I just got Tomb of Horrors (the original/I like to collect) and found two rules that still remain in the game at its core - the fall 10' rule takes 1-6 points of damage and the save for half damage from lightning. Among many others I am sure. Then there's all the magic items that are named relatively the same and then, like archaic history, the slight differences like the original "Adamantite" not "-tine"...
It's sweet that Paizo is keeping the flavor of 1st edition alive in Pathfinder.
I never met the man but i've read articles on Gary and seen interviews about him.
The impression I get is that he loved gaming of all kinds, board games, dice games, computer games. Apparently people used to play games on his doorstep until he invited them in and then they gamed some more.
There are cool things in each edition and some cool things that continue throughout the editions. There is also nothing to stop you bringing back things you thought were unfairly removed, such as level titles from 1st edition or background skills instead of proficiencies. It's your game, make it your own.
As far as Gary goes, I think as long as you are enjoying cooperative gaming, he would be happy.
As far as Gary goes, I think as long as you are enjoying cooperative gaming, he would be happy.
I never got to meet the man either, but from what I understand of who he was based on interviews and other second and third hand information, that statement is completely and utterly correct.
I never met the man but i've read articles on Gary and seen interviews about him.
The impression I get is that he loved gaming of all kinds, board games, dice games, computer games. Apparently people used to play games on his doorstep until he invited them in and then they gamed some more.
There are cool things in each edition and some cool things that continue throughout the editions. There is also nothing to stop you bringing back things you thought were unfairly removed, such as level titles from 1st edition or background skills instead of proficiencies. It's your game, make it your own.
As far as Gary goes, I think as long as you are enjoying cooperative gaming, he would be happy.
Level titles were very cool and I've thought about bringing them back.
Level titles were very cool and I've thought about bringing them back.I never met the man but i've read articles on Gary and seen interviews about him.
The impression I get is that he loved gaming of all kinds, board games, dice games, computer games. Apparently people used to play games on his doorstep until he invited them in and then they gamed some more.
There are cool things in each edition and some cool things that continue throughout the editions. There is also nothing to stop you bringing back things you thought were unfairly removed, such as level titles from 1st edition or background skills instead of proficiencies. It's your game, make it your own.
As far as Gary goes, I think as long as you are enjoying cooperative gaming, he would be happy.
You mean you don't? ^_^
It can be a measure of the threat of your foe if they elect to disclose their true 'title' ... or if an appropriate divination lets slip.
Say, your 3rd level cleric casts some kind of augury, only to be told "'Ware the Myrmidon!"
What are level titles?
(I started in 3.5 era)They sound nifty.
Before 2e, every class had a title for each level. For example, here are the level titles for the fighter from AD&D 1e:
1 Veteran
2 Warrior
3 Swordsman
4 Hero
5 Swashbuckler
6 Myrmidon
7 Champion
8 Superhero
9+ Lord
It was rather odd. Only 2nd level fighters were "warriors", and a 5th level fighter was a "swashbuckler", even if he wore full plate and wielded a two-handed sword.
I don't recall all of them, but here's a sampling:
Druid 23 "Heirophant of the Cabal"
Assassin 15 "Grandfather of Assassins"
Monk 17 "Grand Master of Flowers"
Bard "Master Bard"
'name level' was typically 9th level (11th for magic-users): High Priest or Priestess for Clerics, Lord or Lady for Fighters, Wizard (I think) for magic-user 11th and so on. Since 1e had 'bonus Leadership' (in 3e terms) at name level once your character built a suitable stronghold where most character classes attracted a body of followers.
1e Rangers by far had the best followers, potentially attracting a menagerie of various critters to serve them loyally. I do not believe even a Ranger had to worry overmuch about having a stronghold, but my memory is rather fuzzy on this particular.
Magic-Users earned the title of Archmage at 18th level - no mean feat with a paltry 11d4 hit dice with a CON bonus cap of +2 hp per hit die, earning a scant 1 hp per level after 11th...
Since I have a PDF of the 1e Unearthed Arcana, here's a sampling of level titles for some of the classes in that book:
Cavalier: Horseman, Lancer, Armiger, Scutifer, Esquire, Knight Errant, Knight Bachelor, Knight, Grand Knight, Banneret, Chevalier, Cavalier. After 10th level, a Cavalier was a Cavalier in both class and level title. Paladins were (then) a sub-class of cavalier, so you probably wanted to be quite cautious of calling out such a person.
Barbarians are just 'barbarians' - the only real way to assess the threat they posed was by the company they kept and the presence (or lack) of magic items they possessed. A Bubba packing serious magical loot and keeping company with a Mage and a High Priest is some one you'd best learn to fear real fast. Although they capped at 8d12 hit dice ...
Druids: capped at Grand Druid at 15th level. To advance past that they surrendered their title and position to become a Hierophant Druid. Titling: Hierophant Druid, Hierophant Initiate, Hierophant Adept, Hierophant Master, Numinous Hierophant, Mystic Hierophant, Arcane Hierophant and lastly Hierophant of the Cabal at 23rd level. And if you were about to throw down with a Hierophant of the Cabal, you were in seriously deep poo-doo, as druids did not stop gaining Hit Dice until 15th level.
Thief-Acrobat was the second 1e version of a prestige class (Bard being the first), with such roguish titles as Burglar-Acrobat, Cat Burglar and Master Cat Burglar.
I don't recall all of them, but here's a sampling:
Druid 23 "Heirophant of the Cabal"
Assassin 15 "Grandfather of Assassins"
Monk 17 "Grand Master of Flowers"
Bard "Master Bard"
'name level' was typically 9th level (11th for magic-users): High Priest or Priestess for Clerics, Lord or Lady for Fighters, Wizard (I think) for magic-user 11th and so on. Since 1e had 'bonus Leadership' (in 3e terms) at name level once your character built a suitable stronghold where most character classes attracted a body of followers.
1e Rangers by far had the best followers, potentially attracting a menagerie of various critters to serve them loyally. I do not believe even a Ranger had to worry overmuch about having a stronghold, but my memory is rather fuzzy on this particular.
Magic-Users earned the title of Archmage at 18th level - no mean feat with a paltry 11d4 hit dice with a CON bonus cap of +2 hp per hit die, earning a scant 1 hp per level after 11th...
Since I have a PDF of the 1e Unearthed Arcana, here's a sampling of level titles for some of the classes in that book:
Cavalier: Horseman, Lancer, Armiger, Scutifer, Esquire, Knight Errant, Knight Bachelor, Knight, Grand Knight, Banneret, Chevalier, Cavalier. After 10th level, a Cavalier was a Cavalier in both class and level title. Paladins were (then) a sub-class of cavalier, so you probably wanted to be quite cautious of calling out such a person.
Barbarians are just 'barbarians' - the only real way to assess the threat they posed was by the company they kept and the presence (or lack) of magic items they possessed. A Bubba packing serious magical loot and keeping company with a Mage and a High Priest is some one you'd best learn to fear real fast. Although they capped at 8d12 hit dice ...
Druids: capped at Grand Druid at 15th level. To advance past that they surrendered their title and position to become a Hierophant Druid. Titling: Hierophant Druid, Hierophant Initiate, Hierophant Adept, Hierophant...
~Pulls out my PRINT version of Unearthed Arcana (Gives a snobbish look at Turin's PDF copy) and verifies what the common lout has written~ Yes. He is correct on what he has written. ~gives an overbearing pat on the back to Turin~ Good job, mate! Perhaps one day you might just graduate up to print.
~GRINS~
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I don't mean to rain on the parade, but I always disliked the level titles. I'm a big fan of the idea that not all fighters think of themselves as 'fighters'. They are warriors, mercenaries, cut-throats, vanquishers, bodyguards, champions, protectors, heroes, guardians, defenders, conquerors....the list goes on.
To me it all depends on how they view themselves. Thus, I dislike being told that my plate-wearing and greatsword-wielding dwarven fighter is a champion one level and a swashbuckler another.
He is absolutely not a swashbuckler! He is known throughout the land as Wonko the Great, Champion of Somewhereplace!
Similar results with each other class. My characters rarely walk into a town and declare themselves 'Bob the Ranger', 'Fred the Rogue', or 'Steve, the Sorcerer/Barbarian With One Or Two Levels Of Rogue For A Few Extra Skill Ranks, But That's Not Important'.
I always liked them, but never actually used them in play because they were so completely random.
Wow the orginal fall rules seem better to me...
Btw Rezdave you explain it with alot of grace.
Wow the orginal fall rules seem better to me...
Btw Rezdave you explain it with alot of grace.
I'm not gonna lie, I feel the same way. If you fall 5000' you should take an average of 438,375 damage. ;)
<script type="text/javascript">
var damage = 0;
var i=1;
for (i=1;i<=500;i++)
{
damage += i*3.5
}
alert(damage);
</script>
I always liked them, but never actually used them in play because they were so completely random.
I found the magic-user level names particularly random, as if grabbed from a thesaurus.
"Hey guys, I was a Seer, then a Conjurer, and now I'm an Enchanter! Hopefully I can become a Warlock or Sorcerer some day."
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I too enjoy the Gygaxian in my game. I also see a lot of Jack Vance and Poul Anderson and Fritz Lieber there still.
One of the great Gygaxian tropes of the original DM's guide is Paizo's products often throw away one liners that they can later develop, should they choose. Casually mentioning stuff like "the Wind Dukes of Aaqa" from the original DMG got my imagination firing (and had me put Aaqa as a place in my high school campaign, which is updated and used today for Pathfinder).
When third edition came out, they did a great job of capturing first edition ambiance without the first edition clunkiness on a number of levels.
The only thing I feel that I miss from Pathfinder are some of the overly verbose Gygaxian/Vancian names like "Malandrust's Magnificent Magelight" or "Ibenfaust's Sword of Impaling". But I just added back into my game ... :)
I too enjoy the Gygaxian in my game. I also see a lot of Jack Vance and Poul Anderson and Fritz Lieber there still.
One of the great Gygaxian tropes of the original DM's guide is Paizo's products often throw away one liners that they can later develop, should they choose. Casually mentioning stuff like "the Wind Dukes of Aaqa" from the original DMG got my imagination firing (and had me put Aaqa as a place in my high school campaign, which is updated and used today for Pathfinder).
When third edition came out, they did a great job of capturing first edition ambiance without the first edition clunkiness on a number of levels.
The only thing I feel that I miss from Pathfinder are some of the overly verbose Gygaxian/Vancian names like "Malandrust's Magnificent Magelight" or "Ibenfaust's Sword of Impaling". But I just added back into my game ... :)
Archade, you and I are on the same page totally...