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RPG Superstar 2015

Sinister Adventures LLC - Nick Logue's New Gaming Company


D&D 3.5/d20/OGL

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Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as a favorite.

If you listen REALLY hard, you can actually hear the folks at Paizo staff mulling over if it's time to just lock this thread ....


If they do, they would be doing these boards a favour. It's a venomous, stinky thread, it is.

Sovereign Court

It's useful for those of us waiting for refunds or news.

Sovereign Court

Brian E. Harris wrote:


Back at you. Stop defending theft.

Brian,

Spoiler:

I work in credit and debt collection, and i do not condone theft of any kind. I have now over ten years in this job.

I have initiated several lawsuits against bad payers for my employers, with often much better files than what we have here. I mean, I had a lot of evidence, and the target was solvent.

The short thing is : unless the amount is enormous, and you are willing to spend a fortune on one of the few good lawyers around ... you will be disappointed. A lot.

So now, I always try to solve a dispute peacefully, and I avoid intimidation as much as I can because, when dealing with companies, that is largely bluff.

Of course I am not happy about this, but I can't do much more than rant against Justice in general.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Robert Hawkshaw wrote:
It's useful for those of us waiting for refunds or news.

Exactly - and we are willing to wait and keep hoping that something will be resolved. Yes, we gripe and complain now and again, but still we hope for some type of news or a resolution.

To Sissyl - here's an idea - why not lock YOURSELF out of this thread and leave the rest of us "whiners" alone? How about that?

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32 , Star Voter 2013, Star Voter 2014

Sissyl wrote:
If they do, they would be doing these boards a favour. It's a venomous, stinky thread, it is.

Yeah, and it's mother dresses it funny, too!

Wait...

What are we talking about?


Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber
Stereofm wrote:

Brian,

** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
Not advocating legal proceedings at this point (others brought that up, not me). My bigger issue is with people with suspicious motives defending someone who has absconded with people's money, or those telling the victims of this scenario that they need to "get over" having been screwed.

Whoa... "people with suspicious motives"? There is nothing suspicious about them. I have been entirely honest about it. I think it's a shame you guys can't move on, and worse that you even now can't refrain from calling Nick a villain.

As I said: It's been years. It's not money you needed for food. It's not even massive amounts of money. Time to let go of the anger.

Liberty's Edge

I think the biggest question I keep asking myself is why doesn't Nick take up one of the offers to turn over the project?

It seems obvious that, for whatever reason, he is unwilling or unable to complete it himself. More than one reputable company has obviously contacted him with offers to take the thing off his hands, finish it and make everyone happy.

It seems like a win-win for everyone, yet he apparently is unwilling or unable to take any of theses companies up on the offers. From the sounds of it, he doesn't even reply to the offers. That just seems ... odd.

To me, this is the single strangest aspect of the whole, sorted, messy situation.

Does anyone have any insight on why Nick will not or can not sign over the thing to someone else and wash his hands of the whole situation? Seems like he would welcome the chance to get out from under what has been a huge weight for him.

Full disclosure - I did not pre order and have no money involved that needs refunded. I'm really just interested as an RPG fan who was a big fan of Logue's work and can't figure out what the heck is going on!


Actually, at this point, the only pressure that anyone can put on Nick is to hold his character up for scrutiny. If threads like this can keep Nick from working in the RPG community again, should he ever choose to, until he fixes the situation then that is appropriate to me. He put himself in this situation, nobody forced it on him. His bad choices have tarnished his reputation.

Now if he ever gets things fixed up, by putting out the product and fulfilling the orders or paying back the customers' preorders, and people are still gripping at that point, I will agree it is time to grow up. But this situation is still unresolved, and pressure should be kept up until it is.

Honestly, the only solution I could imagine at this point is another company purchasing the IP and products and put them out. Nick being payed enough to repay all the preorders with perhaps no profit for himself ultimately. And that other company producing them where everyone has to get in line over again to purchase them.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Marc Radle wrote:

I think the biggest question I keep asking myself is why doesn't Nick take up one of the offers to turn over the project?

It seems obvious that, for whatever reason, he is unwilling or unable to complete it himself. More than one reputable company has obviously contacted him with offers to take the thing off his hands, finish it and make everyone happy.

It seems like a win-win for everyone, yet he apparently is unwilling or unable to take any of theses companies up on the offers. From the sounds of it, he doesn't even reply to the offers. That just seems ... odd.

To me, this is the single strangest aspect of the whole, sorted, messy situation.

Does anyone have any insight on why Nick will not or can not sign over the thing to someone else and wash his hands of the whole situation? Seems like he would welcome the chance to get out from under what has been a huge weight for him.

Full disclosure - I did not pre order and have no money involved that needs refunded. I'm really just interested as an RPG fan who was a big fan of Logue's work and can't figure out what the heck is going on!

Not that I am aware of, perhaps people that know him as friends outside of the industry like Pett might, but if anyone does they are not talking as far as I know.


I'm with Marc - why doesn't Nick sell out and let the product be produced by someone else? Maybe he can't for some reason, or maybe it's not as simple as it seems from a layman's point of view.

I just wish Nick would come on these boards and "man up" for what he has done or failed to do. Take responsibility for taking our money and not producing a product as promised. Take the heat, the verbal accusations, the venomous retorts...and then apologize for cheating all of us who pre-paid for RC. Hell, that would go a long way in my eyes for some redemption.

Own up, man up, and apologize.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32 , Star Voter 2013, Star Voter 2014

Dark_Mistress wrote:
Not that I am aware of, perhaps people that know him as friends outside of the industry like Pett might, but if anyone does they are not talking as far as I know.

Nor would you expect them to. Hypothetically, if something like an illness or personal issues was keeping from finishing this, that is none of their business and I wouldn't expect them to come around peddling gossip about one of their friends.


It was resolved quite a while ago. None of us just know what happened. At this point, it is pretty clear that things are not going to change.

So yeah, it's resolved by now. Calling him names to KEEP HIM AWAY FROM THE RPG INDUSTRY is not likely to improve anything, is it now?


Sissyl wrote:

It was resolved quite a while ago. None of us just know what happened. At this point, it is pretty clear that things are not going to change.

So yeah, it's resolved by now. Calling him names to KEEP HIM AWAY FROM THE RPG INDUSTRY is not likely to improve anything, is it now?

Really, what was the resolution? Did he put out a statement that he was telling everyone else that hasn't got their refund that they were out of luck? I missed that. In fact people who show up on this thread asking, "Has anyone heard anything lately?" Also seemed to have missed this announcement. Can you provide a link to somewhere the announcement is posted?

Scarab Sages

Dumping on the guy does no good. I've been collecting from small presses for years and once in awhile something like this happens. I've lost a couple hundred dollars in that span. In a couple of cases, the authors took things into their own hands and sent me copies of their book. (And in one case, the author will send me a copy of his novel as soon as he can get the rights back. He had to take the publisher to court.)

You can sue, but the legal costs just aren't worth it.

In several other cases, the only recourse left was to warn others. This looks like one of those cases. If you can get your money back, good for you. If Nick comes on here and explains himself, that would be a bit better. But I wouldn't bet on it.

Just take the lose. Moan and groan about it all you like, but after awhile it does get old.


Sissyl wrote:

It was resolved quite a while ago. None of us just know what happened. At this point, it is pretty clear that things are not going to change.

So yeah, it's resolved by now. Calling him names to KEEP HIM AWAY FROM THE RPG INDUSTRY is not likely to improve anything, is it now?

Ya mean this "resolution" from Nick?

nick wrote:

sorry the site is out of action! I am having some trouble getting it up and running and I'm also updating it for the endgame of Sinister as a sinking ship with just two products (and one wave of Indulgences left to come).

Those concerned about refunds - just email me at loguen@essex.ac.uk and I'll process those for you as quickly as possible - I'm slowly slogging my way through them all, but its a load of looking up order histories so its taking longer than I would have liked. Sorry for the delays on the repays! Shoot me an email and I will sort you all out! No refund left behind!

or did you mean this one:

nick wrote:
Terribly sorry! Not sure why I haven't received these requests for reimbursements. Please try the following email and I'll process any refunds IMMEDIATELY (or at least within 24 hours).

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Guys, stop picking on each other, please.

I'd hate to have to close this thread because of people sniping at each other.

That way no one would have an official place to snipe about Sinister anymore, and that would be unfortunate.


Hmmm, probably right. It is better to keep the sniping here than get new threads. Ah well, I have said what I intended to say.

Dark Archive

I think the anger and frustration is really all about Nick failing to come out with a definite statement on Razor Coast.

So Nick, can you please post something here to definitely (100%) put to rest the issues of refund and actual publication of Razor Coast?


Radavel wrote:

I think the anger and frustration is really all about Nick failing to come out with a definite statement on Razor Coast.

So Nick, can you please post something here to definitely (100%) put to rest the issues of refund and actual publication of Razor Coast?

Do you really believe that Nick actually reads this messageboard anymore?

Dark Archive

Pual wrote:
Radavel wrote:

I think the anger and frustration is really all about Nick failing to come out with a definite statement on Razor Coast.

So Nick, can you please post something here to definitely (100%) put to rest the issues of refund and actual publication of Razor Coast?

Do you really believe that Nick actually reads this messageboard anymore?

It's a forlorn hope, I know. But I felt the need to put it on record.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Radavel wrote:
Pual wrote:
Radavel wrote:

I think the anger and frustration is really all about Nick failing to come out with a definite statement on Razor Coast.

So Nick, can you please post something here to definitely (100%) put to rest the issues of refund and actual publication of Razor Coast?

Do you really believe that Nick actually reads this messageboard anymore?
It's a forlorn hope, I know. But I felt the need to put it on record.

I imagine he does. Curiosity on what's being said alone would likely cause him to check in once in a while. Posting though is another matter. But I imagine he lurks from time to time

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Cards, Companion, Maps, Modules, Pawns, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber
Black Fang wrote:

I don't want my pre-order money back. I want a PFRPG copy (print and pdf) of Razor Coast.

I'm patient and willing to wait.

I'm sorry, but I can wait no longer as I have lost faith the four items (totaling $90.96) I preordered will see the light of day.

In the event they do, I will most likely purchase them, but until then, I would like my money returned.

I have sent an e-mail to Nick asking that.

...

Nick, be well.

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

I actually gave up about 40 hours of my time to proofread the thing and I'm well fed up with the broken promises. Definitely this summer hasn't happened either, and absolutely no word.

The money - I've long forgotten about it. I'd have billed $500 for 40 hours of proofreading if it was a real job.

The lack of contact, feedback... everything. Inexcusable, and very sad. Back when Nick was in the zone, he was a great guy, full of good ideas and fun mails. This last year or ... two? Not the same.

Dark Archive

Cut loss on this one.

No more purchases ever from this source.

The Exchange

Justin Sluder wrote:

In the event they do, I will most likely purchase them, but until then, I would like my money returned.

I have sent an e-mail to Nick asking that.

...

Nick, be well.

Good luck with that Justin as I've not had a response to the email I sent 2-3 months ago.

Dark Archive

Radavel wrote:

Cut loss on this one.

No more purchases ever from this source.

I think the problem is exactly that one: the source is gone.

Shadow Lodge

0gre wrote:
hogarth wrote:
Well, "Duke Nukem Forever" is due out in May, so Razor Coast should come out a few weeks before that.
It's now a race.

Duke won.


Kthulhu wrote:
0gre wrote:
hogarth wrote:
Well, "Duke Nukem Forever" is due out in May, so Razor Coast should come out a few weeks before that.
It's now a race.
Duke won.

Hail to the king, baby.


Kthulhu wrote:
0gre wrote:
hogarth wrote:
Well, "Duke Nukem Forever" is due out in May, so Razor Coast should come out a few weeks before that.
It's now a race.
Duke won.

That is so sad.


Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game, Tales Subscriber
carborundum wrote:

I actually gave up about 40 hours of my time to proofread the thing and I'm well fed up with the broken promises. Definitely this summer hasn't happened either, and absolutely no word.

The money - I've long forgotten about it. I'd have billed $500 for 40 hours of proofreading if it was a real job.

The lack of contact, feedback... everything. Inexcusable, and very sad. Back when Nick was in the zone, he was a great guy, full of good ideas and fun mails. This last year or ... two? Not the same.

Yeah, me too man.

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

At least I get to laugh when I read your session summaries, Ernest :-)

And my summoner based on your malconvoker is almost level six now and kicking major butt in the Shackled City :-)

Sovereign Court Contributor

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Ernest, carborundum: for what its worth (not much, obviously), let me say again how much I appreciate you joining me in putting out our all for this. It's very disappointing to say the least...


My Razor Coast Campaign hit sixth level...wonder how i did it without the product! :)


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

With Nick slated to appear at PaizoCon this year, will there be any closure on this, or at least some answers?

Shadow Lodge

Anyone wanna put down money on whether or not his appearance is cancel...er...indefinately delayed?

:P

Too soon?

Dark Archive

I don't really care if he makes an appearance.

I am very disappointed in his handling of this fiasco.


ghettowedge wrote:
With Nick slated to appear at PaizoCon this year, will there be any closure on this, or at least some answers?

You're kidding, right? He's got money for airfare, hotel, and expenses...but he can't pay people he owes for the work on this project, much less refund the pre-orders, or release the damn thing! He ought to be ashamed to show his face until he makes amends.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
hedgeknight wrote:
ghettowedge wrote:
With Nick slated to appear at PaizoCon this year, will there be any closure on this, or at least some answers?
You're kidding, right? He's got money for airfare, hotel, and expenses...but he can't pay people he owes for the work on this project, much less refund the pre-orders, or release the damn thing! He ought to be ashamed to show his face until he makes amends.

Hedgeknight, you should probably take a look at this thread.

Marathon Voter 2013

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Campaign Setting, Companion, Roleplaying Game Subscriber

You guys are aware that there's a system in place to get your refunds, right? Go over to the Compatible Products forums if not.


You're right Mothman > wish I had seen that thread before I ranted on Nic...yet again. :)
His apology sounds quite sincere...and that's all I want. Just man up and own up.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

No worries hedgeknight, figured you hadn't seen it.

Really, I think that is all a lot of people were wanting, an explaination and an apology, I'm glad that Nick has found himself in a place where he can do that.


Me too - sounds like he went through some pretty hard times. And that takes a man awhile to crawl out of.

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 32

Amen.


Tbats a lot of posts...


Thanks for the post Mothman - I had no idea that there had been closure.

I very much liked what I had seen, and am sorry that the company failed.

The Auld Grump


I read somewhere that Razor Coast may become a Kickstarter project later in the year...any truth to that?

Shadow Lodge Marathon Voter 2013, Marathon Voter 2014

hedgeknight wrote:
I read somewhere that Razor Coast may become a Kickstarter project later in the year...any truth to that?

There's a few mentions of it over in the other thread(s). But that's all I've heard.

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