Creative Director
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
I'm a big fan of old school horror fiction and am getting into Lovecraft and so naturally I'm fascinated by the upcoming 'Strange Aeons' and in particular the Outer Gods/Great Old Ones.
Is there any chance of writing up some rules for Evangelist/Exalted/Sentinel followers of Hastur and Xhamen-Dor (or any of the Outer Gods) in the publication ?
The Great Old Ones/Outer Gods are such a rich source of insane (pun intended!) RP potential it seems a shame not to flesh them out a bit!
Wellllll... since we do at least 2 deity articles in every AP that include all of those rules, and since there are specific deities involved in Strange Aeons... it would sure make a lot of sense, wouldn't it?
That said... those boons and benefits are going to probably not be all that appropriate for PCs at all. For NPC villains though? Yes indeed!!!
|
Creative Director
|
You're married aren't you? Wouldn't that mean the safest choice would be at work? :)I see that the art for Shensen on the cover of AP volume 100 is sold. Is it safe to assume you acquired it?Yup. Recently got it framed but haven't hung it up yet; not sure if I wanna hang it at home or at work.
I'm single.
Wellllll... since we do at least 2 deity articles in every AP that include all of those rules, and since there are specific deities involved in Strange Aeons... it would sure make a lot of sense, wouldn't it?
That said... those boons and benefits are going to probably not be all that appropriate for PCs at all. For NPC villains though? Yes indeed!!!
Why not for PC's ? :(( What would be so inappropriate compared to what is already out there for other gods?
The idea of an Exalted Cleric of Xhamen-Dor spreading rot and creating undead or an Evangelist of Hastur preaching decadence and disorder sounds most excellent!
I would be first in line for the book/PDF!!
|
Creative Director
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Wellllll... since we do at least 2 deity articles in every AP that include all of those rules, and since there are specific deities involved in Strange Aeons... it would sure make a lot of sense, wouldn't it?
That said... those boons and benefits are going to probably not be all that appropriate for PCs at all. For NPC villains though? Yes indeed!!!
Why not for PC's ? :(( What would be so inappropriate compared to what is already out there for other gods?
The idea of an Exalted Cleric of Xhamen-Dor spreading rot and creating undead or an Evangelist of Hastur preaching decadence and disorder sounds most excellent!
I would be first in line for the book/PDF!!
Because these are deities and demigods that are more interesting as villains than buddies. And worshipers of these two deities is CERTAINLY not a good idea for Strange Aeons in particular. There always seems to be a contingent of players who want to play characters allied with the adventure's enemy/bad guys, and it really vexes me.
Because these are deities and demigods that are more interesting as villains than buddies. And worshipers of these two deities is CERTAINLY not a good idea for Strange Aeons in particular. There always seems to be a contingent of players who want to play characters allied with the adventure's enemy/bad guys, and it really vexes me.
Ahhh no, apols for the misunderstanding, I completely see where you are coming from regarding Strange Aeons.
I was talking more about in general giving players in other campaigns the option/rule set to play an Evangleist/Exalted/Sentinel of Xhamen-Dor for example, in the same way as you can play one who worships Asmodeus, Gorum or Erastil.|
Creative Director
|
Because these are deities and demigods that are more interesting as villains than buddies. And worshipers of these two deities is CERTAINLY not a good idea for Strange Aeons in particular. There always seems to be a contingent of players who want to play characters allied with the adventure's enemy/bad guys, and it really vexes me.
Ahhh no, apols for the misunderstanding, I completely see where you are coming from regarding Strange Aeons.
I was talking more about in general giving players in other campaigns the option/rule set to play an Evangleist/Exalted/Sentinel of Xhamen-Dor for example, in the same way as you can play one who worships Asmodeus, Gorum or Erastil.
There'll be that information. Whether or not playing a worshiper of an evil deity, when the typical worshipers of that deity are insane or sadists or worse, is a good idea for the campaign and/or party unity is a question only your GM can answer.
Hi James,
Why is the spear a 2 handed weapon? I've been asked this numerous times throughout my GMing of Pathfinder and also 3rd Edition. I think the spear should be a 2 handed simple weapon, and a 1 handed martial weapon, sort of like a bastard sword (but not exotic). What are your thoughts on this?
|
Creative Director
|
Hi James,
Why is the spear a 2 handed weapon? I've been asked this numerous times throughout my GMing of Pathfinder and also 3rd Edition. I think the spear should be a 2 handed simple weapon, and a 1 handed martial weapon, sort of like a bastard sword (but not exotic). What are your thoughts on this?
Because it can go either way, and the original designers of D&D went for splitting it between shortspear, spear, and longspear like they did. They had to choose something for it. I prefer that way. Making it into a 2 handed simple/1 handed martial weapon is too complex for something that's not exotic.
Are there any organizations that openly oppose Hellknights in Golarion?
I'm interested in both good ones and evil ones.Hellknights cover a wide range of philosophies, and range in alignment from lawful good to lawful neutral to lawful evil. It's easier to ask about specific orders being opposed, but harder to answer that since there are SO many orders. It's possible even for one Hellknight order to oppose another.
Both of the next two Adventure Paths, "Hell's Rebels" and "Hell's Vengeance" are going to have a fair amount of information about Hellknights, including who they oppose or ally with.
I think it's fair to say that if you want a group that is almost always going to oppose the Hellknights, you'll find that group in the church of Milani, and also in most of the other chaotic churches. The Bellflower Network comes into conflict with them pretty frequently as well. And in some rare cases, House Thrune clashes against them.
Thanks for the answer. That will help both my noble paladin and vicious witch who find Hellknights to be something they don't want to exist how to deal with them.
Could you please ask Rob McCreary to take a look at his question thread
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
There always seems to be a contingent of players who want to play characters allied with the adventure's enemy/bad guys, and it really vexes me.
Don't let them vex you! That's exactly what they want. Besides, people who mistake thoughtless, reactive contrarianism with cleverness are already punished simply by having to be themselves. They miss everything cool and can only experience a kind of tepid vicarious gruel-like feeling in place of what the rest of us call fun.
hello, ive been planing to play a halfling for hell rebels, so i'd like to know if halflings are persecuted in kintaro,how common are free halflings or are there even any slip in kintaro?
|
Creative Director
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
hello, ive been planing to play a halfling for hell rebels, so i'd like to know if halflings are persecuted in kintaro,how common are free halflings or are there even any slip in kintaro?
In fact, Kintargo is one of the best places to be a halfing in Cheliax, as the persecution and enslavement of them is really not that common at all there in Kintargo. Free haflings are VERY common in Kintargo, and for the most part, using the word "slip" in Kintargo is really not something folks do.
hello, ive been planing to play a halfling for hell rebels, so i'd like to know if halflings are persecuted in kintaro,how common are free halflings or are there even any slip in kintaro?In fact, Kintargo is one of the best places to be a halfing in Cheliax, as the persecution and enslavement of them is really not that common at all there in Kintargo. Free haflings are VERY common in Kintargo, and for the most part, using the word "slip" in Kintargo is really not something folks do.
thanks for the quick responce
There'll be that information. Whether or not playing a worshiper of an evil deity, when the typical worshipers of that deity are insane or sadists or worse, is a good idea for the campaign and/or party unity is a question only your GM can answer.
Brilliant - thanks! Will be lining up for my copy :)
I get where youre coming from but I like to think evil PC adventures are perfectly do-able as long as a dose of common sense is applied by the party! I just got through a significant chunk of Way of the Wicked and it was fine. Xhamen-Dor could be worshipped by a neutral cleric for example.
Also there are some CN Old Ones/Outer Gods I believe...Mhar and Yog-Sothoth
Have you read Good Omens by Sir Terry Pratchett and Neil Gaiman? If so, what did you think?
|
Creative Director
|
There'll be that information. Whether or not playing a worshiper of an evil deity, when the typical worshipers of that deity are insane or sadists or worse, is a good idea for the campaign and/or party unity is a question only your GM can answer.Brilliant - thanks! Will be lining up for my copy :)
I get where youre coming from but I like to think evil PC adventures are perfectly do-able as long as a dose of common sense is applied by the party! I just got through a significant chunk of Way of the Wicked and it was fine. Xhamen-Dor could be worshipped by a neutral cleric for example.
Also there are some CN Old Ones/Outer Gods I believe...Mhar and Yog-Sothoth
Yup. Bokrug is also CN. They do exist, and TECHNICALLY that means you could be a CG worshiper of one of them... but that in my case is an example of just because the rules say you can doesn't mean you should. I made those ones CN to reflect the fact that they're truly NOT interested in interacting with humanity/intelligent life significantly, whereas the ones that are evil have some interest in doing so for various reasons.
And worshiping Xhamen-Dor might be fine in other APs... but not in Strange Aeons.
|
Though, we are of course allowed to create characters with weird alignment and faith combo if we can figure out characterization right? :D
More seriously though, I was wondering because of all those Nualia antipalading rebuild threads, if I wanted to try same thing, would it be better to do her as pure anti paladin with same level as multi classes one, anti paladin as lower level or anti paladin and some other combo(like anti paladin with divine scion level) in order to avoid making her much more difficult than her normal version?
And sorry if I or someone else asked this already, but if Nualia would get transformed into demon, which one would fit best? I kinda figured out it should be something that would appeal to Lamashtu's faith, but I'm not sure which one would be best fit
Hi James
How do you feel about psionics in pathfinder? I know dream scarred press put out a pathfinder update to the 3.5 psionic system, and all the rules in that book are on the PFSRD. I was just wondering your opinion on the system as a whole, that book in particular and, does paizo plan and developing there own psionics system or just let DSP have the corner on pathfinder psionics?
|
Creative Director
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Though, we are of course allowed to create characters with weird alignment and faith combo if we can figure out characterization right? :D
More seriously though, I was wondering because of all those Nualia antipalading rebuild threads, if I wanted to try same thing, would it be better to do her as pure anti paladin with same level as multi classes one, anti paladin as lower level or anti paladin and some other combo(like anti paladin with divine scion level) in order to avoid making her much more difficult than her normal version?
And sorry if I or someone else asked this already, but if Nualia would get transformed into demon, which one would fit best? I kinda figured out it should be something that would appeal to Lamashtu's faith, but I'm not sure which one would be best fit
As long as your GM is okay with it, whatever you come up with for your PC is fine.
I much prefer Nualia NOT as an antipaladin, because that class works best in a case like hers if she were a paladin before her fall. She was not, and therefore it doesn't make sense to me that she'd be an antipaladin. And on top of that, I just like the cleric class better. It's a personal choice, at that point, as is ALL design, and being the developer and writer of that particular character... that's the choice I made.
While Tsuto is of course hoping that Nualia is going to transform into a succubus, that doesn't match her personality at all. Demons are closely associated with specific sins, and I'd say that Nualia's greatest sin is probably wrath... even if her wrath is very very very justified. As such, having her transform into a vrock makes a fair amount of sense, and that's sort of what I had in mind by giving her a big red claw for a hand. Kinda like the big red claws vrocks have as it turns out...
|
Creative Director
|
Hi James
How do you feel about psionics in pathfinder? I know dream scarred press put out a pathfinder update to the 3.5 psionic system, and all the rules in that book are on the PFSRD. I was just wondering your opinion on the system as a whole, that book in particular and, does paizo plan and developing there own psionics system or just let DSP have the corner on pathfinder psionics?
I've always LOVED the flavor of psionics while simultaneously never really liking the point-based method by which the game always modeled them. It seemed to be a classic case of overcomplication to me—the game ALREADY has rules for how to handle things like mind reading and telekinesis and all that magic stuff, so why not use the established rules for magic to model psychic stuff? It works fine for arcane and divine magic, after all.
And that viewpoint is really what helped guide Occult Adventures and the development of the psychic magic using classes. Occult Adventures, in other words, IS our "psionics system." We chose to call the stuff psychic magic for two reasons:
1) To make it more of our own and to get out from under the shadow of D&D a bit more.
2) To not "overwrite" the work TSR/WotC and Dreamscarred have done building up the point-based psionics rules.
Psychic magic and psionics essentially do the same thing in terms of in-world flavor. They can both exist side-by-side in your game if you want.
For me, and for Golarion as a whole, the official mind-powered mental magical stuff is in Occult Adventures, though, covered under psychic magic. We'll continue to support those rules now and then as we go forward, and have no plans on touching the point-based system built by TSR/WotC and carried forward by Dreamscarred.
|
We'll continue to support those rules now and then as we go forward, and have no plans on touching the point-based system built by TSR/WotC and carried forward by Dreamscarred.
Though... the Occult Bestiary psionic powers are essentially a (new/different) point based system. :]
Mind you, I like that you integrated 'psionics' in with the rules for the other two types of magic. The Rolemaster RPG had something similar with common rules (ironically, point based) for its Essence (Arcane), Channeling (Divine), and Mentalism (Psychic) magics... yet it was entirely possible to give each type a different 'flavor' within the game.
It just seemed odd that after aligning psychic magic for characters with existing rules you immediately turned around and created a separate point based system for the monsters. Which results in some odd non-integration like 0 PE powers and 'at will' powers being listed/treated separately, despite being essentially the same thing.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Considering that the "current" year in CampaignSetting!Earth is 1921, and will be 1922 when Strange Aeons is released, are there any plans to tie in the events of the AP to the fact that Lovecraft was coming up with the ideas for his stories that inspired the mythos at about the same time?
|
Creative Director
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
We'll continue to support those rules now and then as we go forward, and have no plans on touching the point-based system built by TSR/WotC and carried forward by Dreamscarred.Though... the Occult Bestiary psionic powers are essentially a (new/different) point based system. :]
Mind you, I like that you integrated 'psionics' in with the rules for the other two types of magic. The Rolemaster RPG had something similar with common rules (ironically, point based) for its Essence (Arcane), Channeling (Divine), and Mentalism (Psychic) magics... yet it was entirely possible to give each type a different 'flavor' within the game.
It just seemed odd that after aligning psychic magic for characters with existing rules you immediately turned around and created a separate point based system for the monsters. Which results in some odd non-integration like 0 PE powers and 'at will' powers being listed/treated separately, despite being essentially the same thing.
And personally... I"m not a fan of those psionic powers for monsters. Needless complication, in my opinion, and the same basic end effect would have worked just fine with standard spell-like abilities. I think that it was a mistake, but the design team obviously feels otherwise.
|
Creative Director
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
You do understand that it's the same reason why some people keep pushing for clerics of Aroden, it's because they've bee told they can't do it?Because these are deities and demigods that are more interesting as villains than buddies. And worshipers of these two deities is CERTAINLY not a good idea for Strange Aeons in particular. There always seems to be a contingent of players who want to play characters allied with the adventure's enemy/bad guys, and it really vexes me.
Wellllll... since we do at least 2 deity articles in every AP that include all of those rules, and since there are specific deities involved in Strange Aeons... it would sure make a lot of sense, wouldn't it?
That said... those boons and benefits are going to probably not be all that appropriate for PCs at all. For NPC villains though? Yes indeed!!!
Why not for PC's ? :(( What would be so inappropriate compared to what is already out there for other gods?
The idea of an Exalted Cleric of Xhamen-Dor spreading rot and creating undead or an Evangelist of Hastur preaching decadence and disorder sounds most excellent!
I would be first in line for the book/PDF!!
Yup. Although I haven't actually seen much of this anymore. I expect it to surge again after Pathfinder #100 comes out though, with the Aroden article in there. Which does NOT give any Divine Obediance information, because he's dead, but I still expect some folks to be disappointed by that deliberate omission of information.
Erik Mona, of course, is not one of those, since not doing that information gave him about 900 extra precious words to talk about Aroden. ;-P
|
Creative Director
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Considering that the "current" year in CampaignSetting!Earth is 1921, and will be 1922 when Strange Aeons is released, are there any plans to tie in the events of the AP to the fact that Lovecraft was coming up with the ideas for his stories that inspired the mythos at about the same time?
That's certainly an interesting coincidence, isn't it? Hmmmmm. We'll see in about a year, I guess!
|
|
That said... those boons and benefits are going to probably not be all that appropriate for PCs at all. For NPC villains though? Yes indeed!!!
Oh, great to hear you say that! It's important for villain options to get some love too! :)
THEN as to my actual reason for being here today, how high do the Mana Wastes dead zone extend? Like, could a druid FLY to Alkenstar or would they be like "Skree... OH CRAP!!!"
|
Creative Director
|
THEN as to my actual reason for being here today, how high do the Mana Wastes dead zone extend? Like, could a druid FLY to Alkenstar or would they be like "Skree... OH CRAP!!!"
The height varies and fluctuates in the same way cloud cover varies and fluctuates... but you can't SEE it so it's treacherous to navigate. On average, though, I'd say it goes pretty high... higher in the middle than on the edges. On average I'd say at least a mile at the edge and maybe closer to 5-6 miles high in the center.
|
|
THEN as to my actual reason for being here today, how high do the Mana Wastes dead zone extend? Like, could a druid FLY to Alkenstar or would they be like "Skree... OH CRAP!!!"The height varies and fluctuates in the same way cloud cover varies and fluctuates... but you can't SEE it so it's treacherous to navigate. On average, though, I'd say it goes pretty high... higher in the middle than on the edges. On average I'd say at least a mile at the edge and maybe closer to 5-6 miles high in the center.
Hmmm okay so 37,000 feet altitude should be good... haha. OH and on a related note, do the airships and such in Alkenstar run on magic, or are they totally Steampunk helium/hydrogen/whatever airships? Like the one that flies you to the adventure area in Wardens of the Reborn Forge, I assume it's flying over dead magic areas, is it staying high or is it just not magic?
|
Creative Director
|
speaking of flight acheivements... do you have... the Draenor Pathfinding acheivement yet?
I don't. I haven't really played WoW in several months. I've kept my subscription up, foolishly. I should play more. I still haven't even fully explored all the Draenor zones. A shame. They're fun!
Further complicating that is the fact that my preferred WoW computer is acting up lately. It locks up for 10 seconds or so every 5 minutes, and I have no idea why. I think it's just starting to die or something. It IS a 4 year old computer, so I should probably just bite the bullet and buy a new one... it's something I've been meaning to do for a few weeks now... hmmmmm.
|
Creative Director
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Hmmm okay so 37,000 feet altitude should be good... haha. OH and on a related note, do the airships and such in Alkenstar run on magic, or are they totally Steampunk helium/hydrogen/whatever airships? Like the one that flies you to the adventure area in Wardens of the Reborn Forge, I assume it's flying over dead magic areas, is it staying high or is it just not magic?THEN as to my actual reason for being here today, how high do the Mana Wastes dead zone extend? Like, could a druid FLY to Alkenstar or would they be like "Skree... OH CRAP!!!"The height varies and fluctuates in the same way cloud cover varies and fluctuates... but you can't SEE it so it's treacherous to navigate. On average, though, I'd say it goes pretty high... higher in the middle than on the edges. On average I'd say at least a mile at the edge and maybe closer to 5-6 miles high in the center.
That's something that we haven't really explored much. The author of that adventure, Patrick, is a fan of airships... but there's really not much of a role for steampunk in Golarion, alas. It's a flavor that the rest of the setting just doesn't really support that well, and as such I'd rather have the stuff function via magic and thus limit that flavor to the Alkenstar region.
You're free to change it in your version of Golarion, of course.
|
Creative Director
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Hmmm okay so 37,000 feet altitude should be good... haha. OH and on a related note, do the airships and such in Alkenstar run on magic, or are they totally Steampunk helium/hydrogen/whatever airships? Like the one that flies you to the adventure area in Wardens of the Reborn Forge, I assume it's flying over dead magic areas, is it staying high or is it just not magic?THEN as to my actual reason for being here today, how high do the Mana Wastes dead zone extend? Like, could a druid FLY to Alkenstar or would they be like "Skree... OH CRAP!!!"The height varies and fluctuates in the same way cloud cover varies and fluctuates... but you can't SEE it so it's treacherous to navigate. On average, though, I'd say it goes pretty high... higher in the middle than on the edges. On average I'd say at least a mile at the edge and maybe closer to 5-6 miles high in the center.37,000 FEET? Are airships using sealed cabins, or do the passengers have some kind of survival magic in place?
Just for historical reference, the Hindenberg typically flew at an altitude of 650 feet. (higher when over cities like Manhattan). The service sceiling for a Goodyear class blimp is typically 10,000 feet, the limit for an unpressureised cabin.
The Hindenberg would fly lower to avoid clouds frequently to a minimum altitude of 300 feet. The general practise was to avoid operating close to the pressure limit lest an updraft yank the ship to high enough where the pressure valves would trigger gas release. This was the cause of the wreck of the U.S. airships Akron and Macon which ended the American rigid airship program.
Let's keep this thread to questions please. If you want to open up the airship can of worms, that's a great topic for another thread. Thanks!
Hmm, questions only. How about:
Who is your favorite personally created Pathfinder/D&D character of all time? And why?
Dear Mister Jacobs,
Please forgive the rather formal nature of this note, as you are certainly a busy person.
Are there any plans to have a tengu iconic in the future? Tengu are very much a reason I've come to greatly appreciate Pathfinder, and part of the distinct and unique flavor that sets the environment aside from all the other competitors.
Thank you very much for your time in advance!
Yup. Bokrug is also CN. They do exist, and TECHNICALLY that means you could be a CG worshiper of one of them... but that in my case is an example of just because the rules say you can doesn't mean you should. I made those ones CN to reflect the fact that they're truly NOT interested in interacting with humanity/intelligent life significantly, whereas the ones that are evil have some interest in doing so for various reasons.
Agreed 100% a Chaotic Good worshipper of the Old Ones/Outer Gods just doesnt feel right at all. Theoretically possible, but its a kind of Min/Maxing IMO.
I do feel though that 'Chaotic' has an inherent neutrality to it, since over time random behaviour tends to average out somewhere in the middle. People always associate Chaotic with evil.... mistakenly IMO.
Chaotic neutral seems like a great alignment for a worshipper (and a deity for that matter) of a Old One/Outer God, but I strongly disagree it means that they would have little interest in humanity. Gods by their definition need/require worship and the fact that they grant clerics spells, must mean something surely?!
Out of interest, you mentioned that Exalted/Evangelist/Sentinel rules have been done in AP's. Is this just recent ones? I know the main Golarion gods were all covered in Inner Sea Gods.
|
Creative Director
|
Hmm, questions only. How about:
Who is your favorite personally created Pathfinder/D&D character of all time? And why?
Shensen. Because of all the characters I've played over my 30+ years of gaming, she's the character I've played the longest and who I've had the most fun playing.
Two others come close in terms of level—a druid named Ruvagog (ha!) I played in Jim Butler's 2nd edition game back when WotC first brought TSR out to the Seattle area, but that campaign morphed into a 3rd edition playtest near the end and that kinda sort of disrupted the campaign from a story based one to a constantly changing tangle of rules. It was still fun, but the more it became a playtest, the less I identified with Ruvagog.
The other was Rowyn tai'Tesseril, who I played in Julia Martin's Middle Kingdoms inspired campaign. She was a lot of fun too, but ended up being INCREDIBLY powerful near the end and being able to do anything without worrying too much about the repercussions kinda took the thrill out of the game... although the fact that I ended up playing Rowyn's half-celestial daughter in the next campaign Julia ran was fun too (although that game, alas, ended at around 7th level).
Shensen had the perfect combo of fun, complex storyline, entertaining adventuring companions, power, and flaws that made her a GREAT deal of fun to play. Be it the fact that she was always trying to make crazy risky stunts (be they acrobatic or diplomatic) and not always succeeding, or the fact that her swords kept seeming to break (frustrating when the character worships a swordfighting deity!), or event how she kept seeming to get killed by rend attacks (usually from gorilla-type creatures) but kept finding ways to come back from death... dunno. All that combines to make her my favorite.
|
Creative Director
|
Dear Mister Jacobs,Please forgive the rather formal nature of this note, as you are certainly a busy person.
Are there any plans to have a tengu iconic in the future? Tengu are very much a reason I've come to greatly appreciate Pathfinder, and part of the distinct and unique flavor that sets the environment aside from all the other competitors.
Thank you very much for your time in advance!
No plans. Our iconics are at this point ONLY core races. They are intended to be models of the various classes in the game, and as such, we deliberately do NOT want to complicate things by having one be of a non-core race, since that would "distract" from their role as the poster child for that character class.
That said, we do use tengu in adventures relatively often. In fact, check out parts 1 and 4 of Hell's Rebels for more tengu action!
|
Creative Director
|
Nualia as Vrock? Huh, yeah, someone probably asked this before since it does sound familiar... Still cool xD
Anyway, wait, are anti paladins in Golarion always fallen paladins? I kinda thought out they are just evil warriors really devoted to a chaotic evil god <_<;
Nope; they're not always fallen paladins. Just as paladins aren't always risen antipaladins.
Doesn't change the fact that I just don't think it's the right class for Nualia, though.
|
Creative Director
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Yup. Bokrug is also CN. They do exist, and TECHNICALLY that means you could be a CG worshiper of one of them... but that in my case is an example of just because the rules say you can doesn't mean you should. I made those ones CN to reflect the fact that they're truly NOT interested in interacting with humanity/intelligent life significantly, whereas the ones that are evil have some interest in doing so for various reasons.
Agreed 100% a Chaotic Good worshipper of the Old Ones/Outer Gods just doesnt feel right at all. Theoretically possible, but its a kind of Min/Maxing IMO.
I do feel though that 'Chaotic' has an inherent neutrality to it, since over time random behaviour tends to average out somewhere in the middle. People always associate Chaotic with evil.... mistakenly IMO.
Chaotic neutral seems like a great alignment for a worshipper (and a deity for that matter) of a Old One/Outer God, but I strongly disagree it means that they would have little interest in humanity. Gods by their definition need/require worship and the fact that they grant clerics spells, must mean something surely?!
Out of interest, you mentioned that Exalted/Evangelist/Sentinel rules have been done in AP's. Is this just recent ones? I know the main Golarion gods were all covered in Inner Sea Gods.
I wouldn't call it min/maxing at all. It's just inappropriate story is all; it doesn't give you a particular rules benefit to be a CG worshiper of a great old one at all, since those clerics aren't inherently more powerful than any other deity you could choose... it's just disruptive to the game because it breaks the world flavor in much the same way playing a thri-kreen ranger named Davey Cricket would, or a pudgy halfling thief named Frodo Bilbo would. It's disrespectful to all the work the creators and authors and GMs put into the game to make a PC that deliberately breaks verisimilitude.
Anyway, yeah. It's a pet peeve of mine, as if one couldn't tell. ;-P
And I wouldn't say people always associate Chaotic with Evil. Personally, I associate chaotic with freedom. Most of my favorite PCs are chaotic. Merisiel is super chaotic, but not evil. And in fact, the current AP, Hell's Rebels, is a GREAT example of how chaos is good and law is bad.
We started publishing the Divine Obedience boons for deities in the AP deity articles with the ones appearing in Iron Gods; Brigh was the first to get that update. We've updated Milani (who already got an article without the boons in Reign of Winter) in the Hell's Rebels player's guide. We'll continue to update those all as we go forward; stay tuned!
|
|
Agreed 100% a Chaotic Good worshipper of the Old Ones/Outer Gods just doesnt feel right at all. Theoretically possible, but its a kind of Min/Maxing IMO.
I do feel though that 'Chaotic' has an inherent neutrality to it, since over time random behaviour tends to average out somewhere in the middle. People always associate Chaotic with evil.... mistakenly IMO.
I imagine any chaotic good worshipers of the Old Cults are on a slow descent into neutrality (and madness). At present they're chaotic good, which means they're still holding on to some sense of human decency, but they don't understand that the subject of their worship is completely uncaring and inhuman. Alternatively, they might comprehend their deity, but believe they are simply using that deity for power (as a good wizard who summons evil outsiders). Either way, the connection to such an alien mind is going to catch up to them, and they'll go mad.
|
Creative Director
|
I imagine any chaotic good worshipers of the Old Cults are on a slow descent into neutrality (and madness). At present they're chaotic good, which means they're still holding on to some sense of human decency, but they don't understand that the subject of their worship is completely uncaring and inhuman. Alternatively, they might comprehend their deity, but believe they are simply using that deity for power (as a good wizard who summons evil outsiders). Either way, the connection to such an alien mind is going to catch up to them, and they'll go mad.Agreed 100% a Chaotic Good worshipper of the Old Ones/Outer Gods just doesnt feel right at all. Theoretically possible, but its a kind of Min/Maxing IMO.
I do feel though that 'Chaotic' has an inherent neutrality to it, since over time random behaviour tends to average out somewhere in the middle. People always associate Chaotic with evil.... mistakenly IMO.
Let's keep this thread to questions for me; if folks want to further discuss things like good-aligned great old one worshipers, that should be turned into a separate thread. Thanks!
|
|
Hmm, okay, I was thinking about antipaladin for Nualia since that would make give both melee fighting ability and powers derived from her goddess and so get rid of need for fighter level..
What about replacing her fighter level with divine scion level? Would that work okay?
...BTW, now that I think about how much Nualia as Vrock makes sense(and I could swear I asked about that long time ago), why does book suggest making her half fiend or succubus anyway if she escapes? I never understood why the book says "or maybe as succubus" ._.;
Come to think about it, if Nualia does escape, is there any way for her to actually complete the ritual? I mean, okay, it would be possible if PCs leave Malfeshnekor alive and she comes back, free him and then burn the village, but if they kill the barghest, Nualia's quest has failed and Lamasthu would probably be disappointed. Would she have completely lost her chance to become demon or would she get second change/quest to do so? And is there anyway for her to complete the ritual without destroying the sandpoint?
BTW, is Jubilex still in pathfinder? I can't find mention of him in any real life mythology, but he is apparently D&D demon lord and he seems to be canon in Golarion since he is mentioned in Rotl anniversary edition? Is he in category like Orcus where he does exist in the setting, but he won't be used much in comparison to pathfinder original demon lords?
And finally, I doubt this would ever happen naturally since Nualia is pretty far gone, but what would exactly happen if she would actually get redeemed? I'd imagine Lamashtu would be at least annoyed at her groomed pawn being turned back to good instead of dying as evil, but what would happen to Nualia herself? I'd guess her demonic talon would start rejecting her, but would Lamashtu's taint in her get erased or remain with her?
Would rebuilding Nualia as a warpriest make sense?
What's your favorite Shensen story? (That is, a moment when Shensen, as your character, truly shined, either through battle, interaction, or just roleplay with other party members.)