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I was just wondering if reprints of the APG will have actually corrections and errata included?
The APG is ripe with typographical errors, broken mechanics, abilities that dont function as written, etc...
I love all the options and content of the APG I just hope that in the future I can purchase and "edited/errata'd" copy of it.
Every book in the RPG line thus far that has been reprinted has had the errata updated in it.
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I was just wondering if reprints of the APG will have actually corrections and errata included?
The APG is ripe with typographical errors, broken mechanics, abilities that dont function as written, etc...
I love all the options and content of the APG I just hope that in the future I can purchase and "edited/errata'd" copy of it.
If the Core Rules and Bestiary are any indication, each new reprinting will incorporate the compiled errata, and a PDF of the errata will be released. What you need to do is find (or alternately, start) a post that is compiling all of these errata. While I admit I've only given it a casual read-through, nothing I've noticed so far is jumping out at me as wrong.
The APG is ripe with typographical errors, broken mechanics, abilities that dont function as written, etc...
It's usually "rife with errors", not "ripe", and you're missing an apostrophe in "don't".
When will the next version of your post be coming out? ;-)
The APG is ripe with typographical errors, broken mechanics, abilities that dont function as written, etc...It's usually "rife with errors", not "ripe", and you're missing an apostrophe in "don't".
When will the next version of your post be coming out? ;-)
Oh noes! It is the Grammer Police! Hide!
*hides under the stairs*
It's usually "rife with errors", not "ripe", and you're missing an apostrophe in "don't".
When will the next version of your post be coming out? ;-)
Heh. :)
Yes, subscribers get the first, error-filled hardcover. Unlike the people that pick it up in a later, edited printing. Which is why I have sad face.
Well, until human beings are incapable of mistakes I think this is something that you just expect out of first printings. I'd rather get it early on and enjoy myself though. I can live with a couple typos.
I'm not sure if 4 errata documents count as a "parade", but hey, it's not like WotC books didn't have any errata ... oh wait, they call those "updates" now ?
Seriously. Something I love and hate about 4e, and ultimately feel alienated about is how pointless most of the books wind up feeling. It's not like Paizo's errata makes the existing books less relevant.
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Yes, subscribers get the first, error-filled hardcover. Unlike the people that pick it up in a later, edited printing. Which is why I have sad face.
Subscribers get both, and the PDF is free (and eternally updated for free as well).
Unlike the people that wait to get the error-free version, who will wait eternally because such a beast does not and probably will not ever exist?
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Well, until human beings are incapable of mistakes I think this is something that you just expect out of first printings. I'd rather get it early on and enjoy myself though. I can live with a couple typos.
Couple, yes. Entire sentences, not so much.
Unlike the people that wait to get the error-free version, who will wait eternally because such a beast does not and probably will not ever exist?
Who said anything about 'error-free'?
Creative Director
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Yes, subscribers get the first, error-filled hardcover. Unlike the people that pick it up in a later, edited printing. Which is why I have sad face.
Subscribers get both, and the PDF is free (and eternally updated for free as well).
As has been mentioned above, subscribers also gain the PDF for free, which is a free way to get those erratas.
That said, there's ALWAYS going to be "errors" in gaming books. Our goal is to make sure that we get as many of those errors corrected in a book's first printing, to the point where the first printing, while some errors will slip through, are well under the threshold of making the rules unusable. I feel that to date we've managed that, more or less.
As for WHY there's always going to be errors in gaming books... that's mostly due to the fact that these books are INCREDIBLY complicated. As or even more complicated than many college textbooks. Part of the reason WHY college textbooks cost so much is because they're so difficult to create in the first place—they require a LOT of editorial passes. If we turned that same level of error-crushing to Gaming books, we would need a LOT longer editing cycles (and probably more editors), which would in turn mean that each book would take longer to get to print, and which would thus mean that we'd have less time to work on MULTIPLE books, which would also mean fewer books a year. But our costs of operation wouldn't go down (in fact, with the likelihood of more editors, those costs would increase), which would mean that our books would become much more expensive.
Expensive like similarly-sized textbooks. Likely over a hundred bucks.
Since textbooks have a HUGE market and a legacy of being expensive and lots of other things, they can get away with that.
Since tabletop RPGs are a niche hobby and a luxury/entertainment item, they have to be priced competitive.
Anyway... a long answer to a simple question, I guess. And again, I'm pretty proud of how few errors there actually are in our books.
I'm not sure if 4 errata documents count as a "parade", but hey, it's not like WotC books didn't have any errata ... oh wait, they call those "updates" now ?Kind of makes me sad to be a subscriber.Yeah. The parade of errata is the reason I've decided not to buy hard copies of any Paizo product.
A FAQ with 116 pages and god knows how many erratas.
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I like how everyone dogpiles someone expressing sadness over getting typos.
Gotta agree with TOZ here -this a 100% legit concern which should be directed at the publisher, not the players.
My players (jerks) were already waiting for the various incarnations of the core rulebook while I (as the GM, RE: Sucker) have the most error-laden version out the gate.The bestiary also makes me sad with omitted/cut-off sentences and the like.
I personally would rather have waited an extra month to get some better QC on the hard covers. It sucks having to check data - and then the needing double check that data on a reference doc.
When I am writing up mods it isn't a big deal since I have the updated the pdfs (when they get updated) - but at the table without a laptop it can be a pain, also making sure that each PC has the right errata -first printing, second printing, etc.
Just by my subscriptions you can tell I support this company, and while I don't run a 100% PF RAW game I still support the efforts with the ruleset. I know the company is up against some hard deadlines with cons and so on, but I would really like some more time taken with QC and checking print runs for errors with their books.
Already as a DM I need to pick up a new copy of PF core (3rd print) and bestiary (2nd print) - I know, no one needs to buy the updated books but the situation is annoying.
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Kind of makes me sad to be a subscriber.Yeah. The parade of errata is the reason I've decided not to buy hard copies of any Paizo product.
Let me guess, you always bought the hard covers for 3rd edition and 3.5 edition though, right? If you bought ANY of them then yes you bought a book that had about 100% MORE errors then any and I do mean ANY Pathfinder book to date has ever had. Not to mention the Errata was extremely hard to find for all the books too and hardly advertised.
So I WILL buy Pathfinder and not worry about the Errata's until they come out and the one or two pages that I have to carry in my books is of little concern then :)
If you choose not to buy the hardcover because of the so called horrible mistakes as you imply then that is on you. I would sell all your old edition D&D product then too.
I like how everyone dogpiles someone expressing sadness over getting typos.
Hey, I didn't mean to dogpile. I just a chuckle out of hogarth's post.
I agree the books could use better editing, but as James pointed out, RPG publishers labor under a pretty tight set of constraints.
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Citation needed.
Let me guess, you always bought the hard covers for 3rd edition and 3.5 edition though, right? If you bought ANY of them then yes you bought a book that had about 100% MORE errors then any and I do mean ANY Pathfinder book to date has ever had.
The Erratas for the 3.5 books where not long at all, I think 2-3 pages. About the same Length of as the PFRPG Errata.
Now the FAQ, that was large!
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Monster Manual III.Citation needed.
Let me guess, you always bought the hard covers for 3rd edition and 3.5 edition though, right? If you bought ANY of them then yes you bought a book that had about 100% MORE errors then any and I do mean ANY Pathfinder book to date has ever had.
Allow me to expound. I need the least error filled book from 3.x compared to the APG, which is the most error filled PF book that I know of, and I need proof that the 3.x book contains 100% more errors than the APG. Because he said 'ANY' 3.x book has 100% MORE errors than 'any and I do mean ANY Pathfinder book to date'.
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Citation needed.
Let me guess, you always bought the hard covers for 3rd edition and 3.5 edition though, right? If you bought ANY of them then yes you bought a book that had about 100% MORE errors then any and I do mean ANY Pathfinder book to date has ever had.The Erratas for the 3.5 books where not long at all, I think 2-3 pages. About the same Length of as the PFRPG Errata.
Now the FAQ, that was large!
The errata for the PH and the DMG was only 2-3 pages, but the erratas for the rest of the books was 3-4 pages and we will not even TALK about the Updates to those books will we?
Pathfinder and Paizo are at LEAST nice enough to update the PDF version for free as WotC has never put out a free updated book to anything like that including a simple PDF without charging an arm and a leg for a simple update.
AGP is dead, man. PCI Express is the new standard. You really need to upgrade.
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I suppose we need to define 'errors' as well. Is it just typos and editing mistakes, or nonfunctional rules? I think limiting it to typos would be for the best, as what is 'broken' is highly subjective. After all, I would add the entire 3.5 Fighter and Monk on that list, and that would definitely push an advantage on 3.X in the race for 'most errors'.
Edit: I'd just like to point out again, I said 'I am sad that as a subscriber I get more errors in my hardcover than someone who buys X months down the line'.
In response I've been told 'but you get a free PDF', 'they have infinite PDF updates', 'it's expected', 'you'll never get an error-free book', 'here is why first printings have errors', and best of all 'did you buy 3.x because those were a 100 times worse so you have no reason to complain and should sell all your books if you're unhappy'.
All because I had the gall to feel sad and post criticism.
Look at my tags.
Am I too a sad panda my physical copies will have the most typos/errors/etc? Yes.
Do I think there is any solution that makes any fiscal sense for Paizo to do anything about that? No.
Do I wish there were less mistakes in first printings? Yes.
Does Paizo wish there were less mistakes in first printings? Yes.
Could they do more to have less errors in first printings? Yes: They could take much longer to develop the books, have more people working on editing/proof-reading/etc.
Again, does that make $$$ sense to Paizo? No. They do the best they can in the time they have with the resources they have.
Do I begrudge Paizo for trying to make money instead of having a 100% perfect release? No, absolutely not.
As has been mentioned above, subscribers also gain the PDF for free, which is a free way to get those erratas.
Erratum: change the last word in this sentence to "errata." ;)
Heh, just realized that I don't have a subscription tag. Odd.
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<plenty of points>
And my point is, I have not claimed otherwise anywhere in this thread.
Before we all get worked up over any comments that people are getting carried away with on, why don't we all just agree that the OP's question was answered and leave the thread? :)
*salutes* A fine suggestion comrade.
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Edit: I'd just like to point out again, I said 'I am sad that as a subscriber I get more errors in my hardcover than someone who buys X months down the line'.
I am happy with my APG, there are a good number or issues and I would love to see it improved but overall I'm happy with it. Obviously my expectations are lower than yours in regards to the sort of issues you are upset about.
Instead of subscribing you might seriously consider buying the PDF when it's released then picking up the second printing when the errata'd version is released. Considering the cost of the PDFs its not a horrible deal and for pickier customers.