i have a nephew who is turning 11 this weekend. and he asked, for a bday gift, a pathfinder book. While i sit here and think on perhaps buying him one, i question myself "should his first book into rpgs be pathfinder? or should it be the iconoclastic Dungeons and Dragons rpg?"
I know that receiving your first rpg book is a HUGE thing for us RPG gamers. I remember with fondness purchasing my first AD&D PHB. It was awesome! i loved it! "with this, i can do ANYTHING!" is what i felt. Granted, i didnt get involved with DnD until i was 14/15, but still, a big thing.
But with my nephew its different. He loves to play rpgs, but on the computer. he loves fps. I took him to a gaming convention at the end of feburary, and he enjoyed it. he had alot of fun playing pathfinder, and playing gurps with me, but he didnt get into dark heresy. Ive purchased gifts for him in the past, thinking he would love them, but 2 days later i find them stuffed in random places, forgotten.
So, should the first rpg for a new young player be pathfinder, or should it be something different?
I want to say Pathfinder Basic boxed set. Are we there yet?
If he likes Pathfinder, get him Pathfinder. The Dragon Age boxed set is also a good choice - it's got a very Basic D&D boxed set feel to it.
In any event, you might not want to get him the iconoclastic D&D RPG. Iconoclastic would be image-smashing. You probably meant iconic.
The most important thing to make sure that the book doesn't end up forgotten in a corner, is that your nephew has the opportunity to collect a group of friends to play the game with (possibly with his cool uncle as the GM)?
If he likes Pathfinder, get him Pathfinder. The Dragon Age boxed set is also a good choice - it's got a very Basic D&D boxed set feel to it.
In any event, you might not want to get him the iconoclastic D&D RPG. Iconoclastic would be image-smashing. You probably meant iconic.
Beat me to it. I was too busy wiping the nasal spray of the energy soda that ended up on my monitor. ;)
If you want the iconic boxed set, it's still available on eBay. :)
yeah, my bad. was distracted by trying to buy a house, so i used the wrong word... although you have to admit, iconoclastic does sound cool.
If Pathfinder is what he wants don't get him D&D. That's not what he wants. By that I mean you say he tried Pathfinder and enjoyed it at the convention then that's what he knows and will get the most out of it.
If you were to get him D&D book it's taking you chances. He may like it or not. You already know he like Pathfinder.
Maybe if you have chance see if game of 4E is running at Game shop and see if you can join it with your nephew. Then ask him which he wants.
How did your nephew come to ask for Pathfinder by name? Does he have friends who play?
Honestly — and no edition war please — I would turn to 4e for younger kinds BUT 11 is pushing Pathfinder age IMO.
It really depends on whether he is exhibiting a preference for some reason or is he just modeling behavior on adults he's seen playing PF. If he has friends playing PF, then there's no contest.
Under a certain age kids are so creative that any game just becomes fodder for their imaginations. 2e was much too advanced for me when I was 8, but that didn't stop it from getting absorbed into my general play world and cursing me to become the wretched specimen of adulthood I am today.
Anyway, get him the game he can play with other kids. That's the right game.
Shame the birthday isn't arriving around the time of the anticipated Pathfinder intro box set. Perhaps Christmas?
he asked for pathfinder by name because that is what i play, and what i ran at the convention.
maybe i should find him something more age appropraite and something specific for him and i, since i am the only one who plays this with him. although i could tell him to invite some friends over the next time i see him, and i could introduce him and his friends to roleplaying.
im thinking something more age appropriate would be something like gurps, or shadowrun. i say shadowrun because i know my nephew, he loves first person shooters and i could easily make a zombie campaign where he just runs through, shooting zombies, and laughing about it. Gurps because when i played it with him, it was a very simple system, very simple setup. within 15 min i had figured out the stats and rules...
My boyfriend has a twelve year old nephew. I am running his first RP game tomorrow night. I dropped off the Core Rulebook and the APG at his mom's house two weeks ago.
When we went out to dinner for the boyfriend's birthday, the spawn started asking me questions the moment I sat down, and continued until after we parted ways about three hours later.
He is playing an half-elf cleric of Nethys/alchemist.
I think 11 is perfectly fine for Pathfinder. Yes, the rules aren't the simplest, but if he has a handy GM reference for an uncle, that means he will read the books, and have to think about them. To me I don't see a downside.
Get him Pathfinder because that is what he asked for. I started with AD&D 2nd edition and was sucked in really fast. I go that same sense with 3.0 but not with 4th or Essentials.
When I picked up Pathfinder and started reading... all of that immense anticapation to play and test my character came back.
Might just be me though. My rec is to get him Pathfinder Core Rulebook.
I got friends for X-Mas this year 2 Pathfinder corebooks, 2 APGs and 1 Bestiary. They make great gifts...and I usualy give gaming books as presents to those who I buy presents for that are gamers. They do make great gifts for gamers.
If he has played and enjoy Pathfinder than I say get him the book. As to himn using it...run a game he is in. Maybe it is a solo game...or include his friends and family members if you can. He get a use out of it. And it will give you guys something to do.
As for if he is old enough..I don't know him so I can't judge it...but if he has played before I think he is is old enough.
yeah, my bad. was distracted by trying to buy a house, so i used the wrong word... although you have to admit, iconoclastic does sound cool.
And accurate.
Sometimes the wrong word is the right word. :D
he asked for pathfinder by name because that is what i play, and what i ran at the convention.
maybe i should find him something more age appropraite and something specific for him and i, since i am the only one who plays this with him. although i could tell him to invite some friends over the next time i see him, and i could introduce him and his friends to roleplaying.
im thinking something more age appropriate would be something like gurps, or shadowrun. i say shadowrun because i know my nephew, he loves first person shooters and i could easily make a zombie campaign where he just runs through, shooting zombies, and laughing about it. Gurps because when i played it with him, it was a very simple system, very simple setup. within 15 min i had figured out the stats and rules...
This could be a valuable time to introduce him to the idea that exists more than one RPG and that they have different strengths.
Some people who needed that lesson seem to have lacked a role model such as you.
I think you should consider all of your options, then, don't limit it to Pathfinder. If he only suggested Pathfinder because of an experience playing with you, he is likely to accept any game that meets your approval.
I would get him a gift card for the value of the book and a set of dice (plus tax) and then bring him to the store so he can buy them himself. I know that one of the things I always enjoy is buying a new RPG book. Even when I was 8, being the one to pay for the book that I wanted was so much fun. It felt more personal since it was my purchase.
Being 11, D&D probably wouldn't hold the sentimental value for him that it holds for us older (does 30 count as "older?") gamers, so I would pass on getting him classic D&D material. As mentioned, 4E is a good choice for younger gamers who might not be able to juggle rules in their heads as well as adults, but if he wants PF, I'd say get him PF.
yeah, my bad. was distracted by trying to buy a house, so i used the wrong word... although you have to admit, iconoclastic does sound cool.
And accurate.
Sometimes the wrong word is the right word. :D
But you have a much different agenda than he has with that word usage. I have no illusions as to why you'd say it was the right word. I might even agree with you, too. :P
Has he looked at your books by chance?
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The Core Rulebook doesn't strike me as particularly age-inappropriate. The Bestiary, sure... but the Core Rulebook should be fine for an 11 year old.
I would say, if thet's what he's excited about, get him what he's excited about.
Surely you didn't come to the Pathfinder forum to ask "My nephew wants a Pathfinder book, should I get him D&D instead?" and have people reply, "Yeah, get him D&D!" :-p
does 30 count as "older?"
No, get off my lawn you whippersnapper.
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i have a nephew who is turning 11 this weekend. and he asked, for a bday gift, a pathfinder book. While i sit here and think on perhaps buying him one, i question myself "should his first book into rpgs be pathfinder? or should it be the iconoclastic Dungeons and Dragons rpg?"
I know that receiving your first rpg book is a HUGE thing for us RPG gamers. I remember with fondness purchasing my first AD&D PHB. It was awesome! i loved it! "with this, i can do ANYTHING!" is what i felt. Granted, i didnt get involved with DnD until i was 14/15, but still, a big thing.
But with my nephew its different. He loves to play rpgs, but on the computer. he loves fps. I took him to a gaming convention at the end of feburary, and he enjoyed it. he had alot of fun playing pathfinder, and playing gurps with me, but he didnt get into dark heresy. Ive purchased gifts for him in the past, thinking he would love them, but 2 days later i find them stuffed in random places, forgotten.So, should the first rpg for a new young player be pathfinder, or should it be something different?
If your nephew loves literature and/or fantasy worlds, then for me it's a no-brainer to get him Pathfinder. The first pages alone, and the descriptive text at the beginning of each class description, suggest so much possibility that he will just get excited to jump in. Like you said: "With this, I can do ANYTHING!" I think this is the most important element of providing him a good introduction to roleplaying. And when there's a will, there's a way.
As for being intimidated by the rules crunch, I would emphasize to him that he doesn't need to get all the rules right and should just have fun. In fact, I'm guessing that if he had fun playing PF at the convention, then from his point of view he's already thinking that he just needs something "approximating" that experience, which wasn't the rules but the overall excitement and creativity that roleplaying games make possible.
Also, consider guiding him through some of the basics that someone running the game would need to know, such as standard actions / move actions / 5-foot steps, etc. Also, maybe give him Crypt of the Everflame, a good introductory module for GMs and players. Published modules, since they refer only to specific rules when they arise, are less intimidating -- and they illustrate how to run an adventure more than the Core Rulebook does.
I stared "gaming" around the 3rd grade. Found an old copy of the stater box my folks got as a wedding gift. Tried it out with a friend... didn't fully get it and moved on to HeroQuest. Then in middle school picked up 2e D&D. Not just 2e but all the Players Option books, no issues. At least Pathfinder has fairly consistent internal rules. Yes it will be a challenge for him... but in a mind expanding way. Along with a good reason to learn how to use a spreadsheet when "building" characters.
I've been a quite advocate of getting kids RPG books over video games for a long time. I say give. Although if your on good terms with your Brother/Sister I'd quitely talk with them over you nephew's head about how they feel. If you arent on good terms send it anyways :P .
While some of the art and internal material can seem dicey for there "poor innocent minds" it isn't really that damaging. Midnight Adult Swim on Cartoon Network can be worse for kids of lax parents. Then there are those video games again. I know 8 year olds who play Call of Duty online on their Xboxs. What do you think would be worse for mental development? Some beautiful if more mature art and written themes, or CoD online? If your answer is Pathfinder material I dare you to go on YouTube and look up any video with "kid rage" related to video games.
He asked for PF and you want to buy D&D?
Let me ask you this: As a kid, did you ever ask for, say Transformers, only to have your grandmother (who is oblivious about this sort of thing) buy you a Transmorpher? Were you disappointed by getting off-brand stuff?
So there you have it: Don't buy the poor guy Transmorpher D&D when he wanted Transformer Pathfinder! :)
although you have to admit, iconoclastic does sound cool.
Sure does. So does pyroclastic. Clastic by itself not so much, though.
yeah, my bad. was distracted by trying to buy a house, so i used the wrong word... although you have to admit, iconoclastic does sound cool.
And accurate.
Sometimes the wrong word is the right word. :D
That's quite insightful.
Dewn (may I call you Dewn? Well, I'll just call you Dewn, regardless of what you say, so you don't need to bother forbidding it, anyway :P), D&D is indeed considered iconoclastic by many.
Pathfinder is quite iconic, as it tries to preserve a lot of the spirit of the game and the myths and legends the game... borrowed from.
So in your distractedness, you spoke true. Very Malkavian! :)
If he had fun playing Pathfinder, and wants a Pathfinder Core Rulebook, that's what I'd buy him.
KaeYoss has a good point - when I asked for Transformers, and got Go-Bots, I wasn't thrilled.
When I asked for Lego, and got Brix Blox (Sears knock-off brand), I wasn't thrilled.
11 years old isn't all that young when it comes to something like this...
I would say get him Pathfinder since he asked for it. Plus, he also played Pathfinder and GURPS with you, so he nows there are more games out there.
Plus, if he stays interested in RPGs, he'l check out other games son enough. So for now, get him what he wants - that will make him happier and most likely keep him interested in RPGs.
From the sound of it he has seen your books.
Get him Pathfinder, and help him learn. Create...ANOTHER GAMER!
Mwhahahahahaha...ahem.
My first set was the basic D&D box and I was 10 years old. It was great and then we graduated to Advanced D&D. Since your nephew is very young, get him started on Pathfinder. Kids absorb like a sponge and will pick it up quickly.
Be aware! If he is playing video games, they advance their characters and story line a lot faster than books do. Also, you usually only play once a week at the most. With video games, you can play at anytime and as long as you wish. Good luck!
I've got 4 kids, 24, 17, 10, and 6. (yes, they all game (ok, the 24yo is busy with school and doesn't want to game w/ her sib's)) They know if I try to slide 'em a "generic" and aren't amused. Now, I'll grant you they *are* interested in trying other systems - my son likes the look of the old WEG d6SWRPG, for instance. But if one declares "I wanna play Car Wars," then trying to play Pathfinder ain't gonna cut it - *this* time.
If he's played more than one system and has expressed a preference for a given system - regardless of reasoning behind the choice (altho the whole "I wanna be kewl like Uncle Dewn!" is music to my ears) - hand the lad his preference and use it as the intro point. "So you know how PF works and you know how GURPS works. Let me introduce you to Traveller/Shadowrun/d6/etc." Different games, different styles, different strengths/weaknesses.
And who knows what he'll ask for come Christmas...
(for the record - Go-bots SUCKED and Mega-bloks ain't no Legos!)
eta:And if you guys are in central Louisiana, let me know and we can get some young gamers together.
I've got 4 kids, 24, 17, 10, and 6.
You must really love having little kids around.
Whatever you buy, don't forget a set of dice. Even if they are cheap grab-bag dice from your FLGS, a gamer needs his own dice.
I've got 4 kids, 24, 17, 10, and 6.You must really love having little kids around.
or something!
}:D
11 is not too young. 11 was about the age I was when I got the AD&D GMs guide. Because I was interested in the subject, anything that I didn't understand (words, concepts) I kept pouring over until I understood it (or just looked up the arcane words of Mr. Gygax).
I think that people forget what it was like to be that age. Sure, you remember the wonder of your first gaming experience, but you forget that you wanted to learn and you did learn and that something that might be a little complex for a mind that is ready to absorb knowledge just enriches that mind!
Also remember that at the age of 11 he's too old for teddy bears and too young for women so a shapely figure or a naked breast isn't something alien or traumatizing to him.