Agreed
Agreed.
Let's talk more about my as yet inchoate homebrew, and the evil Zmarists who dwell therein, says the distracting goblinoid.
I really like Zmar's idea of fire and brimstone types who force devils to do their bidding in order to , as they believe, bring on the end times. Way cool!
That would work really well in my homebrew. Zmarism!
I'm going to use fictional religions, not real ones. There will definitely be some elements inspired by real world monotheist faiths, though.
Zmarism brings salvation, not the end times. The end times are inevitable and they are drawing near. Any means are justifiable to bring as many sould toward the good side before the final reckogning, be it damnation to cull the herd of the black sheep, so that the fair ones are not spoiled and can lead their lives in good faith. Of course that devils love to pervert pure intentions toward the worst ends.
So sayeth the great dragon Zmar, the devourer of unpure!
ZMAR! ZMAR! ZMAR!
Zmarism brings salvation, not the end times. The end times are inevitable and they are drawing near. Any means are justifiable to bring as many sould toward the good side before the final reckogning, be it damnation to cull the herd of the black sheep, so that the fair ones are not spoiled and can lead their lives in good faith. Of course that devils love to pervert pure intentions toward the worst ends.So sayeth the great dragon Zmar, the devourer of unpure!
ZMAR! ZMAR! ZMAR!
Yes! The unwise fault Zmarists for 'working with' devils. They are much mistaken. A faithful Zmarist may FORCE devils to serve his will, all in the name of the greater good. He remains untainted because his soul is pure and his intentions are righteous. Devils must bow to his holiness!
ZMAR! ZMAR!
(What really got me in your post was the bit about 'forcing devils to serve the cause.' I like that. These guys are playing with fire, hellfire.)
I'm sure you will agree that Christianity has been a blessing to humankind in general.
Must... not... reply... Remember, kids, when confronted with these sorts of rhetorical questions, honesty is NOT a virtue.
...
Yes! The unwise fault Zmarists for 'working with' devils. They are much mistaken. A faithful Zmarist may FORCE devils to serve his will, all in the name of the greater good. He remains untainted because his soul is pure and his intentions are righteous. Devils must bow to his holiness!ZMAR! ZMAR!
(What really got me in your post was the bit about 'forcing devils to serve the cause.' I like that. These guys are playing with fire, hellfire.)
Well, the devil has always served the church no matter the holy texts. It's the ultimate punishment and a scourge in church's hands. there has always been the whip/sugar relation to the faithful, where paradise is the sugar, while hell is the whip (and it has been designed to be this way). I can imagine the angels being busy and devils readily answering any calls ina a fantasy world, letting the faithful *think* that they are in control, but really serving the ultimate purpose of temptation and removal of those who are not worthy by draging them kicking and screaming to hell for proper "reward".
There is a PrC for control of devils by a good caster in Complete Adventurer, if my memory serves me well.
ZMAR! ZMAR! ZMAR! (3x in the row, or just once, otherwise Zmarite armies shout this while stomping their left leg while marching toward the enemy in the final maneuver before charging).
I'm not sure where you get your confidence from. And I think we'd better stop this line before it derails hard.I'm sure you will agree that Christianity has been a blessing to humankind in general.
Mostly from common sense. Mankind is better off not worse because of Christianity's influence/effect on the world.
This thread was doomed from the get go! lol.
I guess I'm one of the few that does not take Christianity's positive impact on mankind for granted....HONESTLY.
I'm sure you will agree that Christianity has been a blessing to humankind in general.Must... not... reply... Remember, kids, when confronted with these sorts of rhetorical questions, honesty is NOT a virtue.
I must disagree with you here, Kirth- Honesty is always a virtue- but Temperance is another. I find that these two must walk hand in hand at all times.
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I guess I'm one of the few that does not take Christianity's positive impact on mankind for granted....HONESTLY.
Or one of the ones that takes the negative impact for granted.
This thread was doomed from the get go! lol.
No, actually, it wasn't. It's possible to discuss the subject without getting into pointless bickering. It's up to each individual poster to accomplish that, however.
I hope that nobody is equating Catholocism with Christanity here...
There's a difference? </flamebait> :)
LOL yes...like RAI vs RAW :P
So which one is RAW? XD
Catholicism.
Just don't ask any Jews their opinion on the subject...I'm from one of those countries ravaged by the catholics, and had our indigenous culture and faith destroyed by it, so in my mind:
Evil - Extreme intolerance, no qualms of killing those of differing (lesser/heretical) faiths
Law - Control and an exceedingly strict hierarchy
Trickery - Demand one thing of the people, while priests do otherwise, you may pay your way out of damnation, no qualms of using position to steal property and deceive
Glory - God wills it, we are the chosen ones
War - Spread the faith all over the world by the edge of the bladeFavored weapon: Longsword
If you want a fantasy version, based on the ideals of the catholism instead of the history, sure, Good, Law, Community, Glory and Protection are good choices.
That sounds like Islam...not Christianity. I'm sure you will agree that Christianity has been a blessing to humankind in general.
Or Native Americans....
Ok...I know I'm going to regret asking this...
I'll bite. Why do Native Americans dislike Christianity?
Ok...I know I'm going to regret asking this...
I'll bite. Why do Native Americans dislike Christianity?
Check out the history of the California missions and take note of the obscene death toll.
Every so often the Vatican tries to canonize Fr. Serra who founded the California missions and then Native American activists go out and dump blood on the statue of him on Hwy 280 and everyone forgets about it for a while.
Ok...I know I'm going to regret asking this...
I'll bite. Why do Native Americans dislike Christianity?Check out the history of the California missions and take note of the obscene death toll.
Every so often the Vatican tries to canonize Fr. Serra who founded the California missions and then Native American activists go out and dump blood on the statue of him on Hwy 280 and everyone forgets about it for a while.
Ahh Catholicism.
How is Christianity such a negative influence? The society we live in is built on Judeo/Christian values. The U.S. is founded on these values & principles. This is the best system the world has known and I'm hearing the wholesale trashing of it. There is a relectance here to acknowledge that.
The epitomy of those principles is in the United States. We are the most charitable, tolerant, accepting, benevolent country in the world.
How is Christianity such a negative influence? The society we live in is built on Judeo/Christian values. The U.S. is founded on these values & principles. This is the best system the world has known and I'm hearing the wholesale trashing of it. There is a relectance here to acknowledge that.
The epitomy of those principles is in the United States. We are the most charitable, tolerant, accepting, benevolent country in the world.
What? Did we somehow socialize medicine, outlaw the death penalty, and legalize gay marriage while I was taking a shower?
I think you're describing some other country. Canada, or maybe England or Sweden.
How is Christianity such a negative influence? The society we live in is built on Judeo/Christian values. The U.S. is founded on these values & principles. This is the best system the world has known and I'm hearing the wholesale trashing of it. There is a relectance here to acknowledge that.
The epitomy of those principles is in the United States. We are the most charitable, tolerant, accepting, benevolent country in the world.
Sure, the values and principles are great, the problem is that often these principles have been set aside or ignored to achieve another end. The problem gets worse when the religion in question is more organized, and also focused on earthly power.
Arguably, to be "Christian" means to follow the teachings of Jesus. Jesus never told anyone to kill or torture in his name, never advocated convert or die policies, and never advocated the taking of political power. However, when large groups of people who call themselves "Christian" do these things, it puts a stain on attitudes towards the faith.
So... I personally agree that Christianity has been of great benefit to humankind. But I can easily see why others would disagree.
I'm sure you will agree that Christianity has been a blessing to humankind in general.Must... not... reply... Remember, kids, when confronted with these sorts of rhetorical questions, honesty is NOT a virtue.
*looks to the left*
...*looks to the right*
...
"Look, zeppelin!"
I think this thread has covered the ground it needed to cover. Thread locked.