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Yup!


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Orthos wrote:
Likely, this was about 8 to 11 EST.

I was reading my newly purchased PDF of Seven Days to the Grave didn't get too far into it, seems really good what i've read:-)

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
Tacticslion wrote:
Yup!

I can't sleep naked. Too uncomfortable.


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Orthos wrote:

So I spent about three hours last night RPing my NWN character going through surgery after an erinyes shattered her shoulder with a greensteel arrow. Some of the most intense interaction I've ever had, and it pretty much involved me sitting in a chair mumbling incoherently from time to time while three other characters were constantly rolling to pick pieces out of the ground beef that used to be my arm before the shrapnel spread too far.

And then today we need to sit down and analyze the contract she gave me before shooting me, see if we can pick out any useful information that might help us in the upcoming quest tonight, before she wipes a town off the map with her undead army.

Things like this are why I keep coming back to this game.

sounds well played. Is this tabletop or on the server?


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TriOmegaZero wrote:
Tacticslion wrote:
Yup!
I can't sleep naked. Too uncomfortable.

I prefer to sleep naked.


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I sleep in my boxers. >__>


Well I'm uncomfortable...

>.>
EDIT: OOOOOOoooooh, never-mind! Got it. It was something I'd sat on.
:D


Orthos wrote:

So I spent about three hours last night RPing my NWN character going through surgery after an erinyes shattered her shoulder with a greensteel arrow. Some of the most intense interaction I've ever had, and it pretty much involved me sitting in a chair mumbling incoherently from time to time while three other characters were constantly rolling to pick pieces out of the ground beef that used to be my arm before the shrapnel spread too far.

And then today we need to sit down and analyze the contract she gave me before shooting me, see if we can pick out any useful information that might help us in the upcoming quest tonight, before she wipes a town off the map with her undead army.

Things like this are why I keep coming back to this game.

Freehold DM wrote:
sounds well played. Is this tabletop or on the server?

I'd guess server? That seemed to be the implication. Is there a table-top variant or supplement to it?


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So NWN is NeverWinter Nights?
Forgotten Realms, yes?


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Also in winter I Sleep in long johns, summers are nekkid:)


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Freehold DM wrote:
Orthos wrote:

So I spent about three hours last night RPing my NWN character going through surgery after an erinyes shattered her shoulder with a greensteel arrow. Some of the most intense interaction I've ever had, and it pretty much involved me sitting in a chair mumbling incoherently from time to time while three other characters were constantly rolling to pick pieces out of the ground beef that used to be my arm before the shrapnel spread too far.

And then today we need to sit down and analyze the contract she gave me before shooting me, see if we can pick out any useful information that might help us in the upcoming quest tonight, before she wipes a town off the map with her undead army.

Things like this are why I keep coming back to this game.

sounds well played. Is this tabletop or on the server?

Yes, NWN server.

Tacticslion wrote:
Is there a table-top variant or supplement to it?

I've taken a couple dungeons off previous NWN servers (not the one I currently play on though) and adapted them into PnP dungeons in the past. But otherwise no, nothing pre-printed at any rate.

captain yesterday wrote:

So NWN is NeverWinter Nights?

Forgotten Realms, yes?

It doesn't have to be, but the server I play on is FR, yes. I've been on other servers that were set in Planescape or Greyhawk in the past, as well as homebrew settings, and there's nothing stopping someone who's willing to put in the time, effort, and expense from having a server set in Dragonlance, Eberron, Golarion, or any other published setting, or their own custom work.


It's really cool! You should join, and then play with me and the uber-low levels, so we can suck at killing sewer rats together!


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Tacticslion wrote:
It's really cool! You should join, and then play with me and the uber-low levels, so we can suck at killing sewer rats together!

I will investigate.

puts on anti-fr hazmat suit, turns on head flashlight


They ignore a lot of caaaaaaaanooooooon~!


LordSynos wrote:
** spoiler omitted **

Not a parent, but I've worked with small kids from time to time, and the thing I would say is talk to him a lot and read stuff to him - especially pointing-books, as they help with learning what different stuff is called. Singing is good, too - basically anything that exposes him to how you use your language.


Tacticslion wrote:
They ignore a lot of caaaaaaaanooooooon~!

if there's no Elminster or Drizzt, I'm down.


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Freehold DM wrote:
Tacticslion wrote:
They ignore a lot of caaaaaaaanooooooon~!
if there's no Elminster or Drizzt, I'm down.

They exist, but their activity on the server is pretty nonexistent. We're set in Cormyr, far away from where Drizzt hangs out; we're eventually going to get Shadowdale added, but the DMs are pretty averse to making much use of Elminster or other NPCs of that sort of caliber, most of the time.

Silver Crusade

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Did you hear about the new FR book "Drizz and the condemned housing project"...I heard he steps on a rusty nail.


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Tin Foil Yamakah wrote:
Did you hear about the new FR book "Drizz and the condemned housing project"...I heard he steps on a rusty nail.

I already saw Drizzt in the hood . I wanted to see a sequel.


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Turmish would be fun, or maybe around The Great Rift:-)


Turmish is awesome. One of our favorite characters comes from there (the sister of one of the PCs in a 4E game).


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Tacticslion wrote:
They ignore a lot of caaaaaaaanooooooon~!

Wait, which one gets loaded into the Cannon first, I got a match:-)


On Monday, Origin had Dragon Age Inquisition 33% off. I bit, but I didn't get any good game time until yesterday. It's fun, but I feel like my destruction mage (my spells are all elemental damage dealing, and I have multiple elements and spare staffs of other elements than my main staff so I don't get blocked off by resistances) is really, really powerful. If I switch to Cassandra, I feel useless. Can't do anything close to the damage my mage can. Varric is worse.

Silver Crusade

Friday May 29 Saxon and Armoured Saint. I am so there


Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
On Monday, Origin had Dragon Age Inquisition 33% off. I bit, but I didn't get any good game time until yesterday. It's fun, but I feel like my destruction mage (my spells are all elemental damage dealing, and I have multiple elements and spare staffs of other elements than my main staff so I don't get blocked off by resistances) is really, really powerful. If I switch to Cassandra, I feel useless. Can't do anything close to the damage my mage can. Varric is worse.

Well, Cassandra is flipping useless, so there's that. Have you leveled them at all? Or is it just because your PC levels faster than they do? It's not because you're playing a mage though. I've tried mage and fighter and it's pretty much the same. Your PC is way more badass and it becomes a problem if you forget to level your party. At least until you start picking up some more badass companions along the way. Not that I'm really all that terribly far into it. I get motion sick when I play so I have to play in very short increments so I don't exactly make progress quickly. And many of those quests are just so gorram frustrating. I hate having to wander around looking for random stuff. That's just the worst. But I want to find out the story so I keep muddling through....sigh. Is gonna take forever....

Silver Crusade

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And its in San Jose, so I can introduce my two high school buddies to the wonders that is bon Chon chicken.


lynora wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
On Monday, Origin had Dragon Age Inquisition 33% off. I bit, but I didn't get any good game time until yesterday. It's fun, but I feel like my destruction mage (my spells are all elemental damage dealing, and I have multiple elements and spare staffs of other elements than my main staff so I don't get blocked off by resistances) is really, really powerful. If I switch to Cassandra, I feel useless. Can't do anything close to the damage my mage can. Varric is worse.
Well, Cassandra is flipping useless, so there's that. Have you leveled them at all? Or is it just because your PC levels faster than they do? It's not because you're playing a mage though. I've tried mage and fighter and it's pretty much the same. Your PC is way more badass and it becomes a problem if you forget to level your party. At least until you start picking up some more badass companions along the way. Not that I'm really all that terribly far into it. I get motion sick when I play so I have to play in very short increments so I don't exactly make progress quickly. And many of those quests are just so gorram frustrating. I hate having to wander around looking for random stuff. That's just the worst. But I want to find out the story so I keep muddling through....sigh. Is gonna take forever....

so dragon age continues with the "PC mage >>> NPC mage" tradition? Unfortunate...


Tin Foil Yamakah wrote:
And its in San Jose, so I can introduce my two high school buddies to the wonders that is bon Chon chicken.

EPIC FISTBUMP OF DELICIOUSNESS


Freehold DM wrote:
Tin Foil Yamakah wrote:
Did you hear about the new FR book "Drizz and the condemned housing project"...I heard he steps on a rusty nail.
I already saw Drizzt in the hood . I wanted to see a sequel.

Ha, I've got that on DVD.


Freehold DM wrote:
lynora wrote:
Kelsey Arwen MacAilbert wrote:
On Monday, Origin had Dragon Age Inquisition 33% off. I bit, but I didn't get any good game time until yesterday. It's fun, but I feel like my destruction mage (my spells are all elemental damage dealing, and I have multiple elements and spare staffs of other elements than my main staff so I don't get blocked off by resistances) is really, really powerful. If I switch to Cassandra, I feel useless. Can't do anything close to the damage my mage can. Varric is worse.
Well, Cassandra is flipping useless, so there's that. Have you leveled them at all? Or is it just because your PC levels faster than they do? It's not because you're playing a mage though. I've tried mage and fighter and it's pretty much the same. Your PC is way more badass and it becomes a problem if you forget to level your party. At least until you start picking up some more badass companions along the way. Not that I'm really all that terribly far into it. I get motion sick when I play so I have to play in very short increments so I don't exactly make progress quickly. And many of those quests are just so gorram frustrating. I hate having to wander around looking for random stuff. That's just the worst. But I want to find out the story so I keep muddling through....sigh. Is gonna take forever....
so dragon age continues with the "PC mage >>> NPC mage" tradition? Unfortunate...

Name me one game where an NPC cohort/AI-controlled party member was ever allowed to be better than a PC who used the same/similar abilities, and that NPC did not turn out to either be a super-temporary teammate for storyline purposes, a villain in hiding, or both.


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Final Fantasy Tactics
EDIT: Okay, okay, I re-read and you specified "AI-controlled" which doesn't actually cover FFT very well at all, as you control everyone on the team... sort of. There are multiple instances where AI-controlled is temporary, and later the NPC cohort becomes part of the party and they were always and remain more powerful (in many ways, at any rate) than the primary protagonist. This isn't actually a bad thing in that game.


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Tacticslion wrote:

Final Fantasy Tactics

EDIT: Okay, okay, I re-read and you specified "AI-controlled" which doesn't actually cover FFT very well at all, as you control everyone on the team... sort of. There are multiple instances where AI-controlled is temporary, and later the NPC cohort becomes part of the party and they were always and remain more powerful (in many ways, at any rate) than the primary protagonist. This isn't actually a bad thing in that game.

berg-bump

Also, Baldurs Gate.


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Tacticslion wrote:

Final Fantasy Tactics

EDIT: Okay, okay, I re-read and you specified "AI-controlled" which doesn't actually cover FFT very well at all, as you control everyone on the team... sort of. There are multiple instances where AI-controlled is temporary, and later the NPC cohort becomes part of the party and they were always and remain more powerful (in many ways, at any rate) than the primary protagonist. This isn't actually a bad thing in that game.

FFT is more disqualified by the requirement of "a PC who used the same/similar abilities". I'm meaning like comparing a PC mage to the mage NPCs in Neverwinter Nights or Dragon Age will always be better - it's done deliberately so the NPCs don't overshadow the protagonist, and by extent the player.


Freehold DM wrote:
Tacticslion wrote:

Final Fantasy Tactics

EDIT: Okay, okay, I re-read and you specified "AI-controlled" which doesn't actually cover FFT very well at all, as you control everyone on the team... sort of. There are multiple instances where AI-controlled is temporary, and later the NPC cohort becomes part of the party and they were always and remain more powerful (in many ways, at any rate) than the primary protagonist. This isn't actually a bad thing in that game.

berg-bump

Also, Baldurs Gate.

Can you select your protagonist's class in Baldur's Gate? If so, I'd be very surprised to find out that a PC mage is not better than the recruitable NPC mage, PC fighter than NPC fighter, etc.

If you can't choose your class, disqualified as per my previous post.


You can. There are(or were, when I played) several NPC wizards who joined the party that were better than my character. They "fixed" that in BG2.


That seems like a design flaw that would become very irksome to me. If I'm going to play a character of a certain class, I don't want to be shown up by an NPC recruit. Granted nine times out of ten I probably wouldn't recruit someone of the same class as my PC (unless I just really really liked the character) because it would be an unnecessary duplication of abilities in the party, but if the game doesn't give you the option to recruit or not recruit but just adds people to your party based on the storyline I can see how that might not be an option.


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Also, tactics ogre, saga frontier, and fire emblem.


Maybe it's for the best that I haven't played any of those games.

It's one thing to have a recruited ally who's better than you in specific circumstances because they have a different suite of abilities.

It's very much another for them to be better than you at your own schtick, and that would annoy me greatly.


Orthos wrote:
That seems like a design flaw that would become very irksome to me. If I'm going to play a character of a certain class, I don't want to be shown up by an NPC recruit. Granted nine times out of ten I probably wouldn't recruit someone of the same class as my PC (unless I just really really liked the character) because it would be an unnecessary duplication of abilities in the party, but if the game doesn't give you the option to recruit or not recruit but just adds people to your party based on the storyline I can see how that might not be an option.

this was second ed. Ability duplication was necessary to survive.

Moreover, the idea you are putting forthe here seems to be a relatively recent invention. It could all boil down to the fact that you are younger than me and have a different perspective as a result.


Freehold DM wrote:
Orthos wrote:
That seems like a design flaw that would become very irksome to me. If I'm going to play a character of a certain class, I don't want to be shown up by an NPC recruit. Granted nine times out of ten I probably wouldn't recruit someone of the same class as my PC (unless I just really really liked the character) because it would be an unnecessary duplication of abilities in the party, but if the game doesn't give you the option to recruit or not recruit but just adds people to your party based on the storyline I can see how that might not be an option.
this was second ed. Ability duplication was necessary to survive.

I was about to say "Tell that to Planescape: Torment", but then, Torment requires so very little combat to get through.


Orthos wrote:

Maybe it's for the best that I haven't played any of those games.

It's one thing to have a recruited ally who's better than you in specific circumstances because they have a different suite of abilities.

It's very much another for them to be better than you at your own schtick, and that would annoy me greatly.

*shrug* sounds weird to me. Do your characters go around killing anyone who is better than you at what you do? I had to kick someone out of a game who was doing that as part of some strange scheme to be able to charge whatever price he wanted for spellcasting on demand.

With respect to the games, all I can say is that you're missing out.

I have also killed NPC wizards who were supposed to join my party in the first and last games because they were too damn powerful for me to talk to- they had to be taken out. Especially in fire emblem.


Orthos wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
Orthos wrote:
That seems like a design flaw that would become very irksome to me. If I'm going to play a character of a certain class, I don't want to be shown up by an NPC recruit. Granted nine times out of ten I probably wouldn't recruit someone of the same class as my PC (unless I just really really liked the character) because it would be an unnecessary duplication of abilities in the party, but if the game doesn't give you the option to recruit or not recruit but just adds people to your party based on the storyline I can see how that might not be an option.
this was second ed. Ability duplication was necessary to survive.
I was about to say "Tell that to Planescape: Torment", but then, Torment requires so very little combat to get through.

indeed, planescape was in many ways the beginning of character class exclusivity within a party in tabletop gaming.


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Freehold DM wrote:
Orthos wrote:

Maybe it's for the best that I haven't played any of those games.

It's one thing to have a recruited ally who's better than you in specific circumstances because they have a different suite of abilities.

It's very much another for them to be better than you at your own schtick, and that would annoy me greatly.

*shrug* sounds weird to me. Do your characters go around killing anyone who is better than you at what you do? I had to kick someone out of a game who was doing that as part of some strange scheme to be able to charge whatever price he wanted for spellcasting on demand.

Trying to conflate a single-player game experience like Dragon Age or NWN or so forth with a multiplayer experience like D&D/PF or NWN online or anything like that is pretty much impossible. The dynamics are completely different.

That said, our PnP groups do take the time prior to campaign start to try to make sure we aren't stepping on each other's toes and have a balanced party. Likewise when playing with people on NWN online, we (the group of friends I regularly play with) typically try to have different types of PCs available within a certain level range of each other, so that we have a wide variety of skills in the group and someone doesn't tend to feel useless or overridden, though due to the nature of online play it's less manageable than a person-to-person PnP game. Either way, it's not usually a problem we have.

But yeah, when I'm playing a single-player game with a single PC under my control (in contrast to a full party of PCs, like in a console RPG such as Final Fantasy, even though I still try to have a balanced party in those games too, if/when the game storyline allows me to), I typically want my character to be the center of the story and not be overshadowed by NPCs.


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Orthos wrote:
Tacticslion wrote:

Final Fantasy Tactics

EDIT: Okay, okay, I re-read and you specified "AI-controlled" which doesn't actually cover FFT very well at all, as you control everyone on the team... sort of. There are multiple instances where AI-controlled is temporary, and later the NPC cohort becomes part of the party and they were always and remain more powerful (in many ways, at any rate) than the primary protagonist. This isn't actually a bad thing in that game.
FFT is more disqualified by the requirement of "a PC who used the same/similar abilities". I'm meaning like comparing a PC mage to the mage NPCs in Neverwinter Nights or Dragon Age will always be better - it's done deliberately so the NPCs don't overshadow the protagonist, and by extent the player.

It depends. FFT allows any character to choose <most> any classes (with a few notable exceptions). There are a few that come with amazing classes that completely outstrip the Protagonist's role, but (after leveling with those classes) changing both the Protagonist and the Cohort to the same class creates an imbalance in favor of the cohort anyway, due to the lower level benefits having stacked up.

Really, it all boils down to how you want to play the game. It is worth noting, however, that the generic folk you can recruit (as opposed to special ones) are all less than your Protagonist in the same class (and the Protagonist's base "Squire" class is better than anyone else's "Squire" class, outside of a few computer-controlled NPCs, and even then it varies by chapter).

Effectively, though, it doesn't matter - you're in the game to tell the story, and you can do so regardless of who's the most powerful. The Protagonist is more the Nameable Character whose story you follow, instead of "My PC".

Also, if you make the Protagonist too powerful, all of your enemies on the random fields will level to match, so you actually have active incentive to keep him equal to, or even a bit below, the rest of your small army, power-wise (so as to not accidentally over-level), so long as he's survivable.

The Fire Emblem series is similar in that, while the characters cannot switch classes*, they are all working together to tell a singular story. What's more, just as in Tactics, making the Protagonist too powerful levels up everything on the field with him, meaning you want keep your people relatively balanced. (It's also way too easy to become over-reliant on either your Protag, or certain powerful Cohorts, and then you're stuck facing an army of level 12s when all your guys are basically 5s except for those two, and ARG WHY DID I DO THAT, THIS PLAY-THROUGH IS RUINED. It... it's more fun than it sounds, I swear.

It's an interesting set of systems, and I enjoy them a lot.

* Sort of. It's more like they can enter prestige classes. Sort of. It's... hard to explain without unnecessary detail.

Shadow Lodge

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*popcorn*


Ooh! I'll take some!


Well stated.

Orthos, I would like to see you play fire emblem especially. If you can swallow the changes made to the aforementioned prestige class system, that is....


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Tacticslion wrote:
The Fire Emblem series is similar in that, while the characters cannot switch classes*, they are all working together to tell a singular story. What's more, just as in Tactics, making the Protagonist too powerful levels up everything on the field with him, meaning you want keep your people relatively balanced. (It's also way too easy to become over-reliant on either your Protag, or certain powerful Cohorts, and then you're stuck facing an army of level 12s when all your guys are basically 5s except for those two, and ARG WHY DID I DO THAT, THIS PLAY-THROUGH IS RUINED.

has flashbacks


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Freehold DM wrote:
Orthos wrote:
That seems like a design flaw that would become very irksome to me. If I'm going to play a character of a certain class, I don't want to be shown up by an NPC recruit. Granted nine times out of ten I probably wouldn't recruit someone of the same class as my PC (unless I just really really liked the character) because it would be an unnecessary duplication of abilities in the party, but if the game doesn't give you the option to recruit or not recruit but just adds people to your party based on the storyline I can see how that might not be an option.

this was second ed. Ability duplication was necessary to survive.

Moreover, the idea you are putting forthe here seems to be a relatively recent invention. It could all boil down to the fact that you are younger than me and have a different perspective as a result.

I think it's playstyle rather than age because you're younger than I am and I agree with Orthos here. :)


Freehold DM wrote:
Orthos, I would like to see you play fire emblem especially. If you can swallow the changes made to the aforementioned prestige class system, that is....

The main things that keep me out of Fire Emblem are the fact that it's a tactical game system (something I'm still struggling to overcome my aversion to) and the permadeath nature of combat. I'd never get anywhere in an FE game, I can guarantee you, because I'd be constantly restarting to keep people from dying.

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