My players have brought a certain level of paranoia to the Savage Tide Adventure path. This has lead them to make effective and frequent use of divinations. Good for them, right? I like that they're thinking about the mysteries of the campaign and working things out. If it takes away some of the surprise down the road, so be it. They did the work, they know what to expect.
So anyway, we're at the end of Serpents of Scuttlecove, about to start the attack on the Crimson Fleet Base. They've been worried about the whole Tooth Ahazu thing since Zotzilaha's shrine way back in Tides of Dread. So they've been working on the problem. For example, every time they cast commune, which has happened three or four times so far in the campaign, there's always several questions about the individual who they've taken to referring to as The Manipulator.
As an aside, since Lavinia was snatched a leading theory is that she isn't who she seems to be and has actually been playing the party for fools the whole time. This is causing no small amount of consternation for the party rogue, who is married to her.
Anyway, through the communes and careful guesswork one member of the party has pretty much worked out that The Manipulator is another demon lord. So he wants another commune to basically play twenty questions: Is it Orcus? Is it Graz'zt? Is it Malcanthet? Is it Obox-ob?(I'm paraphrasing here, the list is much more extensive and the questions are more carefully worded.) There are some non-demon lords in there also, like Lavinia, Vanthus, and Rowyn.
So I could cheat and have The Manipulator interfere with the commune or something, but it hardly seems sporting. It doesn't derail the campaign for them to have this piece of information now and hard work should be rewarded. My problem is they get the answer now, but at this point it will seem completely random and won't actually matter until Enemies of My Enemy. Cool we figured it out - and that information is largely worthless for two and a half adventures.
I'm not looking for ways to weasel out of this. I'm just looking for suggestions on how to make this information matter earlier in the campaign. Any thoughts?
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they're in scuttlecove, right?
have the "Manipulator" take notice of their communion and either approach them with a minion, or place additional (xp & treasure rich) enemies against them. perhaps slipping them info regarding the current powerbase of the city or the crimson fleet.
this way, they get some payoff, and big M's role comes to the fore earlier rather than later.
also, consider having M take a more direct observation role, via minions, spells, or the like. this way M will know exactly how they operate, who they trust/don't trust, etc...
-t
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And even if they do find out it´s the big M their next thousand communes will be about WHY. And that is a whole other kettle of fish - especially if you consider how many fingers in how many pies M has. At this stage there doesn´t even need to be a single answer to WHY as M can just be putting pieces in place and waiting to see how the board shapes up. (And to make sure M has as many options as possible if and when a course has to be chosen.)
I'm not sure how the communes are being phrased but there is always the chance that the answer given is just one of the intermediaries M used to get the tooth to the party. Does the answer immediately have to go all the way up to the top of the chain? If the answer they get is, say, Sutolore... they're going to want to go back to Tamoachan to try Speak With Dead!
Having the proper answer is fine - they can get an offer of help which scares the pants off them. If they get the idea that their communes have attracted the attention of said M they may back off and try to hide... until they are forced to consider accepting said aid later in the campaign. If they come up with the idea themselves at that stage it'll seem so much more organic/ sandboxy and they will be astonished that you're prepared for it!
Do they already know about Tyralandi's allegiance? If not, you could use her and make her a minion of M. That is a nice and logical way to introduce her, and it fits with Scuttlecove.
I'm not sure how the communes are being phrased but there is always the chance that the answer given is just one of the intermediaries M used to get the tooth to the party. Does the answer immediately have to go all the way up to the top of the chain? If the answer they get is, say, Sutolore... they're going to want to go back to Tamoachan to try Speak With Dead!
Hmmmmm...
Sutolore die, go BOOM!Then, as an extraplanar entity, after his Death Throes whatever is left fades back to the black abyss.
At least that's the way I read it. :)
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Don't come at me with facts! I want solutions!
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"He blew up in my face, dude! That's why I have no eyebrows. There must be traces of him left in this shirt - I haven't done laundry in 14 levels!"
Cue CSI examination of armour for varrangoin DNA, followed by True Resurrection!
If they players do figure it out, let them - its not like it ruins the plot. Make them sweat over whether to reveal what they know. When the moment comes when they confront The Manipulator, they can either be vengeful, proud, or devious and smug enough to play along. Even if the manipulator knows that they know, both sides might still hold on to the pretense! :)
Seems like your group might enjoy this kind of thing.
I don't really find playing Twenty Questions with commune to be an appropriate in-game use of the spell, for most clerics of that power anyways. Really? You are just going to play the divine equivalent of 'are we there yet?' with your god? How does that seem to be a good idea?
I would strive to present that information to them through a different means. Perhaps a dream. I don't have any issues with letting them figure things out (my ST campaign has gone way off expected track in Ch 5, when I introduced a Deck of Many Things), but I'd like to keep things in character.
You could interrupt the commune with a visit from M (in disguise). The angelic woman says "Yes. I can tell you the answers to your questions, for a kiss...." They are much more likely to fail the save this early and become her Thrall. Then all future 'communes' can be M manipulating the answers.
The biggest threat of them knowing who the manipulator is
Personally I would like them to have that information. I think EomE is the weakest link in the path, and feeding that part of the plot to them along several adventures would be better imho than running one long fight-this-for-that-info.
One could also assume the gods (or whomever is answering the commune) is aware of *SPOILER*'s plans and for whatever reason of divinity have decided not to get involved (since the party is handling it) (see 20 questions with your deity above :)
And do not forget that the questions in a commune should be yes/no questions, but that it does not mean you have to answer them that way. You could also answer with a short cryptic message. You could also make this a general cryptic message that applies to every question about demons they ask.