I like them as well and I think they are putting new, more general (i.e. not campaign tailored) traits to the August release.
Traits are awesome - there are some in Unearthed Arcana, also available here.
I'd love to get the trait system into the final RPG rules. If they DO show up in there, though, they'll probably just be the 40 basic traits.
Please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please please.
*bribes with cookies*
I'd love to get the trait system into the final RPG rules. If they DO show up in there, though, they'll probably just be the 40 basic traits.
You like traits? Why didn't you say something sooner? :)
Traits are awesome - there are some in Unearthed Arcana, also available here.
I'd say the Pathfinder traits are rather different Lilith - no drawback on these. That said, you could take the Unearthed ones and for *most* of them, just take the benefit. Some, like the school specialization one and Quick would be far too powerful without the drawback.
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Good point regarding the difference between the Paizo Traits and the Unearthed Arcana ones.
I really hope traits become part of the Pathfinder RPG though. They are such a great idea. In fact, adding Traits actually allows Feats to become more what they were meant to be, in my opinion. Some current Feats, particulary newer ones in various books, seem underpowered and feel like a 'waste' of a Feat. Now, in looking over Traits, some of these lower powered Feats really make much better sense as Traits.
Did that make sense ... ?
Some current Feats, particulary newer ones in various books, seem underpowered and feel like a 'waste' of a Feat. Now, in looking over Traits, some of these lower powered Feats really make much better sense as Traits.
Did that make sense ... ?
Yes, and one I agree with.
More importantly, I think traits are a good way to introduce some roleplaying into the game (weird!) and is particularly helpful with beginning gamers. :)
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I like the fact traits allow you to do things that are cool (or at least, that I think are cool) without costing you a feat (even assuming there was a similar feat in the first place).
For example, I often find the list of class skills too limiting. So my D&D sorcerer can bluff, but what if I'd rather be a diplomat or an information gatherer instead?
The trait gives me the class skill I want, and the fluff also provides a ready answer to the question "So how come you're so good at this, when most sorcerers aren't very diplomatic?"
They are a very good idea.
Creative Director
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The adopted trait allows you to take Racial traits from a different race...but I don't see any racial traits?
You will. The first batch of racial traits appears in the second Pathfinder Companion, "Elves of Golarion." We'll eventually do racial traits for all the PC races, including the various human ethnicities. Most all of the traits will be appearing in the Pathfinder Companions, in fact.
So: While currently, the Adopted trait is pretty useless, but as time goes on it'll grow.
I would like to see them in the core rules, be nice
I am pro traits. Any way to individualize a character, traits, talents, feats etc etc etc I am for
yeah I am not hopeful to see them as space is gonna be hard as is, would be nice but if nothing else they make a nice addition to a later book.
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I would like to see them in the core rules, be niceThere's not going to be room in the Pathfinder RPG core rules for traits, I fear. I'll see what I can do... but the book's already super jam-packed as it is.
snif i agree aweb enhancementwould be great if they can't go in... or take out the monk that would make space enough :D
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Creative Director
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There's not going to be room in the Pathfinder RPG core rules for traits, I fear. I'll see what I can do... but the book's already super jam-packed as it is.Web enhancement, eh?
Please?
I'll see what I can do. But like I say every time requests for web enhancements come along... it's important to remember that the only time saved with a web enhancement at the production end is time spent printing and actually transporting the product. Those are things we don't do at Paizo anyway, so to us, creating a web enhancement is just as difficult and time consuming as producing a print product. As it works out, it's actually MORE difficult, since our schedules currently don't allocate resources to web enhancements, so they almost always mean that we end up working long hours to get them done. And when what's already on the schedule equates to long hours... the prospect of creating a web enhancement becomes even more demoralizing and exhausting.
That said, I do want to snip out the basic rules for feats from the Second Darkness Player's Guide and make them into their own PDF that folk can download. I hope to have that up and live to correspond to the release of the Legacy of Fire adventure path's launch. They'll still be 3.5 of course (since Legacy of Fire is 3.5), but once we switch to PF RPG I'd like to update that PDF to the new rules.
Whether or not there'll be time do do so... I won't know for many months.
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ok :)
its good enough for us that you try to have them around, traits anexcellentdevelopment
but indeed its understood the complexity of the of the job tobe done... for that thanks... and doublethatif its gets done :D
in the time being... i will keep using the ones in Second Darkenss Companion :D
PS: still... are yousure we can't cut the monk for the traits? :D :P
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Creative Director
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ok :)
its good enough for us that you try to have them around, traits anexcellentdevelopmentbut indeed its understood the complexity of the of the job tobe done... for that thanks... and doublethatif its gets done :D
in the time being... i will keep using the ones in Second Darkenss Companion :D
PS: still... are yousure we can't cut the monk for the traits? :D :P
HA! Yeah, I'm sure. If I were to cut ANYthing for traits, it'd probably be the paladin and dwarves. And then I'd be run out of town by a mob of torch-bearing dwarven paladins.
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Some current Feats, particulary newer ones in various books, seem underpowered and feel like a 'waste' of a Feat. Now, in looking over Traits, some of these lower powered Feats really make much better sense as Traits.
Did that make sense ... ?
Yes, and one I agree with.
More importantly, I think traits are a good way to introduce some roleplaying into the game (weird!) and is particularly helpful with beginning gamers. :)
YYYYYEEEEEESSSSSSSSSSS
Agree 100% In fact Traits have become VERY popular in our group. ANd for underpowered feats, Traits makes a perfect place for them to be.
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HA! Yeah, I'm sure. If I were to cut ANYthing for traits, it'd probably be the paladin and dwarves. And then I'd be run out of town by a mob of torch-bearing dwarven paladins.Eh, they run slow. I'd put 200 quatloo on you.
yes
but they don't get tired, they are unrelentless and have mounts :Ppoint taken... snif
yes
but they don't get tired, they are unrelentless and have mounts :Ppoint taken... snif
... I think that I would use either "unrelenting" or just "relentless", otherwise one risks saying the opposite of what one means, possibly by use of a word which doesn't even exist. :)
(Sorry, but I couldn't let that bit of vocabulary/spelling go unremarked!)
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yes
but they don't get tired, they are relentless and have mounts :Ppoint taken... snif
... I think that I would use either "unrelenting" or just "relentless", otherwise one risks saying the opposite of what one means, possibly by use of a word which doesn't even exist. :)
(Sorry, but I couldn't let that bit of vocabulary/spelling go unremarked!)
lol no worries
and you use the same avatar as an old friend who does the same... :Pbut he is more acid about it
thanks for the remark
either way the dwarven paladin are goint to get at Jacobs and pummel him until he ads them again... followed by theother races paladins :P
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I would like to see them in the core rules, be niceThere's not going to be room in the Pathfinder RPG core rules for traits, I fear. I'll see what I can do... but the book's already super jam-packed as it is.
Just a few pages, James, just a few more pages......or a Trait Rule Supplement... or..ahhh, I guess you'll find a way.
Seriously, Traits are really a good addition. Especially if there would be something that would go in the direction of "Childhood Traits".
For the last couple of years we have used something named "Childhood Skills" and "Childhood Feats" in my Campaign as house rules. The reason for this was that feats and Skills for beginning Classes are always selected with the Class in mind (or future Prestige Classes), never for giving color to a character. I always missed that none of the available Skills and Feats (and allowed Points for skills and feats)never allowed for any childhood experience. Thus we decided to give 2 more Skillpoints (must be placed in ONE Skill) and one additional Feat to beginning Characters. Only rule here: The chosen Skill and Feat should be chosen without the Character Class in mind, i.e the skill and feat chosen should not be a class skill for the chosen class. (For Example: Hide or run would be allowed as Childhood-skill/feat for a Wizard but not for a Rogue and should fit into the characters background history. The fledgling wizard needed to hide from his peers due to his affinity to "weird" magic or his mates would have ridiculed him or even gave him a beating when the villages price cow did not give any more milk).
Of course Rogues and Bards had a hard time designing or choosing a childhood skill, since their list of class skills covers almost the whole list. And almost always people tried to circumvent the "no immediate use to Beginners Class" Rule. Exceptions to that rule have only been made when a Player came up with a really good background story which gave a perfect AND genial reason as to why that "prohibited" skill/feat should be allowed. (Sometimes they tended to give me lots of beer or stronger drink before popping the question....eventually I noticed their intend, so nowadays I refuse Character Creation Discussions during and immediately after parties. And unfortunately that decreased the "free drink for George" orders in our local bar.....
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Seriously, Traits are really a good addition.
Ditto! Love the Traits, and am looking forward to seeing more of them :D
For the last couple of years we have used something named "Childhood Skills" and "Childhood Feats" in my Campaign as house rules.
I'm planning on trying out something similar in my game:
At the DM's discretion, a player may choose to select one Background Feat for his or her character, instead of the usual Character Traits. This Background Feat is in addition to the normal bonus feat for Human characters.
A Background Feat is any feat which is untyped, has no prerequisite, and does not affect or otherwise depend on an ability granted by the character's first class level. This means that Combat Feats, Metamagic Feats, and Item Creation feats, as well as feats such as Augment Summoning (which is untyped, but has a prerequisite) and Improved Counterspell (which is untyped and has no prerequisite, but affects an ability available only to spellcasters), may not be chosen at character creation as Background Feats.
Below is the complete list of feats from the Pathfinder RPG Beta rules which may be chosen as Background Feats. Additional feats may be added to this list, with DM approval, from other Pathfinder RPG or D&D 3.5 rules supplements.
Alertness
Animal Affinity
Armor Proficiency, Light
Athletic
Deceitful
Deft Hands
Endurance
Great Fortitude
Iron Will
Lightning Reflexes
Magical Aptitude
Martial Weapon Proficiency
Persuasive
Run
Self-Sufficient
Shield Proficiency
Simple Weapon Proficiency
Skill Focus
Stealthy
Toughness