1) Is Seyltiel an homage to Elric?
2) While outsiders don't need to sleep, does an outsider still need to rest 8 hours to get its spell-like powers back? Probably yes...
3) After reading the Starstone entry in Mythic Realms... did Golarion used to have two moons, or does the current moon have a really big hole in it? I might be slightly confused as to what happened there.
4) Arazni can still grant spells. Would she have at least a small cult in Geb?
Dear James Jacobs
I've thoroughly enjoyed playing in the pathfinder setting in the last few years. I especially enjoy the level of detail given to the various religions and the setting mythology. Reading the mythology is like trying to solve a mystery novel to me. Please keep doing what you're doing, it's been great fun!
Okay, my questions, which are primarily about the Dragon Empires Gazeteer, it's deities, and their relationship to the western deities.
1. While some of the western deities are also worshipped in east by the same name (Pharasma, Shelyn, Desna, etc...) it also seems that some of the eastern deities and western deities are remarkably similar in personality. Enough so that they might actually be the same deity, under a different name. Specifically, I was wondering about the following east/west equivalencies:
Fumeiyoshi = Asmodeus
Shiziru = Sarenrae
Tsukiyo = Ihys
Kofusuchi = Caiden Caelean
Sun wukong= also Caiden Caelean?
Ya matsumi = Rovagug
2. I have a theory regarding the starstone. It seems to me, that the starstone and Ihys murder are related. My current working theory is that Ihys invested some of his personal power to create the starstone before he was murdered. Though I could also see the starstone being the actual remains of Ihys after Asmodeus killed him. Am I on the right track?
3. Given #2, Lao shu po's background sounds like a metaphor for a starstone test. Is this the case?
4. Given #2, and the notion that the starstone was pulled from the diaspora, which appears to have been created from the collision of two planets that occupied similar orbits, is there a metaphysical connection between deities, and celestial bodies? Perhaps a relationship that exists for the older deities only?
Creative Director
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Greetings, oh great and wise James Jacobs.
Impart thine knowledge on me and answer me this:
How does the feat Fast Healer work with fast healing?
And if it does work with fast healing, does in activate on every tick or just once?
You have my gratitude in advance.Fast Healer:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/fast-healerFast healing:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/universal-monster-rules #TOC-Fast-Healing-Ex-Rest and natural healing:
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#_healing
This is, alas, a better question for the rules forum and a FAQ click.
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Have you read up much on The Witcher 3? The Developers said the same thing as Bioware pretty much and said "After Skyrim, we need to work on better environments!"
Is there an area or group in Golarion you think would be good for adapting the Witcher schools? I feel like subjecting people to dangerous experiments for the greater good would be more chaotic good, if it could be considered good at all...
Yeah; Skyrim's success is VERY good for the RPG videogame industry, since the Witcher and the Dragon Age games both had similar problems in their narrow scope and reusing areas. I'm eager to check both out!
The best place to put the Witcher stuff would be Nex.
Well Tolkien is the far better, more erudite writer, with a much better handling of language and setting moods. Just MHO, but the man was a professor of Anglistics. While lovecrafts Horror is pretty stylized in its assumptions (he never actually describes something, but refers to most supernatural entities in term like blasphemous etc.; everything nonhumanoid is terrible...)
*ducks* Oops that wasn't aimed at you, but simply at the comment that Lovecraft wrote better English than Tolkien^^ I apologize for unintentionally hitting a sore spot.
Can I offer you a Triceratops ?
A question which recently came up : Will there - in reasonable time - be an area in Golarion - or the Golarion-verse - where a more "primitive" society with a bronze age or stone age level of industry and development exist ? Or are the rules in Ultimate Combat supposed more for time-traveling purposes (and rare improvised weapons) ?
And any chance for more official ancient gods (like the Thassilonian diety of magic ) or entities (and their temples, equipment or scriptures) over which PCs can stumble in current times.
Say like a lost Old One , whose worship has luckily been forgotten ? Or are the current dieties re-worked/re-purposed dieties from ancient times ?
Last : what would happen if misguided/evil/primitive societies or cults worshipped the Tarrasque (or the Firebringer or one of the other spawn of Rovagug) ? Some drift to Demi-godhood or other form of empowerment since they are already partially divine ?
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Can I offer you a Triceratops ?A question which recently came up : Will there - in reasonable time - be an area in Golarion - or the Golarion-verse - where a more "primitive" society with a bronze age or stone age level of industry and development exist ? Or are the rules in Ultimate Combat supposed more for time-traveling purposes (and rare improvised weapons) ?
And any chance for more official ancient gods (like the Thassilonian diety of magic ) or entities (and their temples, equipment or scriptures) over which PCs can stumble in current times.
Say like a lost Old One , whose worship has luckily been forgotten ? Or are the current dieties re-worked/re-purposed dieties from ancient times ?Last : what would happen if misguided/evil/primitive societies or cults worshipped the Tarrasque (or the Firebringer or one of the other spawn of Rovagug) ? Some drift to Demi-godhood or other form of empowerment since they are already partially divine ?
Yup. Nom.
The stone age/bronze age rules aren't really meant for much in the Inner Sea region. Maybe elsewhere in the world.
We may mention more about the older gods now and then when the context is right. As we just did in Mythic Realms.
Nope; worshiping something is not enough to make it into a demigod. Gods don't "eat" faith in that way.
James the wizard spellbook in Pathfinder recently brought up a question in game. What is the paper technology in Golarion is it the 1) ancient to mediaval animal skin vellum, 2) renaissance pressed cloth paper or 3) Modern wood pulp paper?
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In 2014/15? Please?Will we ever get Archdevils? I want to fight up Mephistophles and Baalzebul.Eventually, yes.
We'll do it when it makes sense. 2014 is unlikely to make sense, and 2015 is too far out to determine yet.
Wes is the local devil champion, in any event—he's the best one to talk to about getting arch devils statted up.
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What would be the best way to run a war-style campaign in Pathfinder? As I've mentioned before, I've been playing Total War: Rome II, and reading books like Bernard Cornwell's Saxon Tales and Warlord Chronicles series and Glen Cook's Black Company novels. War seems like such a great place for drama and tough questions, but you've mentioned before that the Mass Combat rules are still very much in their infancy and that Golarion isn't really made for adventures where war and its effect are center stage. Kingmaker has it in a single episode, but it's not really the focus of the campaign so much as exploration and freedom of choice, and Wrath of the Righteous is a lot more about corruption and redemption and such than it is about plain ol' military engagements.
Where can I go on Golarion to scratch that military fantasy itch?
James the wizard spellbook in Pathfinder recently brought up a question in game. What is the paper technology in Golarion is it the 1) ancient to mediaval animal skin vellum, 2) renaissance pressed cloth paper or 3) Modern wood pulp paper?All three, depending on your preference.
And where a character come from, where he/she/it is currently...
And Goblins love to burn all three equally.
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What would be the best way to run a war-style campaign in Pathfinder? As I've mentioned before, I've been playing Total War: Rome II, and reading books like Bernard Cornwell's Saxon Tales and Warlord Chronicles series and Glen Cook's Black Company novels. War seems like such a great place for drama and tough questions, but you've mentioned before that the Mass Combat rules are still very much in their infancy and that Golarion isn't really made for adventures where war and its effect are center stage. Kingmaker has it in a single episode, but it's not really the focus of the campaign so much as exploration and freedom of choice, and Wrath of the Righteous is a lot more about corruption and redemption and such than it is about plain ol' military engagements.
Where can I go on Golarion to scratch that military fantasy itch?
At this point, we don't really have rules for big wars... not robust enough to serve for a whole campaign of mass combat at least. The Ultimate Campaign rules work good for resolving shorter conflicts that occur during an adventure but aren't the focus of the adventure, and the troop rules we introduced in "Rasputin Must Die!" are great for skirmishes and the like...
...But I don't think we've currently got good mass combat rules that can support a whole campaign. And as such... it's not a type of campaign that I think can be run in Pathfinder yet.
You can certainly use other rules to run Golarion mass battles though, in which case Nirmathas/Molthune is a good place to go. The Worldwound could also serve, as could a flare-up between Taldor and Qadira.
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This is, alas, a better question for the rules forum and a FAQ click.Greetings, oh great and wise James Jacobs.
Impart thine knowledge on me and answer me this:
How does the feat Fast Healer work with fast healing?
And if it does work with fast healing, does in activate on every tick or just once?
You have my gratitude in advance.Fast Healer:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/general-feats/fast-healerFast healing:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/rules-for-monsters/universal-monster-rules #TOC-Fast-Healing-Ex-Rest and natural healing:
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/combat.html#_healing
I thank thee for thine time and words.
Regards.
So, what do you think of the Grell? I'm looking through the bestiaries and they are conspicuously absent. Any particular reason for that?
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So, what do you think of the Grell? I'm looking through the bestiaries and they are conspicuously absent. Any particular reason for that?
Grells have been one of my favorite D&D monsters for about 30 years, in fact. They're one of the best things to come out of the 1st edition Fiend Folio.
They're also not open content, and therefore we can't use them.
Grells have been one of my favorite D&D monsters for about 30 years, in fact. They're one of the best things to come out of the 1st edition Fiend Folio.
They're also not open content, and therefore we can't use them.
That saddens me deeply. Well, guess I have to bust out the conversion booklet.
Any other monsters you wish WotC didn't have an iron grip on?
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Grells have been one of my favorite D&D monsters for about 30 years, in fact. They're one of the best things to come out of the 1st edition Fiend Folio.
They're also not open content, and therefore we can't use them.
That saddens me deeply. Well, guess I have to bust out the conversion booklet.
Any other monsters you wish WotC didn't have an iron grip on?
Plenty... but each day that goes by, I miss them less and less.
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What do you do if the game you're playing just feels dry and routine? I've been trying to force myself to play through Dragon Age: Origins to prepare for Dragon Age: Inquisition, but I find myself feeling frustrated at how long it's taking and that I'm going to die before I play all the games in my massive backlog...
A player for an upcoming AP really wants to play some variation on the whole woman from the waist up, snake from the waist down angle. As a general rule of thumb, I'll let one character per campaign bring a token freak into the party, outside of the race list I toss out, provided it exists somewhere in Golarion and they can rationalize being in the area, and is roughly on par with the standard race options. Now, there's a surprisingly large number of snake/human hybrids to choose from, but the only one I can think of that has arms but no legs is a lamia matriarch, and that's pretty problematic in terms of both power level and premise to pair back to an appropriate level 1 PC.
I'm fine with working up a one-off racial stat block here, but as far as rationalizing it goes, I'd prefer to have her be an unusual member of an existing race than shoehorn in yet another whole race of snake people somewhere. Can you think of anything I could use as a halfway reasonable starting point here?
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What happens to the soul of a mythos entity like the yithians, mi-go, or star spawn when it dies?
Is it judged in the same way as mortal souls and on the same merits or is some other metric used on them considering that many of the older and more powerful races are older then the material plane and quite possibly all of the multiverse?
Finally when these creatures do pass on do they become angels, devils, demons, etc. like other mortal souls do or do they become something else like qlippoth or other entities?
Same, except with glowing red eyes.You've gained your first Mythic Tier! Congratulations!
What does your Mythic Forum Avatar look like?
Something to the tune of this?
A few questions about those there River Kingdoms!
To begin, in the Pathfinder Journal Prodigal Sons I had the impression that the River Freedoms were ideals that were held as paramount law throughout the land, perhaps even by the rulers, is this true?
And, if not, to what degree would they be followed?
Along those lines, I noted that in the Guide to the River Kingdoms, it says that the kingdom of Touvette has way stations along the major roads into and out of the kingdom. It seems to me that this infringes upon the 3rd River Freedom; Walk Any Road, Float Any River.
Do they have these way stations along the river too?
How does that hold with those that advocate the freedoms so strongly?
Also, would the 5th River Freedom; Courts Are for Kings, be able to absolve the 4th or any other?
I understand that law is probably the least of matters in the anarchic region but I felt that the Freedoms seemed to be the wholly accepted throughout. I'd also like to know what they might mean for an up and coming kingdom to the north?
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What do you do if the game you're playing just feels dry and routine? I've been trying to force myself to play through Dragon Age: Origins to prepare for Dragon Age: Inquisition, but I find myself feeling frustrated at how long it's taking and that I'm going to die before I play all the games in my massive backlog...
If I'm playing a game that feels dry and routine and dull... I eventually stop playing and may never go back to play it, despite any lingering guilt I might have that I paid for the game and should at least force my way through to get my money's worth. Because a game that feels dry and routine isn't worth the money. I DO take note of that, and the next time that company or designer or whatever puts out a game, I remember (I hope) and don't fall for the hype! (This is why I never bought another Halo game, for example.)
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A player for an upcoming AP really wants to play some variation on the whole woman from the waist up, snake from the waist down angle. As a general rule of thumb, I'll let one character per campaign bring a token freak into the party, outside of the race list I toss out, provided it exists somewhere in Golarion and they can rationalize being in the area, and is roughly on par with the standard race options. Now, there's a surprisingly large number of snake/human hybrids to choose from, but the only one I can think of that has arms but no legs is a lamia matriarch, and that's pretty problematic in terms of both power level and premise to pair back to an appropriate level 1 PC.
I'm fine with working up a one-off racial stat block here, but as far as rationalizing it goes, I'd prefer to have her be an unusual member of an existing race than shoehorn in yet another whole race of snake people somewhere. Can you think of anything I could use as a halfway reasonable starting point here?
In this case, I'd design the player a snake lady using the race guide, aimed at 10 RP. I'd work with the player to make the race do what she wants, and might even let her design the race herself subject to GM approval.
As for how to rationalize it... here's a few options:
1) Have her be an aasimar with an unusually large amount of lillend blood.
2) Have her be a mutant or cursed character who lost her legs to some sort of bad guy who can later show up as a villain.
3) Have her be displaced from another world via a portal.
4) Have her be a traveler from another world or continent.
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What happens to the soul of a mythos entity like the yithians, mi-go, or star spawn when it dies?
Is it judged in the same way as mortal souls and on the same merits or is some other metric used on them considering that many of the older and more powerful races are older then the material plane and quite possibly all of the multiverse?
Finally when these creatures do pass on do they become angels, devils, demons, etc. like other mortal souls do or do they become something else like qlippoth or other entities?
All souls are judged by Pharasma. The line you stand in is likely sorted by type, so you see a long line of humanoids and the long line of aberrations is elsewhere. In most cases, the souls of a mythos creature would likely go on to the Abyss or the Maelstrom, but I suspect many are sent on back to the Material Plane to reincarnate or be absorbed into the outer darkness or the like.
A mythos soul that makes it all the way into outsider life would likely either merge with the terrain or become a protean or qlippoth, I suppose.
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Something to the tune of this?Same, except with glowing red eyes.You've gained your first Mythic Tier! Congratulations!
What does your Mythic Forum Avatar look like?
HA! I knew someone would hook me up! Exactly!
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Creative Director
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A few questions about those there River Kingdoms!
To begin, in the Pathfinder Journal Prodigal Sons I had the impression that the River Freedoms were ideals that were held as paramount law throughout the land, perhaps even by the rulers, is this true?
And, if not, to what degree would they be followed?
Along those lines, I noted that in the Guide to the River Kingdoms, it says that the kingdom of Touvette has way stations along the major roads into and out of the kingdom. It seems to me that this infringes upon the 3rd River Freedom; Walk Any Road, Float Any River.
Do they have these way stations along the river too?
How does that hold with those that advocate the freedoms so strongly?
Also, would the 5th River Freedom; Courts Are for Kings, be able to absolve the 4th or any other?
I understand that law is probably the least of matters in the anarchic region but I felt that the Freedoms seemed to be the wholly accepted throughout. I'd also like to know what they might mean for an up and coming kingdom to the north?
The degree to which the laws of the River Kingdoms are followed varies widely from kingdom to kingdom. Rememer, a lot of these lands are founded by chaotic folks, and they often will push the boundaries of the law until they break. The flexibility of the laws also varies from kingdom to kingdom.
As for Touvette... those waystations certainly push the line of the 3rd River Freedom, but Touvette's pretty good at walking up to the line and not stepping over. Because they DO frustrate other kingdoms.
Basically... there's always a conflict or war ABOUT to break out as these folks push rules and the like.
A few questions about those there River Kingdoms!
The degree to which the laws of the River Kingdoms are followed varies widely from kingdom to kingdom. Rememer, a lot of these lands are founded by chaotic folks, and they often will push the boundaries of the law until they break. The flexibility of the laws also varies from kingdom to kingdom.
As for Touvette... those waystations certainly push the line of the 3rd River Freedom, but Touvette's pretty good at walking up to the line and not stepping over. Because they DO frustrate other kingdoms.
Basically... there's always a conflict or war ABOUT to break out as these folks push rules and the like.
I see. So, I gather that enforcement of the Freedoms is up to whoever has interest in upholding them, be they ruler or commoner. Would I be correct in that?
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What do you do if the game you're playing just feels dry and routine? I've been trying to force myself to play through Dragon Age: Origins to prepare for Dragon Age: Inquisition, but I find myself feeling frustrated at how long it's taking and that I'm going to die before I play all the games in my massive backlog...If I'm playing a game that feels dry and routine and dull... I eventually stop playing and may never go back to play it, despite any lingering guilt I might have that I paid for the game and should at least force my way through to get my money's worth. Because a game that feels dry and routine isn't worth the money. I DO take note of that, and the next time that company or designer or whatever puts out a game, I remember (I hope) and don't fall for the hype! (This is why I never bought another Halo game, for example.)
What if it's a game you've played five or six times in the past and found fun then, but find yourself getting annoyed at the prospect of slogging through it again?
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I see. So, I gather that enforcement of the Freedoms is up to whoever has interest in upholding them, be they ruler or commoner. Would I be correct in that?A few questions about those there River Kingdoms!
The degree to which the laws of the River Kingdoms are followed varies widely from kingdom to kingdom. Rememer, a lot of these lands are founded by chaotic folks, and they often will push the boundaries of the law until they break. The flexibility of the laws also varies from kingdom to kingdom.
As for Touvette... those waystations certainly push the line of the 3rd River Freedom, but Touvette's pretty good at walking up to the line and not stepping over. Because they DO frustrate other kingdoms.
Basically... there's always a conflict or war ABOUT to break out as these folks push rules and the like.
Pretty much. Of course... the commoner won't be able to enforce much, due to all-around weakness.
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What if it's a game you've played five or six times in the past and found fun then, but find yourself getting annoyed at the prospect of slogging through it again?What do you do if the game you're playing just feels dry and routine? I've been trying to force myself to play through Dragon Age: Origins to prepare for Dragon Age: Inquisition, but I find myself feeling frustrated at how long it's taking and that I'm going to die before I play all the games in my massive backlog...If I'm playing a game that feels dry and routine and dull... I eventually stop playing and may never go back to play it, despite any lingering guilt I might have that I paid for the game and should at least force my way through to get my money's worth. Because a game that feels dry and routine isn't worth the money. I DO take note of that, and the next time that company or designer or whatever puts out a game, I remember (I hope) and don't fall for the hype! (This is why I never bought another Halo game, for example.)
In that case I'd quit playing it again.
Pretty much. Of course... the commoner won't be able to enforce much, due to all-around weakness.I see. So, I gather that enforcement of the Freedoms is up to whoever has interest in upholding them, be they ruler or commoner. Would I be correct in that?Basically... there's always a conflict or war ABOUT to break out as these folks push rules and the like.A few questions about those there River Kingdoms!
Of course, save if there were enough in number. Although, I wouldn't be surprised at a massacre in response or even subtle propaganda to sway the populace. Ah, politics!
This helps me get a bit more perspective on this wacky, wonderful world called Golarion. Thanks a lot, James!
In most cases, the souls of a mythos creature would likely go on to the Abyss or the Maelstrom, but I suspect many are sent on back to the Material Plane to reincarnate or be absorbed into the outer darkness or the like.
A mythos soul that makes it all the way into outsider life would likely either merge with the terrain or become a protean or qlippoth, I suppose.
1. Why would a yithian, generally LN, end up in the Abyss?
2. Why would any soul become a qlippoth? I thought they didn't come from souls.
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In most cases, the souls of a mythos creature would likely go on to the Abyss or the Maelstrom, but I suspect many are sent on back to the Material Plane to reincarnate or be absorbed into the outer darkness or the like.
A mythos soul that makes it all the way into outsider life would likely either merge with the terrain or become a protean or qlippoth, I suppose.
1. Why would a yithian, generally LN, end up in the Abyss?
2. Why would any soul become a qlippoth? I thought they didn't come from souls.
1) It wouldn't. Obviously, mythos creatures run the gamut of alignments, but the VAST MAJORITY are Chaotic Evil, with Chaotic Neutral a close second. A Yithian would go somewhere else, although they don't actually die often since they can transfer their minds when the body gets rotten.
2) Correct. It would seem like Mythos creatures would become qlippoth becasue qlippoth are tentaclly and Lovecraftian, but in fact they would not. Because qlippoth do not form from souls; they form from raw Abyssal quintessence. I should have remembered that but I forgot.
So... where a mythos creature's soul goes after it dies varies a great deal, and they don't all go to the same place. Pharasma DOES judge them, as she judges all souls... but there's not a single "they go here" answer at all.
A player for an upcoming AP really wants to play some variation on the whole woman from the waist up, snake from the waist down angle. As a general rule of thumb, I'll let one character per campaign bring a token freak into the party, outside of the race list I toss out, provided it exists somewhere in Golarion and they can rationalize being in the area, and is roughly on par with the standard race options. Now, there's a surprisingly large number of snake/human hybrids to choose from, but the only one I can think of that has arms but no legs is a lamia matriarch, and that's pretty problematic in terms of both power level and premise to pair back to an appropriate level 1 PC.
I'm fine with working up a one-off racial stat block here, but as far as rationalizing it goes, I'd prefer to have her be an unusual member of an existing race than shoehorn in yet another whole race of snake people somewhere. Can you think of anything I could use as a halfway reasonable starting point here?
Not James Jacobs, but IIRC there is a 0 HD naga type race that fits that description in one of the later issues of Kobold Quarterly. I haven't seen the stats or flavor on it, but that might help. You would of course have to homebrew a place for it.
Oh, so many interesting questions begin to be testable with Mythic rules! :)
If I may continue on the issue of souls:
- Pharasma will send some favoured or failed worshippers to be with their patron either for reward or punishment, right? Does a demigod, such as a character with the Divine Source ability or Great Cthulhu, receive such souls? Or is this something linked to having a divine realm?
- Could a demigod character make a demiplane to serve as a heaven or hell for their fallen worshippers?
- Could a demigod make use of the souls of their fallen worshippers according to the rules in the daemon book on using souls for various things?
- If a demigod dies, can it be raised or resurrected as per its regular type?
- If it is not, will it be a regular, non-mythic petitioner, or something else?
I have a question about invisibility. I know normally, I'd have to look to the rules section, but I've searched and it's apparently been asked before and FAQ and nothing has come of it. I feel that posting the question again wouldn't work. So I'm hoping you can at least help something I'm not quite clear on that I need for an upcoming session I am GMing.
For noticing an invisible creature [Core Rule Book page 563], it states that it is a DC 20 Perception check and that to pinpoint a creature, it is +20 to that. It also gives a table of modifiers for pinpointing, including one for if the creature is using Stealth. So my question is, how do I apply Stealth? Is it:
A) DC 20 + (20 for pinpointing) + (Stealth + 20)
or
B) Notice DC is replaced by the Stealth check, becoming DC (Stealth +20) + (20 for pinpointing)?
If you could answer this for me, I'd greatly appreciate it.
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Oh, so many interesting questions begin to be testable with Mythic rules! :)
If I may continue on the issue of souls:
- Pharasma will send some favoured or failed worshippers to be with their patron either for reward or punishment, right? Does a demigod, such as a character with the Divine Source ability or Great Cthulhu, receive such souls? Or is this something linked to having a divine realm?
- Could a demigod character make a demiplane to serve as a heaven or hell for their fallen worshippers?
- Could a demigod make use of the souls of their fallen worshippers according to the rules in the daemon book on using souls for various things?
- If a demigod dies, can it be raised or resurrected as per its regular type?
- If it is not, will it be a regular, non-mythic petitioner, or something else?
A character who has Divine Source would indeed receive such souls IF they had a realm that could accept those souls as petitioners. Without that divine realm, such a character misses out.
You don't have to be a demigod to create a demiplane. That's a spell that anyone powerful enough can cast.
Depends on the situation and the GM's permission... but remember, once Pharasma judges someone, that soul stops being a soul and becomes a petitioner, which may change some things.
A demigod OR a deity can be brought back from death via the normal rules.
If a demigod or deity dies and doesn't come back to life, what happens to them depends on the GM's whim—it can vary wildly.