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This is sort of a companion thread to the Ultimate Magic wish list thread...what sorts of things are you hoping to see in the Ultimate Combat book due out next year...
My big one is more for animal companions and the classes that love them (er, not in that way). The nature warden from APG was a step in that direction, although I think that it is a little weird and not suitable for all classes. The mounted archtypes are also nice, but I'd like to see more feats and magic items specifically for either the animal companions themselves or for the owners to augment their animal companions (allowing for more exotic companions, like magical beasts, or adding templates).
A stripped down archetype/sub-class of the summoner that transforms it into a Dragon Rider or a class with a dragon animal companion. Drop spell casting and the SLA summon, add some armor, weapon proficiencies, and a combat feat or two.
A martial artist that doesnt have the 'mystic' tie in the monk does. Whether it's through archtypes or new feats or a new base class, I'd like to see a way to create an unarmed specialist who doesnt use things like 'ki' and doesnt have an eastern flavor to them.
A feat which will allow the vital chain to be used with a lance attack.
This is sort of a companion thread to the Ultimate Magic wish list thread...what sorts of things are you hoping to see in the Ultimate Combat book due out next year...
My big one is more for animal companions and the classes that love them (er, not in that way). The nature warden from APG was a step in that direction, although I think that it is a little weird and not suitable for all classes. The mounted archtypes are also nice, but I'd like to see more feats and magic items specifically for either the animal companions themselves or for the owners to augment their animal companions (allowing for more exotic companions, like magical beasts, or adding templates).
I see nothing wrong with more animal-love. In precisely that way.
What? I meant making them stronger combatants of course! =p
A martial Mage base class that neither sucks nor is overpowered. No, not a bard; a higher damage output variant of such... Basically like the suggested EK base class. The bard variant in APG was a huge step in the right direction, but I want more selfishly focused spell lists / abilities.
That will be released as the magus in ultimate magic.
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A martial Mage base class that neither sucks nor is overpowered. No, not a bard; a higher damage output variant of such... Basically like the suggested EK base class. The bard variant in APG was a huge step in the right direction, but I want more selfishly focused spell lists / abilities.
Please forgive the quasi-cross post but might I suggest you take a look at the new Vanguard class from Super Genius Games. It could be to your liking.
Back on topic, I'd love more shield focused stuff (feats etc). The shield fighter is an archtype that I think still has plenty of room left to be explored and expanded on.
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- mass combat rules
- martial arts feats (see this thread) something akin to this
- new sub-classes
- like the idea of animal love (builds of course)
- mass combat rules
- mass combat rules
...and ...I think i'm forgetting something... oh yeah
- M A S S C O M B A T R U L E S
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- mass combat rules
- martial arts feats (see this thread) something akin to this
- new sub-classes
- like the idea of animal love (builds of course)
- mass combat rules
- mass combat rules
...and ...I think i'm forgetting something... oh yeah
- M A S S C O M B A T R U L E S
Mass Combat rules were featured already in the Kingmaker AP. Wouldn't hurt to get them in a generic sourcebook, tho.
Mass Combat rules were featured already in the Kingmaker AP. Wouldn't hurt to get them in a generic sourcebook, tho.- mass combat rules
- martial arts feats (see this thread) something akin to this
- new sub-classes
- like the idea of animal love (builds of course)
- mass combat rules
- mass combat rules
...and ...I think i'm forgetting something... oh yeah
- M A S S C O M B A T R U L E S
In the interviews from gencon on the know direction podcast it was stated that we do indeed expect Mass combat rules in Ultimate Combat, so this should be something we see in the book :).
New magical properties for armor and weapons.
a new martial base class or two
but i aint gettin it
a brand new pathfinder original combat base class with no magic and no spells and is based around combat in a unique and new way
I would like to see a mobility-based warrior type, like a combination of the 3.5 scout and swashbuckler, possibly with rage power-like stunts or tricks or talents.
I would like to see a warrior type that gets combat advantages by putting "conditions" on opponents, like flanked, flat-footed, shaken, prone, dragged or bull-rushed, etc.
I would like to see a warrior type that buffs the party in non-magical ways, like the Marshal.
I would like to see a re-vamping of the hexblade that uses a witch's hexes and other supernatural curses and de-buffs.
I would like to see an exorcist-type warrior that specializes in anti-spellcaster techniques without necessarily being morally or ethically anti-magic.
I would like to see a defense-based character that isn't totally reactive. Kind of like a base-class version of the stalwart defender.
I would like to see a Dex-based rager.
I would like to see a class that uses brains over brawn to be a capable adventurer.
I would like to see a warriory-alchemist that specializes in different mutagens with a little bit more flavor and thematically more dynamic that the alchemist.
I would like to see a magic-using, but not necessarily spell-using, class that is fun and easy in combat without a lot of book-keeping.
Mass combat rules is the first thing that comes to mind
Also I would like to see some feat chains to make unarmed combat (punching/kicking) on par with weapon wielding fighters. I would also love to see some more grappling feats
If the above is not feasible then can we get an unarmed brawler type base class? or prestige class? Please?
Most of my requests fall into the optional rule category:
1. Class-based Defense progression
2. Rules for Armor as DR
(These would mitigate the need for AC-boosting items & make the lightly armored warrior more viable)
3. Hit Location Rules
4. Armor customization rules (i.e. build your own suit / piecemeal armor)
5. Martial arts & Combat Styles - expansions of existing rules like CMB & CMD, just greater tactical variety. NOT Tome of Battle-style powers.
6. Mass combat rules (although WARPATH is fitting the bill nicely)
7. Naval combat rules
8. Tournaments, contests, & ceremonial combat rules/examples (kind of like how Gambling & Chases were handled in the GMG)
9. Expanded critical hits & injury rules
Spell-less Paladins and Rangers, and possibly spell-less bards, alchemists, and inquisitors.
More archetypes for fighters.
Maybe a base class for archers. I see them as possibly lightly armed and armored, with more focus than the archer fighter archetype.
Maybe rules for variable BABs depending on weapon type: melee, ranged, possibly even unarmed.
Spell-less Paladins and Rangers, and possibly spell-less bards, alchemists, and inquisitors.
More archetypes for fighters.
Maybe a base class for archers. I see them as possibly lightly armed and armored, with more focus than the archer fighter archetype.
Maybe rules for variable BABs depending on weapon type: melee, ranged, possibly even unarmed.
Just as a heads up, Spell-less Rangers can be found in the APG under the Ranger Archetypes.
Spell-less Paladins and Rangers, and possibly spell-less bards, alchemists, and inquisitors.
spell less inquistors would be cool
Martial precision the feat that lets you use your Dex as your damage bonus
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Just as a heads up, Spell-less Rangers can be found in the APG under the Ranger Archetypes.Spell-less Paladins and Rangers, and possibly spell-less bards, alchemists, and inquisitors.
More archetypes for fighters.
Maybe a base class for archers. I see them as possibly lightly armed and armored, with more focus than the archer fighter archetype.
Maybe rules for variable BABs depending on weapon type: melee, ranged, possibly even unarmed.
There is also a fairly popular one in Kobold Quarterly issue #11 ...
What? Come on, you know I had to bring it up! ;)
More CMB / CMD uses!!!!
It’s now a standard operation lets use it more often!
An ACF for cavalier: Marshal or Warlod. Remove the mount, and add in 3-4 auras similar to the ones of the marshal in Miniature Handbook.
Martial arts like in the old Oriantal Adventures: Bonus maneuvers you can perform if you fulfill a tier of feats (making fulfilling a tier of feats more rewarding and less one-trick pony).
More CMB / CMD uses!!!!
This. Plus Mass Combat (stated above). Plus something like Weapons Style Feats in Complete Warrior. I always loved the idea of these, but I felt that Wizards really bungled the implamentation of these, making them near useless. I mean I loved them requiring a serious number of feats making the fighter probably the only one going to use them, but they made half of them with exotic weapons that an average gamer never uses (i.e. trident and net, great for flavor, but why not more sword or ax based feats) or were designed with a simple weapon user inmind who probably isn't going to take to many of weapon-based feats.
i would like to see some combat tricks, like using combo's that allow you to do something you normally couldn't.
like mixing some combat maneuvers with some skills like acrobatics
i would like to see some combat tricks, like using combo's that allow you to do something you normally couldn't.
like mixing some combat maneuvers with some skills like acrobatics
+1 to this. Actually, my idea about the old Martial Arts coul match well with this, as well as with things like the Complete Scoundrel Skill Triks.
But something different from the "yet another maneuver feat" because even if you have 21 of them, they will finish. A little bit of versatility could improve a lot the gameplay of meleers.
1) A barbarian variant that doesn't have the rage class feature.
2) Versatile feats: feats that give you more than one option (like several spells do).
3) Mundane ways to combat magic. (example: an alchemical item, naturally occurring mineral, or whatever, that dampens or actually drains magical properties spell slots, ect. in proximity)
4) Magic armor property that circumvents the max Dex bonus (you'd think that with all the magic armor lying about, some mage would have actually tried to use magic to make armor less restrictive with regards to movement).
More magic armor and shield properties, possibly 1 round duration defenses that activate as immediate actions?
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What I *really* want to see is more applications of the stuff we already have. We've got a ton of awesome things, how about we open that up a bit?
Disarm, for example, takes away an opponent's weapon. But if they're not wielding a weapon, your disarm is useless. How about optional rules for allowing disarm to "deny" a natural weapon (keep it from being used) for a round or three? Or using "trip" to give a four-legged the 'entangled' condition (instead of prone) but ignoring their bonus vs. trip? Using an intimidation check to disrupt spell-casting? Or a feint?
More combat uses for common household skills!
Some way for fighters, rogues, or barbarians to get an animal companion/mount (a la cavaliers or paladins). Even if they have to pay for it, and can't get such a thing for free, and even if the scale is worse, as long as there's some rules for these things to scale with level I'm happy.
And a "Wrangler" class might be fun. Kinda like the summoner, but completely non-magical. Starts out with an animal companion (like a guard dog), and makes liberal use of things like flanking and aid another actions to boost everyone's combat effectiveness. Something a little less Pokemon and more animal handler.
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1. A few gagillion more teamwork feats. Maybe with synergies besides standing adjacent. Maybe cool things like ranged/close melee teamwork.
2. A Scrapper Druid archtype who specializes in using his forms attacks specifically for cool attacks strange forms give him/her.
3. Expansion of Cleric/Oracle melee combat options. Maybe cool new weapon channels and curses.
4. More Fighter archtypes.
5. The complete guide to Alchemist/Rogue bombs, traps, tricks, and expanded poisons and gimmicks.
6. A gimmick Rogue. Think 60's era gaget Bond.
7. Military oriented prestige classes and traits.
8. A item section that talks about field kits, how to build them based on your roles.
9. Options to use combat engineering/environments in battle to your advantage.
10. Fantasy Engineer Commandos. :D
Unarmed combat rules that don't require you to take a level of monk just to not suck at punching things.
For the record, a level 20 fighter that actually focuses on it deals more damage with punches than a level 20 monk.
Unarmed combat rules that don't require you to take a level of monk just to not suck at punching things.For the record, a level 20 fighter that actually focuses on it deals more damage with punches than a level 20 monk.
But what about levels 1, 2, 4, 8, and 12? Those are the levels we usually play at. I've rarely gotten up to 20th, and even then, it was either a campaign that got fast-forwarded about 15 levels, or the "level 1" of an epic level campaign, where we didn't earn it.
But what about levels 1, 2, 4, 8, and 12? Those are the levels we usually play at. I've rarely gotten up to 20th, and even then, it was either a campaign that got fast-forwarded about 15 levels, or the "level 1" of an epic level campaign, where we didn't earn it.Unarmed combat rules that don't require you to take a level of monk just to not suck at punching things.For the record, a level 20 fighter that actually focuses on it deals more damage with punches than a level 20 monk.
+1
But what about levels 1, 2, 4, 8, and 12? Those are the levels we usually play at. I've rarely gotten up to 20th, and even then, it was either a campaign that got fast-forwarded about 15 levels, or the "level 1" of an epic level campaign, where we didn't earn it.Unarmed combat rules that don't require you to take a level of monk just to not suck at punching things.For the record, a level 20 fighter that actually focuses on it deals more damage with punches than a level 20 monk.
Anything from 4 up, I believe (weapon specialization and especially weapon training tip the scales).
Actually, hell, let's do the math. We'll assume that Strength scores are even (even though it's far more likely that the Fighter will have a higher Strength than the Monk) and ignore feats that both could take.
A level 1 Monk attacks with his unarmed strike for 3.5 average damage. The level 1 Fighter attacks for 2 average damage. Clear advantage to the Monk. A level 3 Monk is still doing 3.5 average damage, and the Fighter is still doing 2 average damage. At level 4, the monk's damage increases to 4.5 (1d8) and the Fighter's increases to 4 (1d3+2 from Weapon Specialization). At level 5, the monk's damage is still at 4.5 and the Fighter's increases to 5(1d3+2+1 from Weapon Training).
So, from level 5 on, the Fighter deals more damage than the Monk on average with unarmed strikes, assuming both have identical Strength scores. If we're talking more realistic builds with the Fighter ahead by +1 or +2 Strength, the Fighter is almost equal at level 1 and pulls ahead at level 4, if not earlier.
Moral of the story: people really over-value dice rolls and under-value flat damage bonuses.
Oh, and more non-spell casting options for the ranger.
+1
<snip -- interesting stuff>
Nice analysis! It's something I hadn't even considered.
Now I need to reconsider some NPC martial artist builds...
Oh, and more non-spell casting options for the ranger.+1
+2
But what about levels 1, 2, 4, 8, and 12? Those are the levels we usually play at. I've rarely gotten up to 20th, and even then, it was either a campaign that got fast-forwarded about 15 levels, or the "level 1" of an epic level campaign, where we didn't earn it.Unarmed combat rules that don't require you to take a level of monk just to not suck at punching things.For the record, a level 20 fighter that actually focuses on it deals more damage with punches than a level 20 monk.Anything from 4 up, I believe (weapon specialization and especially weapon training tip the scales).
Actually, hell, let's do the math. We'll assume that Strength scores are even (even though it's far more likely that the Fighter will have a higher Strength than the Monk) and ignore feats that both could take.
A level 1 Monk attacks with his unarmed strike for 3.5 average damage. The level 1 Fighter attacks for 2 average damage. Clear advantage to the Monk. A level 3 Monk is still doing 3.5 average damage, and the Fighter is still doing 2 average damage. At level 4, the monk's damage increases to 4.5 (1d8) and the Fighter's increases to 4 (1d3+2 from Weapon Specialization). At level 5, the monk's damage is still at 4.5 and the Fighter's increases to 5(1d3+2+1 from Weapon Training).
So, from level 5 on, the Fighter deals more damage than the Monk on average with unarmed strikes, assuming both have identical Strength scores. If we're talking more realistic builds with the Fighter ahead by +1 or +2 Strength, the Fighter is almost equal at level 1 and pulls ahead at level 4, if not earlier.
Moral of the story: people really over-value dice rolls and under-value flat damage bonuses.
DOH!!! And I just "wasted" half the night working on a Pugilist base class.....
Now all we need is a way to get a decent unarmored AC for a fighter...
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Now all we need is a way to get a decent unarmored AC for a fighter...
I'm ok with full platy types myself. An old character concept of mine had a lawful neutral fighter fighting unarmed AND WINNING by imitating the strict precision of the fighting style of premier LN creatures - the Inevitables. She'd hold them as a paragon for all thing lawful and just, descending on her foes like a wall of steel.
Furthermore, we have the cesti now. No need for an amulet of mighty fists anymore, which makes this character even likelier and, most importantly, it's gear cheaper. Have several cesti for different occasions, adamantine and cold iron mostly, mark them with sigils of absolute hierarchy and punch and german supplex your foes to smithereens.