paizo.com Recent Posts in The Shroud of Old Soulspaizo.com Recent Posts in The Shroud of Old Souls2012-11-15T19:41:22Z2012-11-15T19:41:22ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsChad Pattersonhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#352007-12-03T22:16:00Z2007-12-03T22:15:59Z<p>Like a lot of other posters, I immediately conjured up thoughts of the Shroud of Turin as I read this. I agree with at least one other poster that this particular item might work best as a plot device. In any case, it's got a cool mysterious vibe. I dig it.</p>
<p>Chad</p>Like a lot of other posters, I immediately conjured up thoughts of the Shroud of Turin as I read this. I agree with at least one other poster that this particular item might work best as a plot device. In any case, it's got a cool mysterious vibe. I dig it.
ChadChad Patterson2007-12-03T22:15:59ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsCastleMikehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#342007-12-02T21:05:32Z2007-12-02T21:04:04Z<p>This is a very creative and very interesting item and I am looking forward to the country submission. </p>
<p>I appear to be playing in comparatively low magic games and am curious at what levels it would normally start turning up as treasure in other player's games? Thanks.</p>This is a very creative and very interesting item and I am looking forward to the country submission.
I appear to be playing in comparatively low magic games and am curious at what levels it would normally start turning up as treasure in other player's games? Thanks.CastleMike2007-12-02T21:04:04ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsMatrissa the Enchantresshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#332007-12-02T07:45:15Z2007-12-02T07:45:15Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Matrissa the Enchantress wrote:</div><blockquote>Now I can't decide whether I like this or <a href="http://paizo.com/rpgsuperstar/round1/chartsOfTheShadowVoyage" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"><i>Charts of the Shadow Voyage</i></a> better...</blockquote><p>After due consideration, I decided that the charts win me over a bit more so this ended up in the third position on my list of personal favourites.
<p>And, as such I fully expect to see great things in your country submission Neil. :-D</p>
<p>:-j(enni)</p>Matrissa the Enchantress wrote:Now I can't decide whether I like this or Charts of the Shadow Voyage better...
After due consideration, I decided that the charts win me over a bit more so this ended up in the third position on my list of personal favourites. And, as such I fully expect to see great things in your country submission Neil. :-D
:-j(enni)Matrissa the Enchantress2007-12-02T07:45:15ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsMatrissa the Enchantresshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#322007-12-02T05:17:24Z2007-12-02T05:17:23Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">French Wolf wrote:</div><blockquote>..words fail me its that bloody good.</blockquote><p>Couldn't have said it more aptly.
<p>Now I can't decide whether I like this or <a href="http://paizo.com/rpgsuperstar/round1/chartsOfTheShadowVoyage" target="_blank" rel="nofollow"><i>Charts of the Shadow Voyage</i></a> better...</p>
<p>Awesome item. I can't wait to read up on your country.</p>
<p>:-j(enni)</p>French Wolf wrote:..words fail me its that bloody good.
Couldn't have said it more aptly. Now I can't decide whether I like this or Charts of the Shadow Voyage better...
Awesome item. I can't wait to read up on your country.
:-j(enni)Matrissa the Enchantress2007-12-02T05:17:23ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsKnightErrantJRhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#312007-12-02T04:09:14Z2007-12-02T04:09:14Z<p>This one, while at its heart being a "utility" item, really does what a magic item should, which is, to feel like a magic item, and not just feel like a way around the standard rules. That's not to say that magic items shouldn't be about utility, or shouldn't help "bend" the rules, but the best items do this without clubbing you over the head with the idea that its all about mechanics.</p>
<p>It really does make me think of interesting ways to use the item in a campaign outside of the obvious, which I think is definitely a good thing.</p>This one, while at its heart being a "utility" item, really does what a magic item should, which is, to feel like a magic item, and not just feel like a way around the standard rules. That's not to say that magic items shouldn't be about utility, or shouldn't help "bend" the rules, but the best items do this without clubbing you over the head with the idea that its all about mechanics.
It really does make me think of interesting ways to use the item in a campaign outside of the obvious,...KnightErrantJR2007-12-02T04:09:14ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsCastleMikehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#302007-12-02T03:53:07Z2007-12-02T03:53:06Z<p>Very creative and interesting item which I have been thinking about for a few days. IMO it is a little pricey for the utility for a party of adventureres. This seems more like a plot or quest driven item in most campaigns "Recover the shroud of the missing hero" from the bad guys so it would let the players be heroic. Seems like it would see the most use in a ECS campaign where there are so few clerics able to raise dead and lots of travel time trying to track one down. </p>
<p>Just a few thoughts but if it was based on Repose and the Reincarnation spell (which will make a random body normally) and the Shroud "could be" (not necessarily would be) consumed as the material component for the future Raise Dead spell or a House Jorasco ressurection altar in ECS the price could be dropped quite a bit more particularly if a very broad, very general 30% cost reduction mechanic was applied something like (Good, devoutee of a campaign pantheon like the SH in ECS, citizen of a certan nation).</p>
<p>Looking forward to seeing your country.</p>Very creative and interesting item which I have been thinking about for a few days. IMO it is a little pricey for the utility for a party of adventureres. This seems more like a plot or quest driven item in most campaigns "Recover the shroud of the missing hero" from the bad guys so it would let the players be heroic. Seems like it would see the most use in a ECS campaign where there are so few clerics able to raise dead and lots of travel time trying to track one down.
Just a few thoughts...CastleMike2007-12-02T03:53:06ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsJoel Flankhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#292007-11-30T23:02:16Z2007-11-30T23:02:16Z<p>Wow, great item. Like others, the plot hook aspects of it are amazing, either for bringing back an ancient hero or villain.</p>Wow, great item. Like others, the plot hook aspects of it are amazing, either for bringing back an ancient hero or villain.Joel Flank2007-11-30T23:02:16ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsFrench Wolfhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#282014-02-10T19:04:04Z2007-11-30T21:35:06Z<p>I read this and spent the next few minutes thinking of ways to use it in my campaign. It is simply super.</p>
<p>The idea of bringing back a long dead evil or good is .. is ....</p>
<p>..words fail me its that bloody good.</p>I read this and spent the next few minutes thinking of ways to use it in my campaign. It is simply super.
The idea of bringing back a long dead evil or good is .. is ....
..words fail me its that bloody good.French Wolf2007-11-30T21:35:06ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsBovineMadnesshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#272007-11-30T08:26:18Z2007-11-30T08:26:17Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Mothman wrote:</div><blockquote><p> I like this item. I <i>like</i> the fact that you could, in theory (if there was a corpse) bring back a 10 000 year old dead guy. I wonder though, if there should be a disclaimer that the body must be mostly intact or something of that nature.</p>
<p></blockquote><p>Or maybe that the body must have been killed in the last 24 hours?Mothman wrote:I like this item. I like the fact that you could, in theory (if there was a corpse) bring back a 10 000 year old dead guy. I wonder though, if there should be a disclaimer that the body must be mostly intact or something of that nature.
Or maybe that the body must have been killed in the last 24 hours?BovineMadness2007-11-30T08:26:17ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsMothmanhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#262007-11-30T02:40:17Z2007-11-30T02:40:17Z<p>I like this item. I <i>like</i> the fact that you could, in theory (if there was a corpse) bring back a 10 000 year old dead guy. I wonder though, if there should be a disclaimer that the body must be mostly intact or something of that nature.</p>I like this item. I like the fact that you could, in theory (if there was a corpse) bring back a 10 000 year old dead guy. I wonder though, if there should be a disclaimer that the body must be mostly intact or something of that nature.Mothman2007-11-30T02:40:17ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsErnest Muellerhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#252007-11-30T02:36:49Z2007-11-30T02:36:49Z<p>A winner! Heck, I can think of a neat complex plot where an assassin kills someone, shrouds them, destroys the body, leaves undetected, and "sells" the shroud back to the victim's family as a form of extortion...</p>A winner! Heck, I can think of a neat complex plot where an assassin kills someone, shrouds them, destroys the body, leaves undetected, and "sells" the shroud back to the victim's family as a form of extortion...Ernest Mueller2007-11-30T02:36:49ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsTallghosthttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#242007-11-30T02:32:24Z2007-11-30T02:32:24Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Grimcleaver wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
<p>I would argue that perhaps a good amendment would be that you can drape it over a person before they die, and it would still work, hence what to do about folks who are disintegrated or buried in cave-ins and cannot be shrouded after the fact. </blockquote><p>I'm going to have to disagree with you there. I see too many players saying "Yeah what the hell, I'll just run up to the dragon and kick it in the snout. After all, I have my guy "saved" in the shroud back at HQ."
</p>
But I do like the idea of extending the powers to <i>clone</i>.</p>
<p>This is just the kind of thing that says to me "wonderous" item. Something that will come in handy in dire straits, but not really useful every day. The kind of thing you end up saying "Wow! Thank God we had that thing tucked away."</p>Grimcleaver wrote:I would argue that perhaps a good amendment would be that you can drape it over a person before they die, and it would still work, hence what to do about folks who are disintegrated or buried in cave-ins and cannot be shrouded after the fact.
I'm going to have to disagree with you there. I see too many players saying "Yeah what the hell, I'll just run up to the dragon and kick it in the snout. After all, I have my guy "saved" in the shroud back at HQ."
But I do like the...Tallghost2007-11-30T02:32:24ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsRennie Saundershttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#232007-11-30T01:20:41Z2007-11-30T01:20:40Z<p>Well thought out item. This has come up in oh so many games I've been a part of. I could even see a use for those times when your rogue has been executed and you are given the right of burial. Place him in the crypt. Take the shroud home and poof, Mr. or Ms. Hand in the Cookie Jar is back!
<br />
I look forward to seeing your city. Good luck.
<br />
Darth Frodo</p>Well thought out item. This has come up in oh so many games I've been a part of. I could even see a use for those times when your rogue has been executed and you are given the right of burial. Place him in the crypt. Take the shroud home and poof, Mr. or Ms. Hand in the Cookie Jar is back!
I look forward to seeing your city. Good luck.
Darth FrodoRennie Saunders2007-11-30T01:20:40ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsCpt_kirstovhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#222007-11-30T01:01:33Z2007-11-30T01:01:32Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Mark Brehob wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Nice item. The cost seems off though. Way too high.</p>
<p>Won't a bag of holding or portable hole do much of this?</p>
<p>Mark </blockquote><p>it would bring the body, but if you take too long and you can no longer restore them, you'll wish you had the shroudMark Brehob wrote:Nice item. The cost seems off though. Way too high.
Won't a bag of holding or portable hole do much of this?
Mark
it would bring the body, but if you take too long and you can no longer restore them, you'll wish you had the shroudCpt_kirstov2007-11-30T01:01:32ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsMark Brehobhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#212007-11-29T21:49:53Z2007-11-29T21:49:53Z<p>Nice item. The cost seems off though. Way too high.</p>
<p>Won't a bag of holding or portable hole do much of this?</p>
<p>Mark</p>Nice item. The cost seems off though. Way too high.
Won't a bag of holding or portable hole do much of this?
MarkMark Brehob2007-11-29T21:49:53ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsDungeon Grrrlhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#202007-11-29T10:57:07Z2007-11-29T10:57:06Z<p>It both seems too useful and not useful enough. which means maybe I am just hard to please. But I won't add this to my games.</p>
<p>I -might- add a one-shot artifiact that did this once, accidentally, to a major historical figure as a plot point. But never as a generic or recreatable item.</p>It both seems too useful and not useful enough. which means maybe I am just hard to please. But I won't add this to my games.
I -might- add a one-shot artifiact that did this once, accidentally, to a major historical figure as a plot point. But never as a generic or recreatable item.Dungeon Grrrl2007-11-29T10:57:06ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsThe Earl of Sandwich (alias of Michael Geib)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#192007-11-29T10:16:29Z2007-11-29T10:16:29Z<p>Very evocative...It seems like it should play a major role in a Ravenloft novel....</p>Very evocative...It seems like it should play a major role in a Ravenloft novel....The Earl of Sandwich (alias of Michael Geib)2007-11-29T10:16:29ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsCorian of Lurkshirehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#182007-11-29T10:11:20Z2007-11-29T10:09:48Z<p>It's not just a good way to bring back the ancient dead... it is a great way to have a "master tape" of a person. Say that Dude, 5th level fighter, is killed. His pals use the shroud, and Dude is back. Jump forward 15 levels, and Lord Dude is disintegrated by a villain. Now all the heroes have to do is resurrect him from the shroud.</p>
<p>The text says that it stops working only if the person is resurrected in some other way before the shroud is used.</p>It's not just a good way to bring back the ancient dead... it is a great way to have a "master tape" of a person. Say that Dude, 5th level fighter, is killed. His pals use the shroud, and Dude is back. Jump forward 15 levels, and Lord Dude is disintegrated by a villain. Now all the heroes have to do is resurrect him from the shroud.
The text says that it stops working only if the person is resurrected in some other way before the shroud is used.Corian of Lurkshire2007-11-29T10:09:48ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsHeathanssonhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#172012-11-15T18:45:18Z2007-11-29T03:58:32Z<p>This'd be a good item to bring back an evil ancient wizard from thousands of years ago.</p>This'd be a good item to bring back an evil ancient wizard from thousands of years ago.Heathansson2007-11-29T03:58:32ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsMauricio Quintanahttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#162007-11-29T03:27:50Z2007-11-29T03:27:49Z<p>I just love this item. It brings back memories of a similar one I designed for a campaign I ran a few years back, only in my version you put the body in the shroud and poof! it vanished without a trace. You needed another command word (and folding the shroud in a different way) to get the body to reappear, at which point you could bring the person back to life. </p>
<p>I would also make the modification of allowing a living person to be imprinted. Otherwise, it is just great! Congratulations!</p>I just love this item. It brings back memories of a similar one I designed for a campaign I ran a few years back, only in my version you put the body in the shroud and poof! it vanished without a trace. You needed another command word (and folding the shroud in a different way) to get the body to reappear, at which point you could bring the person back to life.
I would also make the modification of allowing a living person to be imprinted. Otherwise, it is just great! Congratulations!Mauricio Quintana2007-11-29T03:27:49ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old Soulsmythfishhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#152007-11-29T03:19:48Z2007-11-29T03:19:47Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Grimcleaver wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
The one problem I have with it is that it does away with time limits on raising the fallen character. That seems a little too powerful. You could put this over a mummy from Osirion, take it to the cleric, have raise dead cast on it and poof! Good as new guy from 10,000 years ago.
<br />
</blockquote><p>I personally like this aspect of it from a DM plot hook standpoint. "Oh no," says city leader, "we're under attack from evil forces we cannot hope to defeat! You adventurers must A) find magical shroud, B) take it to the tomb of Long-Dead Mythical Hero, and C) resurrect him so he can save us!"
<p>But another way around it might be to say the shroud has to be placed on the body soon after death, but once that's done you can resurrect whoever is imprinted in the shroud 1000 years later if you want to.</p>Grimcleaver wrote:The one problem I have with it is that it does away with time limits on raising the fallen character. That seems a little too powerful. You could put this over a mummy from Osirion, take it to the cleric, have raise dead cast on it and poof! Good as new guy from 10,000 years ago.
I personally like this aspect of it from a DM plot hook standpoint. "Oh no," says city leader, "we're under attack from evil forces we cannot hope to defeat! You adventurers must A) find magical...mythfish2007-11-29T03:19:47ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old Soulsdamnitall22https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#142007-11-29T01:53:45Z2007-11-29T01:53:45Z<p>Well I realize Turin isn't the only one. It is the one most people have heard of though. </p>
<p>Grim, I really like the before death and cloning aspect.</p>Well I realize Turin isn't the only one. It is the one most people have heard of though.
Grim, I really like the before death and cloning aspect.damnitall222007-11-29T01:53:45ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsGrimcleaverhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#132007-11-29T01:44:05Z2007-11-29T01:44:02Z<p>I love the Shroud of Turin flavor to this item. The flavor is cool and its ability is really useful. I enjoy the fact that you can lay this over your friend, give him a decent burial, and then fold up the cloth and get him raised. It's much more dignified then having to heft a gory body over your shoulder and hoof back to town. It's nicely creepy, but with kindova' ambiguous holy aire to it. I could imagine angelic whispery voices as easily as ghostly ones.</p>
<p>The one problem I have with it is that it does away with time limits on raising the fallen character. That seems a little too powerful. You could put this over a mummy from Osirion, take it to the cleric, have raise dead cast on it and poof! Good as new guy from 10,000 years ago.</p>
<p>I would argue that perhaps a good amendment would be that you can drape it over a person before they die, and it would still work, hence what to do about folks who are disintegrated or buried in cave-ins and cannot be shrouded after the fact. I also think it would be neat if the Shroud could be used as the flesh "sample" for spells like Clone. That would be cool.</p>
<p>I would still say though, one way or the other, that the time from imprint to raise attempt would be dealt with exactly as though it were an actual dead body, rather than making the corpse-impression timeless.</p>I love the Shroud of Turin flavor to this item. The flavor is cool and its ability is really useful. I enjoy the fact that you can lay this over your friend, give him a decent burial, and then fold up the cloth and get him raised. It's much more dignified then having to heft a gory body over your shoulder and hoof back to town. It's nicely creepy, but with kindova' ambiguous holy aire to it. I could imagine angelic whispery voices as easily as ghostly ones.
The one problem I have with it is...Grimcleaver2007-11-29T01:44:02ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old SoulsErik Mona (Chief Creative Officer, Publisher)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#122007-11-29T01:33:45Z2007-11-29T01:33:45Z<p>Well, Turin of course was not the only shroud, but I suspect it was at least a major part of the inspiration for this.</p>Well, Turin of course was not the only shroud, but I suspect it was at least a major part of the inspiration for this.Erik Mona (Chief Creative Officer, Publisher)2007-11-29T01:33:45ZRe: Forums: Open Call: Design a wondrous item: The Shroud of Old Soulsdamnitall22https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2hptq?The-Shroud-of-Old-Souls#112007-11-29T01:26:46Z2007-11-29T01:26:46Z<p>Huh? Shroud of Turin?? Still kinda cool.</p>Huh? Shroud of Turin?? Still kinda cool.damnitall222007-11-29T01:26:46Z