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Possible Bestiary 2 PDF errata / problems


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Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:
Strife2002 wrote:
Drakir2010 wrote:
chopswil wrote:
Demon, Omox p. 79...
The last (4th) chosen class skill is not displayed in the stat block.
you're guessing to make the numbers add up

I'm not guessing, i just take the numbers and work backwards based on what i'm given. I only assign something as a chosen class skill if the end result in a skill is 3 points higher than the creature's HD.

I suppose, though, that I'm guessing that Escape Artist is not a class skill simply because it didn't have any ranks in it. It could very well be its 4th chosen skill. Very well, i take back my post and replace it with this:

Omox
13 HD
104 skill points
* = Outsider class skill
$ = Aquatic class skill
! = Chosen class skill
? = Possible chosen class skill

! Acrobatics 23= 7(dex) + 3(class) + 13(ranks)
! Climb 32= 8(str) + 3(class) + 8(climb speed) + 13(ranks)
? Escape Artist 23= 7(dex) + 16(racial) + 0 ranks
! Knowledge (dungeoneering) 18= 2(int) + 3(class) + 13(ranks)
* Knowledge (planes) 18= 2(int) + 3(class) + 13(ranks)
* Perception 28= 4(wis) + 3(class) + 8(racial) + 13(ranks)
* Sense Motive 20= 4(wis) + 3(class) + 13(ranks)
* Stealth 23= 7(dex) + 3(class) + 13(ranks)
$ Swim 32= 8(str) + 3(class) + 8(swim speed) + 13(ranks)

Grand Lodge

wraithstrike wrote:

The Umbral Dragon has cleric spells. In 3.5 certain dragons could do this, but it is listed as an exception to the rules. Are these specific spells exception or can it learn any cleric spells?

The specific spells I noticed are destruction and harm.

The Cloud Dragon also has control weather. I understand it fits thematically, but there is no rule listing what other spells it should be able to choose.

Control weather is a sorcerer spell, too. Same level.

As far as the Umbral Dragon, other random cleric spells include the various inflict wounds spells, slay living, unhallow, and unholy blight.

Grand Lodge

Creatures with rock throwing - Multiple issues

Just like in the first Bestiary, all of the creatures with the Rock Throwing ability seem to differ and not quite adhere to the rock throwing rules:

- Athach - pg. 33
* Has rock damage of 2d6 when twice its slam is 2d8
* Has iterative rock throws
* Doesn't have +1 to rock throws from Rock Throwing ability

- Marsh Giant - pg. 129
* Has a +9 to Rock damage instead of +12, which would be 1-1/2 Str bonus.
* No iterative rock throws

- Taiga Giant - pg. 131
* Has rock damage of 2d6 when twice its slam is 2d8
* Has no iterative rock throws
* Doesn't have +1 to rock throws from Rock Throwing ability

- Korred - pg. 173
* Doesn't have a slam attack to measure damage (though the slam damage for a Small creature is usually 1d3, so it WOULD be 2d3)
* Has +4 to Rock damage instead of +6, which would be 1-1/2 Str bonus.

- Thanatotic Titan - pg. 267 (As Distant Scholar has already mentioned)
* Doesn't have a slam attack to measure damage (though the slam damage for a Colossal creature is usually 2d8, so it WOULD be 4d8)
* Has iterative rock throws
* Doesn't have +1 to rock throws from Rock Throwing ability
* Has a +19 to rock damage instead of +28, which would be 1-1/2 Str bonus.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Agathion, Cetaceal p. 17, unused skill points

skill points = 136
used = 130

Diplomacy +12 = +6 ranks, +3 Cha, +3 class skill
Handle Animal +14 = +8 ranks, +3 Cha, +3 class skill
Heal +21 = +14 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill
Knowledge (arcana) +22 = +17 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (nature) +19 = +17 ranks, +2 Int
Knowledge (planes) +22 = +17 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +28 = +17 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Sense Motive +24 = +17 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +24 = +17 ranks, +4 Dex, +3 class skill
Swim +17 = +0 ranks, +9 Str, +8 extra mods

Probably the case is that out of Diplomacy, Handle Animal, and Heal, only 1 of these is a chosen class skill, in which case the SB is correct.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Agathion, Draconal p. 18, unused skill points

skill points = 312
used = 309

Acrobatics +25 = +20 ranks, +2 Dex, +3 class skill
Bluff +29 = +20 ranks, +6 Cha, +3 class skill
Diplomacy +26 = +17 ranks, +6 Cha, +3 class skill
Escape Artist +22 = +17 ranks, +2 Dex, +3 class skill
Heal +27 = +17 ranks, +7 Wis, +3 class skill
Intimidate +29 = +23 ranks, +6 Cha
Knowledge (arcana) +30 = +23 ranks, +7 Int
Knowledge (nature) +27 = +20 ranks, +7 Int
Knowledge (planes) +34 = +24 ranks, +7 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (religion) +31 = +24 ranks, +7 Int
Perception +48 = +24 ranks, +7 Wis, +3 class skill, +14 extra mods
Sense Motive +34 = +20 ranks, +7 Wis, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Spellcraft +27 = +20 ranks, +7 Int
Stealth +21 = +20 ranks, +2 Dex, +3 class skill, -4 extra mods
Use Magic Device +26 = +20 ranks, +6 Cha

It's likely that only Acrobatics, Intimidate, and Knowledge (arcana) were meant to be chosen class skills, as that leaves them at 20 ranks matching the pattern for this creature where it did not insert a full 24 ranks in a skill. If so then this creature's SB is correct.

Grand Lodge

Lycanthrope, Werebear

Lycanthropes use the base humanoid or the base animal's Str and Con modifiers, whichever is higher, when changing into their hybrid forms and then add +2 to the scores.

The Werebear seems to have taken its human-form scores and added 2 to those instead of using the bear's scores when in hybrid form.

Strength should be 23 instead of 18.
Constitution should be 21 instead of 15.

Many other stats that factor these scores would then change (italics) including:
- hp 50 (4d10+24)
- Fort +9
- Melee mwk battleaxe +12(1d8+6/x3), bite +5(1d6+3 plus curse of lycanthropy), claw +5(1d6+3* plus grab)
- Ranged mwk throwing axe +7(1d6+6)
- CMB +10(+14 grapple)
- CMD 22
- Skills (changes only) Climb +11, Swim +11

*Unless I'm missing something, the claw attack as it was written in the SB is incorrect. It says +4, which is the [incorrect] Str bonus, but since it's being used with a melee weapon, it'd be half the Str bonus. Thus, it would have been +2, but should be changed to +3 because of the new, corrected stats of the hybrid form presented above.

Grand Lodge

Wereboar - pg. 182

The wereboar's hybrid form is using a dagger, a bite, and a gore all as its attack action. Because it is using a manufactured weapon along with natural attacks, these natural attacks would be considered secondary attacks and would only use 1/2 the creatures Str bonus for damage. Currently it is written as using the full bonus.

Bite damage should be changed to "1d4+3/curse of lycanthropy"
Gore damage should be changed to "1d8+3"


Compared to the template described in the first Bestiary, the lycanthropes are all messed up. (For starters, the hybrid is supposed to be the size of the larger of the two forms.)

I'm assuming these are their own critters, that don't need to follow the lycanthrope general rules.

Grand Lodge

Distant Scholar wrote:

Compared to the template described in the first Bestiary, the lycanthropes are all messed up. (For starters, the hybrid is supposed to be the size of the larger of the two forms.)

I'm assuming these are their own critters, that don't need to follow the lycanthrope general rules.

Maybe, but the wereboar and weretiger follow those rules to the T (with the exception of the size issue, which I brought up earlier in this thread, and James Jacobs just said that if it were him he'd just errata the werebear and weretiger to be Medium)

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Agathion, Draconal p. 18 incorrect cleric spell DCs

A saving throw against your spell has a DC of 10 + the level of the spell + your bonus for the relevant ability (Intelligence for a wizard, Charisma for a bard, paladin, or sorcerer, or Wisdom for a cleric, druid, or ranger). A spell's level can vary depending on your class. Always use the spell level applicable to your class.

holy smite= 10 + 8 + 7 (Wis) = 25
SB says 21

flame strike = 10 + 7 + 7 (Wis) = 24
SB says 22

Not an error. Holy smite is a 4th level spell, he just stuck it in an 8th level spell slot (it was quickened, after all). Same with Flame strike. It's a 5th level spell, plus it was empowered. If I recall adding metamagic feats does not affect the save DC of a spell by having it treat its new spell level as its actual spell level.

Grand Lodge

Strife2002 wrote:

Creatures with rock throwing - Multiple issues

...

Ok, I figured out something when I went back into bestiary 1. The only creature that had iterative rock throws in that book was the stone giant, and the only reason he did was because of the Quick Draw feat. Thus, the Athach and the Thanatotic Titan, who don't possess this feat, would NOT get iterative rock throws.

Taldor

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber

Sceaduinar p239:

Languages include 'Daemon', which I do not believe is a language as no daemon speaks it. The Daemon subtype lists languages commonly spoken by daemons too and has no mention of it.

J


Fleanetha wrote:

Sceaduinar p239:

Languages include 'Daemon', which I do not believe is a language as no daemon speaks it. The Daemon subtype lists languages commonly spoken by daemons too and has no mention of it.

J

Do Terrans speak the Terran language? Do sylphs speak the Sylvan language? Then why would daemons have to speak the Daemon language?

:-)

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Lurker in Light p. 180 incorrect Poison DC

10 + 4 (1/2 HD) + 2(Con) = 16

SB says 17

Not an error. The SB says:

"Lurkers typically coat their daggers with shadow essence poison."

This is a commercial, manufactured poison, not one that comes from the body of the fey. It has a set DC of 17.


Achaierai, page 7

In its Skills entry is listed "Fly +0". Other than the fact that listing its fly bonus is quite pointless, since it can't fly, the correct value would be -1 (+1 Dex, -2 size).


Howler, page 159.

The Howl ability lists the save to be used as Will in the main text, but as Fort in the curse affliction section.

Most likely, Will should be used in both locations.


Aeon, Bythos, page 10

Aging Strike special ability wrote:
Aging Strike (Su) If a bythos strikes a living target with two slam attacks in a single round, the bythos ages the creature, causing it to advance to the next age category (Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook 169) if it fails a DC 24 Fortitude save. The victim gains all of the penalties from this aging and none of the bonuses. A venerable victim targeted by this ability dies if it fails a DC 24 Fortitude save. This process is reversible with greater restoration, limited wish, miracle, or wish. The save DC is Constitution-based.

The part in bold. It is a little ambiguous wether it means that it is a second, separate save (read: "...if it fails a second DC 24 Fortitude save"), or that it's just the first and only (read: "...if it fails the save").

Personally, I give for granted that there is only one save, but it's not entirely clear, and for a save-or-die effect I could well understand if there is a second save to make.

Beyond that, skill bonuses issue:

Total points = {6 (Outsider) + 7 (Int)} * 18 HD = 234

Bluff +26 (18 ranks, +5 Cha, +3 class)
Fly +8 (2 ranks, +4 Dex, +4 good meneuverability, -2 size)
Heal +30 (18 ranks, +9 Wis, +3 class)
Intimidate +26 (18 ranks, +5 Cha, +3 class)
Knowledge (arcana) +33 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (nature) +33 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (religion) +33 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (history) +36 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +3 class, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (planes) +36 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +3 class, +9 Extension of All)
Perception +30 (18 ranks, +9 Wis, +3 class)
Sense Motive +30 (18 ranks, +9 Wis, +3 class)
Spellcraft +28 (18 ranks, +7 Int, +3 ???)
Stealth +21 (18 ranks, +4 Dex, +3 class, -4 size)
Use Magic Device +23 (18 ranks, +5 Cha)

As can be seen, there are 231 spent skill points (3 missing from the total), and there are 3 "ghost" points added to Spellcraft.

Personal suggestion (which is how I'll change it until an errata comes):
- Remove the 2 ranks from Fly and assign them to Knowledge (history) and Knowledge (planes), so that they both have 18 ranks (with good maneuverability and the Hover feat I don't see much need to keep those 2 ranks on Fly, for that matter).
- Lower the Spellcraft bonus of those 3 ghost points and assign them to Knowledge (arcana), Knowledge (nature) and Knowledge (religion), so that each of them has 18 ranks.

Grand Lodge

Astral Wanderer wrote:

Aeon, Bythos, page 10

Beyond that, skill bonuses issue:

Total points = {6 (Outsider) + 7 (Int)} * 18 HD = 234

Bluff +26 (18 ranks, +5 Cha, +3 class)
Fly +8 (2 ranks, +4 Dex, +4 good meneuverability, -2 size)
Heal +30 (18 ranks, +9 Wis, +3 class)
Intimidate +26 (18 ranks, +5 Cha, +3 class)
Knowledge (arcana) +33 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (nature) +33 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (religion) +33 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (history) +36 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +3 class, +9 Extension of All)
Knowledge (planes) +36 (17 ranks, +7 Int, +3 class, +9 Extension of All)
Perception +30 (18 ranks, +9 Wis, +3 class)
Sense Motive +30 (18 ranks, +9 Wis, +3 class)
Spellcraft +28 (18 ranks, +7 Int, +3 ???)
Stealth +21 (18 ranks, +4 Dex, +3 class, -4 size)
Use Magic Device +23 (18 ranks, +5 Cha)

A couple of things:

1) with a fly speed, Fly should be treated as a class skill, making it even more wonky.
2) The extra 3 in your spellcraft is because it's a class skill. The 4 class skills for this creature are Heal, Intimidate, Knowledge (history) and Spellcraft. Knowledge (planes) is an outsider class skill.

My estimation is that 8 skills put max ranks in them, while the knowledge skills only stuck 17 in them, leaving 5 points left over. I feel those 5 should just be dumped into Fly, which would be recalculated as:

Fly +14= 5(ranks) + 4(Dex) + 4(maneuverability) - 2(size) + 3(class)

OR you could have those points go into the knowledge skills, increase each of them by 1 point, and calculate Fly as if it had no ranks:

Fly +6= 4(Dex) + 4(maneuverability) - 2(size)


Right, I forgot mentioning that Fly is class skill and thus even more screwed.
About Spellcraft, my fault in mistaking Bluff as one of the four additional class skills it gets as an Outsider, rather than considering it as default. That's what you get when you check out these things half asleep.

_____________________________________________

Aeon, Paracletus, page 11

Fly bonus is listed as +6, but it should be +8 (+2 Dex, +4 good maneuverability, +2 size).

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Astral Wanderer and Strife2002, I'm curious as to your thoughts about the recent Bestiary 1 errata, mainly the seeming lack of changes made from user posts to the errata thread.


chopswil wrote:
Astral Wanderer and Strife2002, I'm curious as to your thoughts about the recent Bestiary 1 errata, mainly the seeming lack of changes made from user posts to the errata thread.

I didn't know it was out. I checked a few (I think) days ago and didn't notice it, when was it added?

Anyway, said that I just downloaded it but have no time to check it out, I'm not surprised if most of the reports from users haven't been added. Other than timing issues (dunno at which point Paizo started to compile the new errata and at which point they finished, in respect to the advancement of the errata thread), I understand that for every report made by an user, the staff should verify if there's really an error, if the user didn't make mistakes on his own (I myself made errors now and then in my reports... see a few posts above for an example), and so on, so it's a lengthy task they may not have much time to spare upon. Nor will, because in the end most errors are small things that hardly would change a fight, interaction or whole gaming session significantly.

Of course I'll keep the annotations about errors found by me and everybody else that haven't been included in the errata, and I'll keep on hoping a future errata will include them, but I don't expect it and I can understand it isn't in Paizo's interests to print one day the "Perfect and Flawless Bestiary". Sad for us, but that's it.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Astral Wanderer wrote:


Of course I'll keep the annotations about errors found by me and everybody else that haven't been included in the errata, and I'll keep on hoping a future errata will include them, but I don't expect it and I can understand it isn't in Paizo's interests to print one day the "Perfect and Flawless Bestiary". Sad for us, but that's it.

I sadly agree...and I'm looking forward to B3 :)


Aeon, Pleroma, page 12

Alright, this one is heavy.

1) Minor typo: in the Cleric spells prepared, level 8: Summon Monster has an unusual space between the word "monster" and the following comma, and misses the "VIII" of "Summon Monster VIII".

2) Another minor typo: Order's Wrath in the 4th level Cleric spells has been written "Order's Wraith".

3) * In the PRD there is the same error, and that "summon monster" bears no link to the spell.
No link also for Geas at 6th level and Order's Wrath at 4th level.
I suppose in the recent PRD update an automatic software was used to apply links to spells and other things, and the typos made it so that the application didn't recognize them and thus didn't apply a link (in the case of Geas the "typo" is in the fact that the spell is effectively called "Geas/Quest" and the missing "/Quest" broke things up).

* There was a thread about all PRD errors, if I recall right, but am unable to find it now. If anyone can, please link it to me and I'll report there too.

4) Among its 5th level Cleric spells are listed Contact Other Plane and Teleport, to both of which it doesn't have access.
Personally, I replaced them with Breath of Life and Slay Living, to stay themed with the creature.

5) As point 4, but Legend Lore and Veil in 6th level (I replace with Harm and Heal).
Also, Repulsion is listed in 6th level, but it is 7th for Cleric (I replace with Greater Dispel Magic).

6) Scrying in 4th level is in truth a 5th level spell for Cleric (I replace with Death Ward).

7) As point 4, but Clairaudience/Clairvoyance and Suggestion in 3rd level (I replace with Bestow Curse and Remove Curse).

8) As point 4, but Detect Thoughts and See Invisibility in 2nd level. Also, I don't see the point of Align Weapon, since it can't (and wouldn't) even cast it on its own natural attacks, and Undetectable Alignment too is quite pointless (being Neutral, the Pleroma can't be detected by Detect Chaos/Evil/Good/Law, the spells used 99 of 100 times to find alignments). Plus, it has Zone of Truth, but it's unclear how much it can be useful to an Aeon, given its Envisaging ability. I replace these five spells with Calm Emotions, Darkness, Lesser Restoration, Remove Paralysis and Silence).

9) As point 4, but Identify, Magic Aura and True Strike in 1st level (I replace with Deathwatch, Divine Favor and Entropic Shield).

10) Cleric spells' concentration bonus is not +27, but +30 (CL 20 + 10 Wis).

11) The Cleric spells' DCs issue chopswil reported earlier, here.

--- Note: I've not finished checking the Pleroma yet, maybe something else will pop out when I have again time to scan it. ---


A much easier fix for the Pleroma Aeon regarding points 4 through 9 would be to add the following to its Spells section: "A Pleroma Aeon can cast spells from the sorcerer/wizard spell list as though they were cleric spells."


Are wrote:

A much easier fix for the Pleroma Aeon regarding points 4 through 9 would be to add the following to its Spells section: "A Pleroma Aeon can cast spells from the sorcerer/wizard spell list as though they were cleric spells."

Yes and no. First, there are things to correct separately anyway (Repulsion and Scrying). Second, all other cases are "Creature casts spell as a Sorcerer and can cast spells from the Cleric list as arcane spells"; doing the opposite would be a unique case that smells of "hole crudely filled".

_____________________________________________

Aeon, Pleroma, page 12

Skills issue

Total points = {(6 Outsider + 8 Int) * 24 HD} = 336

Note: the 4 additional class skills granted by the Outsider type I considered are: Knowledge (arcane), Knowledge (nature), Knowledge (religion) and Spellcraft. The first 3 are obviously supported by math, but the choice of Spellcraft was arbitrary. It could anyway be swapped with Appraise, Heal, Intimidate or Use Magic Device, and the numbers in the end would be the same, if 3 ranks are also swapped.

Skill bonuses as they resuld from doing math with the stat block:

Appraise +30 (22 ranks, +8 Int)
Bluff +32 (22 ranks, +7 Cha, +3 Class)
Fly +16 (2 ranks, +8 Dex, +8 maneuverability, -2 size)
Heal +30 (20 ranks, +10 Wis)
Intimidate +27 (20 ranks, +7 Cha)
Knowledge (arcana) +47 (24 ranks, +8 Int, +3 Class, +12 Extension of All)
Knowledge (dungeoneering) +44 (24 ranks, +8 Int, +12 Extension of All)
Knowledge (engineering) +44 (24 ranks, +8 Int, +12 Extension of All)
Knowledge (nature) +47 (24 ranks, +8 Int, +3 Class, +12 Extension of All)
Knowledge (planes) +47 (24 ranks, +8 Int, +3 Class, +12 Extension of All)
Knowledge (religion) +47 (24 ranks, +8 Int, +3 Class, +12 Extension of All)
Perception +41 (24 ranks, +10 Wis, +3 Class, +4 Alertness)
Sense Motive +39 (22 ranks, +10 Wis, +3 Class, +4 Alertness)
Spellcraft +30 (19 ranks, +8 Int, +3 Class)
Stealth +27 (20 ranks, +8 Dex, +3 Class, -4 size)
Use Magic Device +27 (20 ranks, +7 Cha)

So, with the stat block math, these problems pop up:

1) The total skill points used are 335 out of the 336 they should be.

2) Fly has not been considered a class skill, while it is automatically a class skill for all creatures that have a fly speed.

After that, my personal thougths:
First, what would the Pleroma waste ranks in Appraise for?
Second, as I vaguely said earlier, the Envisaging ability needs to be more clear: depending on how deep an Aeon can scan minds, Sense Motive could become useless for it. Also, since it communicates by sending visions, Bluff is quite useless. I mean, if it sends to a creature the vision of her home destroyed, how can the creature know if it is a bluff or the real intent of the Aeon (and it's also hard to make up a situation in which an Aeon would need to bluff). Yes, Bluff could anyway be used to feint or to create diversions to hide, but thet's really stretching things up.
_____________________________________________

Another error: the attack bonus for the touch of the Pleroma is listed as +25, but should be +30 (+24 BAB, +7 Str, -1 size).


Aeon, Theletos, page 14

Spell-like Abilities: incorrect DC for Bestow Curse. The correct one is 15.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:
Astral Wanderer and Strife2002, I'm curious as to your thoughts about the recent Bestiary 1 errata, mainly the seeming lack of changes made from user posts to the errata thread.

Agreed. I'd like to say "there was probably a reprinting date coming up and the errata needed to be compiled before that date, so a cut off date on the reported mistakes was probably necessary" but even that doesn't make sense since there are still a smattering of skipped over fixes amongst the chosen ones. Maybe the paizo staff found something in our math that says it's not an error and they're just too busy to let us know, I dunno, but they seem like bugs to me.

tl;dr: As long as I know those bugs exist I can live knowing my copies of product are accurate. My OCD doesn't extend to other people's property (he says as he winces over the thought someone else's stuff is inaccurate).


Agathion, Avoral, page 16

This is a personal opinion (but meaybe not just that): why waste 1 skill point in Ride? Even more so for a creature that in case of mounted combat is probably more often the ridden, rather than the riding one.

Agathion, Cetaceal, page 17

1) Spell-like Abilities: listed Concentration bonus is +20.
It should be +18 (+15 CL, +3 Cha).

The additional +2 was the one from the Spell Penetration feat, I suppose, but that bonus must be added when rolling against a spell resistance, not to every concentration check.

2) Spell-like Abilities again: listed DC for Hold Monster is 17 but should be 18 (10, +5 Sorc/Wiz spell level, +3 Cha)

3) Minor typo; spell-like abilities once more: after "greater teleport (self plus 50 lbs. of objects only)" there is a comma.
Most surely a diminutive typo and no more, but I'm reporting just in case something else was intended to be after that and was lost during formatting or things like that and the staff didn't notice.

4) Skills: doing the math, either 6 skill points are unused or two skills haven't been considered class skills (which they should, or at least could, given the four additional class skills granted from the Outsider type's varied nature).

5) Not an error, but an adjustment in line with creatures presented in Bestiary I: the listed damage for the Cetaceal's shortspear is 1d6+10 (plus everything else), which is fine, but usually when a creature uses a one-handed melee weapon and has its second hand free, the Str bonus to damage is listed as if wielding the weapon with two hands.
In that case, the damage becomes 1d6+14.


chopswil wrote:

Agathion, Draconal p. 18 incorrect cleric spell DCs

A saving throw against your spell has a DC of 10 + the level of the spell + your bonus for the relevant ability (Intelligence for a wizard, Charisma for a bard, paladin, or sorcerer, or Wisdom for a cleric, druid, or ranger). A spell's level can vary depending on your class. Always use the spell level applicable to your class.

holy smite= 10 + 8 + 7 (Wis) = 25
SB says 21

flame strike = 10 + 7 + 7 (Wis) = 24
SB says 22

In thos cases the DCs are correct as listed: Flame Strike is 5th level and empowered (+2 spell levels, but only for preparation, not DC, thus 7th level), while Holy Smite is 4th level and quickened (+4, thus 8th level).

_____________________________________________

Agathion, Draconal, page 18

1) Spell-like Abilities: listed DC for Hold Monster is 20 but should be 21 (10, +5 Sorc/Wiz spell level, +6 Cha).

2) In the PRD, the link to the 5th level Cleric spell "Spell resistance" brings to [url=http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/magicItems/armor.html#_armor-spell-resistance]this page with the explanation of the SR rules[url] rather than to the spell of the same name.


Agathion, Draconal, page 18

1) Lay On Hands' values are based on a 20th level Paladin, but Agathions use Lay On Hands as Paladins of level equal to their own HD, and the Draconal has 24 HD (and there is also nothing saying that Lay On Hands has a maximum cap limit).
So, it would change to: "lay on hands (12d6, 18/day, as a 24th-level paladin)".

2) Agathion traits give cold resistance 10; shouldn't the Draconal have it too (and if its color is associated to cold, the immunity, of course)?


Agathion, Silvanshee, page 21

1) The Climb and Fly skill bonuses didn't take account of size, and in the case of Climb, also of the fact that tiny or smaller creatures use the Dex modifier, rather than Str.
So, the bonuses become:

Climb +7 (2 ranks, +2 Dex, +3 class)
Fly +10 (+2 Dex, +4 size, +4 maneuverability)

2) The Silvanshee can use Lay On Hands 2/day (1/2 HD + Cha = 1 + 1 = 2); stat-block says 1/day.

Grand Lodge

Astral Wanderer wrote:

Agathion, Cetaceal, page 17

5) Not an error, but an adjustment in line with creatures presented in Bestiary I: the listed damage for the Cetaceal's shortspear is 1d6+10 (plus everything else), which is fine, but usually when a creature uses a one-handed melee weapon and has its second hand free, the Str bonus to damage is listed as if wielding the weapon with two hands.
In that case, the damage becomes 1d6+14.

Perhaps its other hand is being used for spellcasting? I can't remember if that matters or not, it should be able to grasp and let go of a weapon with its free hand freely.


Strife2002 wrote:


Perhaps its other hand is being used for spellcasting? I can't remember if that matters or not, it should be able to grasp and let go of a weapon with its free hand freely.

Yes, it can let go and hold again freely with the second hand. After all, if it's casting it's not attacking and vice versa, so the two things can't collide.

_____________________________________________

Agathion, Vulpinal, page 22

1) Minor "typo": in the name + CR line of the stat-block, there's the word "Agathion". Usually, the kind of Outsider doesn't appear there; in this case I suppose it's a leftover of the Vulpinal's stat-block copy/pasted from the older book(s?) it appeared in.

2) In the SQ line there's a "bardic knowledge +7". About this:
- First, I suppose it's incorrect due to the fact that the Bardic Knowledge's bonus is half a Bard's level, and if the equivalent Bard level of a Vulpinal is equal to its own racial HD, as reasonable, then the bonus is 7 / 2 = 3.5 rounded to 3.
- Second, whatever you want that bonus to be, it has not been applied to the Knowledge skills in the stat-block (skills math is alright in every other aspect). Dunno if it is something that was intended to be removed entirely when bringing the Vulpinal to Bestiary II from previous books.

Grand Lodge

Astral Wanderer wrote:

Agathion, Silvanshee, page 21

1) The Climb and Fly skill bonuses didn't take account of size, and in the case of Climb, also of the fact that tiny or smaller creatures use the Dex modifier, rather than Str.

Are we positive about that? I know a lot of people draw from that line about familiars in Bestiary 1, but if you look closely, it says this:

"Small animals like these use Dexterity to modify Climb and Swim checks."

As an outsider, this creature doesn't necessarily meet this criteria verbatim...


Strife2002 wrote:

Are we positive about that? I know a lot of people draw from that line about familiars in Bestiary 1, but if you look closely, it says this:

"Small animals like these use Dexterity to modify Climb and Swim checks."

As an outsider, this creature doesn't necessarily meet this criteria verbatim...

Yet, it is applied to all the tiny or smaller creatures in the Bestiary regardless of creature type.

It would be a good thing if in the next reprint/errata of the Core Rulebook they clearly add to Climb and Swim's descriptions that tiny and smaller creatures use Dex instead of Str.


Akata, page 23

Void Death's listed DC is 12, but if it's HD-and-Cos-dependant then it's 14.
This could or could not be an error, depending on the DC being fixed or HD-and-Cos-dependant. The latter is of course far more usual, and that's why I'm reporting this, although it's true that the Void Death's description doesn't report the save as being Constitution-based.

Also (minor unclearness), the descriptive text says: "an infected creature who dies rises as a void zombie 2d4 hours later", which I suppose was meant to be "2d4 hours after death". A new player, not too familiar with the rules, might read it as "2d4 hours after contagion (or after the first ability damage)".


Amoeba Swarm, page 24

It has the Amphibious special quality, but the aquatic subtype is not listed.


chopswil wrote:

Angel, Cassisian's p. 26 I can't see how Diplomacy can be +2.

Outsider can have 4 extra skills as class skills but class skill bonus is +3 and you have to take a rank to use the bonus.
All other skill points are used.

Skills Points: Outsider 6 + Int (Int = 6 (-2)) 2 * ( 6 -2) = 8 points

Diplomacy +2 = +0 ranks, +0 Cha
Fly +13 = +0 ranks, +0 Dex, +3 class skill, +10 extra mods
Knowledge (planes) +2 = +1 ranks, +-2 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (religion) +2 = +1 ranks, +-2 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +5 = +2 ranks, +0 Wis, +3 class skill
Sense Motive +4 = +1 ranks, +0 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +8 = +1 ranks, +0 Dex, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods

About this, the +3 from class skills must not be applied if there isn't at least 1 rank in the Skill.

Anyway, in regard to the skill bonuses as presented in the book, Fly is +8 and should be +10 (+8 maneuverability, +2 size); Diplomacy, instead, was probably not considered a class skill when it could, and as such was listed as +2; it can be brought to +5 by making it a class skill.


This is old, but I haven't seen a full correction on the matter.

Drakir2010 wrote:
chopswil wrote:

Angel, Monadic Deva's p. 27 Survival seems to have 17 ranks which exceeds the max of 14, 14 HD

A thought: Maybe fly was made into a class skill "for free" and the 4th Outsider-theme-fitting class skill is survival?
mdt wrote:


All creatures/species with a move speed have fly as a class skill automatically (in addition to the +8 racial bonus to it) if I remember correctly.

So, if the fly is +25, it's probably +10 ranks, +8 bonus, +4 dex, and +3 class skill.

Fly is automatically a class skill for any creature with a fly speed, so it doesn't count in the "4 varied nature class skills" of flight-gifted Outsiders.

But there is no racial +8 for flying, even if the creature has a fly speed.
The racial +8 is only for Climb and Swim, when the creature has associated speeds.

So, in the end, the Monadic Deva's skill bonuses are all fine as they are in the book.


Angel, Movanic Deva, page 28

Sense Motive and Perception bonuses are 2 points lower than they should be.
Correcting (remember to correct Perception in the Senser entry too):

Sense Motive +18 (12 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class)
Perception +22 (12 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class, +4 racial)

Grand Lodge

Astral Wanderer wrote:


It would be a good thing if in the next reprint/errata of the Core Rulebook they clearly add to Climb and Swim's descriptions that tiny and smaller creatures use Dex instead of Str.

Agreed.

Grand Lodge

Astral Wanderer wrote:

Akata, page 23

Void Death's listed DC is 12, but if it's HD-and-Cos-dependant then it's 14.
This could or could not be an error, depending on the DC being fixed or HD-and-Cos-dependant. The latter is of course far more usual, and that's why I'm reporting this, although it's true that the Void Death's description doesn't report the save as being Constitution-based.

Excuse the noob comment but I'm not sure what the word "Cos" is referring to when you say HD-and-Cos-dependant.

Also, I was under the impression that diseases have a set DC, and poisons were the ones whose DCs varied based on the delivering creature's stats. I could be VERY wrong, though.


Strife2002 wrote:


Excuse the noob comment but I'm not sure what the word "Cos" is referring to when you say HD-and-Cos-dependant.

Also, I was under the impression that diseases have a set DC, and poisons were the ones whose DCs varied based on the delivering creature's stats. I could be VERY wrong, though.

My bad, I meant Con (Constitution).

Anyway, if we look at Bestiary I about diseases:
Bearded Devil, Pit Fiend, Ghoul, Wererat, Mummy, Night Hag, Otyugh, Dire Rat, Rat Swarm, Plague Zombie... they all have disease DCs dependant on Con (or Cha for the Undead) and HD.

Dog (carrying rabies) is the only one with a non-variable DC.


Animate Dream, page 29

Beside the fact that most curses (and the Bestow Curse spell too) require a Will save, the Animate Dream's Nightmare Curse is totally mental, so shouldn't it require a Will save rather than the listed Fort one?


Aranea, page 30

Its AC includes a +4 armor bonus, but it's unknown what provides it.
There is no additional note in the Treasure entry, and there is no Gear/NPC Gear entry.

If it is from an armor such as a chain shirt, then the armor check penalty should be applied to Acrobatics, Climb, Escape Artist and Stealth.
(Skills math is fine as it is, if no armor check penalty is applied).
Also, unless the armor bonus is from something like Bracers of Armor, as stated the Aranea should be able to wear armor only in its alternate forms, and the stat-block is of its base form (not to mention that armor interferes with the Aranea's spellcasting and Bracers of Armor +4, instead, exceed the treasure value of the Aranea by more than ten times).


Astral Wanderer wrote:

Aranea, page 30

Its AC includes a +4 armor bonus, but it's unknown what provides it.

The Bestiary 2 is assuming the aranea has cast its mage armor spell.


Distant Scholar wrote:
Astral Wanderer wrote:

Aranea, page 30

Its AC includes a +4 armor bonus, but it's unknown what provides it.

The Bestiary 2 is assuming the aranea has cast its mage armor spell.

Ah, right. In that case, "one alredy cast" should be added to Mage Armor (or to 1st level spells in general), as done for other creatures.


chopswil wrote:

Archon, Shield p. 31 seems to have 18 unused skill points.

total ranks used = 54, 72 -54 = 18

Skills Points: Outsider 6 + Int, Int = 14 (2), 9 * ( 6+2) = 72 points

Diplomacy +14 = +9 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill
Fly +7 = +1 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill, +2 extra mods
Intimidate +14 = +9 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill
Knowledge (religion) +14 = +9 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +15 = +9 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Sense Motive +15 = +9 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +1 = +1 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill
Survival +15 = +9 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill

Actually, there is indeed a problem with Fly and Stealth, but it's different.

Using the skill points properly would result in:
Fly +0 (9 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class, +4 maneuverability, -2 size, -6 armor penalty, -9 shield penalty*)
Stealth -6 (9 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class, -4 size, -6 armor penalty, -9 shield penalty*)

* The Tower Shield is masterwork/magical, so its check penalty is reduced by 1.

The stat block says Fly +7 and Stealth +1, dunno what was or was not taken into account.


Star Archon, page 32

1) A Starknife sized for a Medium creature deals 1d4 damage, so one suited for a Large wielder should deal 1d6. The Star Archon's Starknife is listed as dealing 1d8, apparently with no justified reason.

Also the listed attack bonuses for the Starknife are +29/+24/+19/+14, but should be +30/+25/+20/+15 (19 BAB, +7 Str, +5 enhancement, -1 size).

2) Prepared Cleric spells, level 3: there are 5 prepared spells, while there should be 6.

3) Skills issue:

Skill points = (6 Outsider, + 5 Int) * 19 HD = 209

Diplomacy +25 (19 ranks, +6 Cha)
Fly +20 (19 ranks, +4 Dex, +3 class, +4 maneuverability, -2 size, -6 armor pen., -2 shield pen.)
Heal +16 (9 ranks, +7 Wis)
Intimidate +25 (19 ranks, +6 Cha)
Knowledge (arcana) +14 (9 ranks, +5 Int)
Knowledge (engineering) +14 (9 ranks, +5 Int)
Knowledge (history) +15 (10 ranks, +5 Int)
Knowledge (nature) +15 (10 ranks, +5 Int)
Knowledge (religion) +24 (19 ranks, +5 Int)
Perception +29 (19 ranks, +7 Wis, +3 class)
Sense Motive +29 (19 ranks, +7 Wis, +3 class)
Spellcraft +24 (19 ranks, +5 Int)
Stealth +14 (19 ranks, +4 Dex, +3 class, -4 size, -6 armor pen., -2 shield pen.)
Survival +17 (9 ranks, +7 Wis)

So, comparing to the stat-block, all skill points are spent, but none of the four additional class skills due to Outsiders' varied nature are applied.

4) Special Attacks: the Star Archon has Smite Evil, which is listed as granting +20 to damage.
Of course this be could be as it was intended to be, but since this kind of abilities usually take the creature's HD as their class-equivalent level, perhaps it was intended to be +19.


Athach, page 33

1)

Sean K Reynolds wrote:


Drakir2010 wrote:

P. 33

Athach ...
Skill points incorrect:That's 24 skill ranks spent.

Athachs have the giant subtype, which gives them Perception as a class skill.

Yet, there is an issue with Stealth.

Skill points = (2 Humanoid, -2 Int) * 14 HD = 1 (minimum) * 14 = 14

Acrobatics +1 (+1 Dex) (+8 to jump thanks to its base speed)
Climb +20 (6 ranks, +11 Str, +3 class)
Perception +12 (8 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class)
Stealth +0 (+1 Dex, -8 size, +???)

Stealth should result in -7.

2) It could wield its mace two-handed (thus dealing 3d6+16 damage), as creatures usually do when wielding a one-handed weapon and not using the second hand.
Or else add a secondary slam attack (+17 to attack, 1d8+5 damage).

3) What has been already reported by others about the Rock ranged attack.

4) As said many times, the Rock Throwing ability needs to be clarified, since it says that rocks "generally" deal double the creature's slam damage but looking through Bestiary I, all the most iconic rock throwers deal damage equal to their slam. Athach, instead, is totally different (slam is 1d8, rock is listed as 2d6).

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