Sometimes you look at something you've seen before one hundred times, but it just looks wrong today. I've seen plenty of feats, but I was looking at the Academy Graduate from the Savage Tide Player's Guide today and something struck me this time: You rarely see a Feat that makes some skill always a class skill in future. But why not?
Well, when you're taking a new different class there's an explanation why an old skill is now cross-class or prohibited that runs something like you need to practice related skills, not tinker around and improve some old unrelated skill.
So the logic behind Academy Graduate implies, Yes, but thanks to your superior education, you can continue studying old skills (provided those were among the Charisma- or Intelligence-based skills you selected).
Are there game balance issues I'm missing should there be new feats like:
Back Alley Child
You were raised in the back alleys and this School of Hard Knocks leaves you adept at learning urban survival skills.
Benefits: You gain a +2 bonus on either Gather Information or Sense Motive checks. In addition, these two skills are always considered class skills for you.
Back Woods Rockhopper
You were raised in the back of beyond hopping around the crags and this experience leaves you adept at improving such skills.
Benefits: You gain a +2 bonus on either Climbing or Jumping checks. In addition, these two skills are always considered class skills for you.
A Feat that grants two +2 skill improvements plus class skill status seems too much and without at least one, seems too strict for 1st level selection. Perhaps they should be restricted to First Level selection only? I'm deliberating pushing the difference between Intelligence-based skills and something else with Rockhopper. Can this be justified in game-balance terms? What do others think?
One of the things I like a lot about the World of Warcraft RPG produced by Sword and Sorcery Studios is that skills that have a racial bonus are also always considered a class skill. To bring that mechanic into D&D and give an example, Listen, Search, and Spot would always be a class skill for an elf.
I think your feats are OK to grant the bonus on both skills and always make the skills a class skill if you make them 1st level only feats.
Let's just say that feats that add bonus on ur skills are a waste.
Firstly, you get a feat every 3 lvls andthe majority of these kinds of feats only give a bonus of +2...I don't think it's worth it
It would be fine if the bonus was a + 4 though (just like improved initiative)
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Let's just say that feats that add bonus on ur skills are a waste.
Firstly, you get a feat every 3 lvls andthe majority of these kinds of feats only give a bonus of +2...I don't think it's worth it
It would be fine if the bonus was a + 4 though (just like improved initiative)
My thoughts exactly. Why waste a feat on a skill bonus? They're good feats for NPC's, or people who role play to the point of gimping their characters.
My thoughts exactly. Why waste a feat on a skill bonus? They're good feats for NPC's, or people who role play to the point of gimping their characters.Let's just say that feats that add bonus on ur skills are a waste.
Firstly, you get a feat every 3 lvls andthe majority of these kinds of feats only give a bonus of +2...I don't think it's worth it
It would be fine if the bonus was a + 4 though (just like improved initiative)
Most of them add +2 to two stats so their is a total of +4 there. I will say, however, that my players pretty much don't go near them and I will probably implement a rule in my campaign that that makes the chosen skills class skills in order to heighten their appeal a little.
One thing we've done to make things balanced between the classes, but less stupid in terms of cross-class skills is to keep the maximums in place, but to have all skills only cost one skill point. That way, while a Fighter will never be as good at Spot as a Scout, he can still have a better chance to do so without completely crippling his ability to, say, climb a wall.
Also, I think it's perfectly reasonable to allow characters to swap up to two standard class skills for other class skills at character creation(with DM's permission, of course), to reflect the cultural differences of that character. The proviso being that NPCs may be encountered with the same switched skills as well.
This is one of the things we have allowed with good explanation.
Two house rules that we have used are:
- Skill Focus makes the chosen skill a class skill (hasn't come up often, but nice option. Typically players are looking for a bonus to a skill that already works with their class and is therefore a class skill already.)
- With a good explanation, each character starts off with two skills that are always class skills as "background skills". And if class grants them as class skills at first level (or choose same skill twice) get a +2 bonus. The players in my groups have been really good at using this for background skills like Climb, Swim, Handle Animal, etc. So far that has often been used to round out a character's backstory and not as a means to min/max.
Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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The only thing I would add is that feats like this have the weird side effect of making characters without the class skill better than those with the class skill. It's a little bit strange because the character that is best at opening locks is not the rogue under this system. You may want to think about providing some other bonus to characters who already have the skill as a class skill to even things up and give them an additional incentive to take the feat.
IMC, I have a house rule where you get one additional class skill per point of intelligence bonus.
Also, if a player can justify it, I allow them to trade out one class skill of another (at 1st level only). For example, a cleric of Procan (a sea god in Greyhawk) would certainly have swim for a class skill, & therefore might trade out Knowledge (Arcana) for it.
I usually let players switch class skills for non-class skills 1 for 1, as long as they use the same ability (for instance, a swashbuckler dropping Craft to gain Appraise to simulate a merchant upbringing). This is generally all the flexibility you need if you utilize background skills (skills that are always considered class skills for a certain background: mountain-dwelling dwarves get Knowledge/Dungeoneering, forest-dwelling elves get Survival, humans from a coastal town get Swim, etc.).
One of the things I like a lot about the World of Warcraft RPG produced by Sword and Sorcery Studios is that skills that have a racial bonus are also always considered a class skill. To bring that mechanic into D&D and give an example, Listen, Search, and Spot would always be a class skill for an elf.
Isn't that already the case? The Wizards' glossary page would suggest it is.