stuart haffenden |
If you prefer a more minimal sheet design, if you have an idea how it can be done, then I seriously urge you to have a go at designing it. I'll give feedback and help with technical stuff where I can, and even share publicity if I think the result is good. The creation of a good set of minimal character sheets for Pathfinder can only be a good thing.
Here is a LINK to a pdf of my sheet. I usually use it in it's excel form and have some calculations going on but I can't to the with pdf's!
sadie |
Here is a LINK to a pdf of my sheet. I usually use it in it's excel form and have some calculations going on but I can't to the with pdf's!
I must confess, I don't like it - though I would say that of course. :)
I think it looks very boxy, just like the original sheet does. I've tried hard in mine to eliminate unnecessary lines, especially in grid areas like the AC calculation.
The saving throw calculations have their totals at the bottom, rather than on the left. I think consistent layout is important.
The skills box isn't flexible: a character can have more than one craft, more than one profession, more than one perform (in fact the latter is obligatory for a Bard), and various unanticipated knowledges. On the other hand, not all the standard skills are relevant to a given character. If you expanded the box to the bottom with empty lines, at the expense of the notes there, it would be more flexible. Also, in Pathfinder you don't care which class contributes to a class skill, so the 4 columns of checkboxes can become 1.
It has nowhere to record what spells a character knows / has prepared, nor details of the selected class such as schools, domains, bloodlines and so on. For some classes these details are essential. It also doesn't list the hit dice and skill ranks for each class.
There's no space to put the special properties of armour, shields or worn items. And I think they belong together.
Why is the AC section repeated? And the buffs section feels like it takes a great deal of space.
The use of colour to represent stats is a nice idea, but I don't like the gradients. I tried a similar approach with colours but never got it to work in a way I was happy with.
It feels very tight: printed on A4 or Letter, the writing would be tiny. But that's to be expected, since you're pushing so much detail into so little space.
Taken as a whole, it feels disorganised. The big split between Offence and Defence is good, but the Inventory belongs in a group with the money, the worn items and the Armour and Shield. The second page feels more careless than the first, and the latter three pages are just sloppy in comparison. It lacks the support pages for spells, inventory, animal companions and so on. These things need recording somewhere.
Tilquinith |
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One thing I've noticed that really bugs me is that on the front page for skills and abilities and whatnot. The ability scores are listed as
STR
CON
DEX
INT
WIS
CHA
All the other sheets I've used including both official sheets that Paizo has go like this
STR
DEX
CON
INT
WIS
CHA
I don't suppose you could change that?
Doodpants |
maven009 wrote:the inability to type info into itIf I were designing electronic sheets they'd be very different - it would do far more for you, rather than having all the calculations up front. But electronic sheets are banned in our group, because if the players have an excuse to have a laptop open at the gaming table they'll never pay attention. I spend enough hours at a keyboard already.
I personally always create my character sheet electronically, and then print it out to bring to the table. Mostly this is because my handwriting is atrocious. :-) But it has other benefits, too. I can email a copy to the DM on request. Or when it gets too dog-eared/worn-out/soda-stained, I can just print out another copy. And when it's time to level up, I can save off a copy before modifying it, so I have an archive of my character at each level.
It has nothing to do with bringing a laptop to the table.
Tamago RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 |
One minor error on the Cavalier page: The Challenges Per Day lists the calculation as: 1 + ([Cavalier Level] / 3) + [Misc]. However, the APG says: "The cavalier can use this ability once per day at 1st level, plus one additional time per day for every three levels beyond 1st, to a maximum of seven times per day at 19th level."
I believe the sheet should say:
1 + (([Cavalier Level] - 1) / 3) + [Misc].
I still would like to see "Challenges Used Today" checkboxes on the Cavalier sheet.
Also, shouldn't all Knowledge skills on the Barbarian class sheet be forbidden during Rage? Knowledge: Arcana is the only one checked on the sheet by default.
Regarding the layout of the NPC sheet, I like Version 2 better. It makes more sense to me to put the Combat Manoeuvres with the offensive attacks. I do like how Version 1 has the Hit Points at the top, though. That will probably be the most often changed field, so it would be nice for it to be easy to find/see.
Awesome stuff; keep up the good work!
sadie |
I believe the sheet should say:
1 + (([Cavalier Level] - 1) / 3) + [Misc].
I try to avoid double brackets in calculations, it makes it seem more complicated than it is and puts people off.
How about this:
([Cavalier Level] / 3) + [Misc] (Rounded up)
sadie |
All the other sheets I've used including both official sheets that Paizo has go like thisSTR
DEX
CON
INT
WIS
CHAI don't suppose you could change that?
Can I have a show of hands for who prefers it that way round?
nidho |
Tilquinith wrote:Can I have a show of hands for who prefers it that way round?
All the other sheets I've used including both official sheets that Paizo has go like thisSTR
DEX
CON
INT
WIS
CHAI don't suppose you could change that?
*raises hand*
I like your sheets a lot and I'm taking steps to get my players start using them soon.
I could get used to use them as they are, but if it doesn't matter to you I'd like them to use the traditional layout.
Kendril Shad |
Tilquinith wrote:Can I have a show of hands for who prefers it that way round?
All the other sheets I've used including both official sheets that Paizo has go like thisSTR
DEX
CON
INT
WIS
CHAI don't suppose you could change that?
*Raises hand...
...starts shaking hand...
...
supports shaking hand with other hand.
In all seriousness though, these are awesome sheets. What program did you use to create them?
sadie |
What program did you use to create them?
Adobe Illustrator, mostly. I stitch all the pages together in Acrobat, and use its optimiser to shrink it. The introduction (which I haven't added to the Pathfinder version yet) was done in InDesign, and the cover (likewise) in Photoshop. Compressed the result in 7zip.
If you look at the open source site on Google Code, you can download the files I used. You're free to alter them if you wish, and I'll even accept submissions if they're good. This isn't as relevant for Pathfinder, but 3.5 had a stupid number of classes. Seriously, go take a look. The file's nearly 100 pages.
Jagyr Ebonwood |
*Raises hand*
I love these sheets! The only things on my wishlist would be an option to remove the slot labels on the magic item section (since my campaign uses slotless bonuses instead of physical items), and as others have requested, a reordering of the physical stats to match up with the standard sheet.
Oh, just remembered another thing - class sheets that have abilities prewritten might interfere with APG archetypes that substitute some of those abilities.
Otherwise, I love these sheets, and plan on recommending them for players in my upcoming game.
sadie |
The sheets are great (really) but the doodle characters are absolutely awesome! Made me smile. Had a rough day.
They're cute, aren't they? I pinched them (with the artist's permission, of course) from D&D Doodle.
Oh, just remembered another thing - class sheets that have abilities prewritten might interfere with APG archetypes that substitute some of those abilities.
I know. They'll never be 100% perfect for each variation, but I do plan to adjust the core sheets at some point to make them a little more flexible. For example, the Ranger is no longer limited to the two combat styles, so I'll either replace it with a completely blank box like the domain or add a third blank column to fill in.
If a feature is removed in a variant, then it can just be crossed out. It's when a variant adjusts the existing features it can get more complicated.
Tilquinith |
First off, I prefer version 2 for the NPC sheet.
Second, I noticed the ability associated with Acrobatics on the skill list you have as STR instead of DEX.
Great sheets, I plan on using them this coming sunday.
One more thing, some sort of page reference on the multipage monster of a character sheet would be helpful to guide people as to which pages they need to print for a particular character sheets. Like a table of contents or something.
sadie |
with Acrobatics on the skill list you have as STR instead of DEX.
Dang, you're right!
Like a table of contents or something.
For the next version (probably out this weekend), I will have a table of contents, as well as the cover and introduction from the 3.5 version. I wanted to have most of the pages in place before I did the table of contents, so I wasn't rewriting it every five minutes. :)
Tilquinith |
Had another idea.
For the NPC cards, there's a box in the upper right corner on the line for class. I'm assuming that this may have been intended for noting the npc's level. Instead I write their level next to thier class names because they may be multiclassed and so I use the little box to mark down their CR. Any chance you could label it as such?
sadie |
Had another idea.
For the NPC cards, there's a box in the upper right corner on the line for class. I'm assuming that this may have been intended for noting the npc's level. Instead I write their level next to thier class names because they may be multiclassed and so I use the little box to mark down their CR. Any chance you could label it as such?
If people use it for different things, surely it's better unlabelled? Or I'd need two boxes, one for level and one for CR? The same applies for the box to the right of XP on the main sheet: it's there for "XP needed for next level", but so many groups use different forms of XP that I've left it for whatever your group uses it for.
I really need to rationalise the level/CR/hit dice section of the Animal Companion sheet. What boxes do I actually need there?
sadie |
i'd say class level of creature. maybe a check box for a -3 to level (think ranger. don't know who else has this) maybe a box for when it inproves, usually 4 or 7. HD is a must i think. A Bonus tricks box and a place for all of them would be nice also...
Thokk, this is entirely my fault rather than yours, but I barely understood a word of that. Can you explain again?
The same sheet serves Familiars, Animal Companions, Mounts and Summoned Creatures, so I don't want it to be fixed to anything too specific like Ranger levels.
Thokk the Ruleslaywer |
i do apologise for the confusion. I've been up all night. sorry...
I ment a box for total class level of the creature, one for hit dice of creature. a box to check (and show) if there is a level penalty (like the ranger's -3 to effective level). A box for when the creature improves, at level 4 or 7.
In addition, i noticed that there is not much room for tricks the animal knows. Might want to add something for that. Hope that helps!
sadie |
Tilquinith wrote:...I use the little box to mark down their CR. Any chance you could label it as such?If people use it for different things, surely it's better unlabelled?
Actually, I had a little think about this, and you're right. There needs to be a CR box on all NPCs, and class level is another, less important field.
sadie |
PurpleWizard |
Kabump |
These rock immensely, but I just want to point out a few things in the newer version I just downloaded.
1) In the example picture for using the sheet, when you are talking about skills, a lot of the side text does not match up with the picture shown. For instance on page 7 talking about the gnome druid, there is mentions of a non-existant (in the example) +2 racial bonus to craft(alchemy), as well as mentions of synergy to appriase with craft alchemy, and also a mention of a +2 racial bonus to listen. These seem to be holdovers from your 3.5 sheet.
2) Im wanting to use this sheet for a summoner Im about to run, but looking at the summoner page I see lots of blank space on its custom sheet. Maybe filling in some of that blank space with a notes/potions/wands section would be nice. As a char based caster, a lot of summoners will have a high UMD, so could probably use the space to track wands. I realize there is a secondary item page with these options, but adding them to the blank space on the summoner sheet would allow use of the equipment page with the larger inventory. Just a thought.
These are just some observations, I absolutely LOVE the look of these sheets, and have finally tracked down some A4 paper so I can properly utilize these sheets.
sadie |
1) In the example picture for using the sheet... These seem to be holdovers from your 3.5 sheet.
They are indeed. Having promised a version this weekend, with pages people wanted, I kind of rushed the examples. I'll fix them up in time.
2) looking at the summoner page I see lots of blank space on its custom sheet. Maybe filling in some of that blank space with a notes/potions/wands section would be nice.
Agreed. I was more focused on the Eidolon, which is where a Summoner spends a lot of their effort. I'll try and get that out soon.
sadie |
YawarFiesta |
Swiftbrook |
New version!
With several of the improvements and fixes people asked for. I've also given the website a bit of an overhaul, so go check it out:
Just took a look at these. Nice. I haven't read the entire thread by here's my 2 cp.
Under Attacks ... Ammo, instead of arrange the boxes like this:
[ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ]
[ ][ ][ ][ ]_ [ ][ ][ ][ ]_[ ][ ][ ][ ]
[ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ]
try this pattern:
[ ][ ][ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ][ ][ ]
[ ][ ][ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ][ ][ ]
[ ][ ][ ][ ][ ]___[ ][ ][ ][ ][ ]
They're arranged in groups of 5, easy counting. Same number in same area.
-Swiftbrook
Just My Thoughts
sadie |
sadie wrote:New version!
With several of the improvements and fixes people asked for. I've also given the website a bit of an overhaul, so go check it out:
Better to post that link in a new thread, because it migth become hard to find among all the other posts and replies.
Humbly,
Yawar
The link in my first post is still valid. I don't want to be seen as the guy who creates duplicate threads all the time. :)
I would like to say I would like a Fighter based page. Other than that, these sheets are the best I have ever seen.
What would go on a Fighter's sheet, that isn't already covered elsewhere? They have stat progression and lots of feats, and that's it.
sadie |
sadie wrote:Download them here.Better to post that link in a new thread, because it migth become hard to find among all the other posts and replies.
I lost this thread for a while. I think they moved it to a different bit of the forum, and the links broke.
I'm tempted to put posts in other parts of the forum linking here, but I don't want to be seen as spamming.
sadie |
Gah! The forum swallowed my post! Trying again.
I haven't really though much about animal inventories - I just assumed they'd be part of the master's inventory sheet. How big an inventory does it need?
I could try and squeeze a bit of inventory space onto the Animal Companion sheet at the expense of the Portrait box - a loss that I suspect few would weep over?
Or I could whip up a half-sized inventory sheet; or add an Animal section (or two) to the much-overlooked Party Funds sheet.
Galnörag |
Gah! The forum swallowed my post! Trying again.
I haven't really though much about animal inventories - I just assumed they'd be part of the master's inventory sheet. How big an inventory does it need?
I could try and squeeze a bit of inventory space onto the Animal Companion sheet at the expense of the Portrait box - a loss that I suspect few would weep over?
Or I could whip up a half-sized inventory sheet; or add an Animal section (or two) to the much-overlooked Party Funds sheet.
Yeah, I really just need the carry capacity, since as you suggest I often keep the animal inventory on the main player sheet, its just tracking if the beast is encumbered. I wouldn't weep over the portrait if it was turned into a weight limit section, but I also can't doodle to save my life :)
sadie |
There is something nice about a paper sheet, where all the numbers are under your control and there's no limit to the options available. That's why I made these.
OTOH, I'm quite impressed with Hero Lab. It's more thorough and flexible than any of the spreadsheet-based options. When you need a character in a hurry, you can build one that's fairly complete quite quickly; and if they're longer lived, you can transfer them to a real sheet.
sadie |
Does anybody use the classes by Super Genius Games, and if so would they consider it worth my time and money making sheets of them?
(You know, I've never charged money for these sheets, but if anyone is super-appreciative then relevant PDFs would be a suitable present hint hint :) )
rswhisper |
Greetings
Allow me to say: I am a huge fan of your character sheets.
Now, allow me a request:
Tome of Secrets
[Pardon the Amazon link, I couldn't find it anywhere on this site]
I acquired the Tome of Secrets book for this past Christmas, and find I utterly adore the Artificer class to the point that I have rolled one up to play in my local group starting this month.
However, as far as I (via Google) have been able to find, there is no character sheet for Pathfinder's Artificer class, nor the others listed in the book (Tome of Secret classes: Artificer, Knight, Priest, Shaman, Spellblade, Swashbuckler, Warlock, Warlord).
Would it be at all possible to add them to your beautiful collection?
sadie |
Interesting, I haven't encountered that book before. Reviews seem to be mixed - could you share what you like about those classes? Does anybody else use them?
I'm certainly not opposed to including 3rd-party classes if they're popular, and the 3.5 version of the character sheets included plenty of them including the 3.5 version of Artificer. However, I obviously don't have this book to work from.
Possible solutions to this that I can see:
- You manage to convince me that the book is worth buying (good luck, I'm a bit broke)
- You buy me a copy of the book, and in return I promise to do the sheets for it
- You create the sheets yourself and contribute them to the open source project - I'll do everything I can to help you with this
- You describe for me the shape of the sheet, possibly based on one of the existing 3.5 or PF classes, and I work with you to turn that into a proper design
- The information is available in an SRD somewhere that I can work from