So a few years ago we published a new core setting book, The Pirate's Guide to Freeport. It is a systemless book, a pure sourcebook without game stats for any RPG. Since then we've done a series of companion books that provide mechanical support for various games. To date we've done True20, d20, Savage Worlds, and Castles & Crusades, and Expeditious Retreat Press just released a 4E version under license. The titles are usually titled [System] Freeport Companion, so we've had the True20 Freeport Companion, the Savage Worlds Freeport Companion, etc.
The tricky bit is that the Pathfinder compatibility license does not allow a publisher to use "Pathfinder" in the title, so we need to figure out what to call it. Which option do you think would be better?
A) Call it Freeport Companion Revisited and rely on the PF logo and the sales text make it clear that this was for Pathfinder.
B) Call it something like the Voyager Freeport Companion. This could potentially make people think it's for a non-existent game called Voyager though.
Opinions?
Chris Pramas
Green Ronin Publishing
A) Trades subtly on Paizo customers familiar with the Revisited series, which is nice, but might confuse other folks into thinking that this is a newer edition of the Freeport Companion.
B) Is looking for a term appropriate to Freeport that is suggestive of Pathfinder. This might be fine, but I don't think you've hit the right combination with "voyager."
Another option:
C) Give up on trying to find a way to title the new version to indicate compatibility and just depend on the PF logo and call it simply The Freeport Companion.
I'm curious: how often are people seeing or hearing folks refer to P20?
EDIT: Does the neologism "Wavefinder" sound corny? (Option B above)
3.75 Freeport Companion?
I like the Wayfinder idea.
Or, using Mairkurion's idea: Freeport Companion Wavefinder Edition...
A) Call it Freeport Companion Revisited and rely on the PF logo and the sales text make it clear that this was for Pathfinder.
Rely on the logo. If you call it something different (ex, "Voyager"), you'll have people looking at the name and wondering what it is. Even "Wayfinder" would be too much of a stretch for the casual user of the website, let alone people that don't go online for their content.
Technically, PF is 3.5 revisited. The key is the product description.
I find it amusing that you guys have thrown out the team's exact suggestions in just 8 posts. Good job, guys! ;)
Of course...you guys hang out with great people.
Director of Game Development
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I find it amusing that you guys have thrown out the team's exact suggestions in just 8 posts. Good job, guys! ;)Wait, you came up with Daiglelingavaughanahodge Half-cocked Freeport Companion on your own?!
There was a half-cocked, ego-driven suggestion. Yes. But not all four in one. ;)
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You can't work out terms to get a one-time license? Now if the legalities of the whole thing make it virtually impossible I understand, but I would hope that something could be worked out.
Otherwise I think the better option would be A.
I agree with this, try to work something out with paizo, some kind of agreement to allow the use of Pathfinder being a great option.
Another option, with a similar vein, would be to release it as some sort of "What If" sourcebook in the Pathfinder Chronicles line, putting Freeport somewhere in The Shackles. This would be awesome.
I'm thinking A is a good option, myself.
Freeport Companion:Bootyfinder edition. Might be fun but give the wrong ideal
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You can't work out terms to get a one-time license? Now if the legalities of the whole thing make it virtually impossible I understand, but I would hope that something could be worked out.
Otherwise I think the better option would be A.
I agree with this, try to work something out with paizo, some kind of agreement to allow the use of Pathfinder being a great option.
Another option, with a similar vein, would be to release it as some sort of "What If" sourcebook in the Pathfinder Chronicles line, putting Freeport somewhere in The Shackles. This would be awesome.
I agree too. I'm sure you know this already, but folks are going to search for "Pathfinder" and you want your product to pop up when they do. If you can't say "Pathfinder," how are you supposed to identify your product as compatible? Is the restriction only in the title? What if you called it the "Freeport Companion" and as a sub-title or maybe just as a reference line on the cover, said it was the Pathfinder-compatible edition. "Wayfinder" says "a Pathfinder fanzine" so there must be some way to get permission to say Pathfinder.
EDIT: Having looked at the cover of several other Pathfinder-compatible products, most seem to go with your choice A.
Freeport Companion (PFRPG)
That's how it would appear on Paizo's own website. look at any of the 3PP.
What about this;
The Ultimate Freeport Companion
...and than actually make it that! :)
Since this product has moved beyond being for d20 or 3rd Era, and with Pathfinder still being OGL, you may just need to call it the OGL Freeport Companion and then have the Pathfinder RPG logo at the bottom of the front cover like most of the other 3pp use to identify the book as being specifically for the Pathfinder RPG.
I'll cast my vote for P20. Or you could go with the guaranteed sales names of "Girls of Freeport." I think there might be a lot of random sales stemming beyond edition specific, but hey, anything that helps it sell is good right. ;-)
It would have to be "Girls of Freeport Gone Wild"...
I like the way you think, Mairk.
Paths to Freeport
Freeport, Return to Port
Return to Freeport
Pathfinder is 3.5 compatible. And we have 3.5 version of Freeport Companion already. While definitely saving on conversion time, new book is going to need something stronger to make it appealing.
So, here is my suggestion:
- add some Golarion spice to the mix
- use another setting specific adjectiveFor example:
Freeport Companion (Golarion Edition, PFRPG)Regards,
Ruemere
Wishful thinking, but the Golarion specific content is not OGC.
I say:
The Freeport Companion: A New Path!
Or 'The Freeport Companion: All Aboard!'
There are enough Pathfinderites (Pathfinderwegians?) that your web presence at least won't be much of a problem. I don't know about brick and morter stores.
Sigurd
I got very good sales on my first PFRPG-compatible product with no branding other than the logo. The Green Ronin brand should be good enough that people recognize the product for what it is, and the compatability logo speaks for itself. All you really need is a product name that distinguishes it from other versions of the sourcebook. I do not recommend the Revisited word if it is being used in Pathfinder product names.
My suggestion would be to stick a normal, non-trademarkable English word at the beginning that will stand in for Pathfinder and use it it in any other Pathfinder-compatible products. I wouldn't use anything overly nautical, even if it would be cute, because then you would be stuck coming up with something new for a non-Freeport-themed product.
My suggestion would be something like The Explorer's Guide to Freeport, The Adventurer's Guide to Freeport, The Vagabond's Guide to Freeport, The Traveler's Guide to Freeport, etc.
The nice thing about using Revisited is that it's something we can use again if we update any of other d20 era products. We could do Book of Fiends Revisited and Advanced Bestiary Revisited, for example, and that would have a consistent meaning without us creating a new brand and logo. I had forgotten that Paizo did a couple of books with the word in the title, but that's not a big concern. Revisit is common enough.
I also considered Freeport Companion Unearthed. That's good from a D&D reference POV, but it doesn't necessarily scream out Pathfinder.
I may be over thinking. I do that. :)
Chris Pramas
Green Ronin
. We could do Book of Fiends Revisited and Advanced Bestiary Revisited,
Chris Pramas
Green Ronin
If you do such a thing, you just sold two books
Book of Fiends Revisited, you say? My interest is piqued.
That having been said, yes, indeed, I liked the Revisited tag for Pathfinder products.
Having the original books in hardcover...I just had a geekgasm!
Saying that, I wouldn't want for it to just be a crunch update; I'd love to have some new content and artwork, too. :D
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Anything Chris Pramas does involving hell has been a must buy for me since 2nd Edition, and the Advanced Bestiary may be my favorite 3rd party product for 3rd Edition (It or the Book of Templates for sure), so revising either of those is a great way to seperate me from my money. :)
To the question at hand, by the way, I like the Revisited tagline best myself.
The nice thing about using Revisited is that it's something we can use again if we update any of other d20 era products. We could do Book of Fiends Revisited and Advanced Bestiary Revisited, for example, and that would have a consistent meaning without us creating a new brand and logo. I had forgotten that Paizo did a couple of books with the word in the title, but that's not a big concern. Revisit is common enough.
I also considered Freeport Companion Unearthed. That's good from a D&D reference POV, but it doesn't necessarily scream out Pathfinder.
I may be over thinking. I do that. :)
Chris Pramas
Green Ronin
Please give us the Advanced Bestiary!
This may be a dumb question, but how about The Pathfinder's Guide to Freeport, using the word as RJ Grady suggests, as the possessive instead of the name of the system? I say dumb, because perhaps that would still violate the license.
This may be a dumb question, but how about The Pathfinder's Guide to Freeport, using the word as RJ Grady suggests, as the possessive instead of the name of the system? I say dumb, because perhaps that would still violate the license.
Even if it didn't technically violate the license, it would certainly go against its spirit and I wouldn't do that to my peeps at Paizo.
Chris Pramas
Green Ronin
Yeah, it was dumb. I guess I've got nothing more. Maybe my creativity would be inspired if somebody promised to do a Pf licensed Advanced Bestiary...
Regardless, Green Ronin has its own rep in the gaming world where people would pick it up based on that logo alone. At least I can find Green Ronin swag in a retail chain such as B&N and Borders.
Really? I used to see it in those places, but sadly, not anymore.
Maybe it's a regional thing. Heck, I was surprised to find the Erotic Book of Fantasy at a Border's late last year of all places...
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The nice thing about using Revisited is that it's something we can use again if we update any of other d20 era products. We could do Book of Fiends Revisited and Advanced Bestiary Revisited, for example, and that would have a consistent meaning without us creating a new brand and logo. I had forgotten that Paizo did a couple of books with the word in the title, but that's not a big concern. Revisit is common enough.
This makes a lot of sense. "Revisited" is a Paizo-associated word without getting too close. Plus, as others have mentioned, this will basically be the book for anyone looking for OGL, not just Pathfinder, so it's also slightly generic. Finally, you can easily apply it to other books you update. WINNER.
While all the play-on-words names and coded references to Pathfinders are cool and all, their a little too precious for a serious product, IMHO.
That book was EVERYWHERE! Even after 4e books were on the shelf. It was nuts. I take it we all know why.