Conan the Barbarian


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i have been keeping track of the new Conan movie coming out next year and was wandering if Conan is my major inspiration for playing a Barbarian what are other peoples inspirations for playing Barbarians.


northbrb wrote:
i have been keeping track of the new Conan movie coming out next year and was wandering if Conan is my major inspiration for playing a Barbarian what are other peoples inspirations for playing Barbarians.

Not for me. Conan's a LOT more level headed than "rage" types, IMO. Sure he's a "barbarian" but for my experience (reading novels, comics, and watching the movies) he's not really a "rage" type of guy. He seems more like a highly skilled Fighter.

If he's "barbarian" it's more a matter of how he interacts with society and civilization in general rather than a game-mechanic-like emphasis on raging and getting more powerful/reckless. Keep in mind the down and dirty nature of his world - it's almost a specific POINT that Conan makes few mistakes in combat because it WILL spell his death. That's not a Barbarian mindset, IMO, it's a Fighter.

The fact that he's ungodly strong - that's just a feature of his stats. He's also consistently strong - not suddenly strong or anything like that (ie: rage).

On a side note: I also think he'd rely on his feats and skill-set more than equipment to see him through - he's always running out of funding and stuff {plus magic just doesn't seem all that frequent in his world}.

Addendum: I think he *might* have a bit of Rogue tossed in there for flavor, too - not much, but a bit.


Hell Yes!

One of my favourite characters would have to be my Barb/Rogue Human.

He was from the 'Kellid' region in PF. Man, that pic in the Campaign Setting looks just like The Destroyer.

Anyhoo, my barb/rogue was pretty much a blender in combat, not much of a skill monkey, but he could climb, survive, steal, stuff like that.

Had to alter my background somewhat for copyright issues tho :)

Paizo Employee Chief Creative Officer, Publisher

Kellids are basically an homage to Cimmerians. So there you have it. :)


Erik Mona wrote:
Kellids are basically an homage to Cimmerians. So there you have it. :)

I KNEW IT!

btw, best game mechanics EVER. and i've been playing a while.

Sovereign Court

northbrb wrote:
i have been keeping track of the new Conan movie coming out next year and was wandering if Conan is my major inspiration for playing a Barbarian what are other peoples inspirations for playing Barbarians.

Conan has proven to the be inspiration for multiple Barbarian/Fighter and Barbarian/Rogue/Fighter builds in our groups thrugh the years.


The Speaker in Dreams wrote:
northbrb wrote:
i have been keeping track of the new Conan movie coming out next year and was wandering if Conan is my major inspiration for playing a Barbarian what are other peoples inspirations for playing Barbarians.

Not for me. Conan's a LOT more level headed than "rage" types, IMO. Sure he's a "barbarian" but for my experience (reading novels, comics, and watching the movies) he's not really a "rage" type of guy. He seems more like a highly skilled Fighter.

If he's "barbarian" it's more a matter of how he interacts with society and civilization in general rather than a game-mechanic-like emphasis on raging and getting more powerful/reckless. Keep in mind the down and dirty nature of his world - it's almost a specific POINT that Conan makes few mistakes in combat because it WILL spell his death. That's not a Barbarian mindset, IMO, it's a Fighter.

The fact that he's ungodly strong - that's just a feature of his stats. He's also consistently strong - not suddenly strong or anything like that (ie: rage).

On a side note: I also think he'd rely on his feats and skill-set more than equipment to see him through - he's always running out of funding and stuff {plus magic just doesn't seem all that frequent in his world}.

Addendum: I think he *might* have a bit of Rogue tossed in there for flavor, too - not much, but a bit.

while i do agree that based on the Conan stories he does seem less of a rager and more of a high skilled fighter i still consider him me biggest inspiration.


I love me some Conan. I've really only read the original Howard stories and a smattering of Jordan, but the fiction is surprisingly good and the character is much less cliche than I expected. He is a very cunning, level headed character. I can see what he does in combat coming from the Rage in PF but he certainly loses no AC, it would be more like the whirling frenzy alternate class feature from Unearthed Arcana or whatever.

Fafhrd is usually cited as another Barbarian character, but again moreso in roleplay than the "rage" mechanic.

One barbarian that absolutely lives up to the rage idea is Logen Ninefingers from The First Law series. There's a pretty intense scene near the end of the first book where he flies into a frenzy and just tears through like twenty guys. I'd recommend it.


Also, Druss the Legend (David Gemmell), is good inspiration for a barbarian character.

There's a scene where he jumps aboard a galley full of pirates and they end up jumping overboard just to avoid his wrath. hilarity ensues.


Conan rages plenty of times in the original Howard stories. As far as the AC thing, most of the time he and the beasty are grappling and clawing and tearing frantically for life, so AC doesn't really matter.

Xuthal Of The Dusk is a good example of this.

Though, my favorite Conan story is Queen Of The Black coast.

and any true Conan fan will tell you that Conan's second favorite weapon is a beef bone.


Have you seen him get mad? oh yeah he rages alright, if by him raging you mean he yells "I'm so angry!" or "I'm about to rage!" than i guess not but think about it he swims, climbs (like a spider, sheesh) doesn't wear armor and is pretty darn tough (he's also good at tracking). He seems to be using pieces of the barbarian class to do Rogue-like things IMO.


The Speaker in Dreams wrote:
northbrb wrote:
i have been keeping track of the new Conan movie coming out next year and was wandering if Conan is my major inspiration for playing a Barbarian what are other peoples inspirations for playing Barbarians.

Not for me. Conan's a LOT more level headed than "rage" types, IMO. Sure he's a "barbarian" but for my experience (reading novels, comics, and watching the movies) he's not really a "rage" type of guy. He seems more like a highly skilled Fighter.

If he's "barbarian" it's more a matter of how he interacts with society and civilization in general rather than a game-mechanic-like emphasis on raging and getting more powerful/reckless. Keep in mind the down and dirty nature of his world - it's almost a specific POINT that Conan makes few mistakes in combat because it WILL spell his death. That's not a Barbarian mindset, IMO, it's a Fighter.

The fact that he's ungodly strong - that's just a feature of his stats. He's also consistently strong - not suddenly strong or anything like that (ie: rage).

On a side note: I also think he'd rely on his feats and skill-set more than equipment to see him through - he's always running out of funding and stuff {plus magic just doesn't seem all that frequent in his world}.

Addendum: I think he *might* have a bit of Rogue tossed in there for flavor, too - not much, but a bit.

+1, in spades

I've always thought this too. My wife and I were watching Conan the Barbarian on our honeymoon and we started discussing game stats for the characters. Conan is much too level-headed and skillful to be a table-top barbarian. I would also agree with the rogue levels, as he spent a considerable amount of time stealing and sneaking around from town to town, until beset by King Osric(sp) in the movie. He certainly dresses the part of a barbarian though, but that's a whole different motive altogether. It goes without saying that the term "barbarian" used in his mythos is a term for uncivilized, borderland peoples, not necessarily raging, HULK SMASH types. Perhaps he kept the title to purposely undermine his enemies; they're expecting a dumb brute, and are met with precision and skill.

I truthfully haven't read much of the fiction aside from a bunch of the Marvel comics. I'm gonna have to check into that.


The Movie Conan is not the same as Howard's Conan.
Conan the Barbarian, with Arnold, while being a decent flick, is a thinly veiled Samurai film.
Even Robert Jordan's Conan doesn't come close to Howard's.
Howard's Conan was a thinking man's hero. Civilization was wicked and corrupt, and Conan, though called a barbarian, had morals and ethics. He also raged quite a bit. I don't have my books handy right no to pull anyy quotes, but there was a fight with a creature named Thaug (Which one, right :)) in which Conan is obviously raging, and another tale where Conan sees a 'crimson mist' as he enters a battle rage.

any true Conan fan would know these things.


Swordsmasher wrote:

The Movie Conan is not the same as Howard's Conan.

Conan the Barbarian, with Arnold, while being a decent flick, is a thinly veiled Samurai film.
Even Robert Jordan's Conan doesn't come close to Howard's.
Howard's Conan was a thinking man's hero. Civilization was wicked and corrupt, and Conan, though called a barbarian, had morals and ethics. He also raged quite a bit. I don't have my books handy right no to pull anyy quotes, but there was a fight with a creature named Thaug (Which one, right :)) in which Conan is obviously raging, and another tale where Conan sees a 'crimson mist' as he enters a battle rage.

any true Conan fan would know these things.

Hmmm ... hadn't thought about the mist actually. Still, given the frequency of when it happens, I'd still bet the majority of his levels are Fighter and Rogue with only a small Barbarian to get the mist going.

It's a pretty marginal power - rarely brought forth, IMO. It'll have it's appearance, sure, but it's not central to the point of his "go to" move - follow? 9/10 he just wipes people out w/out needing to rage at all.


In Pathfinder, I would peg him as a combination of Barb/Ftr/Rog, with the actual number of levels in each class being roughly equal.


Conan is wonderfully multi-skilled, sometimes he doesn't appear a like a pathfinder barbarian at all. One of my favourite stories of him is when he is a king of a nation of chevaliers, and charges into an impossible battle at the head of a wedge a thousand or so heavy knights, becoming the feral heart of a massive meat grinder. Something about that primal ferocity combined with a big sword and full plate armour with a bad tempered steed to match just draws you into the pages.

Scarab Sages RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32

One of the best Conan conversions I've ever come across:

HERE

The conversion is very faithful to the source material, and I think really captures the essence of Conan. (Created some years back for 3.5 though.)


Conan definitely IS a barbarian with rages and other such stuff, although he may be so good that he's gestalt with something else ;)

If you want other inspirations for your barbarians, then look for stories about nordic berserkers, who threw down all their armour to show how they despise death and that all they care about is how many enemies will they take down with them. These volunteers had actually made a show for the enemy before the vikings went on to do the real battle. Their purpose was to intimidate enemies and bring chaos in their ranks and to boost the morale. So if you want to be a little bit of an enthusiast and want to lead the others to greater heroics by example, you may want to build a reputation to earn the right to be THERE when the next great bettle begins.

Other inspiration could be Slaine, Balin the wild... and of course Cohen, the barbarian and his band of not-so-old barbarian friends ;)


I'm really not sure why everyone is insisting he's a rogue. He was a rogue, but not the class. The Mouser is your quintessential rogue. I'll agree he has ranks in Stealth, but that does not a rogue make! You don't need to be a Rogue to steal.

Honestly I'd peg him straight class barbarian in PF. He NEVER shows preference to one weapon or another, using whatever comes along, and is rarely heavily armored which to me is quintessentially a barbarian. Stat-wise I'd say Str 18, Dex 16, Con 16, Int 13, Wis 14, Cha 14. Max ranks in Intimidate, Stealth, Survival, Acrobatics, Perception and half ranks in Sense Motive, Climb and Swim.

Now...what's Elric?


Nah, Conan was a Warblade.

<hides from ensuing firestorm>


Dudes, you should REALLY read Conan's RPG, it's neat. And he actually IS a Barbarian/Pirate/rogue... in that book. And that book's Barbarian is way less "Ragy" but it's an awesome class.


Erik Mona wrote:
Kellids are basically an homage to Cimmerians. So there you have it. :)

Mr. Fishy knows.

As for the rage Conan was a cornered rat rager. The books describe it as a red haze,(barbarian smash). He didn't rage in combat unless he was in trouble or enraged Conan was a creature of passions. He was a Barbarian/Fighter/Rogue Conan was a far roving and veritile.

He wore heavier armor nearer to the end of his career when he fought in more armies. He is written to have had a harness that covered his face (helmet) in Hour of the Dragon.

Elric was an Eternal Champion. He was a Sorcerer King to and he could call upon ancient pacts with other worldly creatures to serve him. The 1st Ed. write up was fighter/mage maybe. Or damn it a...gish.


Mr.Fishy wrote:
Erik Mona wrote:
Kellids are basically an homage to Cimmerians. So there you have it. :)

Mr. Fishy knows.

As for the rage Conan was a cornered rat rager. The books describe it as a red haze,(barbarian smash). He didn't rage in combat unless he was in trouble or enraged Conan was a creature of passions. He was a Barbarian/Fighter/Rogue Conan was a far roving and veritile.

He wore heavier armor nearer to the end of his career when he fought in more armies. He is written to have had a harness that covered his face (helmet) in Hour of the Dragon.

Elric was an Eternal Champion. He was a Sorcerer King to and he could call upon ancient pacts with other worldly creatures to serve him. The 1st Ed. write up was fighter/mage maybe. Or damn it a...gish.

Actually Conan's bursts of inhuman strength could be the short uses of rage (For example when hr strangles the white ape in the cellars... was it the Hour of the Dragon?)


I actually just read all of Howard's Conan stories within the last year. If I had to give him classes up to 15 with DnD classes it'd probably be Barbarian 2/ Rogue 4/ Fighter 9, with a lot of ranks in Profession(Sailor). He's a naturally cunning character who usually relies on a combination of his natural strength, toughness, and excellent skill. And yes, he wears armor almost all the time; not much bare-chested Ah'nuld in the stories. He hulks-out a few times when fighting extra-ordinary critters, but against humans he almost always fights with an implacably clear mind.


JBSchroeds wrote:
I actually just read all of Howard's Conan stories within the last year. If I had to give him classes up to 15 with DnD classes it'd probably be Barbarian 2/ Rogue 4/ Fighter 9, with a lot of ranks in Profession(Sailor). He's a naturally cunning character who usually relies on a combination of his natural strength, toughness, and excellent skill. And yes, he wears armor almost all the time; not much bare-chested Ah'nuld in the stories. He hulks-out a few times when fighting extra-ordinary critters, but against humans he almost always fights with an implacably clear mind.

I have to ask then: why rogue and fighter? Certainly he does roguish things, like sneaking about and stealing from people, but he doesn't do the things that DEFINE and have defined the rogue/thief D&D archetype-carefully disarming magical traps, subtle wordplay and trickery in an urban setting, and stabbing people in the back. As for the fighter part, the things that set the fighter apart from Barbarian are as follows: less skills, well we know Conan is a particularly skilled individual so this doesn't fit. Ability to focus in a particular weapon (weapon spec/greater spec/wpn training) doesn't really fit with someone who is equally lethal with an axe and a beef bone. Tower shields-yeah not really either.

I'm just honestly baffled why people think Conan would need to be some crazy multiclass character.

Grand Lodge

I'm not saying he would be a fighter, but I would say he is specialized with dagger. He is a superb knife fighter.


I think GURPS Conan did the best job of converting Conan into an RPG. By the time he was in his mid 20s he was already a 300 to 400 point character.(200 points was cheesy action movie level in the last edition I read). The problem with stating out Conan is that's he's too powerful for most games to handle. It would like trying to put Batman in D&D/Pathfinder. To do so accurately either one would need to be nearly half a dozen different classes all at once, pushing the gestalt rules in Unearthed Arcana past their limits. Even then there would have to be rules mods and considerations for the different interpretations and liberties other writers have taken with both characters over the last seventy plus years.


Zmar wrote:

Conan definitely IS a barbarian with rages and other such stuff, although he may be so good that he's gestalt with something else ;)

Heh! Given the previous poster's comment, and the limits of the class system, I'd have to agree. If we're going to attempt a gestalt of him, I'd say most gestalt levels were "fighter/barbarian" and the ones that aren't fighter/barbarian would be "fighter/rogue". And who says he needs to specialize in any weapons? Weapon Training would be more than enough to carry him through. Instead of weapon focus/sp/etc - maybe he's just focused on other combat options. Or ... maybe he's pretty good in a few weapons (multiple specializations)? It's not like that particular gestalt combo's lacking in feats ...

For the rogue nay-sayers, how about the "wilderness rogue" variant if that'll make you happy. Skill-monkey is the key feature of rogues, along with sneak attacking. Both fit Conan with his innate clever tactics (which would suggest a broad range of skills) and expansive adventures (he's all over the map - picking things up as he goes here and there, etc). Is he charming? No - not his focus in sp allocation. Is he a trap finder/maker? A little bit, more the making, though. Can he punish opponents brutally when catching them off guard? Absolutely.


still not seeing the need for fighter or rogue myself, when ever he is sneaking around it always is likened to him stalking prey and how easy it is for him to track humans or evade them opposed to animals he has tracked. That seems a lot like a barbarian hunter to me. Rogue just isn't working for me he doesn't sneak attack he doesn't fiddle with traps he either springs them (trap sense) or smashes through them. It seems silly to me that people want to multiclass him with fighter, Barbarians can be skilled in combat as well, and no they don't have formal training per se (neither does Conan) but they become skilled. Yeah he doesn't rage a lot because quite frankly he usually doesn't have to. Yes he is a skilled knife fighter, he's also a skilled kill people with whatever is closest fighter too. If you've ever read the dark horse comics you will see often times when he is fighting multiple opponents he looks very much like he is raging even if there isn't a clear "he was really angry and saw red like a bull" indication. It's silly to think he isn't straight barbarian, the class was created with him heavily in mind. Its like saying Sir Galahad wasn't a paladin, or Merlin a wizard. And i suppose Robin Hood is a Fighter/Cleric/Wizard/Rogue/Ranger/malconvoker too? :P

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32, 2012 Top 4

I have a Kellid character I'm playing in a Savage Tide campaign right now that I've based very loosely off Howard's Conan. I use the awesome image of the Kellid from the Races section of the Pathfinder Campign Setting as his character portrait.

Cumal of Numeria is only a 4th level character right now, so I have him at Barbarian 2 / Rogue 1 / Ranger 1. His stats are Str 18, Dex 18, Con 14, Int 14, Wis 12, Cha 7. Not exactly Conan-esque, but close enough for an homage.

For the Ranger class, I'm using the Spell-less Ranger variant from Kobold Quaterly #11. I don't plan to add any more Barbarian levels. I will add a few more Rogue levels and the rest is undecided. Possibly more [spell-less] Ranger or Fighter.

His attitude is VERY much like young Conan's (Tower of the Elephant, The God in the Bowl, Queen of the Black Coast, Rogues in the House). He's a flanking, melee-machine. He wears a +1 chain shirt and likes to dual wield a +1 bastard sword and a masterwork short sword (his "Numerian long-knife").

He plays the role of scout / trap-finder / bully. He's damn fun to play!


Conan is pushing epic levels. Seriously. Hour of the Dragon? Red Nails?

Statting him out, you could do it in PF with just Barb levels. Remember that skills can be distributed however you like. He can also be statted with just fighter levels.

What are the iconic abilities of Conan? Strength, but that can be from just having a natural 24 STR or it could be from Rage. The dance of death (Whirlwind Attack). Resistance to fear of the "creatures of mightmare and lunacy" (Iron Will). Ability to absorb immense damage (Toughness/high CON/Rage). Natural leadership ability (Leadership/high CHA). Ability to track and survive in the wilderness (Survival). Ability to be a good sailor (Profession).

So, any Conan build would have good overall stats (at least 14+ in all stats), ranks in Survival, Acrobatics, Climb, Swim, Profession(sailor), Stealth, and Perception. Feats of dodge, mobility, spring attack, combat expertise, whirlwind attack, iron will, toughness, and leadership.

I can see fighter or barb doing all this. Really, you only multiclass to get there faster.


Looking at his career path rather than his 'game stats'...

Logically Conan started out as a Barbarian, moved south and played at being a Rouge for a bit. His time in the East with the Kozaks would definitely gain him some Fighter levels. The Queen of the Black Coast era would net him some more Rogue and maybe Fighter levels. Back to the north along the Pictish border would be some more Fighter/Barbarian levels and the tail of his career leading the Aquilonian army and then ruling the kingdom some more Fighter levels.

FWIW, I think the new PRPG Rage powers work better for a 'Conan' type barbarian.


i would like the idea that Conan would be a a full barbarian but there is one thing i would like to comment on, in one of the stories i read of Conan he was sprinting in full armor while being as silent as a shadow.

this is one reason i fell that Conan would have at least 2 levels of rogue to gain the rogue talent fast stealth, and some fighter levels for the armor training.


I think that one of the biggest problems with statting out Conan, is that Howard used him as a literary tool to tell adventure stories of dark sword and sorcery in a time when there were very few Sword and sorcery type tales (Howard invented the genre).

So, Howard wrote Conan as what Conan needed to be for the purpose of the tale. In Hour of the Dragon he could easily be a Barbarian/Fighter. In Tower Of The Elephant he could be a Barbarian/Rogue.

The Movie Conan The Barbarian would probably be a Barbarian/Fighter.

I honestly think that it is nearly impossible to stat out a conan spanning his entire career using the Pathfinder rules.

In Age of Conan the Barbarian class has many abilities that would be attributed to the Rogue or Thief type character.

Its much the same argument people have with Lord Of The Rings. Some say it has to be low level (I agree with this argument) to portray the events, while others say it has to be high level (Why not just teleport to the mountain and drop the ring in?).

So again, Conan is whatever Howard needed him to be for the purpose of the story.


this is true, i would say that characters like Conan if written up for a rpg like pathfinder would honestly have a class of there own, they would get what ever makes sense for them to have basically the best of everything they need.

some times i would love to write up a character with no regards to class but only what makes sense for them to have but i doubt it would ever truly work fairly in everyone's eyes.


northbrb wrote:

i would like the idea that Conan would be a a full barbarian but there is one thing i would like to comment on, in one of the stories i read of Conan he was sprinting in full armor while being as silent as a shadow.

this is one reason i fell that Conan would have at least 2 levels of rogue to gain the rogue talent fast stealth, and some fighter levels for the armor training.

Or his ranks were so hight that the mooks couldn't hear him even with the penalty ;)


Another big problem with Conan is the source material.

Is YOUR Conan the Conan of the original Howard stories, or the Conan of the later edited and re-written Howard stories, or the Conan of the even-later written novels and short-stories by a cast of hundreds of authors, or the Conan of the Golden Era comics, or the Conan of the 1970's comics, or the Conan of the Dark Horse comics, or the Conan of the movies, or the Conan of the TV series, or the Conan of the animated series, et cetera, ad nauseum...

Conan changes over time and over stories and over authors. In any case, I reiterate that either fighter or barbarian would portray a good essential Conan. Maybe ranger could do so as well, but less easily. Rogue is just unnecessary, since no essential quality of Conan is embodied by a rogue ability, but I bet you COULD actually do Conan with straight rogue.

Oh, and Howard did not actually invent sword&sorcery or even dark fantasy (earliest examples actually come from Edwardian London's pulp fiction market), though he WAS the best known and most enduring example of the genere (much like Lovecraft and supernatural horror, or Asimov and robots).


meatrace wrote:

I have to ask then: why rogue and fighter? Certainly he does roguish things, like sneaking about and stealing from people, but he doesn't do the things that DEFINE and have defined the rogue/thief D&D archetype-carefully disarming magical traps, subtle wordplay and trickery in an urban setting, and stabbing people in the back. As for the fighter part, the things that set the fighter apart from Barbarian are as follows: less skills, well we know Conan is a particularly skilled individual so this doesn't fit. Ability to focus in a particular weapon (weapon spec/greater spec/wpn training) doesn't really fit with someone who is equally lethal with an axe and a beef bone. Tower shields-yeah not really either.

I'm just honestly baffled why people think Conan would need to be some crazy multiclass character.

I'm terrible with names so I can't give you titles of the stories, but Conan definitely does "subtle wordplay and trickery in an urban setting, and stabbing people in the back" in some of Howard's tales. Also, what low level Rogue is going to be disarming powerful magical traps in the first place? His time as a thief and pirate seem like rogue levels to me. As for the fighter: Conan spends a good deal of his later life leading troops and armies. He's an excellent military strategist and when he leads Aquilonia into battle he does so in a magnificent set of full plate armor. Conan, while good with any weapon (high BaB) is shown on multiple occasions to be one of the best swordsmen of his day (weapon spec). While a Barbarian (the class) could do these things, the Fighter makes more sense to me.

I think people multiclass Conan because he does lots of different careers over the course of his life.


JBSchroeds wrote:

I'm terrible with names so I can't give you titles of the stories, but Conan definitely does "subtle wordplay and trickery in an urban setting, and stabbing people in the back" in some of Howard's tales. Also, what low level Rogue is going to be disarming powerful magical traps in the first place? His time as a thief and pirate seem like rogue levels to me. As for the fighter: Conan spends a good deal of his later life leading troops and armies. He's an excellent military strategist and when he leads Aquilonia into battle he does so in a magnificent set of full plate armor. Conan, while good with any weapon (high BaB) is shown on multiple occasions to be one of the best swordsmen of his day (weapon spec). While a Barbarian (the class) could do these things, the Fighter makes more sense to me.

I think people multiclass Conan because he does lots of different careers over the course of his life.

Well I don't remember any story in which he EVER minced words, and he always confronted an enemy to his face. Remember ANYONE can steal something. He was more of a thug anyway, and anyone can take ranks in Profession (Sailor). I have no idea how being a fighter makes you more apt to lead armies into battle, and remember how he started along that path was very serendipitous. I could see the argument in 2E D&D of him being a dual class character because you couldn't get thief skills otherwise. In pathfinder however, I see no need to.

To the other poster's question, I think the only fair judge of Conan as a character is the original and completed Robert E. Howard stories, just as the only way to analyze Frodo would be the Tolkien books.

The original Howard stories were glimpses into Conan at varied points in his life. Obviously he becomes an epic character by the time he is king of Aquilonia, but we also see glimpses of him as a youth and at points where he doesn't possess the prowess he does in later stories. I think the mindset we all have is trying to stat him where the majority of his stories come from, his early and mid adulthood before becoming king. The height of his adventuring years.


Mirror, Mirror wrote:

Another big problem with Conan is the source material.

Is YOUR Conan the Conan of the original Howard stories, or the Conan of the later edited and re-written Howard stories, or the Conan of the even-later written novels and short-stories by a cast of hundreds of authors, or the Conan of the Golden Era comics, or the Conan of the 1970's comics, or the Conan of the Dark Horse comics, or the Conan of the movies, or the Conan of the TV series, or the Conan of the animated series, et cetera, ad nauseum...

Conan changes over time and over stories and over authors. In any case, I reiterate that either fighter or barbarian would portray a good essential Conan. Maybe ranger could do so as well, but less easily. Rogue is just unnecessary, since no essential quality of Conan is embodied by a rogue ability, but I bet you COULD actually do Conan with straight rogue.

Oh, and Howard did not actually invent sword&sorcery or even dark fantasy (earliest examples actually come from Edwardian London's pulp fiction market), though he WAS the best known and most enduring example of the genere (much like Lovecraft and supernatural horror, or Asimov and robots).

Very valid point this reminds me of when people were trying to stat "link" of the legend of zelda, when there has been 20+ different links!


My Barbarian type inspiration is a bit more isoteric. It is Li Kiu, The Black Whirlwind" from the book Heroes(Outlaws) of the Marsh (written in the 1500-1600 in china)

He is a 2 battle axe wielding, drunken/raging monster of a warrior.

Its hard to combine Barb/Monk, but I am trying on my PFS character, trying to bring a bit of the flavor into the character.


eric cruz wrote:

My Barbarian type inspiration is a bit more isoteric. It is Li Kiu, The Black Whirlwind" from the book Heroes(Outlaws) of the Marsh (written in the 1500-1600 in china)

He is a 2 battle axe wielding, drunken/raging monster of a warrior.

Its hard to combine Barb/Monk, but I am trying on my PFS character, trying to bring a bit of the flavor into the character.

if you are willing to use some home brewed material check out this base class i came up with.

http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderR PG/communityContent/houseRules/newClassBrawlerRevisited


meatrace wrote:
One barbarian that absolutely lives up to the rage idea is Logen Ninefingers from The First Law series. There's a pretty intense scene near the end of the first book where he flies into a frenzy and just tears through like twenty guys. I'd recommend it.

That is a fantastic scene (the best of the series). It was a great take on the rage mechanic.


meatrace wrote:

Well I don't remember any story in which he EVER minced words, and he always confronted an enemy to his face. Remember ANYONE can steal something. He was more of a thug anyway, and anyone can take ranks in Profession (Sailor). I have no idea how being a fighter makes you more apt to lead armies into battle, and remember how he started along that path was very serendipitous. I could see the argument in 2E D&D of him being a dual class character because you couldn't get thief skills otherwise. In pathfinder however, I see no need to.

[...]

*facepalm* I just reread your post when I quoted "subtle wordplay". I must have read that a dozen times and each time I read "swordplay" and not "wordplay." Sorry 'bout that. You're right about him not being a wordsmith of any variety.

As for the fighter leading armies bit, this is the way I see it. He was a great at deploying his units and using them to the fullest. I don't see a Barbarian (class) being familiar with that sort of thing. Sure, they can lead a horde or raiding party, but it seems more realistic and in-line with class flavor that a Fighter would know military units better. Reassessing the 15 level breakdown I may be more likely to say Barb 7 Rog 2 Fighter 6. I think this'll be my last post on this matter, because I don't think either of us will change our minds.


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All I'm saying is there is nothing in the fighter class that gives one the ability to lead troops.


meatrace wrote:
All I'm saying is there is nothing in the fighter class that gives one the ability to lead troops.

Sure, there's no particular class feature that mentions leading troops, but heck, that's what Leadership is for. Fighters are more prone to have some sort of military background, much more so than Barbarians would at least. Read the text in the opening block of the Fighter in the PF core rulebook. That has Conan written all over it. From the first line of wealth, glory, or revenge, down to the line about rousing the hearts of armies, etc. It even mentions, as many have stated above, training in all manner of weapons, even from exotic masters.

So yeah, no specific game mechanic, but the "fluff" just screams Conan to me all over the place.


hehehe the fluff for "barbarian" seems pretty spot on too :P


Icarus Pherae wrote:
hehehe the fluff for "barbarian" seems pretty spot on too :P

It really does, but makes mention of "knowing little of actual training", and I'd have to say Conan, at least in my idea of him, is nothing if not a well-trained warrior. But, these are just backgrounds of the classes, and as Swordsmasher above even mentioned, there are a LOT of different interpretations of who Conan is. I've only experienced the movies, some of the comics, and the animated series. So, my interpretation of the man could be very different from even the person sitting beside me.


Jandrem wrote:
Icarus Pherae wrote:
hehehe the fluff for "barbarian" seems pretty spot on too :P

It really does, but makes mention of "knowing little of actual training", and I'd have to say Conan, at least in my idea of him, is nothing if not a well-trained warrior. But, these are just backgrounds of the classes, and as Swordsmasher above even mentioned, there are a LOT of different interpretations of who Conan is. I've only experienced the movies, some of the comics, and the animated series. So, my interpretation of the man could be very different from even the person sitting beside me.

Conan is very much not a trained warrior, he is just innately badass and that's kind of his thing. Anything he picks up he is a master with.

You should definitely check out the old Howard stories. They've recently been reprinted in a nice set of 3 books. Go to Amazon and look up "The Coming of Conan the Cimmerian" :). You might be pleasantly surprised.


So we can't have single classed Conan you say?

CONAN, the Barbarian
Human Barbarian 1; nedium natural humanoid (25 pt build... Conan IS epic)

STR 16
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 14
WIS 13
CHA 12

Feats: Toughness, Endurance
Speed 40 ft, AC 12, hp 17
Rage 6 rounds - STR 20, CON 18, hp 19
Skills: Acrobatics*+6; Climb*+7; Intimidate*+5; Perception*+5; Stealth*+3; Survival+5; Swim+7; Sense Motive+2
Favoured Class: Barbarian

Skills marked with * are increased every level, remaining skills are spent for the other skills like sense motive, survival, swim,...

Advancement
lvl 2 Uncanny Dodge, Strength Surge
lvl 3 Power Attack, Trap Sense +1
lvl 4 +1 WIS, Low Light vision
lvl 5 Improved Uncanny Dodge, Improved Initiative
lvl 6 Trap sense +2, Superstition
lvl 7 DR 1/-, Dodge
lvl 8 +1 STR, Clear Mind
lvl 9 Trap Sense +3, Improved unarmed Strike
lvl 10 DR 2/-, Roused Anger
lvl 11 Greater Rage, Cleave
lvl 12 +1 STR, Trap Sense +4, Fearless Rage
lvl 13 DR 3/-, Combat Expertise
lvl 14 Surprise Accuracy, Indomitable Will
lvl 15 Trap Sense +5, Leadership
lvl 16 DR 4/-, Intimidating Glare
lvl 17 Tireless Rage, Vital Strike
lvl 18 Trap Sense +6, Poweful Blow
lvl 19 DR 5/-, Greater Vital Strike
lvl 20 Mighty Rage, Mighty Swing

Of course that you may want to change a few things, but even on level 1 Conan is almost as agile as a tiger (Dex 15) and he can wrestle with a gorilla (Str 15). Just don't think about Conan, that he's a superhero, his opponents are usually just warriors and the beasts are often defeated by brains, not DPR. Conan is a smart guy and doesn't use levels to gain hp, but rather he learns and applies his skills. He's Stealthy, terrifying, great runner, climber and swimmer, gifted with sharp senses... not a powerful build, but Conan would only laugh at such notion IMO ;)

Perhaps I could have used a few (5 max) levels of fighter, but well, that wasn't the point.

BTW Leadership can also explain various princesses slavishly following Conan.

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