Camels vs. Horses


Legacy of Fire

Sovereign Court

We use PRPG rules Beta plus for Animal Companions (i.e. the unified rules for druids, paladins and rangers). We happen to have a druid, a paladin, and a ranger in our party, and there's been a bit of a debate about camels. LoF is a desert setting mostly, and the 3.5 SRD has some vague comments about camels "being able to go for a long time without water." We all know that in the desert, camels are better than horses in real-life, but could there be some clarifications from James or someone else at Paizo as to how to quantify, in game terms, this camel's resistance to thirst and heatstroke?

Right now, the Animal Companion Beta Plus document has the light horse. heavy horse, and camel looking like this, respectively:

Horse, light
Starting Statistics: Size Large; Speed 60 ft.; AC +4
natural armor; Attack 2 hooves (1d4*); Ability Scores
Str 14, Dex 13, Con 15, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 6; Special
Qualities low-light vision, scent. * A horse’s bite is
a treated as a secondary attack and adds only half
the horse’s Str bonus on the damage roll.
4th Level Advancement: Attack 2 hooves (1d4),
bite (1d3); Ability Scores Str +2, Con +2; Special
Qualities war trained.

Horse, heavy
Starting Statistics: Size Large; Speed 50 ft.; AC +4
natural armor; Attack 2 hooves (1d6*); Ability Scores
Str 16, Dex 13, Con 15, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 6; Special
Qualities low-light vision, scent. * A horse’s bite is
a treated as a secondary attack and adds only half
the horse’s Str bonus on the damage roll.
4th Level Advancement: Attack 2 hooves (1d6),
bite (1d4); Ability Scores Str +2, Con +2; Special
Qualities war trained.

Camel
Starting Statistics: Size Large; Speed 50 ft.; AC +1
natural armor; Attack bite* (1d4*); Ability Scores
Str 18, Dex 16, Con 14, Int 2, Wis 11, Cha 4; Special
Qualities low-light vision, scent. * A camel’s bite is
a treated as a secondary attack and adds only half
the camel’s Str bonus on the damage roll.
4th Level Advancement: Ability Scores Str +2,
Con +2.

Additional comments:
- the camel should have a greater Con to reflect its endurance.
- the higher STR of the camel is great for carrying stuff, but useless in combat due to having one bite attack at half STR as opposed to two hooves at full STR and one bite at half STR (e.g. horses)
- some wording should be included to reflect the camel's resistance to thirst, starvation, heatstrokes, etc.
- they're pack animals, so some encumbrance advantage should be given, akin to dwarves at med and heavy loads, etc.

Paizo Employee Chief Creative Officer, Publisher

Why not just give 'em the Endurance feat?

Sovereign Court

Endurance as a bonus feat for camel? excellent idea... I will run this by our DM.

The 3.5 SRD horses (light or heavy) started with the Endurance and Run feats, but none of those were bonus feats (i.e. they were purchased by virtue of the animal's 3 HD, which granted two feats).

Endurance as a bonus feat takes care of both thirst and heat checks (i.e. gives a +4 to those checks). Me likes!

Now if we could also get a "sandwalking" effect due to the camel's special foot shape (i.e. a-la-sandwalker... now that would be great!)

...wait... maybe camels should have Sandwalker, as per the Legacy of Fire Player's Guide! :)

SANDWALKER
You are at home on the shifting waves of sand.
Prerequisites: Dex 13, Con 13
Benefit: When desert terrain would reduce your overland
movement speed to 1/2 normal, you can move at 3/4 your
normal speed.
You gain a +2 bonus to Survival checks to find food and
water, and to checks to avoid getting lost in a desert.

Hmmm... Endurance as bonus feat, with Sandwalker as one of the selected feat... would make quite a good camel... :P

PS: Erik, can we get a feat that a ranger/druid/paladin can take to increase their "effective druid level" in regards to their animal companion? :)

Sovereign Court

Purple Dragon Knight wrote:
PS: Erik, can we get a feat that a ranger/druid/paladin can take to increase their "effective druid level" in regards to their animal companion? :)

Erik: could you give us a bit of spoilage on if a similar feat made it for the final PRPG version? :)

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