Me and my friends noticed this Friday night and we confirmed it with the rule book.
The serpentfolk in this campaign can't turn into humanoids (humans) or humanoid (charau-ka) with disguise self. They can turn into: centaur, doppelganger, gargoyle, green hag, harpy, lamia, medusa, minotaur, morlock, sahuagin, sea hag, skum, or yeti... because disguise self says:
You cannot change your creature type
(although you can appear as another subtype).
and (monstrous) is not a subtype.
I understand the necessity of it as a storytelling mechanic with Yarzoth, but to have Issilar use it wrong as a way to deflect attention from himself in combat is kind of bunk.
Creative Director
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Me and my friends noticed this Friday night and we confirmed it with the rule book.
The serpentfolk in this campaign can't turn into humanoids (humans) or humanoid (charau-ka) with disguise self. They can turn into: centaur, doppelganger, gargoyle, green hag, harpy, lamia, medusa, minotaur, morlock, sahuagin, sea hag, skum, or yeti... because disguise self says:
You cannot change your creature type
(although you can appear as another subtype).and (monstrous) is not a subtype.
I understand the necessity of it as a storytelling mechanic with Yarzoth, but to have Issilar use it wrong as a way to deflect attention from himself in combat is kind of bunk.
Actually, in the case of serpentfolk, they CAN use disguise self to appear human. That was always the design goal.
It's unfortunate that an (in my opinion unfortunate and limiting and frustrating) change to the way a spell works has this sort of stealth "ripple effect" on a monster. Serpentfolk first appeared in print in a Pathfinder product in the 3.5 book "Into the Darklands." At that point, disguise self WOULD allow them to disguise themselves as human.
We should have noticed this change when updating the serpentfolk to the Pathfinder RPG, but we did not, alas. The simplest solution is to simply remove "disguise self" from the serpentfolk's spell-like abilities and give him the "change shape (any humanoid, alter self)" special ability, I suppose. Another one would be to say that instead of having "disguise self" as a spell-like ability, serpentfolk have a spell-like ability called "disguise self as humanoid" which works the same way as disguise self but only lets you appear as a humanoid.
Another option: Replace their ability to use disguise self at will with this:
veil (self only, humanoid appearance only, DC 19)
That's the official errata for these guys for now, in any event. (Frustratingly, it's too late to include that errata in pretty much any Serpent's Skull volume OR in the Bestiary 2, where the serpentfolk appear). It DOES make it more difficult than ever to see through their illusion but that's kind of fine with me.
I'm a fan of the "change shape (any humanoid, alter self)" method, because disguise self doesn't change the sound of your voice or the feel of your body behind the glamer, and I get that maybe serpentfolk might have this "sleeper" kind of intent where they're meant to be part of a game for a long time as a mole and then suddenly reveal their presence.
We'll just keep it at that for our games, I think.
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...I get that maybe serpentfolk might have this "sleeper" kind of intent where they're meant to be part of a game for a long time as a mole and then suddenly reveal their presence.
Oh, you are so ready for Sanctum of the Serpent God, my friend. ;-)
...I get that maybe serpentfolk might have this "sleeper" kind of intent where they're meant to be part of a game for a long time as a mole and then suddenly reveal their presence.Oh, you are so ready for Sanctum of the Serpent God, my friend. ;-)
sssssSPOILERS!
Gosh!
Hardly. You had to know there'd be lots of serpentfolk in the finale.
The masters of copy/paste fail to read the data first again. lol
Is it just me, or is The Route to Tazion map non selectable? I have Adobe 8 so this is not usually a problem.
Annoying because I was just about to print it up for the party for my game tonight.
Not just that, but that image is the entire world map, just zoomed in to one spot. That's why that page takes so long to load...
For my game, I just took a screenshoot of the PDF, pasted into Paint, and went from there.
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Is it just me, or is The Route to Tazion map non selectable? I have Adobe 8 so this is not usually a problem.
Annoying because I was just about to print it up for the party for my game tonight.
Not just that, but that image is the entire world map, just zoomed in to one spot. That's why that page takes so long to load...
For my game, I just took a screenshoot of the PDF, pasted into Paint, and went from there.
Vic or James,
Any way we can get this fixed?
In page 56 it says :
'which hides a prized Azlanti weapon, a shatterspike.'
I can't find stats for that weapon (or reference where to find it if it's in on other book.)
Did i fumble my perception roll or is something missing?
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In page 56 it says :
'which hides a prized Azlanti weapon, a shatterspike.'
I can't find stats for that weapon (or reference where to find it if it's in on other book.)
Did i fumble my perception roll or is something missing?
page 475 of the core rule book
It's a +1 longsword that acts as a +4 longsword when the wielder has Improved Sunder and is attempting to sunder.
On p55 of RtR, the sidebar lists PA awards if the GM is using the Faction Guide. Does each PC get the listed awards, or do they only apply to the group as a whole?
On p55 of RtR, the sidebar lists PA awards if the GM is using the Faction Guide. Does each PC get the listed awards, or do they only apply to the group as a whole?
As I understand it, the rewards are meant to be given to each player individually, at least this is what i have been doing.
Am i right in thinking that even though Dargan Etters is LN, allying with the Aspis Consortium which is, overall, NE is going to be a violation of the paladin's code?
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Am i right in thinking that even though Dargan Etters is LN, allying with the Aspis Consortium which is, overall, NE is going to be a violation of the paladin's code?
In part 3, city of the seven spears, Dargan stat's block lists him as LE. Not sure which is right.
As for violating the Paladins Code, that is a GM call. It would depend for me on the Paladin's god, oath and what they let Dargan get away with.
I have read through the AP 1-4 and have a question on Racing to Ruin. It's a spoiler, though:
Why are the Mzali rangers lawful evil? Just because they want to kick non-Mwangi out and purge Mwangi collaborators? Because they make gallows trees and use human bane arrows? By default because Walkena is Lawful Evil? Is there a writeup anywhere that goes into this or Walkena beyond the text in Heart of the Jungle?
Did these rangers or guys like them make the gallows tree bodies into zombies? I don't see anything in their stat block that would allow it. Were the zombies deliberately created, say by a witch doctor traveling with warriors? Are the zombies just "natural"? Are they a byproduct of Walkena's being a mummy?
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I have read through the AP 1-4 and have a question on Racing to Ruin. It's a spoiler, though:
** spoiler omitted **
In this case, they are there to be enemies for the PCs to fight, and their LE alignment reflects both the alignment of their "god" Walkena and the racial intolerance of Mzali as a whole.
That being said, you can certainly change them to be LN if you want an encounter that the PCs can roleplay through instead of fighting. I wouldn't make them good, however, because Mzali is extremely xenophobic and make a regular practice of attacking non-Mwangi traveling through their lands.
Thanks, Rob.
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RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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Quick question. For the spirit animals/tattoo once my players have earned them it says they can be use 'once per adventure for the duration of the Adventure Path" does that mean once per gaming session? Once a game week? Just looking for a little clarification. Thanks
I thought it simply meant once per Adventure Path. So, once in Racing to Ruin, once in City of Seven Spears, once in Vaults of Madness, once in The Thousand Fangs Below, and once in Sanctum of the Serpent God.
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Quick question. For the spirit animals/tattoo once my players have earned them it says they can be use 'once per adventure for the duration of the Adventure Path" does that mean once per gaming session? Once a game week? Just looking for a little clarification. Thanks
An adventure path is divided into 6 adventures, so as JoelF847 said, it can be used once per adventure.
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I had a question about the travels times on page 23. How were they calculated?
They seem to average about 18 miles per day, even though the terrain varys (from plains to jungle). It also seems after Kalabuto most of it should be trackless, hence moving 18 miles per day on the plains/savanah or 6 miles per day in the jungle.
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I had a question about the travels times on page 23. How were they calculated?
They seem to average about 18 miles per day, even though the terrain varys (from plains to jungle). It also seems after Kalabuto most of it should be trackless, hence moving 18 miles per day on the plains/savanah or 6 miles per day in the jungle.
Assuming a speed of 30 (which the adventure does), the PCs do average about 18 miles a day. In the plains, the terrain is considered trackless, but in the jungle after Kalabuto, it is assumed to be road or trail. This is in fact why the route to Tazion follows the river, because traveling along the riverbank is easier than cutting your way through trackless jungle.
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I take a lot from the justification of why they're ahead and apart from the main expediton in the first place - they being the 'trailblazers'. I plan to emphaises this both to enhanse the story and to explain the travel times: Their job is not just to get from A to B, but to clear the quickest cleanest path from A to B for the primary expedition (which is encumbered by a big baggage train).
So, actually they may be moving a lot faster than 18 miles a day, BUT they're not going in anywhere near a straight line, and they are doing a lot of "three steps forward two steps back", even in open terrain, since they'll be constantly backtracking, marking out the best trail for the drovers and porters of the main expedition group. All of THAT activity abstracts down to the travel times on the chart, and justifies the travel time bonuses they get as encoutner area awards (saves them an amount of this back and forth).
Just a curiosity question related to something that came up while I was running this for my group the other night. I know this is supposed to be the GM thread but since it surprised my players so much I'll put this in spoilers just in case.
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Just a curiosity question related to something that came up while I was running this for my group the other night. I know this is supposed to be the GM thread but since it surprised my players so much I'll put this in spoilers just in case.
** spoiler omitted **
I was en-route to a TPK, 3/4 of the group failed their save vs fear, So I had to pull back to let the group survive.
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Just a curiosity question related to something that came up while I was running this for my group the other night. I know this is supposed to be the GM thread but since it surprised my players so much I'll put this in spoilers just in case.
** spoiler omitted **
Yes, it's a one-shot item, whether the
Just a curiosity question related to something that came up while I was running this for my group the other night. I know this is supposed to be the GM thread but since it surprised my players so much I'll put this in spoilers just in case.
** spoiler omitted **
My group made all their saves against the fear effect and knowledge checks to realize the ape was possessed. The paladin managed to exorcise the demon using the fetish in round two of the combat so I guess my group was lucky.
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RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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Just a curiosity question related to something that came up while I was running this for my group the other night. I know this is supposed to be the GM thread but since it surprised my players so much I'll put this in spoilers just in case.
** spoiler omitted **
My group had big problems with that encounter as well. They failed to notice the possession, and then almost the whole party got hit with the fear effect, except the group's rogue and one of their minions (a guardsman from being allied with the Sargavan government). The ape ended up killing the guard and the rest of the group ran away while it was distracted. They then decided to avoid going back to that area, and I ruled it cost them about 2 days to blaze a trail to circumvent it.
They ended up using the spirit fetish on the
I had a moment of hilarity with Encounter C - The Fzumi Salt Mines.
"Well why bother going through the mines? We'll go with Athyra because if she'll be waiting for us on the other side her way must be quicker!"
I, as DM, had to mumble something about Athyra being able to travel quicker than the rest of the party, and besides (luckily) they had a pack horse that wouldnt be able to trek the route that Athyra would take. We all had a good laugh about it though.
I had a moment of hilarity with Encounter C - The Fzumi Salt Mines.
** spoiler omitted **
I stumbled across that as well.
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RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32
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I've been suprised at just how effective the 1st level warrior guardsmen that the Sargavan government sent along with my group have been. I think both my players and I expected 1st level NPCs to die in the first couple of encounters, but these guys have actually done okay. My group just killed Issilar and they still have one of them left; the others were killed by various critters:
My group has finally made it off the Shiv and with Eleder on the horizon we finished the last session. Now I have some ways in stock to introduce the factions to the PCs but I'd like to hear what you think of them and what else you might have come up with in your games.
One of the players took the "Get the Cargo Through"-Trait and soon forgot about her duty and left it on the Shiv. Now she owes the Aspis Consortium and among the first encounters on the docks will be a representative of that faction who'll be "very dissatisfied" about that. She'll be summoned to the Consortium's HQ in Eleder one of the next days and asked to lead the expedition to pay off her dues.
One unlucky ranger got himself cursed by the Glyph of Warding in the Inner Sanctum and now he desperately wants do get rid of it. Eleder has lvl 6 spells available so that wouldn't be a problem but the Pathfinder Society, being very experienced with tomb robbing related curses, offer salvation for free in exchange for trail blazing services.
Jask got quite friendly with the PCs but will be arrested by the Sargavan Government the moment his feet touch Sargavan ground at the docks as the group hasn't found proof of his innocence. In exchange for Jask's freedom the PCs will have to lead the way to Tazion. Pretty much by the book here.
The Free Captains of the Shackles will come into play should the PCs try to find shadier ways to free Jask. An agent of the faction promises to break/bribe out Jask if the PCs join with the Captains on the race to Tazion.
All in all I am afraid that my paranoid players won't pick up on the fact that they need to join with a faction and will either try to stay out of it or do it double agent style. We'll see how it turns out.
My group has finally made it off the Shiv and with Eleder on the horizon we finished the last session. Now I have some ways in stock to introduce the factions to the PCs but I'd like to hear what you think of them and what else you might have come up with in your games.
One of the players took the "Get the Cargo Through"-Trait and soon forgot about her duty and left it on the Shiv. Now she owes the Aspis Consortium and among the first encounters on the docks will be a representative of that faction who'll be "very dissatisfied" about that. She'll be summoned to the Consortium's HQ in Eleder one of the next days and asked to lead the expedition to pay off her dues.
One unlucky ranger got himself cursed by the Glyph of Warding in the Inner Sanctum and now he desperately wants do get rid of it. Eleder has lvl 6 spells available so that wouldn't be a problem but the Pathfinder Society, being very experienced with tomb robbing related curses, offer salvation for free in exchange for trail blazing services.
Jask got quite friendly with the PCs but will be arrested by the Sargavan Government the moment his feet touch Sargavan ground at the docks as the group hasn't found proof of his innocence. In exchange for Jask's freedom the PCs will have to lead the way to Tazion. Pretty much by the book here.
The Free Captains of the Shackles will come into play should the PCs try to find shadier ways to free Jask. An agent of the faction promises to break/bribe out Jask if the PCs join with the Captains on the race to Tazion.
All in all I am afraid that my paranoid players won't pick up on the fact that they need to join with a faction and will either try to stay out of it or do it double agent style. We'll see how it turns out.
I based the factions reactions to my players on how their "representatives" on the shiv felt about them.
Pathfinders - The group willing and even enthusiastically gave Gelick the information he wanted about the wrecked ship. So when they needed a translator for the notes they found they asked Gelick and he made introductions to the Pathfinders.
Apis Consortium - No real interactions happened with Ishoru, he took offense at being ignored and once he found that they were working for the pathfinders he put the consortium on to them for a reward.
Red Mantis - All party members were openly antagonistic to Sasha (and I have no clue why) so while she managed not to be killed on the shiv her report to them upon arrival was that the party needed to be watched not allied with.
Free Captains- The party was offered a place in in the Captain's crew after a good review by Aeyrs(sp?) but that fell through after they signed up with the pathfinders. (They wanted to ally with both but in the end managed to insult the Captain's intelligence quite a few 1s on diplomacy were rolled that night).
The Government- unable to prove himself innocent Jask was taken as a prisoner, the government allows a slave trade, the party contains a radial abolitionist blight druid, they freed the slaves and robbed the Governor blind before leaving the city.
My group has just thrown their lot in with the Pathfinders (using the Faction Guide rules).
Am I right in thinking that Amivor would be somewhat unimpressed to discover that some of the PCs went straight out and sold the wayfinders they were given?
I'm pondering docking those that did 1 TPA and 1 CPA. Thoughts?
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I'd just let them find out their membership is suspended and they can't gain any advancement until they get them back (or find replacements).
I'm still on the shiv, but working on a Sperpent Skull/Kingmaker mashup. Tweeks include:
- They have to fix the tides & currents to get saved. Rescue won't risk a landing otherwise. Since this can only happen at the end, also ensures they get to the end.
- With the currents fixed, people can go there, setting the stage for settlement.
- Nominally Sargavan territory, the noble who currently holds title isn't interested in the developing the place, but is very interested in selling it. None of the other nobles are very interested in the place, bad reputation and all. So, the factions can take the isle cheap and gift the PC title without too much political trouble:
- The Sargavan government could grant title directly plus give tax breaks (also great to have a base there for policing the smuggling trade)
- The Aspis, Pathfinders, or Red Mantis can buy title from the noble and pass it on, and offer to cover taxes to Sargava in enchange for base rights (all would also love base in the area, but away from Elender's problems)
- The Shackels can take it as discount off the Sargava tribute and pass it on as a vassalage to the Hurricane King (and great for encouraging the smuggling trade, and scouting marks).
- The Shiv starts as a one hex kingom, per Kingmaker rules, with all the ruins and resources they discovered and cleared in PT1 granting appropriate benefits. The PCs get monthly reports, and transmit back thier orders to through the main expedition caravan to the burocrats back on the Shiv, which are agents the factions loan to pcs to fill the vacant government roles. So they can develop their fiefdom paralele to their exploring overland, maybe even picking up additional hexes in the Sargavan hinterlands as they clear the path for the expedition.
But, only if they sign up.
One of my player characters has had a romantic liaison with Sasha, which started on Smuggler's Shiv. The same character had a Pathfinder background, he (like Gelik Aberwhinge) wants to be a Pathfinder. On Smuggler's Shiv I thought they might be rivals, but the PC shared the information he found freely with him, hoping they could both be made full members.
In Eleder I was expecting the party to join The Pathfinders, and have the Aspis Consortium as enemies, and maybe the Red Mantis as allies as well (because the Red Mantis only really want certain artefacts, not all the treasure). It didn't work out that way. They entered a deal with both The Pathfinders AND the Aspis Consortium who were both willing to deal with them, but unhappy about the party having two masters. I could have stopped that short, but I want to let the party have a say in how it goes. Their main allegience is to The Pathfinders, but the deal they have with The Aspis Consortium is that they will sell all the items they find in Saventh-Yhi to them at half market price. Of course the Aspis Consortium have a twist in their tale and they will obey the letter of the agreement but not the spirit. Of course they are not to know how horribly wrong things are going to go for them in Vaults of Madness. Despite this the Aspis Consortium were also the only ones who could get the party out through bribery when the Sargavan Government faction put a blockade around Eleder (easy because its a walled city) to try and stop expeditions leaving before them.
Sasha has decided to renounce all ties with Red Mantis. This is partly because of her romance with a PC and partly because of what happened to Pezock. Initially on Smuggler's Shiv Sasha and the tengu Pezock were enemies because she did not believe his story about how he obtained a red mantis sawtooth sabre. Later they became friends, although the sabre was always a point of conflict. The party took Pezock with them when they were rescued, and he decided he wanted to continue his career at sea and so joined Aerys when they arrived in Eleder. However Pezock was later murdered and his sawtooth sabre taken - the party blames Red Mantis for that (they are right). So they are the main enemy and all the rival faction agents belong to Red Mantis, and I'm thinking of including a Red Mantis priest (stats available in City of Seven Spears page 64) with the Rival Agents when they attack the party in Kalabuto (should be next session).
One issue I am having is that my five PC's seem to be ahead of the xp scale. They are now level 6 just having reached Kalabuto. I'm hoping the trip to Tazion won't be too easy for them.
One issue I am having is that my five PC's seem to be ahead of the xp scale. They are now level 6 just having reached Kalabuto. I'm hoping the trip to Tazion won't be too easy for them.
I don't think this will be an issue, my group hit lvl6 right around here as well and the next few major encounters can be incredibly tough even for a "above normal" leveled party.
Then the fight with the necromancer caused three of them to flee into the woods making a difficult battle for the remainder
Followed by the spriggans who beat several level 6 party members into a pulp before finally being defeated
and if that succubus manages to dominate the party tank as she did with my group then thats another big fight right there
and finally there is Taizon itself those giant constrictors are some nasty customers.
all of this is just an observation of my group mind you.
Reading through Racing to Ruin and loving one encounter after another (Umagro, the cock fight, Possessed Ape, Succubus, etc).
I think the necromancer/undead troll encounter is cool too, but two things:
1) I think the stat block forgot to include his bonuses for Greater Spell Focus
2) It says he fights to the death. The guy is a "greedy grave robber" who is emerging victoriously from the tomb when he runs into the PCs. I can see why he'd want to test out his new mask and stuff, but the guy is flying around and fighting with spells. He already has the spoils he wanted from the tomb. If he is reduced to low hitpoints, why not just fly away?
Just thought I'd mention here a sidequest I'm going to be running in the next session or so, while the characters are still in Eleder preparing to leave. I've taken the Freeport adventure 'Holiday in the Sun' (which can be downloaded for free from the Green Ronin website) and adapted it thus:
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Am i right in thinking that even though Dargan Etters is LN, allying with the Aspis Consortium which is, overall, NE is going to be a violation of the paladin's code?In part 3, city of the seven spears, Dargan stat's block lists him as LE. Not sure which is right.
As for violating the Paladins Code, that is a GM call. It would depend for me on the Paladin's god, oath and what they let Dargan get away with.
I just envisioned Dargan Etters starting out as LN but as he continued to take those "I'll do ABSOLUTELY anything to find Savanth-Yhi before THEY do" kinda actions, he slips into LE alignment. It was probably a mistake but overall, it works for me :)
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Just thought I'd mention here a sidequest I'm going to be running in the next session or so, while the characters are still in Eleder preparing to leave. I've taken the Freeport adventure 'Holiday in the Sun' (which can be downloaded for free from the Green Ronin website) and adapted it thus: ** spoiler omitted **
Could you provide a link to Holiday in the Sun for me? I can't find it on their site.
Thank you.
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William,
I found it on this Freeport page.
Did anyone do some adventures in Eledar before the race begins? I was thinking of throwing in a few mini-adventures & interesting REs as the PCs cruise about town deciphering the notes.
So what is everyone doing for maps for the many encounters that don't include them?
So what is everyone doing for maps for the many encounters that don't include them?Just makin' it up. They didn't seem too terribly challenging to me.
Word. I would draw up very large city maps, and the PCs could enter from several places to make it feel like a new map. A lot like Dragon Age 2. If you have a small map (25"x22"), probably not good, but we have a big one (47"x32") and it worked out well.
My group is trying to form some sort of coalition by getting multiple factions working together. Obviously any combination that has the Pirates-Red Mantis and/or the Aspis Consortium-Pathfinder Society won't work, but could a combination that voids the conflicting parties work. I'm thinking that given the primary motivations of the different factions means it possibly could work.
Say the Sargavan Government (Money, trade, political influence), Pathfinder Society (history, exploration) and possibly the Red Mantis (temple and artefacts)? Given the motivations it could work initially and then be a good challenge for my group to try and hold the coalition together. The Bard is naturally the driving force behind this so it would bring his abilities to the fore.
Maybe three is too many and it should be just kept to two. But then again the complexity and diversity could make it fun. What do people think?