of life there.. Or a wolf. Unfortantly, now you are starting to fight things like worgs or half-drow bard vampires..
Basically.. Without the summoners digimon to fight, he is stuck with basically magicarps. And as we all know, splash just isn't effective.
Suggested Solution:
I think the problem here is the word "temporary" in temporary hp. A fix which may work is to remove the word "temporary" and replace it with "additional". But as is pointed out earlier this would give a summoner more hp than a raging barbarian (which is just wrong: nothing has more hp than a raging barbarian).
Mind you though a raging barbarian can rage whenever he wants to. He doesn't have to go through a ritual of drinking and chewing tobacco to eventually go "You know what? I'M ANGRY!"
Suggested Solution:
I think the problem here is the word "temporary" in temporary hp. A fix which may work is to remove the word "temporary" and replace it with "additional". But as is pointed out earlier this would give a summoner more hp than a raging barbarian (which is just wrong: nothing has more hp than a raging barbarian).
Mind you though a raging barbarian can rage whenever he wants to. He doesn't have to go through a ritual of drinking and chewing tobacco to eventually go "You know what? I'M ANGRY!"
True. Also the Synthesist Summoner loses a lot compared to a standard summoner though he does gain a little in survivability. So perhaps the change could be as simple as changing a single word: temporary to additional. And maybe also clarifying that the summoner can choose to split healing as he wishes.
Synthesist basically loses a lot of raw power for the benefit of being way cool so I don't see how allowing the eidolon to heal is in any way bad or "unbalancing" here.
I mean hell, Synthesist loses an additional action from the eidolon each turn. That's gigantic.
You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
This is a ridiculous overstatement. An eidolon is a class feature just like barbarian rage or wizard spells or druid wildshape. All of these class features allows changing of stats in some form or another each with their own advantages and disadvantages. You cannot compare point buy with class abilities.
I'm starting a synthesist PC tonight for a Council of Thieves game and it required a few questions to the DM and this was one of them. Thankfully, my DM decided that the temp hp can be healed in the same way that an eidolon would be or it would be IMPOSSIBLE to actually heal your eidolon. Ever. Even after dying, the eidolon comes back with 1/2 its max HP which would lock it there until the end of your characters career. WTF.
The archetype also got a few houseruled abilities to bring it more in line with the original summoner in the game that I'm playing, though I have no idea how balanced/unbalanced it will be.
This is a ridiculous overstatement. An eidolon is a class feature just like barbarian rage or wizard spells or druid wildshape. All of these class features allows changing of stats in some form or another each with their own advantages and disadvantages. You cannot compare point buy with class abilities.You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
Granted - but it's not entirely unlike a very favorable point-buy once you consider the ability to increase stats by evolution.
Granted - but it's not entirely unlike a very favorable point-buy once you consider the ability to increase stats by evolution.This is a ridiculous overstatement. An eidolon is a class feature just like barbarian rage or wizard spells or druid wildshape. All of these class features allows changing of stats in some form or another each with their own advantages and disadvantages. You cannot compare point buy with class abilities.You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
You know I ran some playtests over the last few days with Synthesist and a few of the other ultimate magic book characters, and I understand the initial concern (I thought it was a little crazy at first). Essentially, Synthesists make really great tanks, but I wasn't floored with it's (bipedal) damage output at any given level. It more or less turns you into a frontliner, and a great damage sponge, which is a novel thing for the class.
I ran tests at 2, 6th, and 12th levels against CR appropriate encounters (starting with cr-1, then cr, then cr+1, cr +2, cr +3) and while it certainly stayed WELL ahead of the pack in terms of hp, the Qiggong (I know I spelled that wrong) monk put it to shame in damage. Lvl 12 Suli Qiggong Monk/Monk of the Four Winds w/belier's bite was doing 2d8+5+1d4 bleed +4d6 (any element) + 2d6 holy (brass knuckles) per hit. Things got real scary with Quicken Spell Like Ability on Scorching Ray, and the Slow Time Monk of the Four Winds ability... (Four casts of Scorching Ray in one round at caster level 12 = 48d6 fire damage).
Granted - but it's not entirely unlike a very favorable point-buy once you consider the ability to increase stats by evolution.This is a ridiculous overstatement. An eidolon is a class feature just like barbarian rage or wizard spells or druid wildshape. All of these class features allows changing of stats in some form or another each with their own advantages and disadvantages. You cannot compare point buy with class abilities.You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
For the record, I agree that it could be abused as a 1 level dip. Most things can be though, and while I agree that the bonuses here are significant, there's not a lot that can be done about it. If your concern is with your group at home I'd just slap a restriction on it.
@nathan blackmer:
"Four casts of Scorching Ray in one round at caster level 12 = 48d6 fire damage"
As a swift action, the monk can expend 6 ki points to gain three standard actions during his turn instead of just one. The monk can use these actions to do the following: take a melee attack action, use a skill, use an extraordinary ability, or take a move action. The monk cannot use these actions to cast spells or use spell-like abilities, and cannot combine them to take full-attack actions
It's a good idea, but you cannot do it. :)
For the record, I agree that it could be abused as a 1 level dip. Most things can be though, and while I agree that the bonuses here are significant, there's not a lot that can be done about it. If your concern is with your group at home I'd just slap a restriction on it.Granted - but it's not entirely unlike a very favorable point-buy once you consider the ability to increase stats by evolution.This is a ridiculous overstatement. An eidolon is a class feature just like barbarian rage or wizard spells or druid wildshape. All of these class features allows changing of stats in some form or another each with their own advantages and disadvantages. You cannot compare point buy with class abilities.You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
The way I interpret the rules for it, it's not a very good 1-level dip, at least not if you want to hit things. In the text where it says you use certain statistics from the Eidolon instead of from yourself, BAB is included. Some have interpreted this to mean that you use the Eidolon's BAB instead of your summoner levels, but I think it makes more sense to rule that you use it as your full BAB. By that interpretation, 1-level dip means permanent BAB of +1 while the Eidolon's out.
The way I interpret the rules for it, it's not a very good 1-level dip, at least not if you want to hit things. In the text where it says you use certain statistics from the Eidolon instead of from yourself, BAB is included. Some have interpreted this to mean that you use the Eidolon's BAB instead of your summoner levels, but I think it makes more sense to rule that you use it as your full BAB. By that interpretation, 1-level dip means permanent BAB of +1 while the Eidolon's out.For the record, I agree that it could be abused as a 1 level dip. Most things can be though, and while I agree that the bonuses here are significant, there's not a lot that can be done about it. If your concern is with your group at home I'd just slap a restriction on it.Granted - but it's not entirely unlike a very favorable point-buy once you consider the ability to increase stats by evolution.This is a ridiculous overstatement. An eidolon is a class feature just like barbarian rage or wizard spells or druid wildshape. All of these class features allows changing of stats in some form or another each with their own advantages and disadvantages. You cannot compare point buy with class abilities.You know what else is gigantic? Potentially using a 15pt buy character to have a 42pt buy character. (Selling all your physical stats and replacing them with eidolon stats - and using all your points to get super high mental stats.)
I'd have to agree there. It says you use its BAB, not that its BAB replaces your summoners BAB. Thus taking as a level 1 dip would result in always having only a bab of 1 while it is out.
Oddly though, you are able to take the Mount evolution to allow other people to ride you.
@nathan blackmer:
"Four casts of Scorching Ray in one round at caster level 12 = 48d6 fire damage"
As a swift action, the monk can expend 6 ki points to gain three standard actions during his turn instead of just one. The monk can use these actions to do the following: take a melee attack action, use a skill, use an extraordinary ability, or take a move action. The monk cannot use these actions to cast spells or use spell-like abilities, and cannot combine them to take full-attack actionsIt's a good idea, but you cannot do it. :)
*cries* fair enough. Still, two in a turn is 24d6, which is still not bad.
Sythesist summoner is a deceptively good looking archtype. It appears to be a powerhouse, even better than a straight barbarian or fighter. But is it really?
The Good:
- Great sense of character immersion: Now you really can play a dragon/demon/angel etc. And still be of acceptable power level.
- Awesome Adaptability from Eidolon evolutions and Evolution Surge spells.
- Insane number of natural attacks.
- Acceptable AC. (The natural AC improvement can only be taken once at each of level's 1,10,15,20)
- High number of hp.
The Bad:
- 13 Con is the base for eidolons. This does not seem so bad with the doubling up of the hp but it does hurt with the following point:
- Fort and reflexes saves. They are bad. For a front line fighter having a bad fort save is almost a death sentence. And having bad reflex saves renders the evasion ability almost useless.
- DR Difficulties Getting through DR is a problem. For that specific DR overcoming weapons are required. But a summoner has only simple weapon proficiency, if you want better weapons at least one feat is required.
- Feats Here's the problem for a synthesist. Firstly there arn't enough to split between combat feats and those handy summoner feats. Secondly and most importantly you have to be able to qualify for those combat feats (like Power Attack). Which leads to:
- Stats: Making your physical stats a dumbstat is just not an option. Also you need to survive when your eidolon is not around (like when summoning/resting up or in social situations where a giant freakish monster would not be welcome). Also buffing your stats with evolutions is expensive especially when most of your evolution points are going into just getting those insane number of natural attacks.
- Actions: Normal summoner has 2 actions to a synthesists single action. This is (as many people have pointed out) a huge deficit.
The Ugly:
Which brings me to the eidolon healing dilemma. A fair ruling, given the power loss of the synthesist compared to the normal summoner is one that has been given over and over earlier. Rejuvenate Eidolon spells heal eidolon damage. Normal (clerical) healing spells heal the summoner. Fast healing evolution heals summoner or eidolon split as the summoner sees fit.
I would even go a step further and say that while combined into a single being, any healing applied to the summoner (including rejuvenate eidolon spells) can be split by the summoner to heal the eidolon or summoner hp.
Few things you forgot though..
While the summoner only has simple weapon prof, for the price of 4 evolution points (Or 2 points when you can do greater aspect) You too can have martial weapon prof.
Most of the handy summoner feats don't work for the synthesis.
There is still a number of ways for natural weaponists, to get past DR. The evolution and the feat.
Some of the scary things this summoner can do is duel wield 2handed weapons. (course they are taking -4/-4)
Few things you forgot though..
Maybe I did that on purpose :p
While the summoner only has simple weapon prof, for the price of 4 evolution points (Or 2 points when you can do greater aspect) You too can have martial weapon prof.
Which is not worth the evolution points. It's arguably better to take a feat. But I will concede that it is a way.
Most of the handy summoner feats don't work for the synthesis.
True. But some do. Extra Evolution is just too good to pass up.
There is still a number of ways for natural weaponists, to get past DR. The evolution and the feat.
You can get past some. But not all as handily as a cold iron, silver or adamantium weapon would. That said, dealing loads of damage will do the trick as well.
Some of the scary things this summoner can do is duel wield 2handed weapons. (course they are taking -4/-4)
You would have to take two weapon fighting feat which has a 15 Dex prerequisite. And you must meet the prerequisites when the eidolon is not fused. It is a valid build but somehow I do not find that too appealing. Also you would require a feat (or evolution) to get an adequate 2handed weapon. Maybe dipping into a level of ranger can sort out these things?
Actually, you do not have to be able to meet the requirements to take a feat.
You just have to be able to rationalize that you have a readily available method to meet the requirements often enough to train it. - And the Eidolon is That.
This is similar to having a magic item that grants +STR. With the item, you meet certain pre-regs., without it you do not.
When you do not meet the requirements, the feat is passive and not usable. When you do meet the requirements, the feat is active and usable.
Actually, you do not have to be able to meet the requirements to take a feat.
You just have to be able to rationalize that you have a readily available method to meet the requirements often enough to train it. - And the Eidolon is That.
This is similar to having a magic item that grants +STR. With the item, you meet certain pre-regs., without it you do not.
When you do not meet the requirements, the feat is passive and not usable. When you do meet the requirements, the feat is active and usable.
You can't take a feat and have it lay dormant until you qualify.
"Prerequisite: A minimum ability score, another feat or feats, a minimum base attack bonus, a minimum number of ranks in one or more skills, or anything else required in order to take the feat. This entry is absent if a feat has no prerequisite. A feat may have more than one prerequisite."
If you do not meet the requirement, you can't even take the feat, dormant or otherwise.
Now, if you DO meet the requirement (such as by having a magic item that grants you enough strength to pick up Power Attack), you can take the feat. If you later lose the requirement, only then does the dormancy effect take place.
Ravingdork clarifies it well. If you have the ability to create a situation where you meet the requirements, you may take the feat.
You do not need to be able to persist that situation indefinitely.
Being able to use a minute when you wake up and then have the prerequisites for the desired feat should be more than enough to claim that you meet the prerequisites for the purposes of taking the feat.
- You probably don't sleep with your belt of STR or headband of INT, do you? - So casting an all day buff when getting up in the morning should qualify just as well as a persistent item bonus does.
I agree with Ravingdork, you have to be able to produce the requirements before you can grab the feat. You can't take it if you do not yet have access to a way to meet the requirements.
My favorite race of synthesist would be half-orc for the free falchion prof, or half-elf if I want exotic weapons with the ancestral arms racial trait.
Or, ya know, just get the heirloom weapon trait cause that is amaaaazing.
Half-elf also gets 5 more Evolution points via his alternate favored class bonus. (Over the 20 levels, 1/4 per level)
Few things you forgot though..
Maybe I did that on purpose :p
While the summoner only has simple weapon prof, for the price of 4 evolution points (Or 2 points when you can do greater aspect) You too can have martial weapon prof.
Which is not worth the evolution points. It's arguably better to take a feat. But I will concede that it is a way.
Most of the handy summoner feats don't work for the synthesis.
True. But some do. Extra Evolution is just too good to pass up.
Actually, that is one you don't qualify for. The feat says Prerequisite: Eidolon class feature.
You gave up that class feature for Fused Eidolon Class feature. So by raw, you do not qualify.
There is still a number of ways for natural weaponists, to get past DR. The evolution and the feat.
You can get past some. But not all as handily as a cold iron, silver or adamantium weapon would. That said, dealing loads of damage will do the trick as well.
You would have to take two weapon fighting feat which has a 15 Dex prerequisite. And you must meet the prerequisites when the eidolon is not fused. It is a valid build but somehow I do not find that too appealing. Also you would require a feat (or evolution) to get an adequate 2handed weapon. Maybe dipping into a level of ranger can sort out these things?
Some of the scary things this summoner can do is duel wield 2handed weapons. (course they are taking -4/-4)
Then tell me, how do druids enhance their wild shape forms with things such as improved natural attack, eldritch claws, and rending claws?
The Ugly:
Which brings me to the eidolon healing dilemma. A fair ruling, given the power loss of the synthesist compared to the normal summoner is one that has been given over and over earlier. Rejuvenate Eidolon spells heal eidolon damage. Normal (clerical) healing spells heal the summoner. Fast healing evolution heals summoner or eidolon split as the summoner sees fit.I would even go a step further and say that while combined into a single being, any healing applied to the summoner (including rejuvenate eidolon spells) can be split by the summoner to heal the eidolon or summoner hp.
Actually, the way I read it, you gain the eidolon's hp as temporary hp. When these temporary hp are depleted, the eidolon is shunted back home. However, from my understanding, the eidolon doesn't actually take damage. It can't be targeted separately, so it can't be turned to stone, or take damage in any way. Next time you summon it, it should still be at full health.
I guess that's how you replenish your temporary hp. Resummoning. Is that too strong?
On another note, Augment Summoning and the Summon Eidolon spell seems like a really attractive combination for a Synthesist.
That does have a certain simplicity to it that is appealing.
It does also kill off any ability to "refill" them using fast healing though. - As you do not really have the Eidolon's HP's, you have a buff of temporary HP's that just happens to match the HP of the Eidolon
Hmm, how does these temporary hitpoints stack with other temporary hitpoints?
Actually, you do not have to be able to meet the requirements to take a feat.
You just have to be able to rationalize that you have a readily available method to meet the requirements often enough to train it. - And the Eidolon is That.
This is similar to having a magic item that grants +STR. With the item, you meet certain pre-regs., without it you do not.
When you do not meet the requirements, the feat is passive and not usable. When you do meet the requirements, the feat is active and usable.
You can't take a feat and have it lay dormant until you qualify.
"Prerequisite: A minimum ability score, another feat or feats, a minimum base attack bonus, a minimum number of ranks in one or more skills, or anything else required in order to take the feat. This entry is absent if a feat has no prerequisite. A feat may have more than one prerequisite."
If you do not meet the requirement, you can't even take the feat, dormant or otherwise.
Now, if you DO meet the requirement (such as by having a magic item that grants you enough strength to pick up Power Attack), you can take the feat. If you later lose the requirement, only then does the dormancy effect take place.
That's not what he said. The bonus from a magic item falls under the category of a Permanent Bonus:Ravingdork clarifies it well. If you have the ability to create a situation where you meet the requirements, you may take the feat.
You do not need to be able to persist that situation indefinitely.
...
I agree with Ravingdork, you have to be able to produce the requirements before you can grab the feat. You can't take it if you do not yet have access to a way to meet the requirements.
Ability bonuses with a duration greater than 1 day actually increase the relevant ability score after 24 hours. Modify all skills and statistics related to that ability. This might cause you to gain skill points, hit points, and other bonuses.
You don't qualify for feats until the bonus from a magic item becomes permanent. Being able to cast Bull's Strength doesn't enable you to take feats as if your strength was 4 higher unless your duration is greater than 24 hours.
Actually, the way I read it, you gain the eidolon's hp as temporary hp. When these temporary hp are depleted, the eidolon is shunted back home. However, from my understanding, the eidolon doesn't actually take damage. It can't be targeted separately, so it can't be turned to stone, or take damage in any way. Next time you summon it, it should still be at full health.
I guess that's how you replenish your temporary hp. Resummoning. Is that too strong?
I like this reading. I really do. It certainly gives the synthesist an advantage over a base summoner, which helps make up for the loss of the second set of actions.
That's not what he said. The bonus from a magic item falls under the category of a Permanent Bonus:Ability bonuses with a duration greater than 1 day actually increase the relevant ability score after 24 hours. Modify all skills and statistics...
Then druids do not qualify for..
Rending Claws
Eldrich Claws
There are more out there. But basically that is what you are saying.
That's not what he said. The bonus from a magic item falls under the category of a Permanent Bonus:Ability bonuses with a duration greater than 1 day actually increase the relevant ability score after 24 hours. Modify all skills and statistics...Then druids do not qualify for..
Rending Claws
Eldrich ClawsThere are more out there. But basically that is what you are saying.
Yep, that's what I'm saying.
An 8th level druid (when they get BAB +6) does have enough wild shape time to be able to stay in animal form for a whole day, but that's three uses so each use doesn't last long enough to qualify. A 24th level druid, on the other hand, would be able to qualify...
As a GM I might allow it anyway, but I don't believe it to be RAW.
You don't qualify for feats until the bonus from a magic item becomes permanent. Being able to cast Bull's Strength doesn't enable you to take feats as if your strength was 4 higher unless your duration is greater than 24 hours.
But a summoned eidolon doesn't have a duration. It lasts until you fall asleep. Or get bonked onna head. Does that mean, if you can stay up for 24 hours, those bonuses become 'permanent bonuses' until you keel over?
That's not what he said. The bonus from a magic item falls under the category of a Permanent Bonus:Ability bonuses with a duration greater than 1 day actually increase the relevant ability score after 24 hours. Modify all skills and statistics...Then druids do not qualify for..
Rending Claws
Eldrich ClawsThere are more out there. But basically that is what you are saying.
Yep, that's what I'm saying.
An 8th level druid (when they get BAB +6) does have enough wild shape time to be able to stay in animal form for a whole day, but that's three uses so each use doesn't last long enough to qualify. A 24th level druid, on the other hand, would be able to qualify...
As a GM I might allow it anyway, but I don't believe it to be RAW.
He would have to be in animal form for the whole day, never coming out of it.
Not to mention, you also have the Fly skill. By default no one qualifies for it.. but so many classes that have a high possibility of learning a fly spell get it.
Not to mention, you also have the Fly skill. By default no one qualifies for it.. but so many classes that have a high possibility of learning a fly spell get it.Fly specifically says:
You cannot take this skill without a natural means of flight or gliding. Creatures can also take ranks in Fly if they possess a reliable means of flying every day (either through a spell or other magical manner, such as a druid’s wild shape ability).
So that's not really relevant to feats. There's no feat text which says "You must possess a reliable means of meeting the prerequisites every day."
Not to mention, you also have the Fly skill. By default no one qualifies for it.. but so many classes that have a high possibility of learning a fly spell get it.Fly specifically says:You cannot take this skill without a natural means of flight or gliding. Creatures can also take ranks in Fly if they possess a reliable means of flying every day (either through a spell or other magical manner, such as a druid’s wild shape ability).So that's not really relevant to feats. There's no feat text which says "You must possess a reliable means of meeting the prerequisites every day."
I take ranks in fly regardless of that rule. It's as simple as saying he had a wizarding uncle who was kind enough to let him fly around all the time as a kid.
You can stay awake once for 24 hours with the Eidolon up if you want. RAW thus satisfied.
Actually, that is one you don't qualify for. The feat says Prerequisite: Eidolon class feature.You gave up that class feature for Fused Eidolon Class feature. So by raw, you do not qualify.
Noooooooooooooooooooooooo.
By RAW it seems you are correct but I would still wheedle my DM to allow this one :)
Then tell me, how do druids enhance their wild shape forms with things such as improved natural attack, eldritch claws, and rending claws?
They cannot. But as GM I would allow that if "You must possess a reliable means of meeting the prerequisites every day." you can take the feat. But by RAW it seems it is not allowed.