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I trust the show's producers. I haven't read the books, but so far the pacing, plot development and ratio of action to quiter, dialogue scenes has been just about perfect.
As has been said before (about this and other successful book adaptations) what works well in books often does not translate effectively to film. Producers have to change things up, trim portions and tighten up plot threads in order to make books work in film, which is, afterall, an entirely different medium.
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I have mixed feelings about the adaptation.
One one hand, some stuff has worked really well, like the inclusion of Hardhome in Jon's storyline, or the alterations to Dany's plot.
On the other hand, Dorne was absolutely terrible. They shucked out the existing plotline down there, and instead produced one that is terrible and silly that ultimately has no payoff.
I thought they were going to have the sandsnake seduce/blackmail bron into killing the princess.
Re dorne: It had more Bron, which I can't complain about.
The other martel plots went nowhere: they're prime material to be cut. Even in the books with its in depth exposition and multitides of extra characters the other prince (or some purple eyed imposter that thinks he is) is a bit of a butt pull
You have to do SOMETHING with the actor. While dorn was very lackluster (until the very end anyway) sending jamie to deal with the riverlands plot would have been just as boring, and he seems to have learned the same lesson about acting like a human being (until the end anyway...)
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IF I was going to include Dorne...
I would have cut the Sand Snakes completely. Introduce Arianne as Trystane's older sister who is in line with the throne. Keep the plot to crown Myrcella queen of Westeros, and have it orchestrated by Arianne and Ellaria.
Have Jaimie be sent down with Bronn to keep Myrcella safe (and remove Jaimie from meddling with Cersei). Have Jaimie and Bron attempt to rescue Myrcella, with Ellaria killing or maiming Myrcella in the process.
End season 5 in Dorne with Doran berating Arianne, only to reveal to her he has been actually working with Varys the entire time, and that they are plotting to bring Dany across and declare their support for her
Doing so has several benefits:
Jaimie and Bron still have something to do, and it doesn't involve them ninja-ing in and out of Dorne, which even Bron says is a stupid plot.
You get to keep the whole "first born" rule of Dorne, and introduce a powerful female character. Given the grief the show has gotten, the fact that they cut this out seems a move to make the show even further misogynistic...
Actually makes Dorne seem relevant. Dorne is likely to be a major factor in the upcoming Westeros wars...the fact that we got no hint of it in the season finale reduces the Dorne plotline to a sideplot that went nowhere.
Actually reduces cast! Two of three sandsnakes had zero development, while a third had marginal at best. Getting one new character who actually has room for development is better than three new characters who serve as wallpaper
IF I was going to include Dorne...
I would have cut the Sand Snakes completely. Introduce Arianne as Trystane's older sister who is in line with the throne. Keep the plot to crown Myrcella queen of Westeros, and have it orchestrated by Arianne and Ellaria.
Have Jaimie be sent down with Bronn to keep Myrcella safe (and remove Jaimie from meddling with Cersei). Have Jaimie and Bron attempt to rescue Myrcella, with Ellaria killing or maiming Myrcella in the process.
End season 5 in Dorne with Doran berating Arianne, only to reveal to her he has been actually working with Varys the entire time, and that they are plotting to bring Dany across and declare their support for her
Doing so has several benefits:
Jaimie and Bron still have something to do, and it doesn't involve them ninja-ing in and out of Dorne, which even Bron says is a stupid plot.You get to keep the whole "first born" rule of Dorne, and introduce a powerful female character. Given the grief the show has gotten, the fact that they cut this out seems a move to make the show even further misogynistic...
Actually makes Dorne seem relevant. Dorne is likely to be a major factor in the upcoming Westeros wars...the fact that we got no hint of it in the season finale reduces the Dorne plotline to a sideplot that went nowhere.
Actually reduces cast! Two of three sandsnakes had zero development, while a third had marginal at best. Getting one new character who actually has room for development is better than three new characters who serve as wallpaper
All fair points but it remains to be seen if these plot points are developed further next season so I am reserving judgment as to whether Dorne this season was a waste. If they return there and hit these plot points, or develop something new and interesting next season, I can live with what happened this season as a developmental phase of introducing Dorne.
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Jon wargs into Wun Wun or into an ice dragon
Jon wargs into Wun Wun or into an ice dragon
Warging into a person is HARD. Varymir sixskins was an absurdly powerful and trained warg who was strong enough to push other wargs out of their own personal animal. When the woman he was trying to take over fought back, mentally, HE lost.
Bran can take over hodor because 1) Bran is as far above wargs as wargs are above regular people. AND 2) Hodor isn't all that much brighter than ghost.
Besides not speaking common, Wun wun (at least in the show) seems to be as smart as anyone else.. smarter even. He was using fire against the wights, and made a fairly orderly retreat into the ocean at the right time.
I have a question. The swords the iron throne is made up of, what type of metal are they?
I have a question. The swords the iron throne is made up of, what type of metal are they?
Assuming that most swords in westeros are like those in the real world, they would be made of non stainless steel (carbon +iron). Modern steel has a bit of chromium in it, which prevents rust but takes out the flexibility a thin piece of metal needs to hit another sword or chunk of armor and not shatter.
So yes, that thing should require a serious amount of oiling (which should itself require a lot of bandages on peasants)
I just had this crazy thought that it might be made of Valyrian steel and they could be melted down and reforged the steel into weapons (like they did with Ice) and give the South a large number of weapons to fight the walkers.
I just had this crazy thought that it might be made of Valyrian steel and they could be melted down and reforged the steel into weapons (like they did with Ice) and give the South a large number of weapons to fight the walkers.
Unfortunately no.
Tywin lanister had trouble buying one. Noble houses pass them down from generation to generation and he couldn't find a house willing to sell there's at a price he could afford. I think there's about 30 in the country.
also, even if you melted them down into smaller weapons, Valyrian steel is rare enough that you still wouldn't have anything like a viable stockpile of weapons to use against the White Walkers.
Better to just mine obsidian and start churning out obsidian arrowheads.
I just had this crazy thought that it might be made of Valyrian steel and they could be melted down and reforged the steel into weapons (like they did with Ice) and give the South a large number of weapons to fight the walkers.Unfortunately no.
Tywin lanister had trouble buying one. Noble houses pass them down from generation to generation and he couldn't find a house willing to sell there's at a price he could afford. I think there's about 30 in the country.
And what better way to show the power and wealth of the king than him sitting on a pile of it?
Like I said, it was a crazy thought.
It's worth noting that the Iron Throne in the show looks nothing like the description from the book.
What the actual iron throne looks like is this.
Kit Harrington says he won't be returning next season as Jon Snow. That may mean he's really dead. However, it wouldn't be the first time people on a show said one thing and did another.
Besides, there's a priestess of the Red God nearby. When they put their mind to it, dead people don't stay dead.
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This might be a dumb question, but ... I'm not sure why there is confusion on this. Did he die in the books? Does he get resurected by Melesandre in the books? Does he instead warg into someone/something else in the books? Obviously I've not read them, so I'm asking an honest question here.
Is the 'is he or isn't he' stuff because they've strayed far enough away from the books on this that it's up for debate now? Or maybe because this is about where things end in the ladt book?
This might be a dumb question, but ... I'm not sure why there is confusion on this. Did he die in the books? Does he get resurected by Melesandre in the books? Does he instead warg into someone/something else in the books? Obviously I've not read them, so I'm asking an honest question here.
The show has caught up to the books, and both ended the exact same way, leaving his fate up in the air in both mediums.
The books had a lot of foreshadowing for him warging into ghost.
In both shows we know that a red priest (but not melisandre) can bring back the dead, but there's a prophecy that might be about john about him comming back from the dead. (or Dadnny may have already fulfilled)
So.... ...
There's a thread up that's currently discussing conversions of ASOIF characters into Pathfinder rules. They discussion has gotten pretty interesting.
Feel free to jump in.
GRRM has made comments suggesting Jon may come back from the dead in the books, and the books have far more build up on the mystery of Jon's parentage, which suggests that he is not likely dead yet. Also the way Jon Snow's final death happens...seems to strongly suggest he is Azor Ahai (spelling?) reborn.
The comments from the producers/Kit Harrington...leave some wiggle room. They confirm he is dead (which doesn't rule out resurrection) and that Jon will be absent in season 6 (which doesn't rule out being a major character in season 7).
Although it's very possible that Kit is indeed gone for good. 5 years is a long time to be on a show, and if the actor was interested in doing more movies and not returning, they might have killed him off for good. it's a mystery right now.
I do think...if Jon stays dead it would be a pretty horrible for the show, and seriously hurt it in the long run.
Azor Ahai?
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Ice zombie killing Red God Jesus.
I believe Kit is doing Wall scenes for a possible funeral.
Weird theory: The gods of the north are real. They just happen to be that one wizard looking through the weirwoods. What if the other gods in the series are just powerful wizards, Like Rhlor looking through fires and communicating with his followers?
Well there is a lot of weird stuff. Mel clearly has something going on with her shadowbabies but also has lots of sleight of hand.
Course, she took off the instant it was clear that Stannis wasn't her destined puppet and is now looking for Jon and more people to burn. Hopefully, her scene in S6 is limited to her getting stabbed in the face by Davos.
Weird theory: The gods of the north are real. They just happen to be that one wizard looking through the weirwoods. What if the other gods in the series are just powerful wizards, Like Rhlor looking through fires and communicating with his followers?
That is interesting, if only because we've seen Bran warg into a weirwood to receive visions of the past and future. I was as interested to see that when the warlocks of Qarth gave Dany a vision of the iron throne, it was Joffrey's interior decoration, which she had no way of knowing about.
Mel seems to be a pretty unreliable prophet; every time she sees a vision of banners aflame, she assumes it means victory for the red god, whereas given the the track record in Westeros, it's just as likely that everyone's gonna die in a house fire. :P
Since Martin likes doign stories about hive-mind creatures, perhaps in the books the Children are going to use Bran to tray to draw in humanity for some reason.
Something I noticed was that the Nights king stopped at the sea. Perhaps he can't cross the domain of the sea god? I mean otherwise its not like they need to breathe or anything, they could just march into the sea and go around the wall.
the Others are fey, not undead, maybe the wall is like a polar circle ley line they can't cross
I just want to see giant ice spiders.
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Something I noticed was that the Nights king stopped at the sea. Perhaps he can't cross the domain of the sea god? I mean otherwise its not like they need to breathe or anything, they could just march into the sea and go around the wall.
Maybe they melt in water.
the Others are fey, not undead, maybe the wall is like a polar circle ley line they can't cross
Maybe everyone is wrong in assuming they want to get on the south side of the wall. Perhaps they just want to keep all the bickering humans and their treachery from infecting the far north.
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Small update, looks like 8 seasons are being made. Longest HBO series.
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Ermagherd! Germ of Threrns!
Seriously, I'm looking forward to seeing the clash between the Sparrows and Gregorstein. Also, Jon Snow has a lot of screen time for a totally dead and not coming back guy.
Heres hoping for a totally hilarious Gregorsmite on Cersei's ex-boytoy.
Although having Jamie be taken prisoner to Dany's city and the Dorne ex-beloved of Mycella finding out that Tyrion is there would be fantastic to watch for the beatdown.
After this season, GAME OF THRONES has only 13 episodes left.
Producers David Benioff and D.B. Weiss have proposed to HBO that Season 7 should consist of only seven episodes, and Season 8 of six episodes. HBO are apparently considering this plan. This would allow more time for writing and more budget, production and post-production time on each episode. Apparently Seasons 4 and 5 pushed the show's production time to breaking point, and Season 6 pushed it over breaking point with the now-standard late-season large battle/vfx sequences (they had to draft in a lot of extra resources to get it down, taking the season budget to over $100 million).
It sounds like HBO will 100% renew the show for its final two seasons in a couple of weeks, but are still negotiating how many episodes are left. It might end up being more (maybe 7 & 7 or 7 & 8). But it looks definite that we're not going to get two more 10-episode seasons.
huh...that doesn't give them a whole lot of time, but if fewer episodes means better writing and more epic-ness I am all for it. Anything to avoid a repeat of the Dorne plotline of last season.
Frankly, the show producers have already cut out so much from the books and combined or cut out so many characters that it barley resembles the books anymore.
Done get me wrong, I like the show. Any talk of cutting season length or whatever just means it will resemble the books less and less until the show is a mere bullet point highlight of the books which it already is.
DISAPPOINTED!
We already know the plot. Move plot move.
DISAPPOINTED!
We already know the plot. Move plot move.
Yep a bit of a dud that one.
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The people that watch this show for boobs should be careful of what they wish for...
The people that watch this show for boobs should be careful of what they wish for...
LOL.
