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Possible Bestiary 2 PDF errata / problems


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chopswil wrote:

Tenebrous Worm p. 260,

missing comma between skills

Will is off by 2, missed Iron Will mod

Confirmed.


chopswil wrote:

Toad, Giant p. 268 skill points issue, Stealth incorrect

forgot stealth size mod?

skill points = 3

Acrobatics +5 = +0 ranks, +1 Dex, +4 extra mods
Perception +8 = +3 ranks, -1 Wis, +3 class skill, +3 extra mods
Stealth +1 = +0 ranks, +1 Dex +4 racial mod - 4 large
Swim +12 = +0 ranks, +4 Str, +8 extra mods

Or, possibly, they spent a nonexistent 4th skill point on Stealth.


chopswil wrote:

Glacier Toad p. 268 skill points issue, Swim incorrect

supposed to have swim speed? would give it +8

skill points = 7

Acrobatics +9 = +1 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Perception +11 = +4 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill, +3 extra mods
Stealth +6 = +2 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill
Swim +6 = +0 ranks, +6 Str

I concur.


chopswil wrote:

Undine p. 275, incorrect Init

with Dex 14 Init should be +2

I concur.


chopswil wrote:

Urdefhan p. 276, skill points issues

If I add a rank to Knowledge (dungeoneering) it will add +4 due to class skill and make it +6, SB says +5.
Same basic issue for Ride, add rank , class skill +4 total +5, SB says +4

skill points = 24
used so far = 21

Intimidate +8 = +3 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill
Knowledge (dungeoneering) +2 = +0 ranks, +2 Int
Knowledge (planes) +8 = +3 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (religion) +8 = +3 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +7 = +3 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill
Ride +1 = +0 ranks, +1 Dex
Sense Motive +7 = +3 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill
Survival +7 = +6 ranks, +1 Wis

Drakir2010 wrote:

Corrected the name and page number when I quoted you.

You haven't included the armour check penalty in your calculations, but things still don't add up.

If I set 4 "theme appropriate" class skills are Intimidate, Knowledge (Religion), Ride and Survival:

Intimidate +8 = +3 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill
Knowledge (dungeoneering) +5 = +3 ranks, +2 Int
Knowledge (planes) +8 = +3 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (religion) +8 = +3 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +7 = +3 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill
Ride +4 = +1 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill, -1 ACP
Sense Motive +7 = +3 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill
Survival +7 = +3 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill

Which means only 22 of 24 skill points have been spent.

If you don't make Ride a class skill, and don't take into account the ACP for Ride, everything matches up nicely. :-)


Drakir2010 wrote:

Worm That Walks p. 286

Has 5 cantrips prepared. A wizard never has more than 4 cantrip slots. Being a specialist does not grant an extra slot.

skill points = 104
used = 107

Craft (Alchemy) +21 = +13 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Fly +20 = +13 ranks, +4 Dex, +3 class skill
Intimidate +16 = +16 ranks, +0 Cha (is this supposed to be made class?)
Knowledge (arcana) +21 = +13 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (dungeoneering) +21 = +13 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (the planes) +21 = +13 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +22 = +13 ranks, +1 Wis, +8 racial bonus
Sense Motive +9 = +1 Wis, +8 racial bonus
Spellcraft +21 = +13 ranks, +5 Int , +3 class skill
Stealth +12 = +4 Dex, +8 racial bonus

Additionally, CMD seems wrong:

CMD: 26 = 10 + BAB (6) + Str (-1) + Dex (4) + insight (2) + racial bonus (4) + Dodge (1)
SB says 24.

Lastly, hit points seem off.

hp: 113 = first level wizard hit die (6) + 12 normal wizard hit dice (3.5*12=42) + Con per hit die (3*13=39) + favoured class bonus (13) + toughness (13). This would read as 13d6+65
SB says 123= 13d6+78

I concur with all of these. I think they maybe forgot the insight bonus to CMD. I don't know what's up with the hit points.


wraithstrike wrote:

Xacarba

Redirect Spell (Su) Any creature that attempts to cast a spell
within 30 feet of a xacarba must cast the spell defensively.
If the caster fails the concentration check to do so (or if the
caster opts to not cast defensively), the xacarba can choose
the target of the spell as a swift action. The new target must
be a legal target—if there’s no legal alternative target to
choose from, this ability cannot be used.

Since this occurs on the player's go shouldn't it be an immediate action?

I agree that, to be useful, the action should be an immediate action.


Lord oKOyA wrote:

Not sure if these count as errata per se, but in the interest of continuity...

The Giant Whiptail Centipede entry in the Bestiary 2 (pg 53) does not match up exactly to the version presented in the Kingmaker AP (#31 - Stolen Land, pg 35). Ignoring the stat block adjustments to the AP version due to 'squeezing' penalties, the poison DC is listed as 14 as opposed to the Bestiary listing it as 17. I see no reason for them to be different. I would also suspect the 17 is the correct value.

Also, the Bestiary version does not include the special ability:

Compact (Ex) Although a giant whiptail centipede is a Huge creature, its compact and slender frame allow it to squeeze through areas as if it were a Medium creature—it still suffers normal effects for squeezing into small areas.

Again I see no reason for this omission.

Cheers

They decided to change the monster. You may not like it, but that's not errata.

Edit: Think of it as gaining a bonus monster! Two versions of the GW Centipede!


Have they even released errata for this yet? Why the long wait? We've done most of the work for them all this time, it seems >< Paizo's getting rather lazy with the fixes. It's so simple to do, in fact, a couple of work days at the most to fix it by just perusing this thread.


Razz wrote:
Have they even released errata for this yet? Why the long wait? We've done most of the work for them all this time, it seems >< Paizo's getting rather lazy with the fixes. It's so simple to do, in fact, a couple of work days at the most to fix it by just perusing this thread.

To be fair, they can't just take our word for the errors; sometimes we're wrong.


If anyone's curious as to why I'm sending out a flurry of postings, I've been writing up Bestiary 2 monsters for PCGen. I've only done S-Z so far, though.

Anyway, on to my own findings.

Shining Child: I'm getting a DC 24 for Blinding Light, rather than a 25. (Did someone already mention this one?)
Siren: A 4th-level bard with 15 Charisma should have 15 rounds per day of bardic performance, rather than 9. This may be the specific Siren entry trumping the more general bardic performance rule, though.
Slime Mold: I think it should be blind, and get blindsight, like other oozes.
Glacier Toad: Being a Magical Beast, it should have 60' of darkvision.
Ice Troll: It seems to have all low saves.
Twigjack: Doesn't a spear have a x3 crit multiplier?
Wendigo: Did someone mention the 19-20 crit range on the bite? It has Improved Crit (claws) but not Improved Crit (bite).


Is a Juju Zombie supposed to keep its human traits (bonus feat, bonus skill points, favored class bonuses)? I can't see anything that says it loses them, but the stat block doesn't seem to use them.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Razz wrote:
Have they even released errata for this yet? Why the long wait? We've done most of the work for them all this time, it seems >< Paizo's getting rather lazy with the fixes. It's so simple to do, in fact, a couple of work days at the most to fix it by just perusing this thread.

errata is put out when next printing is about to be released.

next printing is released when current printing copies are "low"
they don't tell people when current printing copies are "low" or no one would buy the current printing as they would hold out for new printing

them's the rules


A couple I forgot:
Thanatotic Titan: The stat block doesn't seem to have taken into account the titan's Rock Throwing ability: it should get a +1 on rock attacks and +1.5xSTR bonus. Also, it seems to be throwing Medium-sized rocks (like a Huge giant) rather than Huge-sized rocks (like a Colossal giant).
Totenmaske: Maybe it's just me, but I can't find the devour memories ability anywhere. Does it exist?

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Ifrit p. 160 incorrect SLA DC

flare = 10 + 3 (Cha) + 0 (sor/wiz level) = 13
SB says 15

Not quite. While it's still wrong in the SB, it should actually be 14. The Elemental Affinity ability increases his Charisma by 2 points for all sorcerer spells and class abilities.

Grand Lodge

P. 202: Nightwave

This creature's Swim skill is wrong. It was treated as if Swim wasn't a class skill (which it is, since this creature has the aquatic subtype). It says Swim +56 but it should be +59:

Swim +59 = 29(ranks) + 19(Str) + 8(swim speed) + 3(class skill)

Grand Lodge

Drakir2010 wrote:
chopswil wrote:

Ogrekin p. 204, minor typo

should be be Init +5 instead of Int +5

Additionally:

Skill points don't add up
Climb +9 = +1 ranks, +5 Str, +3 Class skill
Swim +9 = +1 ranks, +5 Dex, +3 class skill

SB lists both as +7, an impossible number.

Still wrong, but so is the Stat Block. You're forgetting to add in the bonus skill point from the base creature being human. It comes out to:

2 ranks + 5 Str + 3 class skill = Climb +10
2 ranks + 5 Str + 3 class skill = Swim +10

Grand Lodge

P. 198 - Nereid

Spray ranged attack doesn't have a range.

Grand Lodge

Distant Scholar wrote:
chopswil wrote:

Scylla p. 241, unused skills points

skill points = 180
used = 178

Acrobatics +34 = +20 ranks, +11 Dex, +3 class skill
Bluff +26 = +20 ranks, +6 Cha
Fly +35 = +21 ranks, +11 Dex, +3 class skill
Knowledge (nature) +25 = +17 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +29 = +20 ranks, +6 Wis, +3 class skill
Sense Motive +26 = +20 ranks, +6 Wis
Stealth +26 = +20 ranks, +11 Dex, +3 class skill, -8 extra mods
Swim +39 = +20 ranks, +8 Str, +3 class skill, +8 extra mods
Use Magic Device +26 = +20 ranks, +6 Cha

Scylla only has 20 HD; she can't have 21 ranks in Fly. The Fly bonus should be +34. I think the writeup is missing Knowledge (nature) as a class skill. I concur with the AC being incorrect.

If the Dex bonus were calculated as being +12 universally, it would show up in some other skills, like Acrobatics and Stealth.

This touches on something that I believe needs some urgent clarification, and that's with regards to creatures that use a constant fly spell-like ability for flying. It's using the spell fly, and therefore that spell should be used when determining the bonuses to the Fly skill. This means it should receive a bonus equal to 1/2 the caster level. It also means (probably) it should NOT receive a maneuverability bonus, because the fly spell always provides a rating of "good," and the Fly skill itself says only those with "natural fly speeds" get a maneuverability bonus. Furthermore, if this creature weren't an aberration (who get Fly automatically as a class skill), would it receive Fly as a class skill? They don't have "natural" flight, only that provided by a spell effect. I understand that if it were from a supernatural effect, it would, but a spell-like ability?

So in this case:

20(ranks) + 11(dex) + 8(1/2 CL) + 3(class skill) - 4(size) = Fly +38

Further proof of this exists in the breakdown of the Nightwave's Fly skill.

Can one of the brilliant Paizo staff who frequent these boards either tell me "we're working on it" or tell me "it's not as complicated as you think and here's why"?

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Wendigo p. 281, unused skill points

everything seems to add up but there are points left over

skill points = 252
used = 240

Acrobatics +27 = +15 ranks, +9 Dex, +3 class skill
Bluff +28 = +18 ranks, +7 Cha, +3 class skill
Diplomacy +9 = +0 ranks, +7 Cha, +2 extra mods
Fly +33 = +15 ranks, +9 Dex, +3 class skill, +6 extra mods
Intimidate +29 = +15 ranks, +7 Cha, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Knowledge (arcana) +26 = +15 ranks, +8 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (geography) +26 = +18 ranks, +8 Int
Knowledge (nature) +26 = +18 ranks, +8 Int
Knowledge (religion) +26 = +18 ranks, +8 Int
Knowledge (planes) +29 = +18 ranks, +8 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +26 = +18 ranks, +5 Wis, +3 class skill
Sense Motive +26 = +18 ranks, +5 Wis, +3 class skill
Spellcraft +26 = +18 ranks, +8 Int
Stealth +26 = +18 ranks, +9 Dex, +3 class skill, -4 extra mods
Survival +23 = +18 ranks, +5 Wis

Chopswil, I know you use a program that tries to "figure out" the equation to get a creature's skills, right? When it does outsiders, does it auto-assign the top 4 non-class skills as class skills? I ask because I believe this creature simply never was assigned any of the 4 class skills it gets to choose. When you take out all the "+3 class skill" parts for those skills that aren't normal outsider class skills, and then increase the ranks from 15 to 18 it comes out normal but with two errors remaining:

1) Fly is still wrong, as they forgot to treat it as a class skill. It should be raised to +36
2) Intimidate is still wrong because the Persuasive feat isn't being treated as if the creature has 10 or more HD, which it does. It should be raised to +31.

Once that's all done, THEN you should pick 4 skill to be class skills, slapping an additional +3 to 'em.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Strife2002 wrote:


Chopswil, I know you use a program that tries to "figure out" the equation to get a creature's skills, right? When it does outsiders, does it auto-assign the top 4 non-class skills as class skills? I ask because I believe this creature simply never was assigned any of the 4 class skills it gets to choose.

How to handle outsider "themed" class skills is still one of the unanswered questions people have.

some outsiders seem to have unused/left over "themed" class skills and when you have unused ones with skills that are "themed" the questions becomes did they forget or not use a "themed" class skill slot on purpose or what?
Also you can't tell if they are unused "themed" skills unless you go back and break it all down so how are people to know you have two left over?

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

Some outsiders don't use all four of their "extra" class skills--at least, they don't use them on skills for which they have ranks.

Frex, a low-Int outsider that only gets 4 skill ranks per HD may only put ranks in Bluff, Knowledge (planes), Perception, and Stealth, all of which are already class skills for all outsiders. What its "extra" ones are is irrelevant for the default monster in the Bestiary, as the class skill bonus doesn't add unless you have ranks in a skill.

Grand Lodge

Sean K Reynolds wrote:

Some outsiders don't use all four of their "extra" class skills--at least, they don't use them on skills for which they have ranks.

Clearly, I was really just curious if his program auto-assigns 4 class skills to outsiders and tries to reverse-math them that way. In the case of the wendigo, I just thought it was weird that it had 7 skills with ranks in them that aren't outsider class skills and hadn't chosen any of them to be so.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Strife2002 wrote:


Clearly, I was really just curious if his program auto-assigns 4 class skills to outsiders and tries to reverse-math them that way. In the case of the wendigo, I just thought it was weird that it had 7 skills with ranks in them that aren't outsider class skills and hadn't chosen any of them to be so.

Basically, it checks to see if the skill is one of the given outsider class skills :Bluff, Craft, Knowledge (planes), Perception, Sense Motive, and Stealth. Also things like if it has a fly speed then it makes Fly a class skill.

If the skill hasn't been determined to be a class skill then it makes it a class skill as one of the "themed" ones, it also keeps track that there should only be four of these. 1st come alphabetically, first assigned.
So here Bluff, Knowledge (planes), Perception, Sense Motive, and Stealth are class skills with Acrobatics, Fly, Intimidate and Knowledge (arcana) as the 4 themed ones.
There is no way to tell what the monster designer "meant" to be the 4 themed skills in an example like this since it could have been Spellcraft as one of the 4; you reduce it by 3 ranks and give it +3 for class skill.

I'm just trying to see if the skill points add up in a case like this, not to tell you what the 4 themed class skills are because that's not possible.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I know it will never happen but I secretly wish they would mark the 4 themed class skills for outsiders with something like an *

Paizo Employee Creative Director

chopswil wrote:
I know it will never happen but I secretly wish they would mark the 4 themed class skills for outsiders with something like an *

I can certainly understand that. I'd even extend it to the outsider's saving throws, since which two are good saves varies as well. But that type of additional information falls just on the far side of my personal "clutter threshold" when it comes to making stat blocks as uncluttered as possible.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:
Strife2002 wrote:


Clearly, I was really just curious if his program auto-assigns 4 class skills to outsiders and tries to reverse-math them that way. In the case of the wendigo, I just thought it was weird that it had 7 skills with ranks in them that aren't outsider class skills and hadn't chosen any of them to be so.

Basically, it checks to see if the skill is one of the given outsider class skills :Bluff, Craft, Knowledge (planes), Perception, Sense Motive, and Stealth. Also things like if it has a fly speed then it makes Fly a class skill.

If the skill hasn't been determined to be a class skill then it makes it a class skill as one of the "themed" ones, it also keeps track that there should only be four of these. 1st come alphabetically, first assigned.
So here Bluff, Knowledge (planes), Perception, Sense Motive, and Stealth are class skills with Acrobatics, Fly, Intimidate and Knowledge (arcana) as the 4 themed ones.
There is no way to tell what the monster designer "meant" to be the 4 themed skills in an example like this since it could have been Spellcraft as one of the 4; you reduce it by 3 ranks and give it +3 for class skill.

I'm just trying to see if the skill points add up in a case like this, not to tell you what the 4 themed class skills are because that's not possible.

Cool cool. I figured that's how it worked I was just curious.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
chopswil wrote:
I know it will never happen but I secretly wish they would mark the 4 themed class skills for outsiders with something like an *
I can certainly understand that. I'd even extend it to the outsider's saving throws, since which two are good saves varies as well. But that type of additional information falls just on the far side of my personal "clutter threshold" when it comes to making stat blocks as uncluttered as possible.

met me half way?

could we get a list posted here of all the outsiders from the bestiaries and their class skills from the secret document that has all the notes and math?

Grand Lodge

Werebear (p.181) & Weretiger (p.183)

Lycanthropes in hybrid form take on the size of whatever creature is larger, either the base creature or the creature they transform into.

The werebear and the weretiger say their hybrid form is Medium, when the bear and the tiger are both Large animals. No biggie, simple errata would be to just increase their size as well as all the relevant stats associated with doing so (-1 attack, -1 AC, +1 CMB and CMD, increased space and possibly reach, -4 Stealth) but the bigger problem is in the equipment. It says that equipment doesn't meld into their forms between humanoid and hybrid forms, so what happens to all that Medium-sized equipment? Does the armor theatrically burst apart (becoming battered or broken) as its wearer grows in size? Does the bigger creature suddenly wield smaller than normal weapons and take penalties (i believe that's what happens when wielding unsuitably sized weapons)?

If I recall magical armor and weapons resize for the wearer (I could be wrong though), so that would be one solution, but not a great one.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

chopswil wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
chopswil wrote:
I know it will never happen but I secretly wish they would mark the 4 themed class skills for outsiders with something like an *
I can certainly understand that. I'd even extend it to the outsider's saving throws, since which two are good saves varies as well. But that type of additional information falls just on the far side of my personal "clutter threshold" when it comes to making stat blocks as uncluttered as possible.

met me half way?

could we get a list posted here of all the outsiders from the bestiaries and their class skills from the secret document that has all the notes and math?

Heh... no. I'm not interested in setting the precedent that everything we publish gets a 100% transparency/look-under-the-hood treatment. Mostly because I'd rather use that time to answer more than one question a week on these boards.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Strife2002 wrote:

Werebear (p.181) & Weretiger (p.183)

Lycanthropes in hybrid form take on the size of whatever creature is larger, either the base creature or the creature they transform into.

The werebear and the weretiger say their hybrid form is Medium, when the bear and the tiger are both Large animals. No biggie, simple errata would be to just increase their size as well as all the relevant stats associated with doing so (-1 attack, -1 AC, +1 CMB and CMD, increased space and possibly reach, -4 Stealth) but the bigger problem is in the equipment. It says that equipment doesn't meld into their forms between humanoid and hybrid forms, so what happens to all that Medium-sized equipment? Does the armor theatrically burst apart (becoming battered or broken) as its wearer grows in size? Does the bigger creature suddenly wield smaller than normal weapons and take penalties (i believe that's what happens when wielding unsuitably sized weapons)?

If I recall magical armor and weapons resize for the wearer (I could be wrong though), so that would be one solution, but not a great one.

In this case, I'd rather errata it to say that the hybrid form takes the size of their humanoid form.

In any event, when you change size and wear armor and that armor doesn't change size with you, I'd suggest that the armor gains the broken condition automatically as it pops its stitches and falls off.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

qlippoth, Thulgant p. 226, all saves off & CMD incorrect

Fort 21 = 12 +9
Ref 26 = 12 + 12 + 2 Lightning Reflexes
Will 20 = 12 + 8

SB says Fort +25, Ref +30, Will +18

CMD = 10 + BAB + StrMod + DexMod + SizeMod + ACBonus

55 = 10 + 20 +8 + 12 + 1 + 4

SB says CMD 51

Actually the SB is correct as far as the saves are concerned:

1) Only Fort and Ref are good saves for this creature. Will is a bad save for it.
2) You're forgetting to add in the constant cloak of chaos spell-like effect to those saves.

Fort +25= 12 base + 9 Con + 4 SLA
Ref +30= 12 base + 12 Dex + 2 feat + 4 SLA
Will +18= 6 base + 8 Wis + 4 SLA

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Qlippoth, Shoggti p. 225, unused skill points

skill points 49
used 46

Escape Artist +13 = +7 ranks, +3 Dex, +3 class skill
Intimidate +13 = +4 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Knowledge (planes) +11 = +7 ranks, +1 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +18 = +7 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Sense Motive +14 = +7 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +9 = +7 ranks, +3 Dex, +3 class skill, -4 extra mods
Use Magic Device +19 = +7 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill, +7 extra mods

Not an error. Intimidate is not intended to be a class skill.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

qlippoth, Iathavos p. 222, incorrect For & Will & CMD

Fort 24 = 14 + 10
Will 24 = 14 + 10

SB says +28 for both

CMD = 10 + BAB + StrMod + DexMod + SizeMod + ACBonus

62 = 10 + 24 +15 + (-1) + 8 + 6

SB says CMD 60

The saves are not an error.

Forgetting to add cloak of chaos constant spell-like ability to saves:

14 + 10 + 4 = 28

Now before anyone says "well wouldn't that make the Reflex save incorrect then?" Here's the equation for it and why it's correct in the SB.

8(bad base save) - 1(Dex) + 2(feat) + 6(spell-like abilities*)

*cloak of chaos(+4) and foresight(+2), both constant

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Protean, Naunet p. 216, skill points issue, Fly should be +12

skills points = 54
used = 53

If I give Fly 1 rank then it is +4 due to class skill so Fly+12 and SB has Fly +11

Acrobatics +15 = +9 ranks, +3 Dex, +3 class skill
Fly +8 = +0 ranks, +3 Dex, +6 extra mods
Intimidate +14 = +9 ranks, +2 Cha, +3 class skill
Perception +15 = +9 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +11 = +9 ranks, +3 Dex, +3 class skill, -4 extra mods
Survival +15 = +9 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Swim +25 = +9 ranks, +5 Str, +3 class skill, +8 extra mods

Check your math. You've used all of your skill ranks. 6 skills with 9 ranks in each = 54 ranks.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Strife2002 wrote:


Check your math. You've used all of your skill ranks. 6 skills with 9 ranks in each = 54 ranks.

true, but fly isn't what the Stat Block says it is

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:
Strife2002 wrote:


Check your math. You've used all of your skill ranks. 6 skills with 9 ranks in each = 54 ranks.
true, but fly isn't what the Stat Block says it is

Indeed. They did not implement the size penalty, it should be +9.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Inevitable, Kolyarut p. 163,unused skill points

skill points 72
used = 69

Diplomacy +22 = +12 ranks, +3 Cha, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Disguise +19 = +9 ranks, +3 Cha, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Knowledge (planes) +15 = +12 ranks, +0 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +22 = +12 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Sense Motive +22 = +12 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Survival +18 = +12 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill

Probably not an error. Disguise was not meant to be a class skill.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Gug p. 151, skill point issue, unused skill points

skill points = 60
used = 57

Climb +15 = +0 ranks, +7 Str, +8 extra mods
Escape Artist +13 = +5 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill, +4 extra mods
Knowledge (dungeoneering) +10 = +7 ranks, +0 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +27 = +15 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill, +6 extra mods
Stealth +15 = +15 ranks, +1 Dex, +3 class skill, -4 extra mods
Survival +21 = +15 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill

Probably just forgot to make Knowledge (dungeoneering) a class skill. Raise to +13.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Gloomwing p. 133, multiple issues

Fort computed 4 (good) + 2 = +6
SB says Fort +2

Minor formatting, missing comma between Wis value and Cha

1 unused skill point

skill points = 10
used = 9

Fly +5 = +0 ranks, +3 Dex, +2 extra mods
Perception +8 = +4 ranks, +1 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +7 = +5 ranks, +3 Dex, +3 class skill, -4 extra mods

Skill point issue is indeed valid. However, the Fort save should be +3, not +2 or +6:

1 (bad base save, Ref and Will are the good ones) + 2 (Con) = +3 Fort

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Draugr p. 110 ,skill point conundrum

Climb should be +6
if I add a rank to Climb it is also a class skill so it will add +4 and make it +7
also Swim is a class skill so there should be an extra +3 there too but then we are over the stated +11
I've only used 6 of 9 skill points too, so 3 left over
A whole lot doesn't add up.

skill points = 9

Climb +3 = +0 ranks, +3 Str
Perception +6 = +3 ranks, +0 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +6 = +3 ranks, +0 Dex, +3 class skill
Swim +11 = +0 ranks, +3 Str, +8 extra mods

Climb in the stat block says +6 but it should actually be +9. They just forgot to treat it as a class skill:

3(ranks) + 3(Str) + 3(class skill) = 9 Climb
3(ranks) + 3(class skill) = 6 Perception
3(ranks) + 3(class skill) = 6 Stealth
3(Str) + 8(swim speed) = 11 Swim

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

With potential skill point errors it is difficult to tell what the author "meant" to do and there is usually more than one way to fix it.

I just like to "lay out the math" as I see it to show the discrepancy and the Paizo people can make the fix needed to make the numbers add up.

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

Adult Umbral Dragon p. 102 two totally different Feats and Skills sections in Stat Block

Feats Critical Focus, Hover, Improved Critical (bite), Improved
Initiative, Improved Vital Strike, Multiattack, Power Attack,
Skill Focus (Stealth), Snatch, Vital Strike
Skills Bluff +25, Diplomacy +25, Fly +12, Knowledge (arcana,
local, planes) +25, Perception +25, Sense Motive +25,
Spellcraft +25, Stealth +18
Feats Hover, Imp. Critical (bite), Imp. Initiative, Imp. Vital Strike,
Multiattack, Power Attack, Skill Focus (Stealth), Snatch, Vital Strike
Skills Bluff +24, Diplomacy +24, Fly +16, Know (arcana, local, planes)
+24, Perception +24, Sense Motive +24, Stealth +18, Survival +24

yep yep. It looks like the first listing of feats is invalid, as it has one too many feats for the number of HD this creature has. I'd say delete it and take the second list of feats.

The opposite for skills, the second set of skills is invalid for this creature compared to the first set which fits in nicely based on the number of skill points this creature gets.

In summary, delete the first listing of feats and second listing of skills. If you wanted to be really thorough you could then reverse the remaining feats and skills lists in order to stick to the normal formatting order (first feats, then skills).

Grand Lodge

chopswil wrote:

repost

Daemon, Meladaemon p. 69, skill point issues

154 points but I had to give 17 ranks to Survival to make the number work, but there are only 14 HD so that can't be correct.

skill points = 154

Bluff +21 = +14 ranks, +4 Cha, +3 class skill
Fly +19 = +12 ranks, +6 Dex, +3 class skill, +-2 extra mods
Heal +11 = +5 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Intimidate +21 = +14 ranks, +4 Cha, +3 class skill
Knowledge (planes) +22 = +14 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (religion) +22 = +14 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +20 = +14 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Sense Motive +20 = +14 ranks, +3 Wis, +3 class skill
Spellcraft +22 = +14 ranks, +5 Int, +3 class skill
Stealth +19 = +14 ranks, +6 Dex, +3 class skill, +-4 extra mods
Survival +20 = +17 ranks, +3 Wis
Use Magic Device +14 = +10 ranks, +4 Cha

I'm getting a different result. Still wrong though.

My equations rely on the Fly skill being calculated based on the fly spell, which is what this creature uses to fly. That means NO maneuverability bonus (which, by the way, should be good, another mistake, since this uses the fly spell) and a bonus equal to 1/2 its caster level. I'm also not certain if Fly should be included as a natural class skill, since it technically isn't "natural," it uses a spell (i've asked about this on the boards several times but haven't really heard a response). For purposes of this, we're going to assume it's a class skill naturally based on its flight speed. * marks a natural class skill, ! marks one of the 4 class skills chosen:

* Bluff +21= 4(Cha) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
* Fly +19= 6(Dex) - 2(size) + 5(half CL) + 3(class) + 7(ranks)
Heal +11= 3(Wis) + 8(ranks)
! Intimidate +21= 4(Cha) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
* Knowledge (planes) +22= 5(Int) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
! Knowledge (religion) +22= 5(Int) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
* Perception +20= 3(Wis) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
* Sense Motive +20= 3(Wis) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
! Spellcraft +22= 5(Int) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
* Stealth +19= 6(Dex) - 4(size) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
! Survival +20= 3(Wis) + 3(class) + 14(ranks)
Use Magic Device +14= 4(Cha) + 10(ranks)

TOTAL: 154 skill points
TOTAL USED: 141 skill points

I'm not even sure where to start here...

Grand Lodge

Daemon, Meladaemon p. 69

Wrong fly maneuverability. Since this creature uses fly spell to fly, it should have a maneuverability of good, not average.

Grand Lodge

Strife2002 wrote:
chopswil wrote:

repost

Daemon, Meladaemon p. 69, skill point issues
...

I'm getting a different result. Still wrong though.

...

Whoops, I meant Total Used: 151.

Come to think of it, the stat block may be correct because it's unknown whether Fly is supposed to be treated as a class skill.

"You're dumb. It has a fly speed. Creatures with fly speeds have Fly as a class skill."

This is true, but the question is do creatures who use the spell fly as their means of flight, like this creature does, get it as a class skill. If they don't, then the stat block is actually correct.

Grand Lodge

Drakir2010 wrote:
chopswil wrote:

Demon, Omox p. 79, skills ranks exceeded, need more points; missing mod?

I had to give 16 ranks to swim to make it work but that can't be, only 13 HD. If I take a class skill from somewhere else for Swim there is still an issue, I'm 3 point over.

skill points = 104
use 107

Acrobatics +23 = +13 ranks, +7 Dex, +3 class skill
Climb +32 = +13 ranks, +8 Str, +3 class skill, +8 extra mods
Escape Artist +23 = +0 ranks, +7 Dex, +16 extra mods
Knowledge (dungeoneering) +18 = +13 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Knowledge (planes) +18 = +13 ranks, +2 Int, +3 class skill
Perception +28 = +13 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill, +8 extra mods
Sense Motive +20 = +13 ranks, +4 Wis, +3 class skill
Stealth +23 = +13 ranks, +7 Dex, +3 class skill
Swim +32 = +16 ranks, +8 Str, +8 extra mods

The 4 'theme-appropriate' skills are Acrobatics, Climb, Knowledge (dungeoneering) and Swim, so no issue there.

Incorrect, 3 of the 4 'theme-appropriate' skills are Acrobatics, Climb, and Knowledge (dungeoneering). Swim is a natural class skill because this creature has the aquatic subtype. The last (4th) chosen class skill is not displayed in the stat block.

Grand Lodge

Drakir2010 wrote:
chopswil wrote:

Daemon, Olethrodaemon p. 70, incorrect CMD

...

Further: Saving throws are strange. Firstly, it seems that the weak save of daemons is not consistent. Some are standard Outsiders (weak fort), some are weak will (Derghodaemon), and Olethrodaemon appears to be weak reflex. That said...

fort: 20 good Hit Dice(12) + Con Modifier(13) = 25 total
Reflex: 20 poor Hit Dice(6) + Dex modifier(8) = 14 total
Will: 20 good Hit Dice(12) + Wis modifier(8) + Iron Will(2) = 22 total

These are consistently 4 points below the listed value.

You're forgetting to add in the bonus from unholy aura which adds +4 to all saves.

Cheliax

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Strife2002 wrote:
Drakir2010 wrote:
chopswil wrote:
Demon, Omox p. 79...
The last (4th) chosen class skill is not displayed in the stat block.

you're guessing to make the numbers add up

Grand Lodge

vip00 wrote:

P. 44

goliath stag beetle's trample and bite damage don't match and it doesn't have any feats being mindless. In theory they should be equal!

Trample uses a creature's slam damage to determine damage, not bite. Though this creature doesn't have a slam attack, a creature its size (Huge) would normally have a base slam damage of 1d8. Instead it has a trample damage of 2d8, so maybe that's an error? Also its bite damage is 3d8 when a creature of its size normally has a base bite damage of 2d6.

Either way, speculating on whether this is an error or not is impossible since the table detailing these attacks has a footnote that says the damage values may vary from creature to creature. Kind of makes fact checking impossible.

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