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PFS Special 2010: Year of the Shadow Lodge (Spoiler Inside)


Pathfinder Society GM Discussion

Qadira ****

I was one of the table GMs this weekend at Atlanta Comic Con for this mod. I loved it and thought it was pretty exciting. My only question is - why the hell can you not buy dragon armor after this scenario? This is the first one I can remember seeing where you fight and kill dragons, yet it does not give you the ability to buy armor. I think at the special we killed like 20+ dragons total.

I heard from another player that they have played in only 1 scenario where you can buy dragon armor. And the only reason that's the case is because the guy had dragon armor and when he dropped, it was one of the things the chronicle sheet allowed you to buy. To me, that's kind of off.

Do you think we could make a change regarding this for this scenario?

Taldor *****

Joseph Caubo wrote:

I was one of the table GMs this weekend at Atlanta Comic Con for this mod. I loved it and thought it was pretty exciting. My only question is - why the hell can you not buy dragon armor after this scenario? This is the first one I can remember seeing where you fight and kill dragons, yet it does not give you the ability to buy armor. I think at the special we killed like 20+ dragons total.

I heard from another player that they have played in only 1 scenario where you can buy dragon armor. And the only reason that's the case is because the guy had dragon armor and when he dropped, it was one of the things the chronicle sheet allowed you to buy. To me, that's kind of off.

Do you think we could make a change regarding this for this scenario?

+1, good thinking.

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber

How many of those dragons where wearing fully made Dragon Armor?...

Grand Lodge ***

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Card Game Subscriber

Hmm.. postmonster ate my answer. The following are just my perspective, and meant to help explain.

I don't think that access to a special material should necessarily give you the item crafted from it. If you found a darkwood tree, would you expect to automatically see all items made from it on the chronicle?

Do all of the characters have the Survival and Craft skills that would be necessary to make the armour?

Spoiler:
The special, as written, includes several random encounters, so it is impossible to know what quantity and size of dragons a party faces.

Spoiler:
There is not enough time for a party to be skinning and curing the dragon hides as they are racing from the Irorium, through the streets, and into the mausoleum.

I agree that the hide should be considered as treasure, just not an available crafted item.

Glad you enjoyed it, it's a fun event!

Taldor *****

Dragnmoon wrote:

How many of those dragons where wearing fully made Dragon Armor?...

So in Absalom there are no artisans and armorers who are qualified to craft dragon scale armor for purchase after the events? Seems like if those who wrote the mod were so inclined they could have included the armor's availability without anyone complaining about its inclusion.

Qadira ****

It's not like you could ever take the hide from the animal right there during the Scenario. But I think it's kinda crap that you play through the only Scenario to have dragons, yet you can't get dragonhide armor. Yet, you can play a different one where one guy you kill has dragonhide armor, and then you can purchase it for your character.

You can buy darkwood at any time I believe, it's just dragonhide that you cannot.

And I think you do have enough time, considering dead dragons will be littered all over the place.

Grand Lodge ***

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Card Game Subscriber

Todd. you are probably right that no one would ever complain about getting something extra :)

Bottom line is that finding material should not give you access to a finished product, unless getting the product made was included in the scenario.

Taldor *****

K Neil Shackleton wrote:

Todd. you are probably right that no one would ever complain about getting something extra :)

Bottom line is that finding material should not give you access to a finished product, unless getting the product made was included in the scenario.

I was just re-reading the section on materials, it looks like Dragon hide armor is available as long as you have the PA's for it.

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber
Todd Lower wrote:
K Neil Shackleton wrote:

Todd. you are probably right that no one would ever complain about getting something extra :)

Bottom line is that finding material should not give you access to a finished product, unless getting the product made was included in the scenario.

I was just re-reading the section on materials, it looks like Dragon hide armor is available as long as you have the PA's for it.

Correct

Qadira ****

Dragnmoon wrote:
Todd Lower wrote:
K Neil Shackleton wrote:

Todd. you are probably right that no one would ever complain about getting something extra :)

Bottom line is that finding material should not give you access to a finished product, unless getting the product made was included in the scenario.

I was just re-reading the section on materials, it looks like Dragon hide armor is available as long as you have the PA's for it.
Correct

False. On page 24 it states:

Quote:
All basic armor, gear, items, and weapons from Chapter 6 (the equipment chapter) of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook. This does not include equipment made from dragonhide, but it does include equipment made from the other special materials such as alchemical silver and cold iron (see Special Materials section on page 154 of the Core Rulebook).

Grand Lodge **

Joseph Caubo wrote:


False. On page 24 it states:

Ahem.

Let's be careful. This was clarified quite some time ago :)

Taldor

I got to play at the atlanta comic con and i wasnt greatly impressed by the player rewards the cash was nice but for the risk getting a reroll wasnt great IMO....was saving up some gold in hopes of some ability to buy some nice gear for my charecter but to no avail

Grand Lodge *** Venture-Captain, Canada—Edmonton aka Northron

I had a chance to play this scenario at Gen Con, and I had a blast! I ended up being one of two clerics in the party, and a good thing too. As I was playing a first level character, I wasn't too worried one way or another about dragon hide armour; it will be a while before I can afford anything that fancy-schmancy. :)

But I do agree, it would have seemed appropriate to have dragon hide available at the end. Maybe we'll see it somewhere down the line...

Taldor

maybe im too used to specials from the other company....great xp a boon some good gold and a item choice. course if i had to put a gold value on what we faced id say we got gipped.....maybe a special pathfinder society magic medallion for our charecters to impress the new members and give them something to look foreward to, tho now im imagining it in about 5 years wearing all the items from the specials its gonnna look like pimp my adventurer

Taldor *****

Mikado67 wrote:
maybe im too used to specials from the other company....great xp a boon some good gold and a item choice. course if i had to put a gold value on what we faced id say we got gipped.....maybe a special pathfinder society magic medallion for our charecters to impress the new members and give them something to look foreward to, tho now im imagining it in about 5 years wearing all the items from the specials its gonnna look like pimp my adventurer

Cool . . . Yes I vote for that, pimped out Taldoran adventurer. I can see it now . . .

Grand Lodge ***

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Card Game Subscriber

Some historical perspective:

I have been involved with 4 PFS "Specials" so far: the Drow one at GenCon 08, the Grand Convocation at PaizoCon 09, the Passion at GenCon 09, and this year's Year of The Shadow Lodge.

Each has become better. The writing has become more clear to offset the chaos of such a large event. The balance of encounters has improved, to allow the involvement of characters of every level. The scale of the storyline has become more appropriate.

The only one to offer significant character rewards was the Convocation at PaizoCon. It also included several significant character penalties. My character earned some magic arrows, a divine mission which would allow a permanent Wis bump, and a noble title. He also got penalties to attacks for the duration of the con, and lost access to a feat for a year. However, with the rewards/penalties being somewhat imbalanced, and the conversion to PFRPG, everything from the Convocation was declared void a few weeks later when Season 1 started.

The specials are a work in progress. I think that your feedback will help make future specials better. In the meantime, I think you should consider the unique experience of playing in such a large scale game as a reward in itself.

Grand Lodge **

K Neil Shackleton wrote:
The specials are a work in progress. I think that your feedback will help make future specials better. In the meantime, I think you should consider the unique experience of playing in such a large scale game as a reward in itself.

This year was my first. My first Gen Con and of course my first Special. I am very, very excited to be able to share that special event at Who's Yer Con 2011 in March!

Grand Lodge *****

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Tales Subscriber

I was a GM at PaizoCon UK and have to say I really enjoyed it with the low tier group at my table.

The very first scene got a little bit delayed - so waiting for the others and doing some fluff one member in the group suddenly says "I want a drink". being aware of the impending signal for action and what is to follow I reply that splitting the party is no good idea.
So the whole party in unison says - we all want a drink. What then happened was a tiny bit off script.

Spoiler:

I didn't have any props / maps for the location of scene 1 - but I had a bar and lots of barrels as part of my DwarvenForge Scenery that I had lugged around. So on the spot I decide - isn't it a great idea if I build up a drinks stall just at the entrance to where scene is supposed to happen and we take it from there. Makes sense role-play wise as this would give the low level players a head start and also a reason to avoid all the dragon.

I guess we where the only group who fought the gobbos outside at the drink stall. They never got their drink as the first wave dropped while they queued and nobody served after that.

But we had a memorable gob death - a dropped barrel that one player tried to take in the chaos went with a nat 19 on top of one of the goblins. So no drinks - but a great scene.

Thod

Shadow Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Alma

Ok, I've been looking this over for Marmalade Dog. Not really that impressed with it.

First question, where is the entrance to the Mausoleum at? D1 doesn't seem like it should be the entrance, but besides the courtyard (which wouldn't make sense either) I can't figure out where the entrance should be.

Shadow Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Alma

9 days, no answers... So, anyone have answers to previous questions?
Also, where's the door supposed to be for d8? There's only one door in D7, and that goes into a room with no description, and there isn't any door to d8. Do they have to deactivate the artifact? If everyone were to bypass it, and the first round they open the door to d8 (which isn't there, maybe invisible?) then what happens? is it impossible to make the str check required to get to the next room until the machine is destroyed? One spot says the door is locked, yet another place says its just been piton'd on the other side and only needs the str check.

With an event that is this "special" I really would have thought it would have been put together better or match the map at least...

I haven't seen Blood under Absalom, but I hope it was put together better than this one.

Qadira ****

I was a table Judge for this this past week end, and may be able to help a little.

If I remember (I do not have it in front of me right now) the Door into the Mausoleum is from D3 - which appears to be a courtyard. the PCs inter into the building thru a door from D3 to the inside of the building (D2 I think, or maybe to D1).

the door to D8 is dark - perhaps because it was intended to be locked. THe PCs go thru a door at the bottom of the page into a small room, then up into the "darkened" door into D8.

Or at least that's the way we did it.

Taldor **** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Northwestern Indiana aka VanceMadrox

I'm prepping this to run at Marmalade Dog this weekend too.

The entrance to D1 is from D3 the courtyard.

The Courtyard makes sense to me as the entrance, what doesn't make sense is why it's numbered D3, I would have made it D1.

The door into D8 is dark as nosig said. In the pdf it's at the very top of the map.

Blood Under Absalom was had fewer issues than this (although it still had 1 big oversight) but IMO is nowhere near as cool. The fights are mostly cakewalks at every tier and there's barely any table interaction.

Shadow Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Alma

Thanks guys. I had figured D3 made the most sense for an entrance, but I'm with you VanceMadrox, it would have made more sense if it were D1 instead of D3, though having to sneak/run past the dragon twice in a row seems a little off to me as well.

Qadira ****

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Eric:
we had a fun event happen during the running...

spoiler:

I was running a low tier table (1-2) and when the adventure got to the main gate (Disable Device DC60?!!!)our "big guy" (a 3rd level Dwarven druid) anounces he's going up and using an AR boon that he has. It allows his PC to succeed at "any one skill check the PC is untrained in" .... and he opens the gate.

I called the head judge. Who looked it over and went to tell the high level table that they saw a Dwarven druid walk up and push the gate open. From the Tier 1-2 table. It was one of the high lights of the night for the table.

**

3rd GM here. I've almost completed my prep. If you look at the map on page 15, it shows a path leading into the courtyard. So I agree, D3 to D1 is the way in.

If anyone has extras of the needed flip-mats, I'd like to borrow them.

-Swiftbrook

Silver Crusade ****

Just my two cents, I ran BUA and am prepping as master GM for M-Dog. This one seems more dynamic and epic compared to BUA. BUA just seemed like a giant combative slug out with just enough story to make qualify as a B-movie action flick in my book. If 1970's kung fu movie was what they were going for, then they got it right.

Silver Crusade ****

Swiftbrook wrote:

3rd GM here. I've almost completed my prep. If you look at the map on page 15, it shows a path leading into the courtyard. So I agree, D3 to D1 is the way in.

If anyone has extras of the needed flip-mats, I'd like to borrow them.

-Swiftbrook

I believe I have a copy of the arena that was a black & white printout another player gave me in my pile of maps somewhere. I'll look for it tonight, and if so you can use it and I'll bring it to the con.

Taldor **** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Northwestern Indiana aka VanceMadrox

Eric Clingenpeel wrote:
Thanks guys. I had figured D3 made the most sense for an entrance, but I'm with you VanceMadrox, it would have made more sense if it were D1 instead of D3, though having to sneak/run past the dragon twice in a row seems a little off to me as well.

As I'm reading it I don't think you have to Twice.

It describes evading the dragon in the first part of Act 4 which is the mausoleum.

This part takes place in the location marked D3.

When I played it this is how it was ran, we only had to avoid the dragon once.

Now why the text for the dragon isn't in section D3 (which should have been D1) I couldn't tell you.

BTW do you have a preference on what Tier level to run? I generally prefer Mid levels but can run high if nobody else wants to.

Shadow Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Alma

I prefer lower tier (assuming I'm needed to run it, I'm the alternate GM) But I can run any of them.

I am excited to get the chance to actually use my city market flip mat. :) I've had it for years, and this is the first scenario I've encountered that has it in it.

By not doubling up (entrance/courtyard) that should help to speed things up too. And it does make sense, even if the numbering is wacky...

Silver Crusade ****

I will attempt to match everyone to their tier of choice. I don't have a whole lot of control over who shows up with what though.

Taldor **** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Northwestern Indiana aka VanceMadrox

Agreed, the number is very wacky.

Dan I can be flexible about which tier I need to run.

My wife is hoping to play her 9th so hopefully we can get a table of higher levels.

Swiftbrook what's your preference?

Qadira ****

I was kind of puzzled by the Market encounter

Market:
I think the discription says the goblins can fire over the barricade - yet it falls on people. I get the image of a 4' pile of boxes falling and crushing the feet of a PC 10 feet away. Did I read this wrong?

Silver Crusade ****

nosig wrote:

I was kind of puzzled by the Market encounter

** spoiler omitted **

I would probably explain it that there are "towers" on the barricades, that the goblins are shooting in between the towers and over their little walls. It's the only way I can envision their traps and them not standing on their "Trap of Doom".

Alternatively, maybe they are on a 10' high barricade and they go with the trap. They are goblins after all. They don't exactly think these kind of things through.

Edit: If I were running this as a session GM, I would go with option B, just because in my mind it explains the way goblins think all too well, and daring players have the option to intentionally set off the traps to get the goblins. I would probably just kill the goblins outright for story purposes and the fact that the player took the risk to off the goblins.

**

VanceMadrox wrote:
Swiftbrook what's your preference?

Prefered: 3-4.

Will do fine: 1-6
Don't put me there: 10-11

Looking to have a blast!

-Swiftbrook

**

nosig wrote:

I was kind of puzzled by the Market encounter

** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
For me, the traps as described, don't make sense. They can't be set up quickly, they can't have rocks falling on you, etc. I don't care, I'll just say something like:

"you triggered a trap, roll a Reflex save"
"you snagged a tripwire and have fallen on some very sharp debris ..."

-Swiftbrook

Taldor **** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Northwestern Indiana aka VanceMadrox

Ok Dan if we do have a higher level table I'll take it.

Silver Crusade ****

VanceMadrox wrote:
Ok Dan if we do have a higher level table I'll take it.

Noted

Taldor **** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Northwestern Indiana aka VanceMadrox

Any of you guys have an extra Dragon Mini I could borrow for the mod?

Silver Crusade ****

I have a medium black dragon from the 3.5 era beginner box. I will have it with me.

Another note: I've been getting over a really bad cold that has knocked me completely out of gaming the last two weeks. If my voice has not returned to yelling capability by Saturday. I may need one of you guys to do the group announcements for me as much as that sucks. I'm rapidly on the mend, so this may be a moot point.

Qadira ****

Good luck everyone - I think this was a fun little adventure!

Shadow Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Alma

I'm tempted to bring my gargantuan black in the off chance we have a group that fights her... even though Pathfinder doesn't have a gargantuan sized dragon anymore... :/

Silver Crusade ****

Eric Clingenpeel wrote:
I'm tempted to bring my gargantuan black in the off chance we have a group that fights her... even though Pathfinder doesn't have a gargantuan sized dragon anymore... :/

I say we drop the figure on the highest table, minus stats... lol

Taldor **** Venture-Lieutenant, Indiana—Northwestern Indiana aka VanceMadrox

Eric Clingenpeel wrote:
I'm tempted to bring my gargantuan black in the off chance we have a group that fights her... even though Pathfinder doesn't have a gargantuan sized dragon anymore... :/

You should definitely bring it with you

**

Dan Luckett wrote:
Eric Clingenpeel wrote:
I'm tempted to bring my gargantuan black in the off chance we have a group that fights her... even though Pathfinder doesn't have a gargantuan sized dragon anymore... :/
I say we drop the figure on the highest table, minus stats... lol

I'm bringing my medium, large, Paizo huge, just in case .... I can bring my gargantuan as well .... maybe for effect at the tier 3-4 table ;-)

-Swiftbrook

Silver Crusade ****

By all means, I have no problem with you altering the size of the dragon facing your particular table for "cinematic" effect, as long as it's real stats reflect the tier. That and having the "correct" size dragon unless you're an avid mini collector is unlikely.

I think this is the 2nd scenario in which I've seen an actual dragon. The last one was a small...and we killed it in 1 round. Paladin A and Paladin B smite evil, pound pound pound = grease spot on the floor.

Shadow Lodge ***** Venture-Captain, Michigan—Alma

Ok, since this was my first time with a special, I've got another question. I just assumed that the gm's would get the boon for their character's level too, but just remembered that gm's don't get boons. Does this include the specials? :/

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber
Eric Clingenpeel wrote:
Does this include the specials? :/

Yes GMs get a Boon from this.

a rule they have followed so far is when all there is are boons, the GM gets them as well.

Grand Lodge ****

can anyone tell me what the table rewards should be? The convention Boons? and do all the players at a table get them?

Andoran *****

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Deluxe Comics Subscriber
zrinka znidarcic wrote:
can anyone tell me what the table rewards should be? The convention Boons? and do all the players at a table get them?

There will only be a Convention boon if it meets the requirement of Boon support for Conventions, 15 tables.

The Boons for the Special are on the Chronicle Sheet, which everyone gets for completing

On how Convention boons are handed out are up to the Organizer of the Convention with input from Mike and their VC.

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