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Antimagic Fighter


Pathfinder RPG General Discussion


Had this concept for an antimagic fighter.

The basic concept is

Antimagic field + Fighter.

anyone you engage in melee is surrounded by your antimagic field so all thier magic gear goes non functional, by the same token you never benefit from magic items.
So 1v1 battles come down to raw pyshical prowess.
or
you fire magic arrows/bolts which become magical again once they leave the field.

So far I've found no way of making a viable antimgaic fighter short of expensive magic items with the antimagic field spell use X/day

Pretty much any build I've tried dosent even get access to antimagic field until very late in the game and it nullifies a big poriton of the builds other abilities

The only viable thing I've seen in the same vein is a rogue with the dispelling attack but its not really the same thing.

any ideas ?


It's a great idea. Will you also make the converse character, the anti-fighter mage who has a bubble around him in which only spells work, melee or ranged combat is prohibited?

That would be cool too.

I think there is a reason that antimagic is rare and high-level stuff. It pretty much neutralizes whole character classes and robs other characters of a significant portion of their offensive and defensive capability. It's almost an instant-win against many encounters.

Such a concept as you've described should be rare and expensive, and shouldn't be lightly tossed around at low-levels.

Now, the above is just the prevailing theory, and the very fact that antimagic spells and equipment and even antimagic monsters are all high-level indicates the game designers see it that way too. That doesn't mean you have to see it that way in your own game.

So this concept of yours, are you thinking of making a character class out of it? Or just a fighter build using feats/equipment to achieve this concept? Did you want suggestions for home-brew classes, items, or feats?


Psionics disable spellcasting, according to AD&D rules. Your chaacter gets a certain number of attack points based on Intelligence + Wisdom. Ego Whip takes no real time at all, possibly the fastest thing out there. Your antimagic fighter would be a charlatan and always at risk of meeting a more powerfull mind or getting locked into a duel with another psionicist costing attack and defense points. You would stand only a chance of getting what you want though, the Major / Minor is based on a roll.


Bright what in the heck are you talking about and how does it apply here?

You know what -- skip that, I know what you are talking about, just get to the "how does it apply here" part since we are only about 5 editions of D&D away from what you are talking about.

To put it shortly what does AD&D psionics have to do with a viable pathfinder anti-magic field fighter?


The concept seems a tad overpowered to me. But if you are working on something that does well against casters .. *ponders*....don't Hexblades get a special ability called "mettle"? Or the Illithid slayer prestige class from the 3.5 psionics handbook have some good things? Maybe a re-read of those could get you some ideas?

Different game system: In Palladium's Beyond the Supernatural, they had a nega-psychic. Just being around him would make psychic abilities more difficult for others...it was balanced out by his never being able to take advantage of any positive abilities from other classes/critters.

Perhaps your anti-magic fellow could never use or get advantages from magic. No potions, no magic weapons, no magic armor..etc. Perhaps an expert or warrior with SR that can never be shunted by mortal means. *shrugs*

I dunno. Just the idea of a magic weilding anti-magic fighter seems a bit over the top for my style of playing.

Now if you gave him fastheal 20, sneak attacks and HiPS as well.... *grins*

greg


IIRC, there was a PrC in one of the 3.x splatbooks called aforsaker, who gained some level of restistance to magic, among other anti-magical abilities, in exchange for not only eschewing magic but going on a vendetta against it. As DM_Blake has pointed out, a broad and all-encompassing antimagic power is pretty unbalancing. Perhaps a progressio nbased on class level, with a save of some sort, might make the idea more convincing.

Taldor

the combination of the feats disruptive, spellbreaker and step up (and perhaps lunge) should be quite sufficient although not as broken.


Well I came across the idea when my puny mage put up an antimagic field to walk through a heavily magically warded area, we got into combat and instead of dropping the field I left it up held 3 summoned critters basically out of play while the rest of the group dealt with some others and then I moved close to the main boss of the room nullifying his gear while they group handled the 3 summons I was holding down.

boring fight for me but very effective was just pondering on actually making a class around the whole idea of magic denial.

I guess another way to do it would be a counterspelling fighter type although your actions are kinda chewed up by setting up to counterspell

just shooting around some ideas is all, maybe come across some interesting combo's or possibly a good mechanic for a home brew class


If you really want to do an anti magic sort the primary ingredient is going to be Eldritch Knight. With careful application of quicken spell and still spell you can set yourself up to counter spells and get actions out with enough armor to have a chance yourself while in the Anti magic field... just realize that you're feat choices are going to be very different than might be "normal" for an EK.


Greg Wasson wrote:
The concept seems a tad overpowered to me.

I don't want to witness what you call "really overpowered".

There are no cheap, low-level, long-lasting ways to disable all magic because that would kill the game.

The GM could just rip out the pages that detail more than half the character classes (wizard, sorcerer, cleric, druid - bards would be close to useless, too, and even paladins and rangers would feel it), just forget about the hundreds of pages of spells, and the useful part of the bestiary would be limited to "dumb brute" type creatures.

Magic is too big a part of the game to be just nixed like that.


It's an interesting idea, but it would be very hard to balance. And the downsides are harsher than just not being able use magic weapons and armors, because you wouldn't be able to use potions and other people couldn't cast cure spells on you. It would be very hard to adventure with such a character.

Sczarni

drow fighter/ take improved saves feats and eventually disruptive and spell breaker. in the magic item compendium there was also some weapon enhancements for fighting against spellcasters, mage bane was one of them, i think it gave the bane property to your weapon vs arcane casters.

p.s. i suggested the drow because they get a spell resistance naturally.


On reflection, I had an idea for a Feat-Chain

starting with the ability to make, in essence "alchemical counterspell potions" - ie, you have a bag full of "anti-material componants" that counter your enemies spells

Feat two makes it more flexible - rather than making one-potion-at-a-time, you just have a "generic bag of stuff" that you can whip out anti-magic things from, but needs regular refreshing

Feat three takes it a step further - you deck yourself in amulets, talismans, tattoos, body-paint, to give save bonus's to spells - but, possibly again, it "wears out" and needs regular refreshing

and feat 4 takes it to the above stuff to grant spell resistance

Sczarni

i might also suggest 2 levels of barbarian to pick up the rage power superstitious.


Bright wrote:
Psionics disable spellcasting, according to AD&D rules. Your chaacter gets a certain number of attack points based on Intelligence + Wisdom. Ego Whip takes no real time at all, possibly the fastest thing out there. Your antimagic fighter would be a charlatan and always at risk of meeting a more powerfull mind or getting locked into a duel with another psionicist costing attack and defense points. You would stand only a chance of getting what you want though, the Major / Minor is based on a roll.

3.5 Pionics have to make concentration checks in an antimagic field old DC 20+ power level.

Also the Psionic Combat is gone in 3.5


Yeah antimagic field is up there.. I'd suggest something a bit more progressive, something along the lines of a protection domain cleric. At low levels, having access to abilities designed to ruin spellcasters in a more subtle way - distraction spells like color spray and pyrotechnics, dispel magic, globe of invulnerability, etc, and then gaining access to Antimagic field at a (Much) later level. Adding spell resistance perhaps instead of fighter bonus feats, and gaining the other powers as spell-like abilities in exchange for never gaining magical benefits?


Antimagic fighter would be destroyed in most mid level to hight level games when critters have damage reduction and the enchantments on the fighters weapons and armor do not work. Yes it would work on taking out a wizard or lich, but not a dragon or pit fiend.


It acutally sounds like this would be a better as an NPC that the GM could throw at the party mid-high levels to really give em a scare and make em think.

Acutally had a cool idea for an NPC who is the guardian of one or more evil artifacts. His antimagic field is more powerful than the spell of the same name able to supress the magic of artifacts.

So while in his posession the artifacts are nothing more than masterwork weapons and or armor.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Tales Subscriber

Not working due to the meta game.

Imagine the DM being forced to have two stat-blocks for every critter, one with magic and one without. Same for you and probably most party members too.


If 3.5 is allowed there's a Forgotten Realms book (Shining South, i think) with the Battle-Scarred Berserker. You're talking 12+ lvls, but yeh, they get anti-magic field as one of their spells. Kinda like a barbarian EK. Or look at the Occult Slayer. But the EK idea's the best cuz you can switch it on or off, depending on DR etc.

Of course take the mage slayer feat chain too.


donaldsangry wrote:
Bright wrote:
Psionics disable spellcasting, according to AD&D rules. Your chaacter gets a certain number of attack points based on Intelligence + Wisdom. Ego Whip takes no real time at all, possibly the fastest thing out there. Your antimagic fighter would be a charlatan and always at risk of meeting a more powerfull mind or getting locked into a duel with another psionicist costing attack and defense points. You would stand only a chance of getting what you want though, the Major / Minor is based on a roll.
3.5 Pionics have to make concentration checks in an antimagic field old DC 20+ power level. Also the Psionic Combat is gone in 3.5

I still play AD&D. It is bizarre that people are offended by this. This reminds me of another cheap "anti" magic. Use a ray of enffeblement to reduce the caster's power. That depends on the GM's view of items and difficulty, the idea was to attack the caster while challenging an item or spell, like a warding. Someone else seriously whacked out about AD&D in this thread, I brought it up because in Pathfinder you are stuck creating new spells, classes, feats and races to do such a thing. Or an item, but if a PC owns it everything is thrown off again, so make it some inconspicuous and give it a role--or intelligence of its own maybe.

Grand Lodge

Bright wrote:
donaldsangry wrote:
Bright wrote:
Psionics disable spellcasting, according to AD&D rules. Your chaacter gets a certain number of attack points based on Intelligence + Wisdom. Ego Whip takes no real time at all, possibly the fastest thing out there. Your antimagic fighter would be a charlatan and always at risk of meeting a more powerfull mind or getting locked into a duel with another psionicist costing attack and defense points. You would stand only a chance of getting what you want though, the Major / Minor is based on a roll.
3.5 Pionics have to make concentration checks in an antimagic field old DC 20+ power level. Also the Psionic Combat is gone in 3.5
I still play AD&D. It is bizarre that people are offended by this. This reminds me of another cheap "anti" magic. Use a ray of enffeblement to reduce the caster's power. That depends on the GM's view of items and difficulty, the idea was to attack the caster while challenging an item or spell, like a warding. Someone else seriously whacked out about AD&D in this thread, I brought it up because in Pathfinder you are stuck creating new spells, classes, feats and races to do such a thing. Or an item, but if a PC owns it everything is thrown off again, so make it some inconspicuous and give it a role--or intelligence of its own maybe.

WHAT?!? How does ray of enfeeblement which attacks strength reduce caster power?!? And what item chucks this version of RoE out agian? While challeneging for the item?!? Honestly you make no sense.

As for AD&D...the issue isn't if you play it or not...the issue is relavence in THIS discussion (which is about a system that is 5 generation removed). There is a difference there.

Cheliax

If you are in a party beg a wizard to become an archer and shoot the anti-magic arrow towards you; to the extent I am aware, they are the only ones who (core) can move an amf off themselves. Pretty good prestige anyway.


just get the expansive item of anti-magic. It's not as if you are going to be getting any other magic gear. You have gold to burn.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Tales Subscriber

Whoa, thread necromancy! Unless you are a Juju-Oracle this is an evil act.

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