Just out of curiosity-aside from the TPK-machine that is Xanesha, what are some other NPCs/monsters from the APs that people have had great difficulty with/are known for TPK'ing frequently?
Cheers!
Just out of curiosity-aside from the TPK-machine that is Xanesha, what are some other NPCs/monsters from the APs that people have had great difficulty with/are known for TPK'ing frequently?
Cheers!
They populate the SCAP, AOW, and STAP extensively.
The boss for book 2 of Kingmaker could be an issue. The advanced will o wisp is quiet annoying due to its high AC, and to be clear the will o wisp is not the boss of book 2.
There is an imp or quasit in RotRL that is annoying also. I would not mind trying it again after I replaced my first character to see how hard it really was.
Just out of curiosity-aside from the TPK-machine that is Xanesha, what are some other NPCs/monsters from the APs that people have had great difficulty with/are known for TPK'ing frequently?
Cheers!
Spoilered for those who haven't yet played in that AP (RotRL).
A large factor is where she is encountered.
So all of this adds up to just a massive horror show (for most GMs too).
In answer to the OPs question. CotCT (Seven Days to the Grave) has ...
Well, in CotCT we have
Escape from Old Korvosa: Bahor. He has problems dealing damage, but he has no problems hitting and not being hit.
Skeletons of Scarwall: Belshallam. If played well, he does very impressive damage with his breath weapon and can stay out of reach of the melee opponents for a long while.
Archbishop Zev Ravenka: TPK waiting to happen, depending on how the party approaches him.
Crown of Fangs: Queen Ileosa, obviously.
Just out of curiosity-aside from the TPK-machine that is Xanesha, what are some other NPCs/monsters from the APs that people have had great difficulty with/are known for TPK'ing frequently?
Cheers!
For Curse of the Crimson Throne, let's not forget the demilich. He's a good time all around.
Bahor should only be a problem for people who can't be caught flat-footed. He's got the feats to make the average fighter or cleric suck a lot of sneak attack damage.
Alicavniss Vonnarc.
The encounters during the play can definitely add up to a TPK.
The three vampires in the basement of Delvehaven.
The Wriggling Man and the Lesser Jabberwock.
Lesser Jabberwock more because he has 30d6 vital strike touch attack eye lasers.
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I did not find WM that impressive. The other one though is quiet fun to use as a DM. :)
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Oh, yeah I forgot her... Our gm just said no you don't attack her when we tried...
We have played (the first two adventures of) RotR, CotCT and KM yet.
RotR:
Malfeshnekor would have been a TPK, but the PCs fled and as he couldn't leave the room....
Xanesha would have been a TPK if I hadn't closed one and a half eye! (Can I say this in English?) You can read the whole story here.
CotCT:
Lady Adaisin was very tough, but far from a TPK due to several criticals.
KM:
Hargulka was very, very tough slaying three of five PCs. The two PCs could just escape with magical aid.
If half the party hadn't run in CoT
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that was us, it was two or three rounds (back in 2008/09) bit of fuzzy memory.
Serpent's Skull:
I'm surprised no one has mentioned...
Yeah, but as written she's supposed to fight the PCs for 3 rounds and then retreat. No biggie.I'm surprised no one has mentioned...
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Heh - I didn't realize that. I'm a player in that game and we killed her by the end of round 3. Of course, being a "Pathfinder" paladin helped matters greatly. Xanesha was far, far worse in our experience.
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Heh - I didn't realize that. I'm a player in that game and we killed her by the end of round 3. Of course, being a "Pathfinder" paladin helped matters greatly. Xanesha was far, far worse in our experience.Yeah, but as written she's supposed to fight the PCs for 3 rounds and then retreat. No biggie.I'm surprised no one has mentioned...
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I ran that encounter for my group of PF characters and by round 3 I would retreat even if the AP didn't tell me to do so :)
Xanesha has something of a legendary status when it comes to making grown men and women cry.
Heh - I didn't realize that. I'm a player in that game and we killed her by the end of round 3. Of course, being a "Pathfinder" paladin helped matters greatly.
My character did as well, though I imagined that was rather unusual. I'm curious how you managed it; care to elaborate?
Heh - I didn't realize that. I'm a player in that game and we killed her by the end of round 3. Of course, being a "Pathfinder" paladin helped matters greatly.My character did as well, though I imagined that was rather unusual. I'm curious how you managed it; care to elaborate?
We did it with a raging, power attacking, vital striking, greataxe-wielding barbarian and a fire-optimized dragon disciple. Also, APG spell Blessing of Fervor helped as well. Our barbarian, already with a massive movement, used the extra movement from Blessing of Fervor to catch up.
Also, it doesn't hurt when the GM forgets spell resistance.
Also, it doesn't hurt when the GM forgets spell resistance.
Heh. Yeah, I imagine that'd help. Figuring her SR was likely sky high is the reason I didn't even bother trying to cast spells directly at the Mother of Oblivion.
Now I'm curious to know how many groups eschewed the AP's intended early end to the battle and instead defeating the Mother of Oblivion outright; a challenge with a CR approximately 7-8 higher than appropriately levelled adventuring groups. And conversely, how many died in the tentacles of Black Magga?
Heh - I didn't realize that. I'm a player in that game and we killed her by the end of round 3. Of course, being a "Pathfinder" paladin helped matters greatly.My character did as well, though I imagined that was rather unusual. I'm curious how you managed it; care to elaborate?
It helped that my Ranger/Paladin landed a crit in the first round amongst a volley of arrows. I was doing 1d8 + 3 (magic) + 6 (STR) + 6 (deadly aim) + 12 (smite) for a total of 3d8+81. I think it ended up being 95 damage (which also ignores DR).
Once I was grabbed in the next round, our cleric used his freedom of movement ability (travel domain, I think) to free me up to make a full attack with my falchion and I landed at least one more crit (needing only 15s now). There rest of the party was mostly arcane casters and although they had a tough time with SR, they did land a couple spells which did damage. When I made another full attack on round 3, it went down.
Also, it doesn't hurt when the GM forgets spell resistance.Heh. Yeah, I imagine that'd help. Figuring her SR was likely sky high is the reason I didn't even bother trying to cast spells directly at the Mother of Oblivion.
Now I'm curious to know how many groups eschewed the AP's intended early end to the battle and instead defeating the Mother of Oblivion outright; a challenge with a CR approximately 7-8 higher than appropriately levelled adventuring groups. And conversely, how many died in the tentacles of Black Magga?
I know that in Aubrey's PbP on these boards his party dropped the church spire on her..
For my part from playing or running these:
Age of Worms- (Spoilers)
Savage Tide- (Spoilers)
RotR- (Spoilers)
only to confront her again and barely succeed. Against her, you have no idea what you're really up against until it's too late. (I had a blast running her.)
I hate to say it, but it seems like the near legendary, TPK badass that used to warrant dozens of posts in the eariler paths hasn't made its mark in some time. Spoilers for CotCT, LoF, CoT-
In Crimson throne, very few individual fights are the stuff of nightmares. Sure, the Nosferatu in book #7 and the Zon-Kuthonites from
book #4 could be TPK material, except you aren't necessarily supposed to fight them which takes them out of contention. Scarwall has some nasty undead to be sure, but none of them, with the possible exception of the Demi-Lich (and that's only an extemely unlucky or ill-prepared party) are really TPK material.
Moving onto LoF, any party that knows what they're up against and doesn't just march directly to him is going to mop Ghartok; his AC and HP are too low to contend with any mass DPS'er at 7th level. Besides this, the Sepid Div comes closest to TPK material. The Div is nasty just because it's location in module #23 makes it an unexpected encounter, though really, its the autodamage ability that gets some parties. However parties don't necessary have to fight it; they can pass by it and not even know of its existence unless they're totally thorough with the dungeon. Beyond that, the Azi seem like they could be nasty monsters, except they aren't featured in the core path. Oh well.
Finally, with Council, nothing other than the Triceratops in #27, really stands out as a nail biter, and due to the number of parties that have nerfed it with Command Undead, isn't really that terrible. Liebdaga comes a little closer, but a party that has everything the module gives him should have no problem dealing with him. I'm not sure enough people have made it to the end to see if Malvengian, Eccardian, and Chammady can't kill a few PCs. (I'll hopefully know soon)
It seems almost like since Runelords, the difficulty of the Paths has gone down quite a bit. For example, in Runelords: (Spoiler)
Not only is Xanesha nasty, but so is retaking Fort Rannik (Pappy and Dorella make a nasty duo), as well as the fights against Mokmurian, Gamigin, Ghlorafaex, High Ceoptera, and of course the Rune Giants.
Hey Paizo, How about upping the difficulty and giving us a few more PC chewing monstrosities??
It helped that my Ranger/Paladin landed a crit in the first round amongst a volley of arrows. I was doing 1d8 + 3 (magic) + 6 (STR) + 6 (deadly aim) + 12 (smite) for a total of 3d8+81. I think it ended up being 95 damage (which also ignores DR).Impressive. I figured that, between her über AC, mountain of hit points and SR, that trying to whittle her down with conventional attacks would be futile. So instead I came up with the tactic of taking her down with ability damage instead. To that end, my sorcerer summoned five shadows, hasted them and then surprised the MoO by having them emerge from the dam's surface right on top of her. She was surprised and then lost initiative and so suffered 12 touch attacks (some missed) each dealing 1d6 Strength. She was dead before her action on the second round. The party members just watched from a safe distance near the end of the dam.
I know that in Aubrey's PbP on these boards his party dropped the church spire on her..How'd they manage that?
Xanesha. Again, the threads speak for themselves. Against her, you have no idea what you're really up against until it's too late.
Heh, my players are still griping about those wolves in AoW the Whispering Cairn. The first combat of the game and three freaking wolves get the initiative and knock the paladin and the mage flat and then proceed to tear into those guys like fresh hamburger. Still makes me laugh.
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Heh, my players are still griping about those wolves in AoW the Whispering Cairn. The first combat of the game and three freaking wolves get the initiative and knock the paladin and the mage flat and then proceed to tear into those guys like fresh hamburger. Still makes me laugh.
All the talk in AoW appears to be centred upon the Mindflayer. The difference with that encounter is that his presence is well telegraphed ahead of time and the PCs have ample opportunities to prepare for him (and for casters to choose support spells appropriate for taking him on, too).
More AoW I forgot about:
-Three Faces of Evil: The whole Hextor wing. Ran a group through this with
two TPKs
-Spire of Long Shadows: Swords of Kyuss. I think one encounter has three of them. They win init... take 42d6 negative energy. Better have those Death Wards up!!
-Kings of the RIft: Xyzanth. As he's written, you're supposed to attack the party in its sleep... with this Wyrm Fang Dragon. An utter killing machine.
-Into the Wormcrawl: The Wormdrake. Give an already horrific monster the ability to use Gate (Balor? Why not??) and the ability to summon 1d4 Frostworms and what you have could be called the "Battle of Exploding Monsters". Never mind its other Spell-likes and two different breath weapons...
-Dawn of a New Age: The Broodfiends, cause 2d8 Int Drain a hit can kill some PCs in a single hit. Also, the leader of the Kyuss Knights (Marilee) is a real killer. Vorpal for the win.
Also.. More Savage Tide:
-The Brain Collector from Golismorga.
-Kala from City of Broken Idols.
-Lilianth (Legendery Leader Marilith) from Into the Maw
-Red Fang from Enemies of my Enemy.Also Major Endrin and his Dino-Riders.
Nothing like being incredibly strong, large sized, having a lance, and Spirited Charge to boot. I remember our Cleric got Critically speared for like 180 damage. Dead in one hit.
-Arendagrost from Prince of Demons.
...Good times.
QUOTE="DM Wellard"]I know that in Aubrey's PbP on these boards his party dropped the church spire on her..How'd they manage that?
Enlarged Barbarian with Bulls strength on him toppled the already weakened tower onto her..Epic