paizo.com Recent Posts in Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIpaizo.com Recent Posts in Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally III2012-11-15T22:16:40Z2012-11-15T22:16:40ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIwraithstrike (alias of concerro)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#322011-12-14T03:04:58Z2011-10-03T07:59:57Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Starglim wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
<p>I certainly agree. The original question and, as far as I can tell, Mr. Jacobs' reply concerned <i>summon nature's ally</i>. </p>
<p></blockquote><p>No, the changes concern Summon Monster.
</p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Quote:</div><blockquote><p><b>James Jacobs wrote:</p>
<p>Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster</b> lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.</p>
<p>Errata is:</p>
<p>Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)</p>
<p>Change Riding Dog to Dog.</p>
<p>Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker.</p>
<p>Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.</blockquote><p>James calls this official(and at the time official changes were allowed on the messageboard), but it needs to be errata'd into the CRB, and the PRD.
<p>I bumped the thread so people would FAQ it, and get it put into the next printing. I am sure there are not too many printings left of the core book, and there are still a few things, such as this that need to be fixed. I thing the higher level summon monster list are correct.</p>Starglim wrote:I certainly agree. The original question and, as far as I can tell, Mr. Jacobs' reply concerned summon nature's ally.
No, the changes concern Summon Monster.
Quote:James Jacobs wrote:
Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.
Errata is:
Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon...wraithstrike (alias of concerro)2011-10-03T07:59:57ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIStarglimhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#312011-10-03T07:42:34Z2011-10-03T07:42:34Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Starglim wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date—>The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11. </blockquote><p><a href="http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/summonNatureSAlly.html#_summon-nature-s-ally-i" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">This PRD?</a>
<p>It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata). </blockquote>That is summon nature's ally which is not the same as summon monster. </blockquote><p>I certainly agree. The original question and, as far as I can tell, Mr. Jacobs' reply concerned <i>summon nature's ally</i>.
<p>Since you bring it up, though, perhaps it would be useful to summarise what changes you see need to be made to the <i>summon monster</i> spells.</p>wraithstrike wrote:Starglim wrote: wraithstrike wrote: It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date-->The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11.
This PRD? It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata). That is summon nature's ally which is not the same as summon monster. I certainly agree. The original question...Starglim2011-10-03T07:42:34ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIwraithstrike (alias of concerro)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#302011-10-03T06:01:33Z2011-10-03T06:01:33Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Starglim wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date—>The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11. </blockquote><p><a href="http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/summonNatureSAlly.html#_summon-nature-s-ally-i" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">This PRD?</a>
<p>It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata). </blockquote><p>That is summon nature's ally which is not the same as summon monster.Starglim wrote:wraithstrike wrote: It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date-->The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11.
This PRD? It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata). That is summon nature's ally which is not the same as summon monster.wraithstrike (alias of concerro)2011-10-03T06:01:33ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIhogarthhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#292011-10-03T04:06:21Z2011-10-03T04:06:21Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Starglim wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date—>The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11. </blockquote><p><a href="http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/summonNatureSAlly.html#_summon-nature-s-ally-i" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">This PRD?</a>
<p>It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata). </blockquote><p>Your link is pointing to Summon Nature's Ally (which has been corrected), not Summon Monster (which hasn't been completely updated — it still has references to Giant Lizards and Riding Dogs).Starglim wrote:wraithstrike wrote: It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date-->The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11.
This PRD? It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata). Your link is pointing to Summon Nature's Ally (which has been corrected), not Summon Monster (which hasn't been completely updated...hogarth2011-10-03T04:06:21ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIStarglimhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#282011-10-01T22:41:06Z2011-10-01T22:41:06Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date—>The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11. </blockquote><p><a href="http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/spells/summonNatureSAlly.html#_summon-nature-s-ally-i" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">This PRD?</a>
<p>It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata).</p>wraithstrike wrote:It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date-->The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11.
This PRD? It appears to have all of these changes applied (and the change to the Giant Scorpion mentioned in 3rd printing errata).Starglim2011-10-01T22:41:06ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIwraithstrike (alias of concerro)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#272011-10-01T13:33:28Z2011-10-01T13:33:28Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Starglim wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.</p>
<p>Errata is:</p>
<p>Change <b>Giant Lizard</b> to <b>Monitor Lizard</b>. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)</p>
<p>Change <b>Riding Dog</b> to <b>Dog</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, drone</b> to <b>Ant, worker</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, soldier</b> to <b>Ant, giant</b>.</p>
<p>The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from miscommunication between what was and wasn't changing with these animals in the switchover between the 3.5 Monster Manual and the Pathfinder Bestiary.</p>
<p>A few other notes:</p>
<p>The Giant Frilled Lizard is so much tougher than a bison or an ape because it's something that probably would HUNT bisons or apes. It'd be best to compare the giant frilled lizard ecologically wise to a tiger or bear; it's a top-tier predator.</p>
<p>Camels will be in the Bestiary II. If you need stats before then, though, they'll be VERY similar to the stats for a horse, except they'll have some sort of long-term go without water ability. </blockquote>We need to FAQ James post so it makes it into the errata. This was made before official answer had to be posted in the FAQ so I am sure it is still official, but I don't want it to be forgotten. </blockquote>As far as I can tell, changes have been fully applied by the 4th printing and partly noted in the 3rd printing-4th printing errata. </blockquote><p>It is not in the PRD which claims to be up to date—>The Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Reference Document contains all errata to the Core Rulebook, Bestiary, and Advanced Player's Guide as of 9/13/11.Starglim wrote:wraithstrike wrote: James Jacobs wrote:Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.
Errata is:
Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)
Change Riding Dog to Dog.
Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker.
Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.
The majority of these errors, I...wraithstrike (alias of concerro)2011-10-01T13:33:28ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIStarglimhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#262011-10-01T08:23:02Z2011-10-01T08:23:02Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">wraithstrike wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.</p>
<p>Errata is:</p>
<p>Change <b>Giant Lizard</b> to <b>Monitor Lizard</b>. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)</p>
<p>Change <b>Riding Dog</b> to <b>Dog</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, drone</b> to <b>Ant, worker</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, soldier</b> to <b>Ant, giant</b>.</p>
<p>The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from miscommunication between what was and wasn't changing with these animals in the switchover between the 3.5 Monster Manual and the Pathfinder Bestiary.</p>
<p>A few other notes:</p>
<p>The Giant Frilled Lizard is so much tougher than a bison or an ape because it's something that probably would HUNT bisons or apes. It'd be best to compare the giant frilled lizard ecologically wise to a tiger or bear; it's a top-tier predator.</p>
<p>Camels will be in the Bestiary II. If you need stats before then, though, they'll be VERY similar to the stats for a horse, except they'll have some sort of long-term go without water ability. </blockquote>We need to FAQ James post so it makes it into the errata. This was made before official answer had to be posted in the FAQ so I am sure it is still official, but I don't want it to be forgotten. </blockquote><p>As far as I can tell, changes have been fully applied by the 4th printing and partly noted in the 3rd printing-4th printing errata.wraithstrike wrote:James Jacobs wrote:Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.
Errata is:
Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)
Change Riding Dog to Dog.
Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker.
Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.
The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from...Starglim2011-10-01T08:23:02ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIwraithstrike (alias of concerro)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#252011-10-01T07:14:56Z2011-10-01T07:14:56Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.</p>
<p>Errata is:</p>
<p>Change <b>Giant Lizard</b> to <b>Monitor Lizard</b>. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)</p>
<p>Change <b>Riding Dog</b> to <b>Dog</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, drone</b> to <b>Ant, worker</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, soldier</b> to <b>Ant, giant</b>.</p>
<p>The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from miscommunication between what was and wasn't changing with these animals in the switchover between the 3.5 Monster Manual and the Pathfinder Bestiary.</p>
<p>A few other notes:</p>
<p>The Giant Frilled Lizard is so much tougher than a bison or an ape because it's something that probably would HUNT bisons or apes. It'd be best to compare the giant frilled lizard ecologically wise to a tiger or bear; it's a top-tier predator.</p>
<p>Camels will be in the Bestiary II. If you need stats before then, though, they'll be VERY similar to the stats for a horse, except they'll have some sort of long-term go without water ability. </blockquote><p>We need to FAQ James post so it makes it into the errata. This was made before official answer had to be posted in the FAQ so I am sure it is still official, but I don't want it to be forgotten.James Jacobs wrote:Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.
Errata is:
Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)
Change Riding Dog to Dog.
Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker.
Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.
The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from miscommunication...wraithstrike (alias of concerro)2011-10-01T07:14:56ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIITwowlveshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#242009-12-23T16:18:23Z2009-12-23T16:18:23Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">DM Wellard wrote:</div><blockquote> Change Riding Dog to Dog..oww that's just nerfed SM 1 completely as the riding dog was the only thing worth summoning on that. </blockquote><p>That should have been your first clue that it was a mistake. If one option is not just better than the rest, but head and shoulllders by far better, it's probably a mistake. The Riding Dog is as powerful as the Wolf on the SMII list, so it's not only too good for SMI, it's too good for SMII (why get one wolf when you can get 1d3 riding dogs that each are as good as a wolf?).DM Wellard wrote:Change Riding Dog to Dog..oww that's just nerfed SM 1 completely as the riding dog was the only thing worth summoning on that.
That should have been your first clue that it was a mistake. If one option is not just better than the rest, but head and shoulllders by far better, it's probably a mistake. The Riding Dog is as powerful as the Wolf on the SMII list, so it's not only too good for SMI, it's too good for SMII (why get one wolf when you can get 1d3 riding dogs that each...Twowlves2009-12-23T16:18:23ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIstuart haffendenhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#232009-12-23T14:43:13Z2009-12-23T14:43:13Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Treantmonk wrote:</div><blockquote><p> So on the Summon Nature's Ally 3 list is the "Giant Lizard"</p>
<p>Now in the Bestiary, I can only find one "Giant Lizard" and that's the Giant <b>Frilled</b> Lizard.</p>
<p>I was assuming that was the right creature, until I started looking at the stats, and it seems pretty potent against the other creatures on the list.</p>
<p>That wouldn't suprise me too much, the Ant Drone is far more powerful than it's SNA II brethren, as is the Riding Dog at SNA I.</p>
<p>However, I am wondering if perhaps they meant the Monitor Lizard, which, although doesn't have "Giant" in the name at all, the abilities would fit more in line with the other SNA III creatures.</p>
<p>Or is there supposed to be another Giant Lizard entry in the Bestiary that maybe got edited out, like the camel.</p>
<p>Anyone have an opinion on this? </blockquote><p>I'm sure you noticed I used the Monitor Lizard in my SNA sheets, I just assumed the mistake when I saw the Frilled abilities.Treantmonk wrote:So on the Summon Nature's Ally 3 list is the "Giant Lizard"
Now in the Bestiary, I can only find one "Giant Lizard" and that's the Giant Frilled Lizard.
I was assuming that was the right creature, until I started looking at the stats, and it seems pretty potent against the other creatures on the list.
That wouldn't suprise me too much, the Ant Drone is far more powerful than it's SNA II brethren, as is the Riding Dog at SNA I.
However, I am wondering if perhaps they meant...stuart haffenden2009-12-23T14:43:13ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIhogarthhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#222009-12-23T14:43:09Z2009-12-23T14:43:09Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">hogarth wrote:</div><blockquote> Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. </blockquote>But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet. </blockquote><p>Maybe. Although I find it's a little surprising that getting run over by a 2,200 lb bison is more painful than getting run over by a 20,000 lb triceratops.James Jacobs wrote:hogarth wrote: Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out.
But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet. Maybe. Although I find it's a little surprising that getting run over by a 2,200 lb bison is more painful than getting run over by a 20,000 lb triceratops.hogarth2009-12-23T14:43:09ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIBalodekhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#212009-12-23T14:37:10Z2009-12-23T14:37:10Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">hogarth wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Treantmonk wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!</p>
<p></blockquote>Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. </blockquote>But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet. </blockquote><p>Yeah, something that big that can jump an 8 foot fence and out accelerate my motorcycle is not a critter I want to stand in front of when it gets going.James Jacobs wrote:hogarth wrote: Treantmonk wrote:
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!
Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet. Yeah, something that big that can jump an 8 foot fence and out accelerate my motorcycle is not a critter I want to stand in...Balodek2009-12-23T14:37:10ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIDM Wellard (alias of Wellard)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#202009-12-23T10:13:24Z2009-12-23T10:12:59Z<p>Change Riding Dog to Dog..oww that's just nerfed SM 1 completely as the riding dog was the only thing worth summoning on that.</p>
<p>Need to put this out on my pbp threads asap</p>Change Riding Dog to Dog..oww that's just nerfed SM 1 completely as the riding dog was the only thing worth summoning on that.
Need to put this out on my pbp threads asapDM Wellard (alias of Wellard)2009-12-23T10:12:59ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIJason Nelson (Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#192009-12-23T09:31:05Z2009-12-23T09:31:05Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">hogarth wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Treantmonk wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!</p>
<p></blockquote>Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. </blockquote>But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet. </blockquote><p>They should probably both have Improved Bull Rush as a bonus feat though!James Jacobs wrote:hogarth wrote: Treantmonk wrote:
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!
Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet. They should probably both have Improved Bull Rush as a bonus feat though!Jason Nelson (Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games)2009-12-23T09:31:05ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIJames Jacobs (Creative Director)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#182009-12-23T08:11:20Z2009-12-23T08:11:19Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">hogarth wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Treantmonk wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!</p>
<p></blockquote>Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. </blockquote><p>But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet.hogarth wrote:Treantmonk wrote:
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!
Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out. But should come as no surprise to anyone who's dealt with bison in real life, I bet.James Jacobs (Creative Director)2009-12-23T08:11:19ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIInexuspherehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#172009-12-23T07:59:36Z2009-12-23T07:59:19Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.</p>
<p>Errata is: </blockquote><p>Oh my. I wasn't actually expecting you to, you know, meet my request.
<p>PAIZO 4 LIFE.</p>
<p>You guys are awesome.
<br />
-Campbell</p>James Jacobs wrote:Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.
Errata is:
Oh my. I wasn't actually expecting you to, you know, meet my request. PAIZO 4 LIFE.
You guys are awesome.
-Campbellnexusphere2009-12-23T07:59:19ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIhogarthhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#162009-12-22T22:20:06Z2009-12-22T22:19:50Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Treantmonk wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!</p>
<p></blockquote><p>Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out.Treantmonk wrote:It's so odd to have creatures like the Ape and Bison be on the lower tier power-wise!
Note, however, that the Bison (and the lower CR Aurochs) now have the Trample ability. That came as a surprise to me when someone pointed it out.hogarth2009-12-22T22:19:50ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIjreysthttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#152009-12-22T21:55:43Z2009-12-22T21:55:43Z<p>For anyone who uses d20pfsrd.com, we've updated the summon spells to reflect James' statements above.</p>For anyone who uses d20pfsrd.com, we've updated the summon spells to reflect James' statements above.jreyst2009-12-22T21:55:43ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIspalding (alias of Abraham spalding)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#142014-02-20T18:19:39Z2009-12-22T21:34:45Z<p>Can't say I'm too surprised to hear that... I had originally been expecting it to be a shot to the eyes to blind, and was surprised that it didn't at least have a save throw. However since it didn't seem to be noticed I thought it was on purpose to 'even out' the camel against the horse somehow (as we don't have stats I wasn't sure the camel didn't have different stats than the horse).</p>Can't say I'm too surprised to hear that... I had originally been expecting it to be a shot to the eyes to blind, and was surprised that it didn't at least have a save throw. However since it didn't seem to be noticed I thought it was on purpose to 'even out' the camel against the horse somehow (as we don't have stats I wasn't sure the camel didn't have different stats than the horse).spalding (alias of Abraham spalding)2009-12-22T21:34:45ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIITreantmonkhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#132009-12-22T13:04:29Z2009-12-22T13:04:29Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">jreyst wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
Wow. I hadn't noticed that one. That does seem a little, err.. silly. At least give it an easy DC saving throw or something. </blockquote><p>Good point. In the Druid animal companion entry it doesn't say there is a saving throw at all...jreyst wrote:Wow. I hadn't noticed that one. That does seem a little, err.. silly. At least give it an easy DC saving throw or something.
Good point. In the Druid animal companion entry it doesn't say there is a saving throw at all...Treantmonk2009-12-22T13:04:29ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIjreysthttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#122009-12-22T07:44:12Z2009-12-22T07:44:12Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">James Jacobs wrote:</div><blockquote>Personally... I kinda wish that ability hadn't gone in. It feels a little bit too "meta." Would an aboleth or a xorn or a giant spider or another camel or an air elemental REALLY be sickened by being spit on by a camel? It's a bit too "cute" for my tastes. We WILL need to support this attack in Bestiary II, I guess, when it comes out, but I'll be pushing to put in some additional language there to limit the sickened effect to other humanoids.</blockquote><p>Wow. I hadn't noticed that one. That does seem a little, err.. silly. At least give it an easy DC saving throw or something.James Jacobs wrote:Personally... I kinda wish that ability hadn't gone in. It feels a little bit too "meta." Would an aboleth or a xorn or a giant spider or another camel or an air elemental REALLY be sickened by being spit on by a camel? It's a bit too "cute" for my tastes. We WILL need to support this attack in Bestiary II, I guess, when it comes out, but I'll be pushing to put in some additional language there to limit the sickened effect to other humanoids.
Wow. I hadn't noticed that...jreyst2009-12-22T07:44:12ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIITreantmonkhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#112009-12-22T03:45:04Z2009-12-22T03:45:04Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Quote:</div><blockquote><p>Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)</p>
<p>Change Riding Dog to Dog. </p>
<p>Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker. </p>
<p>Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.</blockquote><p>That makes a lot more sense.Quote:Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)
Change Riding Dog to Dog.
Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker.
Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.
That makes a lot more sense.Treantmonk2009-12-22T03:45:04ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIJames Jacobs (Creative Director)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#102009-12-22T03:38:08Z2009-12-22T03:38:08Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Abraham spalding wrote:</div><blockquote> Camel's also have a ranged touch attack ability to sicken without save throw according to the druid's animal companion list. That is one reason I would actually summon one. It's one of the earliest "ability/debuff" creatures in the game, especially with a decent chance of success, and the ability to keep it up and alive. </blockquote><p>Personally... I kinda wish that ability hadn't gone in. It feels a little bit too "meta." Would an aboleth or a xorn or a giant spider or another camel or an air elemental REALLY be sickened by being spit on by a camel? It's a bit too "cute" for my tastes. We WILL need to support this attack in Bestiary II, I guess, when it comes out, but I'll be pushing to put in some additional language there to limit the sickened effect to other humanoids.Abraham spalding wrote:Camel's also have a ranged touch attack ability to sicken without save throw according to the druid's animal companion list. That is one reason I would actually summon one. It's one of the earliest "ability/debuff" creatures in the game, especially with a decent chance of success, and the ability to keep it up and alive.
Personally... I kinda wish that ability hadn't gone in. It feels a little bit too "meta." Would an aboleth or a xorn or a giant spider or another...James Jacobs (Creative Director)2009-12-22T03:38:08ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIAbraham spaldinghttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#92014-02-20T18:20:33Z2009-12-22T03:13:59Z<p>Camel's also have a ranged touch attack ability to sicken without save throw according to the druid's animal companion list. That is one reason I would actually summon one. It's one of the earliest "ability/debuff" creatures in the game, especially with a decent chance of success, and the ability to keep it up and alive.</p>Camel's also have a ranged touch attack ability to sicken without save throw according to the druid's animal companion list. That is one reason I would actually summon one. It's one of the earliest "ability/debuff" creatures in the game, especially with a decent chance of success, and the ability to keep it up and alive.Abraham spalding2009-12-22T03:13:59ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Giant Lizard: Summon Nature's Ally IIIJames Jacobs (Creative Director)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2k6lj?Giant-Lizard-Summon-Natures-Ally-III#82012-09-26T21:06:52Z2009-12-22T03:05:50Z<p>Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.</p>
<p>Errata is:</p>
<p>Change <b>Giant Lizard</b> to <b>Monitor Lizard</b>. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)</p>
<p>Change <b>Riding Dog</b> to <b>Dog</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, drone</b> to <b>Ant, worker</b>. </p>
<p>Change <b>Ant, soldier</b> to <b>Ant, giant</b>.</p>
<p>The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from miscommunication between what was and wasn't changing with these animals in the switchover between the 3.5 Monster Manual and the Pathfinder Bestiary.</p>
<p>A few other notes:</p>
<p>The Giant Frilled Lizard is so much tougher than a bison or an ape because it's something that probably would HUNT bisons or apes. It'd be best to compare the giant frilled lizard ecologically wise to a tiger or bear; it's a top-tier predator.</p>
<p>Camels will be in the Bestiary II. If you need stats before then, though, they'll be VERY similar to the stats for a horse, except they'll have some sort of long-term go without water ability.</p>Ugh... while we tried our best to make sure the Summon Monster lists were accurate, there is obviously some errors.
Errata is:
Change Giant Lizard to Monitor Lizard. (The lists don't support summoning a giant frilled lizard, but you could probably add them to summon monster V or summon nature's ally V.)
Change Riding Dog to Dog.
Change Ant, drone to Ant, worker.
Change Ant, soldier to Ant, giant.
The majority of these errors, I suspect, came from miscommunication between what was and...James Jacobs (Creative Director)2009-12-22T03:05:50Z