Pathfinder iPhone app, input needed!


Homebrew and House Rules

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During the last month I've been chiseling away at an iPhone app which presents the OGL part of the Pathfinder reference document to the user for efficient and comfortable browsing.

Check it out here: http://itunes.apple.com/no/app/pfr/id365514623?mt=8

The PFR app features:
- Full PRD, fully browseable
- Back, forward and main menu buttons
- Bookmarking
- App remembers the last visited item
- Rotation to landscape removes all GUI elements, making for less cluttered browsing. Good for reading tables.

I used the app myself while playing Pathfinder the other night, and have now reached the point where I could stop development and still be very happy with it during sessions. The question now is how could I move forward in order to take the app to the next level?

Is the full OGL PRD too much information? Is the app bland and could benefit from more ribbons and shiny bits? Is the main menu and deeper navigation optimal? Are there other functions that really needs to be in there?

I would be very grateful to hear what kind of suggestions and insights the Pathfinder community has on this. Anything might be useful!

Liberty's Edge

You may need to clarify how the app is different than either browsing to http://www.d20pfsrd.com/ or using a free pdf view app to view the prd or Turbo prd.

In order for it to take off as a paid app, it has to be something better than what can be had for free.


cyrusduane wrote:
You may need to clarify how the app is different than either browsing to http://www.d20pfsrd.com/ or using a free pdf view app to view the prd or Turbo prd.

Ah! Very good point, this definitely needs to be mentioned. I get good feedback from players who have bought it, so I think I have something going. Will try to distill this into words.

Anything else?

Shadow Lodge

Hmm, maybe instead of saying input needed you should say "PFRPG App for sale"?

Or at the very least mention in your post that you are charging $5 for it? This should probably be in the "Pathfinder Compatible products" Forum.


Nice work.
A search function would be nice, maybe a meta search.
Example:
Hit Search will let you to a new screen.
There you can enter a search string and the app will show in real-time all related articles (like the drop down at a browser, when you enter a side you already visited).
This will help to quickly find spells, special conditions or rules (one pain in the as at the table I think).
The meta search results have to be very clear where they lead to (e.g. Spells: Magic Missle, Rules: Grapple etc.)

Another nice feature would be a possibility to create a customized personal spell list, this will be nice for spontaneous caster and special classes (APG classes,importet DnD 3.5 classes etc.)


Phileas wrote:

Nice work.

A search function would be nice, maybe a meta search.
Example:
Hit Search will let you to a new screen.
There you can enter a search string and the app will show in real-time all related articles (like the drop down at a browser, when you enter a side you already visited).
This will help to quickly find spells, special conditions or rules (one pain in the as at the table I think).
The meta search results have to be very clear where they lead to (e.g. Spells: Magic Missle, Rules: Grapple etc.)

Another nice feature would be a possibility to create a customized personal spell list, this will be nice for spontaneous caster and special classes (APG classes,importet DnD 3.5 classes etc.)

Ah, yes. I agree a search would be nice. I hear others asking for this as well, so as of now it's on my list for stuff that I need to look into.

I'm a bit unsure about the custom spell list, as this is sorta' a step away from what this app does. I believe in narrow apps that do few things but do them well. But I'll definitely draw something on my pad and ponder this a bit; see what it could look like... thanks for the input!

Ogre: Sorry for posting in the wrong forum! Do you have the power to move this thread? I don't want to step on any toes, least of all an Ogres!


I bought the app a week or two ago and I've been enjoying it. I would probably include a "quick jump" list at the start of any of the sections that don't have it, like Equipment, NPC Classes, and Combat. Overall it's been *very* easy to simply draw up the particular rule I need, but these sections are such a drudge trying to scroll through walls of text to get to the particular paragraph I need- Honestly, I've reverted to dragging out my book.

Edit: Just downloaded the update- good stuff! Did you change the colors? Also, a way to organize your bookmarks would be awesome. Folders, horizontal rules, colors, symbols, or labeling could all work.


Sean FitzSimon wrote:

I've reverted to dragging out my book.

Edit: Just downloaded the update- good stuff! Did you change the colors? Also, a way to organize your bookmarks would be awesome. Folders, horizontal rules, colors, symbols, or labeling could all work.

Oh! If you've reverted to using the book for your quick lookups, the app is not as good as it should be. But you wrote that before you upgraded to v1.1, right? 'Cause the bookmarking feature was added to make lookups, to all those places you know that you are returning to again and again, very fast. And if you bookmark smartly, scrolling distance can be very short to nearby resources.

Organizing bookmarks in some way is a very good idea! How about an early version of this, where bookmarks are automatically given a color, depending on what kind of item they point to? Would that help? This would probably be quick to implement.


thomax wrote:

Oh! If you've reverted to using the book for your quick lookups, the app is not as good as it should be. But you wrote that before you upgraded to v1.1, right? 'Cause the bookmarking feature was added to make lookups, to all those places you know that you are returning to again and again, very fast. And if you bookmark smartly, scrolling distance can be very short to nearby resources.

Organizing bookmarks in some way is a very good idea! How about an early version of this, where bookmarks are automatically given a color, depending on what kind of item they point to? Would that help? This would probably be quick to implement.

Colors would be good- especially if you had some way of doing user-defined colors for each bookmark item. I don't know how difficult that would be to implement, though. Having standard colors for different stuff would be groovy- and implementing some sort of divider or horizontal rule in the bookmark section would be awesome for chunking up your bookmarks. I've been using it for 2 different characters, and having Boledrin's stuff totally seperate from Kai's stuff would be awesome, though not totally necessary. I'm an organizational freak. :D


Sean FitzSimon wrote:
I'm an organizational freak. :D

After considering the feedback here, and thru some other cannels, my priority will probably look something like this:

- Add a lot more indexes for quick navigation on the various pages.
- Make the app work in "HD" mode on the iPad.
- Look into possibilities around colored bookmarks.
- Add the possibility for putting in your own custom content:

Add a fourth tab on the bottom tabbar called "Custom". Pressing a plus-button at the top allows you to type a URL, which gets its own row in the table view. When you press a sync-button, the app tries to go online and fetch the resource (a single html page, a single pdf etc), and caches it for offline use. The user can then refer to it at his own leisure, and sync it again if he wants.

Something along these lines: http://grab.by/3SAs.

Would this be a useful feature?


First of all Thomax great work, it really helped me and my group, during combat and such, especially with the 1.1 update.

But a thing I was wondering is, have you considered asking Paizo for permission to add, lets say, the playtests classes? If they where in there i think i would outright have falled instantly in love. But I guess this request is close to Utopia?

Again great work!

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Just wanted to bump the thread, as an itinerant app developer who has been over worked in his day job, I've pretty much replaced my own apps development with use of this app. I've been corrosponding back and forth with the author, but I thought I would add to the thread for discussion features I would like to see:

* Search
* Indexes at the top of sections, especially the glossary
* sortable bookmarks

I'd love to see the play test classes integrate, but I suspect we may have to wait until the PRD gets the official update post APG release.


Thanks so much for your suggestions and encouragement! It really means a lot to me, knowing that there are someone out there who cares and even likes what's going on! Yay :-)

Latest news:

- I just submitted my second app to the app store; it's called d20 Rules. It's a d20 v3.5e version of the PFR app. Not only with the core rules, but also with monsters, divine, epic, psionic and variant rules. I don't really know if most people have moved on to Pathfinder, or if the majority who is not on 4e are still playing v3.5, but I thought it was worth a shot. I'll ping back here when it's available.

- I also just submitted v1.2 of PFR to the app store. This version has indexes at the top of all the subsections, vastly improving lookup-speed.

- I discovered Web offline, an app which does local caching of web resources for offline browsing. I'll not try to duplicate this function (custom content, as mentioned above) in my apps.

- Next up is iPad support!


Search is most definately what I'd recommend adding. And a version that takes advantage of the iPad screen size.


thomax wrote:
Next up is iPad support!

I've purchased the app, and it is very useful to have offline access to the PathFinder SRD.

However, I was surprised by the lack of a search function. I see that several others in this thread have asked for this (I agree with the suggestions of Phileas, above), and I hope that you will prioritize a search feature in the near future.

Good work so far!

- thulsa

The Hyborian Age Campaign Website
http://hyboria.xoth.net/

The Spider-God's Bride & Other Tales
http://xoth.net/publishing/xp1/index.htm


the hunger for more wrote:
I hope that you will prioritize a search feature in the near future.

All right, all right :-) ...so many people ask for this, and I even missed the search feature myself while playing pathfinder this weekend. I have surrendered to your wishes and am actually well on the way of implementing this.

Also: My d20 Rules app (3.5e) is also available now http://itunes.apple.com/no/app/d20-rules/id368796548?mt=8

It's built on the same framework as the PFR app, and will of course get the search feature as well when the time comes.


the hunger for more wrote:

I hope that you will prioritize a search feature in the near future.

Good work so far!

Update PFR now, and you will get search :-)

There is a known bug which will crash the app when you try to initiate a search before while another one is still running. I'm working on that one now.


The app is great. However when you have an excessive amount of bookmarks the last one is not accessable. This is because the bar on the bottom covers it up. If it let switch into landscape it might not be as big an issue but there is no landscape mode on the bookmark screen. Otherwise, great app. Now if you could develop a character tracker for pathfinder I'd buy it. Or better yet update this one to be a character tracker. Now that would be awesome.


thomax wrote:
Update PFR now, and you will get search :-)

Excellent! The new search feature is great! Combined with the bookmarks feature, it's possible to look things up really fast.

I'll recommend this app to all PF gamers who have an iPhone.

- thulsa

The Hyborian Age Campaign Website
http://hyboria.xoth.net/

The Spider-God's Bride & Other Tales
http://xoth.net/publishing/xp1/index.htm


Seeker of skybreak wrote:
Now if you could develop a character tracker for pathfinder I'd buy it. Or better yet update this one to be a character tracker. Now that would be awesome.

Ah yes, I agree we really need a good electronic char sheet for Pathfinder! I have in fact considered taking this on, but I believe in narrow apps which do on job and do it well, so I don't think this would fit in this app.

I could look into making one, but then there is the excellent DnD Scribe which works really great for d20 3.5 characters. Let's just beg that guy to make a Pathfinder version until I succumbs to our will :-)


the hunger for more wrote:

Excellent! The new search feature is great! Combined with the bookmarks feature, it's possible to look things up really fast.

I'll recommend this app to all PF gamers who have an iPhone.

Thanks! I just discovered a way to improve the search further, by putting exact hits at the top of the result list and linking straight to the term search for (if such a paragraph exists). This works really well; hope ya'll find it useful! This version will be available next weekend, I Apple wills.

Also, in addition to the d20 version of the app, a d20 Modern version is coming soon :)

Anyone know of other OGL systems/content that has a big enough fan base which merits it's own app?

Any other improvements which would make the app more enjoyable to use?


thomax wrote:
Any other improvements which would make the app more enjoyable to use?

I loved the idea of color-coding the bookmark links. Or being able to sort your bookmarks into folders.

Grand Lodge

Hi Folks!

I just downloaded the app and will be trying it out at the table during the next game but I do have one quick comment.

Using the index at the top of the Spell List page I navigated to the Paladin Spells. I then rotated to move to Landscape mode and ended up looking at the Cleric spells. I then had to scroll down the page to get where I wanted. Sort of made the index useless . . .

Also, it then took me a while to figure out that I have to rotate BACK to portrait mode to get the GUI back. How hard would it be to implement a the 'swipe' functionality to go 'Back'?

Finally, I understand the 'narrow' app concept, but I feel that with that should also come the smaller cost. Think about it. I mean, I've already paid the price so cutting the price now won't effect me, but I likely would not have paid if I had realized the 'narrow' nature of the app . . . and cutting the price would likely lead to greater sales, making up for the cut in price . . .

Maredudd

Liberty's Edge

In the reviews on iTunes, one user notes that the monster listing is incomplete.

Does the PFR app include all the monsters from the Bestiary?

*EDIT* Another question - how far have you gone to incorporate errata into the PFR app?


Maredudd wrote:
Using the index at the top of the Spell List page I navigated to the Paladin Spells. I then rotated to move to Landscape mode and ended up looking at the Cleric spells. I then had to scroll down the page to get where I wanted. Sort of made the index useless...

Thanks so much for the feedback! I've discovered how to fix this bug you describe, and will include the fix in the next upcoming version (v1.6).

Maredudd wrote:
Also, it then took me a while to figure out that I have to rotate BACK to portrait mode to get the GUI back. How hard would it be to implement a the 'swipe' functionality to go 'Back'?

Hmm, I absolutely see the need for opting in on the GUI when in landscape mode, but I'm not sure what the perfect solution is. I think swiping should be reserved for panning left/right when zoomed in. Maybe a small button or something... I'll have to think a bit more about that one.

Maredudd wrote:
Finally, I understand the 'narrow' app concept, but I feel that with that should also come the smaller cost.

Too bad you fell that way. I know for certain (since I play PF a lot) that the app would be more than worth $5 for me. And I hear others saying the same. So give it a fair try and get back on this one?

And on the note of "app narrowness": Several folks have asked for this, so I've started developing a new feature which lets the user download and cache files to the device for offline use. Thus making it easy to bring along house rules, maps etc. The plan is to include a primitive variant of this feature in the next version (v1.6) which will most likely hit the app store in a week or two from now.


Jagyr Ebonwood wrote:
In the reviews on iTunes, one user notes that the monster listing is incomplete. Does the PFR app include all the monsters from the Bestiary?

I'm only at liberty to republish OGL material. I haven't been through comparing (monster by monster) the OGL part of the PRD vs the Bestiary book, so I'm not 100% sure all of the Bestiary is in the app. But rest assured that all monsters from http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ is in the app.

Jagyr Ebonwood wrote:
Another question - how far have you gone to incorporate errata into the PFR app?

The app is current with what is live on http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/.


My third app is out now: d20 Modern! Same functionality, different content! Yay!

Also, I'm now up and running with a commenting section for each of my apps, so it's also possible to voice opinions, share ideas and bestow curses over at http://ufisk.no/index.php?p=pfr :-)


thomax wrote:
And on the note of "app narrowness": Several folks have asked for this, so I've started developing a new feature which lets the user download and cache files to the device for offline use. Thus making it easy to bring along house rules, maps etc. The plan is to include a primitive variant of this feature in the next version (v1.6) which will most likely hit the app store in a week or two from now.

Oh, god, I'm super excited about this. This would be a great way to not only have easy access to house rules (and variants), but a great way to upload non-core material for personal use.


Hey Thomax,

I'm a user of your app and it has been extremely helpful. My biggest issue is that I have to take the time to zoom in to tap a letter to move to an index (big fingers and all that).

Have you thought about using the built-in API for alphabetized lists (i.e. like the iPhone uses to list contacts). I use your app mostly for spells and monsters, and this seems like it would greatly increase ease of use for your app.

One other thing, as well. For a guy with poor eyesite, the fonts are a bit small to me. I'd rather have to scroll a bit to read an entire entry than to zoom the screen or strain my eyes to see the smaller font. Can you set an option to blanket increase the font across all displays?

Good job overall, though.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber; Pathfinder Maps, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Charter Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Any update in iPad support?

Scarab Sages

First, good app. It's worth the $5. I used it in lieu of lugging around my rulebook and bestiary to my weekly PFS game, and it wasn't any harder to use than those books.

One thing I'd like to see added: The ability to bookmark *any* spot on any page. For example, I can bookmark the environments page, but scrolling down ninety times to find the section on cave-ins is the opposite of good times.


Dragnmoon wrote:
Any update in iPad support?

Indeed! I just submitted v1.6 of the PFR app. This update adds iPad support. And I gotta say: This app looks really good and is even more usefule on the iPad!

Usually the approval process takes about a week, so expect the update by the beginning of next week or so.


Sean FitzSimon wrote:
Oh, god, I'm super excited about this. This would be a great way to not only have easy access to house rules (and variants), but a great way to upload non-core material for personal use.

Good news: I just submitted v1.6 of the PFR app for approval at the app store, and this version includes the new custom content feature:

Type a URL to download a specific file from the Internet. This feature does not spider web sites, so a downloaded web page will only include naked HTML. But it can be useful for keeping maps, PDF-books, character sheets and other notes handy at the gaming table.

I hope you find the feature useful, and would very much appreciate feedback :)


Tom Baumbach wrote:
First, good app. It's worth the $5.

Glad to hear it!

Tom Baumbach wrote:
One thing I'd like to see added: The ability to bookmark *any* spot on any page. For example, I can bookmark the environments page, but scrolling down ninety times to find the section on cave-ins is the opposite of good times.

The search feature will help you out in a lot of these cases: Search for established terms like "grappled" or "darkness", navigate there and then hit + to bookmark the spot.

In your case with the cave-in bookmark you'll have to search for the exact phrase "cave-ins and collapses" (because that's what the heading says) to get a green highlighted search result which will then take you to the place in the text where cave-ins are described.

Was that helpful?


Geeky Frignit wrote:
I'm a user of your app and it has been extremely helpful. My biggest issue is that I have to take the time to zoom in to tap a letter to move to an index (big fingers and all that).

In the upcoming version I have tried to partly fix this by making the shortcut links at the top of the various pages larger. Hope it might help you a bit!

Geeky Frignit wrote:
Have you thought about using the built-in API for alphabetized lists (i.e. like the iPhone uses to list contacts). I use your app mostly for spells and monsters, and this seems like it would greatly increase ease of use for your app.

Thanks for this excellent suggestion! I will definitely look into adding this in v1.7.

Geeky Frignit wrote:
One other thing, as well. For a guy with poor eyesite, the fonts are a bit small to me. I'd rather have to scroll a bit to read an entire entry than to zoom the screen or strain my eyes to see the smaller font. Can you set an option to blanket increase the font across all displays?

I'll try look into this one as well. If you get an iPad, though, all these small-text troubles will be solved ;-)

Geeky Frignit wrote:
Good job overall, though.

Thanks :-)


Dragnmoon wrote:
Any update in iPad support?

Yup! The PFR app is now iPad enabled :-)


What are your plans for the APG?

Free update? Paid update? Separate app?

I vote the first option :)

Liberty's Edge

Propane wrote:

What are your plans for the APG?

Free update? Paid update? Separate app?

I vote the first option :)

+1.

Although, if it were priced at $.99, I'd probably get it.


Jagyr Ebonwood wrote:


+1.
Although, if it were priced at $.99, I'd probably get it.

I'd pay for an update but not for a separate app. The point of it for me is it's one bundle

Scarab Sages

Any word on an updated version?


Propane wrote:

What are your plans for the APG?

Free update? Paid update? Separate app?

I vote the first option :)

It's been a while now - Still waiting, still hoping.


Propane wrote:
It's been a while now - Still waiting, still hoping.

The new version a lot of users have been asking and waiting for is just around the corner: Revamped menu page, rotate-loose-position bug is fixed, OGL'ed images included, latest errata, and in-app purchase of APG and GMG OGL content ($0.99 each).

I hope to submit it to the app store in a couple of days, which means it will be available in 6 to 12 days or so.


thomax wrote:
I hope to submit it to the app store in a couple of days...

For the first time in my developer history, something went quicker than anticipated; app submitted 10 seconds ago!

I'm very excited about this release! Most of all for my own part actually, 'cause I've been missing the new content badly in the app :-)


Is there any reason why I can'T update my old version?


Tryn wrote:
Is there any reason why I can'T update my old version?

Not sure I understood your question...

The current version of PFR is 1.6. Version 1.7 will be downloadable from the appstore in about a week. This is an update, not a separate/new app. The update is free, as are all app updates.

v1.7 summary:

- Updated with the latest PRD errata.
- Improved graphics experience on high-res devices.
- Fixed the lost-position-in-document-on-rotate-bug so you can now switch between landscape/portrait mode without loose your position on the page.
- Fixed several memory leaks and bugs.
- On popular demand: Tabbar no longer disappears in landscape mode, but the toolbar will disappear.
- Completely revamped the document main menu page.
- OGL'ed images (like attacks of opportunity and spell areas) are now included in the documents.
- Option for in-app purchasing of APG and GMG Open Game Content.


Ok my mistake, I read it so that v 1.7 is already available :( Sorry.

And by the way nice work !

P.S.: A nice add for the app would be a spell list feature, where you have you're class spell list and mark the ones you memorized for this day.


Tryn wrote:
P.S.: A nice add for the app would be a spell list feature, where you have you're class spell list and mark the ones you memorized for this day.

Thanks for the feedback! I agree this would be very useful, but it really sounds like a separate app due to all the specialized functionality which is needed for proper working. I'll give it some thought. The user should probably be able to choose spells not only from pathfinder, but other/older d20 sources. Support for several characters. Spellbooks/spells known/casts per day. Cleric domain spells. Hmmm.

Scarab Sages

thomax wrote:
...but other/older d20 sources.

No please, I like having just the core Paizo RPG line material in the ap. I would vote against even the non-RPG line OGC that Paizo produces. Even though I like and use said material, not having to separate the core from the extra is far too convenient.


Tom Baumbach wrote:
thomax wrote:
...but other/older d20 sources.
No please, I like having just the core Paizo RPG line material in the ap. I would vote against even the non-RPG line OGC that Paizo produces. Even though I like and use said material, not having to separate the core from the extra is far too convenient.

He has it set up fairly nicely, with the APG and GMG content each under it's own heading, no reason not to do the same with other sources.

Kudo's on the work you've put into this thomax, the app is more useful than ever now. And I hadn't expected the GMG content to be available too, so good job there as well.


Firest wrote:
Kudo's on the work you've put into this thomax, the app is more useful than ever now. And I hadn't expected the GMG content to be available too, so good job there as well.

Thanks! I'm quite happy with the way this version turned out. I put a lot of work into scripting the content to fit the app, but from now on it will be easier for me to grab the latest errata and even new OGL material, and update the app.

One thing which would be very interesting to know: Are there anyone who uses the Custom Content feature? I realize I have no idea if this is useful, or just making the app more complicated and deserves a coup de grace?

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