Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
He'll get better. (If you can, you might want to change the title, for FF readers who don't want spoiled yet)
I was expecting Johnny because it wasn't the clear choice. Well that and with Captain America revving up for release, I figured we might see a resurgance of the Invaders in the books, and Jim Hammond might not want the competition. We knew it wasn't the Thing.
It's kind of ironic that Chris Evans is doing Cap, instead of the Torch, and Fox is trying to reboot the FF franchise
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
Aberrant Templar |
Link
Dead until the writer changes. :-)
Sort of like Superman, Batman, Captain America, Jason Todd, Gwen Stacey, Thing, Thor ... we could fill a whole thread with comic characters who have died and come back.
Kevin Andrew Murphy Contributor |
Or they can do like they did in 1978 and replace him with H.E.R.B.I.E. the robot.
Or they can rotate in the She-Hulk to be the fourth member of their band.
Not like they haven't done this before.
All it will take is a new set of writers and a "re-imagining" (read: retcon) and Johnny Storm will be back no worse for the wear.
Black Dougal |
Or they can do like they did in 1978 and replace him with H.E.R.B.I.E. the robot.
Why in the world did you need to mention that?! I had completely forgotten this for 30 years and now I just experienced a huge disturbance in the force, like a billion voices crying out in pain, and then silenced forever.
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
Kevin Andrew Murphy wrote:Why in the world did you need to mention that?! I had completely forgotten this for 30 years and now I just experienced a huge disturbance in the force, like a billion voices crying out in pain, and then silenced forever.Or they can do like they did in 1978 and replace him with H.E.R.B.I.E. the robot.
Apparently you don't watch Avengers. :-)
Set |
After sending super-villain 'cape-killers' after his wife, brother-in-law and best friend, among a half-dozen other villainous turns of late, I kinda wanted Reed to be the one to take a nap for a year or two, so that, when he inevitably returned, I might be ready to see him as a good-guy again.
I mean, it worked for Hal Jordan and Jean Grey. Death, and a quick retcon, and suddenly they're good guys again. :)
Still, I guess it was obvious that it wasn't going to be Illuminati Reed or Avengers Ben, both of whom have been seen on covers for comics coming out in April.
And killing Sue, after getting rid of Wanda and Janet and Jean, would leave *none* of the original female heroes around. There's the kind of sexism that is pretty much expected from comic books, and then there's 'Hey, why is this team such a sausage-fest? We've got two Wolverines, two Captain Americas, a couple of Thor knock-offs and an entire emotional spectrum worth of Hulks, can't we spare a brother a dame?'
Mikaze |
I mean, it worked for Hal Jordan and Jean Grey. Death, and a quick retcon, and suddenly they're good guys again. :)
The next breakout supervillain:
Genre-savvy and crazy enough to murder superheroes that have gone darkside(or even just seem to have gone there) in the hopes of taking the Marvel(or DC) Universe out of its current dark age.
...of course that would probably just lead to things being darker. Still, there are a lot of heroes from both companies that could really use a karma enema.
Steven Tindall |
Kill them all and reboot the whole universe.
Didn't they try that when they made collasus gay and the FF a bunch of kids, plus the way they rebooted quicksilver and scarlet witch into a creepy insest ridden elitist couple was just not right.
I forget what it was called something like marvel ultimate or something, the worst one was the hippy liberal Thor guy that got his powers from his hammer rather than being an actual God of Thunder.
If thats marvels idea of a reboot then no thanks. Besides pretty soon if sales keep going down then graphic novels are gonna be the new norm and month to month comics will go the way of the newspapers.
Chris Mortika RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16 |
Since Young Allies did not do so well, maybe Firestar could take his place. That would be fun.
Well, Johnny's major contribution to the FF has never been his powers. Yeah, they're a nice visual, and they help keep the entire team from looking like their uniform is, well, uniform, but the major draw of the Fantastic Four is that they're family.
Remember the episodes a few years back, when Sue was going to teach Johnny the responsible, financial side of being one of the four shareholders of FF, Inc? Those were great stories.
The Ben / Johnny dynamic gets front-and-center attention. But I also like the Reed-and-Johnny relationship, where Reed simply, deliberately treats Johnny as an equal, capable partner, in the teeth of any evidence Johnny might demonstrate to belie that trust.
Firestar might be able to replace the Human Torch on the magazine cover the next time the FF are in combat with the Sandman, but there's no way she can fill in for him in the ways that really matter.
Who could? Namor. The Black Panther? Maybe one of the Inhumans? Spider-man?
But, yes, Reed has "died" a few times. Ben has really and truly died -- the FF needed the combined power of Stan and Jack to bring him back. I trust that the characters will treat this "death" as a solemn and serious situation. And, on a more cynical note, I suspect they'll forget they have a flipping Time Travel machine to undo all that.
PsychoticWarrior |
If thats marvels idea of a reboot then no thanks. Besides pretty soon if sales keep going down then graphic novels are gonna be the new norm and month to month comics will go the way of the newspapers.
That'd be fine with me. I don't buy monthly comics anymore but do pick up trades when they appear. They just have to knock off the hardcover nonsense now.
David Fryer |
David Fryer wrote:Since Young Allies did not do so well, maybe Firestar could take his place. That would be fun.Well, Johnny's major contribution to the FF has never been his powers. Yeah, they're a nice visual, and they help keep the entire team from looking like their uniform is, well, uniform, but the major draw of the Fantastic Four is that they're family.
Remember the episodes a few years back, when Sue was going to teach Johnny the responsible, financial side of being one of the four shareholders of FF, Inc? Those were great stories.
The Ben / Johnny dynamic gets front-and-center attention. But I also like the Reed-and-Johnny relationship, where Reed simply, deliberately treats Johnny as an equal, capable partner, in the teeth of any evidence Johnny might demonstrate to belie that trust.
Firestar might be able to replace the Human Torch on the magazine cover the next time the FF are in combat with the Sandman, but there's no way she can fill in for him in the ways that really matter.
I don't know, I think she could bring her own dynamic that would be just as good. One of the big issues that Firestar has had lately is her infertility which was caused by her powers. There are about three researchers that she could go to for help with that, Hank McCoy, Henry Pym, and Reed Richards. Hank is off with the X-Men in San Fransisco and Angel has seemed reluctant to deal with the X-Men in the past. Whether that is still some lingering effect of Emma Frost's conditioning or not is something I don't know. However, when you add that Emma is with the X-Men now, I don't see Firestar turning to Hank for help. Similarly, since Wasp (still feels weird to call Henry "Wasp") works with Vance now I doubt Angel would turn to him for help since she doesn't want to run the risk of bumping into her ex-fiance. So that leaves Reed Richards as the sole researcher that would really understand her position. Angel turns to Reed for help, and not only does she get one of the brightest minds on Earth working to solve her medical problems but she also develops a big sister/little sister relationship with Sue, who can relate to where Angel is from an emotional standpoint since she has struggled with the same issues. This gives her ties to two of the three remaining members of the team, Reed as her doctor and Sue as her counselor and confidante. We do not have to define a relationship with Ben yet, because that could grow out of her interaction with him. So yes, I agree that the Fantastic Four's strength has always been that they are family, but that does not preclude expanding that family. In fact, Firestar's own family issues could be the reason that she seeks out the FF in the first place.
Freehold DM |
Since Young Allies did not do so well, maybe Firestar could take his place. That would be fun.
Unfortunate that it didn't do so well. I love second string teams and I know a lot of other people do too- I had a hard time finding issues every month, so I'm not thinking the book was a failure. I'm wondering whether or not the sales were poor or if they were just trying to capture New Warriors-esque lightning in a bottle again or what.
Freehold DM |
Chris Mortika wrote:I don't know, I think she could bring her own dynamic that would be just as good. One of the big issues that Firestar has had lately is her infertility which was caused by her powers. There are about three researchers that she could go to for help with that, Hank McCoy, Henry Pym, and Reed Richards. Hank is off with the X-Men in San Fransisco and Angel has seemed reluctant to deal with the X-Men in the past. Whether that is still some lingering effect of Emma Frost's conditioning or not is something I don't know. However, when you add that Emma is with the X-Men now, I don't see Firestar turning to Hank for help. Similarly, since Wasp (still feels weird to call Henry Wasp) works with Vance now I doubt Angel would turn to him for help since she doesn't want to run the risk of bumping into her ex-fiance. So that leaves Reed Richards as the sole researcher that would really understand her position. Angel turns to Reed for help, and not only does she get one of the...David Fryer wrote:Since Young Allies did not do so well, maybe Firestar could take his place. That would be fun.Well, Johnny's major contribution to the FF has never been his powers. Yeah, they're a nice visual, and they help keep the entire team from looking like their uniform is, well, uniform, but the major draw of the Fantastic Four is that they're family.
Remember the episodes a few years back, when Sue was going to teach Johnny the responsible, financial side of being one of the four shareholders of FF, Inc? Those were great stories.
The Ben / Johnny dynamic gets front-and-center attention. But I also like the Reed-and-Johnny relationship, where Reed simply, deliberately treats Johnny as an equal, capable partner, in the teeth of any evidence Johnny might demonstrate to belie that trust.
Firestar might be able to replace the Human Torch on the magazine cover the next time the FF are in combat with the Sandman, but there's no way she can fill in for him in the ways that really matter.
Agreed. Angel is her own character, and has been for quite a few years now.
Lathiira |
@David: I thought Hank Pym got rid of that in the Avengers? I might have the comic. She got some sort of green techmesh suit to wear under her costume.
That suit got demolished during the fight with Ultron not long after. I don't think we heard much about it afterward, though I coulda sworn that she was still worrying about the problem during Civil War. I think that problem could come up again.
Edit: A quick look at Wikipedia tells me the problem is still there, and she's also contracted cancer from her powers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firestar
Mac Boyce |
Mac Boyce wrote:@David: I thought Hank Pym got rid of that in the Avengers? I might have the comic. She got some sort of green techmesh suit to wear under her costume.That suit got demolished during the fight with Ultron not long after. I don't think we heard much about it afterward, though I coulda sworn that she was still worrying about the problem during Civil War. I think that problem could come up again.
Edit: A quick look at Wikipedia tells me the problem is still there, and she's also contracted cancer from her powers.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firestar
Sweet. Someone knew what I was talking about and my seizure addled brain didn't make it up! :D
Kevin Andrew Murphy Contributor |
joela |
Actually, here's my bet: It wasn't actually Johnny who was killed. It was the Phoenix Force, which doesn't care what gender it is, but has a thing for fire, and so took over Johnny's life after it locked him in the broom closet that it had formerly locked Jean Grey in all those years ago.
Speaking of Phoenix, is Jean back yet? Hope's an okay character but the original's always the best (especially in red).
juanpsantiagoXIV |
Link
Whoop-dee-doo. When the major comic lines start killing off big characters and leaving them dead (no, I don't mean getting someone else to take on their identity, I mean gone for good), then and only then will it be shocking. Or moving at all, for that matter.
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
Kevin Andrew Murphy wrote:Actually, here's my bet: It wasn't actually Johnny who was killed. It was the Phoenix Force, which doesn't care what gender it is, but has a thing for fire, and so took over Johnny's life after it locked him in the broom closet that it had formerly locked Jean Grey in all those years ago.Speaking of Phoenix, is Jean back yet? Hope's an okay character but the original's always the best (especially in red).
Not yet, though she might be back in the Age of X crossover (stupid alternate universe things).
To be honest, I like Emma as she was portrayed in Whedon's run on X-men and ahve grown to enjoy 'reformed Emma' I don't want Jean back and screwing things up. She also screwed up Maddie Pryor. (Who I enjoyed being the X-men's Oracle). I just hate Scott Summers.
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
Freehold DM |
joela wrote:Kevin Andrew Murphy wrote:Actually, here's my bet: It wasn't actually Johnny who was killed. It was the Phoenix Force, which doesn't care what gender it is, but has a thing for fire, and so took over Johnny's life after it locked him in the broom closet that it had formerly locked Jean Grey in all those years ago.Speaking of Phoenix, is Jean back yet? Hope's an okay character but the original's always the best (especially in red).Not yet, though she might be back in the Age of X crossover (stupid alternate universe things).
To be honest, I like Emma as she was portrayed in Whedon's run on X-men and ahve grown to enjoy 'reformed Emma' I don't want Jean back and screwing things up. She also screwed up Maddie Pryor. (Who I enjoyed being the X-men's Oracle). I just hate Scott Summers.
Reason # 952 why I hate Joss Whedon.
LazarX |
GM Wulfson wrote:LinkWhoop-dee-doo. When the major comic lines start killing off big characters and leaving them dead (no, I don't mean getting someone else to take on their identity, I mean gone for good), then and only then will it be shocking. Or moving at all, for that matter.
Mar-Vell to date has not been resurrected... He's appeared in spirt form, and recently been duplicated by an amnesiac Skrull sleeper, but he's been consistently dead since Graphic Novel Number One.
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
Matthew Morris RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8 |
I don't know why anyone was surprised at this. I mean Johnny was a psuedo interesting character with potential for growth. It was inevitable that Marvel would off him. But WTH he'll be back next year, only half as fun and a quarter as interesting.
With the Captain America movie coming out, I give a minimum of two years, since I expect to see more appearances of Jim Hammond and Toro.