Not a druid or ranger animal companion, not a paladin or cavalier mount, just a plain old cleric of Iomedae wanting a trained heavy warhorse.
So now what? I find it hard to believe that something as simple as "heavy warhorse" is SO borked in Pathfinder! The Guide says if you buy a Core Rulebook "combat trained heavy horse", all it does is "come trained to bear a rider into combat", which itself is vague. Does my 300gp buy all 6 tricks listed under "combat trained" in the Handle Animal entry or not? How many attacks does it get, and at what to hit and damage (I'm assuming bite/hoof/hoof are all primary attacks for +5 to hit and 1d4+5/1d6+5/1d6+5 damage)? Does my combat trained heavy horse have Armor Proficiencies or not? How can it gain any if not? I assume that if I armor the horse up without the feat, it'll just take the armor check penalty to hit as well as skill checks, so who cares?
Since it's only got 2HD (and 19hp) and is not any kind of special critter, it'll never gain HD and therefore feats, so I can't see any way the clasical "heavy warhorse in plate barding" can be possible without it belonging to a cavalier, ranger, druid or paladin. The Mounted Combat feat seems pretty useless for people with bog-standard mounts.
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As far as I understand a war horse is a combat trained advanced horse.
It does not gain any armor proficiency, so barding improves defense at a cost to offense, but since a 2HD horse is not going to make mutch of a difference in combat, by the time you can afford plate barding, who cares.
The attacks and dmg you list are correct.
Regional Venture-Coordinator, Baltic
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As far as I understand a war horse is a combat trained advanced horse.
It does not gain any armor proficiency, so barding improves defense at a cost to offense, but since a 2HD horse is not going to make mutch of a difference in combat, by the time you can afford plate barding, who cares.
The attacks and dmg you list are correct.
There's a post here where James Jacobs says some interesting things. Don't know if his swapping feats is Society approved though.
Thanks for linking that. Unfortunately, in doing a search of the forums I ran across a FAQ entry or a post by Jason (I forget which) that essentially calls that a house rule.
The Advanced Creature template is nice, but I feel it's a poor substitute for Heavy Horses and Ghasts. Not bumping the HD of a 2 HD critter makes these two examples very weak as compared to their 3.X ed counterparts.
At any rate, I'm going to assume that 300gp gets me a 19hp horse without Armor Proficiencies (but with all 6 tricks listed and the attacks outlined in my original post), and therefore avoid one after all. Which makes me a little sad.
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There's a post here where James Jacobs says some interesting things. Don't know if his swapping feats is Society approved though.
Great that you found that. I thought I remembered about the light armor bit.
As for swapping feats as PFS legal, I seriously doubt that will ever happen... far to many "ifs" behind that door, I fear.
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Great that you found that. I thought I remembered about the light armor bit.
As for swapping feats as PFS legal, I seriously doubt that will ever happen... far to many "ifs" behind that door, I fear.
What has been clarified in the FAQ is that combat training does not grant any armor proficiency. James said one think in the referenced thread and later retracted it. I'm not sure which you were talking about, Diego; I'm clarifying for other readers more than anything.
The heavy warhorse in full plate barding is very possible in PFS. Proficiency isn't required for wearing the armor at all. Suit up and have fun; your cleric's mount is good to go.
As for horses with swapped out feats, the way I would expect this to be handled in PFS would be for the horse to appear as a reward on a chronicle sheet.
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What I meant to say was:
Heavy warhorses are advanced horses with combat training as described in the Handle Animals section.Jason confirmed that.
Jason also stated that combat traine animals should have light armor proficiency. It might be errated at a later point, but is not yet part of the PRPG and therefore not PFS legal either.
Jason said it was reasonable for GMs to swap feats. Hyrum is the GM, so unless he gets into this it is not PFS legal.
As for horses with swapped out feats, the way I would expect this to be handled in PFS would be for the horse to appear as a reward on a chronicle sheet.
...and that is actually a brilliant idea :)
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As for horses with swapped out feats, the way I would expect this to be handled in PFS would be for the horse to appear as a reward on a chronicle sheet....and that is actually a brilliant idea :)
+1
Especially since I just played a brand new year two mod and not a single thing was listed on the scenerio sheet that isn't always available to players. None of my current characters need a warhorse, but that isn't the point, just the fact that it would be something not available elsewhere for those who might want a warhorse is the point.
Well, I figured out how to get a heavy warhorse in HeroLab, and it has the proper stats and prices for barding etc, but I just can't get around that "19 hit point is all you'll ever get" problem. Much less spending upwards of 1000+ gp to pump the AC for what ammounts to an expendible mount, High AC/Mounted Combat soak-a-hit not withstanding.
I was hoping for something to help with my gods-awful 20' movement speed, not so much the extra help in melee, as well as looking for another use for the Weapon Master 8th level ability prereq/gateway feat of Mounted Combat.
I guess I'll pick something else and save up for Boots of Speed/Striding & Springing.
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Well, I figured out how to get a heavy warhorse in HeroLab, and it has the proper stats and prices for barding etc, but I just can't get around that "19 hit point is all you'll ever get" problem. Much less spending upwards of 1000+ gp to pump the AC for what ammounts to an expendible mount, High AC/Mounted Combat soak-a-hit not withstanding.
I was hoping for something to help with my gods-awful 20' movement speed, not so much the extra help in melee, as well as looking for another use for the Weapon Master 8th level ability prereq/gateway feat of Mounted Combat.
I guess I'll pick something else and save up for Boots of Speed/Striding & Springing.
Figurine of Wondours Power, Bronze Griffon or Ebony Fly? Or are those too much?
Natertot
NYC
Ebony Fly is the size of a pony, so no medium characters can mount it.
You, sir, are a sick, sick man.
Well if the cleric worshiped a different deity he could take the Animal domain and get an animal companion later on. Though that would mean a total revamp of the character.
Just throwing that out there.