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Poll: What part of Pathfinder do you want to know more about?


Pathfinder Campaign Setting General Discussion

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Contributor

although at the moment in fantasy terms I'm in the cornfield:>

and its BAD in here:>

Ulp...


A map.

Now that I know the rough story of RotRL, and what elements are involved (goblins, giants, wizard-kings), all I need now is a map to get a sense of the geography and finish coverting the series to the setting I'll be using...


I, for one, like a change of genre once in a while.
Although I'm 80% of the time on a "fantasy RPG" mode, I like to switch to SF settings a couple of times a year (ahh, the smell of plasma burns do get your mind off those fireball blisters ...)
Anyway, I would favor having an AP "Future" once every two years, for example.
Is the Pathfinder team considering it as an option or is Paizo only comited to fantasy roleplaying ?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Foxish wrote:

A map.

Now that I know the rough story of RotRL, and what elements are involved (goblins, giants, wizard-kings), all I need now is a map to get a sense of the geography and finish coverting the series to the setting I'll be using...

The map's still a few weeks away from being in any state to be shown to the public, but we'll get there soon!

Paizo Employee Creative Director

xipehuz wrote:

I, for one, like a change of genre once in a while.

Although I'm 80% of the time on a "fantasy RPG" mode, I like to switch to SF settings a couple of times a year (ahh, the smell of plasma burns do get your mind off those fireball blisters ...)
Anyway, I would favor having an AP "Future" once every two years, for example.
Is the Pathfinder team considering it as an option or is Paizo only comited to fantasy roleplaying ?

Pathfinder is going to remain focused on fantasy roleplaying. That doesn't mean we won't some day do a modern or futuristic Adventure Path, but if we do, it'll be a separate product from Pathfinder.

Taldor

Pathfinder Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Comics Subscriber; Pathfinder Campaign Setting, Companion, Modules, Tales Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:


Pathfinder is going to remain focused on fantasy roleplaying. That doesn't mean we won't some day do a modern or futuristic Adventure Path, but if we do, it'll be a separate product from Pathfinder.

Thanks for this assertion!

I understand xipehuz' wish, but I'd expect Pathfinder to stay true to its supposed content: fantasy.

Eventually publishing a separate product for other tastes sounds interesting, though.

Greetings,
Günther

Cheliax Contributor

EP Healy wrote:
Unfortunately, I've found it difficult to put together a campaign with a decidedly "oriental" flavor.

The first thing we'll do, if we we do any kind of Far Eastern themed product, is eliminate the word "oriental" from it. A growing number of Asians find the term offensive, so we won't use it.

Contributor

RE "oriental": That'd probably be best, Mike. The fact that Asians might find it offensive never crossed my mind. However, that "oriental" didn't originally refer to Asian culture, had. (I've gotten strange looks when referring to the Hittites as an "oriental" culture, for instance.) Either way, I love the genre and know you'll tackle it eventually. Until then.


I really want to know the submission guidelines for Pathfinder.

Cheliax Contributor

Jeremy Laverdiere wrote:
I really want to know the submission guidelines for Pathfinder.

So does everyone else...

Including us. ;D


Gary Teter wrote:

What part of Pathfinder do you want to know more about?

And should this be a multiple-choice poll?

Can I purchase advertising with pathfinder?

Oh, yes. I am a psionics player. how does pathfinder adress psionics?

Andoran

Almighty Watashi wrote:
Mike McArtor wrote:
That would be cool, although we're already looking at ways to support those who prefer their games with a decidedly Asian feel. :)
Ooh, someone could make the Kitsune as a race :)

More nit-pickery, but keep in mind that "kitsune" simply means "fox" in Japanese--there's no special connotation to the word that indicate a supernatural creature. It's only that some foxes (kitsune), raccon-dogs (tanuki) and sometimes cats (neko) are thought, in Japanese folklore, to be able to change shape to varying degrees. So it's better to think of them as animals (or animal-fey) that are natural shapechangers--any humanoid form is just one of many that these special animals are capable of assuming.

The only thing that flummoxes me is trying to reduce such an animal-shapechanger to a playable, ECL 0, PC race.

Andoran

EP Healy wrote:
RE "oriental": That'd probably be best, Mike. The fact that Asians might find it offensive never crossed my mind. However, that "oriental" didn't originally refer to Asian culture, had. (I've gotten strange looks when referring to the Hittites as an "oriental" culture, for instance.) Either way, I love the genre and know you'll tackle it eventually. Until then.

Of course the term "Asian" isn't exactly better. Asia's a pretty big continent with many diverse and disparate cultures and ethnicities. But what're ya gonna do? :)

Really, it would be interesting to see the Pathfinder setting lose the false Occidental/Oriental dichotomy, and just use (and intermix) Occidental/Oriental elements as appropriate to each nation/culture.

Cheliax Contributor

Azzy wrote:
More nit-pickery, but keep in mind that "kitsune" simply means "fox" in Japanese--there's no special connotation to the word that indicate a supernatural creature. It's only that some foxes (kitsune), raccon-dogs (tanuki) and sometimes cats (neko) are thought, in Japanese folklore, to be able to change shape to varying degrees. So it's better to think of them as animals (or animal-fey) that are natural shapechangers--any humanoid form is just one of many that these special animals are capable of assuming.

Oooo... thanks for the information! :)

Azzy wrote:
The only thing that flummoxes me is trying to reduce such an animal-shapechanger to a playable, ECL 0, PC race.

Right. Which means it might not happen. I'm speaking here very hypothetically. As you have probably guessed by now, we don't have everything completely figured out quite yet. :)

Cheliax Contributor

Azzy wrote:
Of course the term "Asian" isn't exactly better. Asia's a pretty big continent with many diverse and disparate cultures and ethnicities. But what're ya gonna do? :)

The difference is that "Asian" isn't offensive to those who descend directly from Asian bloodlines. My guess (and I don't know, because I'm not Asian) is "Asian" isn't offensive because Asia is an actual place. Orient is not a place, it's a direction. Or a verb, even.

Azzy wrote:
Really, it would be interesting to see the Pathfinder setting lose the false Occidental/Oriental dichotomy, and just use (and intermix) Occidental/Oriental elements as appropriate to each nation/culture.

We discussed that idea (since Wes and I are both Asiaphiles) but ultimately rejected it for numerous reasons. The most important reason, though, is that the majority of gamers don't want an Asian feel in their world's most popular fantasy roleplaying game.

That's not to say we won't have a little bit of mixture, since theoretically an Asian analog will exist and thus will provide some influence (and allow for me to play ninjas, of course). :)


Mike McArtor wrote:


We discussed that idea (since Wes and I are both Asiaphiles) but ultimately rejected it for numerous reasons. The most important reason, though, is that the majority of gamers don't want an Asian feel in their world's most popular fantasy roleplaying game.

That's not to say we won't have a little bit of mixture, since theoretically an Asian analog will exist and thus will provide some influence (and allow for me to play ninjas, of course). :)

Could you take a continent (as Eberron's Sarlona) and give it an asian feel? Aboveboard it's "asian," but in-game, it's simply referred to by whatever that land's name is?

This way they are isolated from the "sword & sorcery" of the Pathfinder lands. Watch out though where those two cultures meet! :)


I like deClench's idea - the possibilities of a buffer zone between the two regions where the two styles mix-and-clash are tantalizing.

Taldor

I think I'm most interested in seeing how to contribute.
The rest will come to me when my subscription starts rolling in.

Cheliax Contributor

deClench wrote:
Could you take a continent (as Eberron's Sarlona) and give it an asian feel? Aboveboard it's "asian," but in-game, it's simply referred to by whatever that land's name is?

Way ahead of you, my friend. :)


The cultures of different races.

With a vote for those cultures to more divergent from each other not just humans with pointy ears or beards - cultures that make sense given the geography and resources they originate from.

Unique/magical landscapes/geography.


Okay, seriously n00b question and I apologize if this is not necessarily the right place for this...

I've honestly not played D&D in some time, though i still buy the books and Dragon now and then for kicks. I decided to start a brand new campaign using the Pathfinder material pretty much on a whim, because I <3 Dragon and was p!ssed at WotC/Hasbro for canceling your license.

So, I'm not really 100% clear on some of the basic assumptions/terminology here. Are adventure paths in general (or the Pathfinder series in particular) designed pretty much to start brand new characters at 1st and take them up to whatever from there, or do they assume players/characters who have been together for some time?

Oh, and I was wondering as to the extent of new magical bits you guys intended to introduce in these books. Are you relying entirely on the SRD stuff, or will we see a healthy selection of new spells/magic items/psionics/whatever? And if so, how much of it will be there at the start, and how much will only slip in later?

If there's a "dumb-a$$" board I should be reading to answer questions like that, feel free to direct my attention there.

Qadira

Mike McArtor wrote:
That would be cool, although we're already looking at ways to support those who prefer their games with a decidedly Asian feel. :)

WOOOO!!!! I can pretty much guarantee I'd buy every such product you put out.

Mike McArtor wrote:
I've played with the idea a little. The problem is, until recently I'd never seen a kitsune done in a way that wasn't just a sucky fox-headed human.

Frankly, I don't mind kitsune just being another SLA-using creature, but if you want something with more flavor, Dog Soul's Kitsunemori does a pretty good job making them interesting and distinctive. I don't have my PDF with me, though, and I can't remember how much of it, if any, is OGC.

Cheliax Contributor

RatBastard wrote:
So, I'm not really 100% clear on some of the basic assumptions/terminology here.

No worries, man. We're here to help. :)

RatBastard wrote:
Are adventure paths in general (or the Pathfinder series in particular) designed pretty much to start brand new characters at 1st and take them up to whatever from there?

Yes, that is correct. The intent of an Adventure Path is to create an entire campaign, from 1st level to Nth level (N varies by AP).

RatBastard wrote:
Oh, and I was wondering as to the extent of new magical bits you guys intended to introduce in these books. Are you relying entirely on the SRD stuff, or will we see a healthy selection of new spells/magic items/psionics/whatever?

I don't know how much you consider healthy, but I'm sure the Pathfinder team will add in new magical doodads as they need. I understand that they intend to include at least one new magic item per volume, but that's something Dr. Jacobs needs to verify.

RatBastard wrote:
And if so, how much of it will be there at the start, and how much will only slip in later?

I think they intend on spreading out the new stuff.

RatBastard wrote:
If there's a "dumb-a$$" board I should be reading to answer questions like that, feel free to direct my attention there.

Naw, nothing like that. Don't sweat it. We're more than happy to answer questions. :)

Cheliax Contributor

Occam wrote:
WOOOO!!!! I can pretty much guarantee I'd buy every such product you put out.

Heh. If I could get that promise from 2,000 more people, I'd be in Erik's office in seconds promoting a PaizoFarEast expansion. ;D

Mike McArtor wrote:
Frankly, I don't mind kitsune just being another SLA-using creature, but if you want something with more flavor, Dog Soul's Kitsunemori does a pretty good job making them interesting and distinctive. I don't have my PDF with me, though, and I can't remember how much of it, if any, is OGC.

I have the Kitsunemori sampler downloaded and have skimmed through it. I fear delving into it too much, though, lest whatever awesomeness might await me therein unconsciously affects my design process if ever I'm granted the ability to shepherd a PaizoFarEast... thing.


Mike McArtor wrote:
Occam wrote:
WOOOO!!!! I can pretty much guarantee I'd buy every such product you put out.
Heh. If I could get that promise from 2,000 more people, I'd be in Erik's office in seconds promoting a PaizoFarEast expansion. ;

I would most assuredly buy one. That's 2, or .1% of the guarantee you need.

RPG Superstar 2009, Contributor

To kind of tag along with the Asia-analogue discussion, I'm curious about what kind of potential ethnic groups will find their way into this campaign world. Greyhawk has Baklunish, Flan, Oeridian, Olman, Rhennee, and Suloise humans. Forgotten Realms has its own variety. But what do you guys have planned for the geographic and cultural diversity of Varisia and the other realms/continents under development?

--Neil

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

There will be lots of different kinds of humans in our campaign setting, including some cultural analogs to Earth cultures like Vikings, Ancient Egypt, etc. We're trying not to go too crazy with this, and the setting will include lots of races and cultures that are mish-mashes and created from whole cloth, but there are a few iconic cultures that we simply could not do without.

Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

--Erik

Andoran

Vikings.


Vikings !

Andoran

Hippies! Ooops, I mean Vikings!!!

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

The Vikings in our world hail from the frozen Lands of the Linnorm Kings, but their cultural and mercantile reach extends deep into the continent. Egyptian analogues come from Osirion, an equatorial region based on Egypt in the era of Napoleon, when outsiders raced each other the catalogue the history of ancient empires.

With monsters.

--Erik Mona

Andoran

That's awesome. I was thinking two days ago about the Napoleonic adventures in Egypt--lotsa fun adventure ideas there.
And the Rosetta stone!


Maybe it's just me, but I'm not a "flashy" kind of guy. I think that Hero Games has some of the best products out there because they print in black and white and have so few pictures. It speaks loudly to me that they can produce a product that is twice the size, has strong content, and is the same price as a WotC product.

While the RHoD is a nice product, do you really need all the flash? Let's just say you got rid of the border. You could easily fit a 4 or 5 letter word that will fit within that border region.

Let's say 75 lines at 4 letters (300 characters a page) for 96 pages is 28,800 characters. Subtract 1/4 of that from the total for pictures/maps/diagrams and you have 21,600 characters. That's another 3,085 seven letter* words or 4,320 five letter* words. Or, you could save the money with the images and give us 4,114 and 5,760 respectively.

Help a gamer out, will ya?!

Also, a desktop wallpaper of the world would be nice : )

*I made 7 letters to be 6 and a space.

Andoran

Feuding citystates filled with feuding merchant houses are always fun for intrigue and adventure like medieval/renaissance Italy...

Qadira

Erik Mona wrote:

There will be lots of different kinds of humans in our campaign setting, including some cultural analogs to Earth cultures like Vikings, Ancient Egypt, etc. We're trying not to go too crazy with this, and the setting will include lots of races and cultures that are mish-mashes and created from whole cloth, but there are a few iconic cultures that we simply could not do without.

Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

China/Japan/Korea/etc.

India
Arabia/Persia/Egypt
Sub-Saharan Africa
Mesoamerica

Basically, I'd love to see analogs of any non-European historical cultures.


Erik Mona wrote:

There will be lots of different kinds of humans in our campaign setting, including some cultural analogs to Earth cultures like Vikings, Ancient Egypt, etc. We're trying not to go too crazy with this, and the setting will include lots of races and cultures that are mish-mashes and created from whole cloth, but there are a few iconic cultures that we simply could not do without.

Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

--Erik

How will this play in with other races? For example will the dwarves and elves of Orision (your Egypt analog) be different (flavorwise, obviously) than those of Varisia?


Occam wrote:
Erik Mona wrote:

There will be lots of different kinds of humans in our campaign setting, including some cultural analogs to Earth cultures like Vikings, Ancient Egypt, etc. We're trying not to go too crazy with this, and the setting will include lots of races and cultures that are mish-mashes and created from whole cloth, but there are a few iconic cultures that we simply could not do without.

Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

China/Japan/Korea/etc.

India
Arabia/Persia/Egypt
Sub-Saharan Africa
Mesoamerica

Basically, I'd love to see analogs of any non-European historical cultures.

I like all these cultures too. It seems that the designers use these cultures to borrow ideas, but never captures their "feel". For instance, the rakshasas of the D&D world has never felt particularly Indian to me. Parts of the Savage Tide seem based on Mesoamerica with the names and tribes, but not enough to really feel like a part of that civilization. I'd love something that really felt like a submersion into a new culture.


Occam wrote:
Erik Mona wrote:


Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

China/Japan/Korea/etc.

India
Arabia/Persia/Egypt
Sub-Saharan Africa
Mesoamerica

Basically, I'd love to see analogs of any non-European historical cultures.

Well, since someone else brought it up...

I wholly support this message. I'm anxious to explore beyond Tolkien's legacy.

Additionally, how about Atlantis-Lemuria-Mu-Hyperboria?


Occam wrote:


China/Japan/Korea/etc.
India
Arabia/Persia/Egypt
Sub-Saharan Africa
Mesoamerica

Basically, I'd love to see analogs of any non-European historical cultures.

Yes. Non-European historical culture analog/shakeups please-and-thank-you.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Pawns Subscriber
Erik Mona wrote:

There will be lots of different kinds of humans in our campaign setting, including some cultural analogs to Earth cultures like Vikings, Ancient Egypt, etc. We're trying not to go too crazy with this, and the setting will include lots of races and cultures that are mish-mashes and created from whole cloth, but there are a few iconic cultures that we simply could not do without.

Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

--Erik

Indian

Persian
Mongol/Chinese - the Water Margin is a much-overlooked influence

Japan generally a bit overdone IMHO.

Integrating the non-human races into each culture would be good; it's interesting to have a tension between homeland and racial loyalties.

Every culture should have a few paragraphs to succintly describe/stereotype them - Iron Heroes has some excellent suggestions on how to do this.

Osirion

declench wrote:
Atlantis-Lemuria-Mu-Hyperboria?

YES!!

One of the things that drives me utterly batty with a great deal of fantasy RPG settings (*cough FORGTTEN REALMS cough*) is the massive proliferation of ancient, uber-powerful but now destroyed empires leaving behind their ruins for monsters to inhabit and adventurers to pillage.

This may sound counter-intuitive, but please PLEASE give us only a few (maybe three or four) ancient ruin-dropping civilizations but DETAIL them in depth so that when the time comes for us to launch off and make our own adventures, we have solid background material to build from and use. Too many runs quickly into the "oh, ANOTHER lost ancient civilization" feeling.


Erik Mona wrote:


Is there anything in particular you're looking for?

--Erik

Mesoamerica would be money. There's something great about exploring the jungles and finding an ancient ziggurat pyramid, covered with eroded glyphs of mass sacrifice.


cthulhudarren wrote:

Mesoamerica would be money. There's something great about exploring the jungles and finding an ancient ziggurat pyramid, covered with eroded glyphs of mass sacrifice.

...only to be eaten in the end by a Great Old One. >_>;

How about some of those? :)

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

Mesoamerica: Check
India: Check
Persia: Check
China/Mongolia/Etc.: Check (but very much on the periphery for right now)
Atlantis/Mu/Lemuria: Check, Check, Check
Feuding City States: Check

Checks all around. :)

--Erik


Will there be any psionics supported?

- Neomorte


The Last Rogue wrote:
For example will the dwarves and elves of Orision (your Egypt analog) be different (flavorwise, obviously) than those of Varisia?

I'd like to mention that it really bugs me when European myths are dropped whole cloth into non-European fantasy worlds.

I love me some Al-Qadim, but it seems so out of place to have elves, dwarves and gnomes in my Arabian Adventures.

If your going to crib cultures from the real world, please take the time to create demi-human races inspired by those cultures. Elves and dwarves in a viking culture are a given, but I don't remember reading about any elves or dwarves living in the Nile region.

Cheliax Contributor

Neomorte wrote:

Will there be any psionics supported?

- Neomorte

Psionics won't be banned in our world, but I wouldn't expect a great deal of support. The simple truth is that psionic fans form a small but vocal minority. Most D&D players are only neutral at best toward psionics, so it's not a system we're going to spend a lot of time or effort supporting. That said, we're not going to prevent psionic fans from including the system into their campaigns (i.e., we're not going to say "Psionics don't exist in our world. Nyeh!").

All that said, I'd like to see some psionic support coming out of Paizo some day. I have a list of other things I'd rather see before that, and while that list is pretty long I suspect it's shorter than anyone else's here in the editorial pit. :)

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

Fletch wrote:
The Last Rogue wrote:
For example will the dwarves and elves of Orision (your Egypt analog) be different (flavorwise, obviously) than those of Varisia?

I'd like to mention that it really bugs me when European myths are dropped whole cloth into non-European fantasy worlds.

I love me some Al-Qadim, but it seems so out of place to have elves, dwarves and gnomes in my Arabian Adventures.

If your going to crib cultures from the real world, please take the time to create demi-human races inspired by those cultures. Elves and dwarves in a viking culture are a given, but I don't remember reading about any elves or dwarves living in the Nile region.

This is a tricky one for me. On the one hand, the game has elves and dwarves. On the other hand, if I had a free hand to do whatever I wanted (despite the sales implications), things like dwarves would be relegated entirely to the Nordic region and elves would be on the periphery. I probably wouldn't include halflings or gnomes at all, but again, that would be a poor choice insofar as sales are concerned.

I am not going out of my way to put dwarves in Osirion.

--Erik


Erik Mona wrote:


I am not going out of my way to put dwarves in Osirion.
--Erik

Maybe the dwarves in Osirion shave themselves and tatoo their faces and look like miniature Michael Clarke Duncan's? ;)

Erik Mona wrote:
I probably wouldn't include halflings or gnomes at all, but again, that would be a poor choice insofar as sales are concerned.

I was always incredibly impressed with the cannibal halflings from Dark Sun.

Gnomes on the other hand can go quietly into the night... :)


Erik Mona wrote:
Fletch wrote:
The Last Rogue wrote:
...will the dwarves and elves of Orision (your Egypt analog) be different (flavorwise, obviously) than those of Varisia?

...bugs me when European myths are dropped whole cloth into non-European fantasy worlds.

...it seems so out of place to have elves, dwarves and gnomes in my Arabian Adventures.

This is a tricky one for me. On the one hand, the game has elves and dwarves.

Here's an idea from a slightly different perspective. Don't think of the regions as separate settings but as part of the same world. The non-human races may originate from a particular region (i.e. dwarfs from the north), but that doesn't mean they can't travel. Jump the timeline ahead a bit, suddenly there are dwarves and gnomes and whatever traveling to the corners of the globe and actually wanting to settle down. Farther ahead in time, subcultures of those dwarves and gnomes and whatever have arisen due to the incorporation of local customs with their own.

It doesn't have to mean that dwarves are retroactively forced into a pseudo-egyptian mythology, but that the "real" dwarves in the game are free-willed creatures that can displace themselves just as any human can.

The corollary to this, of course, is that the persian peris or the asian kappas or the lemurian serpentmen are just as free to travel and populate the world.

Cheers.

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