Please post questions etc. here.
Hi GM Birch. First off, thanks again for being accomodating in running additional games. I'm hoping that this doesn't put too much strain on yourself, what with planning on running one game and ending up with three!
My first question is regarding mechanics actually. If I understand correctly CotCT was written for 3.5, are we still playing using Pathfinder mechanics?
I just read over the campaign traits for CoCT, and they are both highly specific and would drastically alter Vir's backstory as currently written.
That isn't to say that I don't want to play. I do. It just means that the backstory and much of the crunch needs to change. Is that alright? I am not completely sure if you chose us for the characters, primarily, or because we were putting in roleplaying effort.
In the interest of rebuilding the character, I do have one favor to ask. Will you please relax the original racial restrictions as long as the race is on the official PRD website? I promise I'm not trying to min-max (which was your stated concern for non-Core races, but when I was reading over the CoCT players guide thinking about traits and Summoners, I thought that a Fetchling Summoner (Shadow Caller) whose Eidolon is his shadow/imaginary best friend would be a better fit for Unhappy Childhood (Trait) than an optimistic Half Elf who wants to be a paladin. I would be happy to link are relevant information for ease of access and adjudication.
Hi GM Birch. First off, thanks again for being accomodating in running additional games. I'm hoping that this doesn't put too much strain on yourself, what with planning on running one game and ending up with three!
My first question is regarding mechanics actually. If I understand correctly CotCT was written for 3.5, are we still playing using Pathfinder mechanics?
Absolutely - this is a Pathfinder game. I never liked 3.5 oddly enough. I have a few issues with the Pathfinder rules but I go with the flow anyway (why does AC count for both being hit and the damage taken? Heavy armour means you're more likely to get him (you're slower right) but you'll take less damage - surely).
Anyway, back on subject - yes, Pathfinder.
I'm exhausted before we start!
Thanks for sticking by me and well done to you all. What's next? I need you to:
1. Review your characters and make sure they're 100% to your satisfaction
2. If someone fancies themselves as a rules-helper, please check out/help the other guys to make sure they're characters are 100% to your satisfaction ; p
3. Be really clear about why you're here
4. Please help out if I'm asked a question and you know the answer. I won't mind if someone jumps in and solves the mystery or gives advice
5. I have a house-rule now. Knowledge (local) is about where you come from primarily. If you go somewhere new, I suspect you're the sort that obseves things, listens to gossip etc. Once you're in a new place for at least 24-hours, you can roll for that place too.
6. If you want to weave back-stories, now is the best time
Just a quick note to let you know I am still game. Although I felt more prepared with ROTRL it really doesn't matter what AP he's in. Give me a couple days to sort through CotCT's player guide and make any needed adjustments. :)
I'll need maybe a day or two to rewrite a bunch of the fluff (Self-made hero farmboy, plopped down in a very different campaign? Uh, nope). The character himself should stay the same in his personality, I'll just need to change where he's coming from and where he's going.
Also, I'll just be swapping over to Urban Ranger (APG) instead of straight ranger. We don't have a Rogue, so far as I can tell, so those are skills worth picking up.
Character listing, as of current posting
Eltanin Titansglade - Half-Elf Magic User(?)
Galen Zanderholm - Human (Chelaxian) Paladin
Gwernach Nickelbeard - Dwarf Cleric
Vir - Half-Elf Summoner/TBD(?)
Walden Tyronius Ettinmoor - Gnome Wizard
Wilthorn Gwanae - Human Urban Ranger
Will have Galen's alias/crunch/revised backstory up soon. Just dotting in.
I can't say as I am drawn to any of the suggested CoTCT traits. If it is alright with you I'd rather leave Gwernach the way he is but with a tweaked background to tie him into the AP. The parts I've changed have been 'highlighted'. Let me know if this is kosher.
I'm having trouble finding a download for CoTCT campaign material. I'm getting the impression that it was lucky I caught my new campaign before I finalized my equipment, but I think my char can work here more or less as is. Eltanin is flexible that way.
I agree. None of the traits seem to jive with a middle aged academic who doesn't have any immediate family, unless he was a professor at a school in the city? He also doesn't seem to be the type to go after a small time criminal. Any thoughts guys?
Found the guide to DL, so no worries there.
Professor, how about a little collaboration? I had planned to take the Framed background with the Dropout trait. I'll PM you and see if we can work out some weaving...
I'll need maybe a day or two to rewrite a bunch of the fluff (Self-made hero farmboy, plopped down in a very different campaign? Uh, nope).
There is no rush - I'll be focussed on RotR for at least a few days until that's established before adding Cot and CotCT.
I can't say as I am drawn to any of the suggested CoTCT traits. If it is alright with you I'd rather leave Gwernach the way he is but with a tweaked background to tie him into the AP. The parts I've changed have been 'highlighted'. Let me know if this is kosher.
If a campaign trait doesn't work, you have my permission to choose 2 that work for you.
I agree. None of the traits seem to jive with a middle aged academic who doesn't have any immediate family, unless he was a professor at a school in the city? He also doesn't seem to be the type to go after a small time criminal. Any thoughts guys?
As before, don't be wedded to a campaign trait if it doesn't work.
I just got your message Eltanin, but haven't had time to respond. Expect something later on tonight. In other words, I think this could work for a tie in!
GM, I took the Rich Parents as a trait (mostly because I figured an actual established professional would likely have some additional resources) would beginning with minor magical items (scrolls, wands, etc.) be reasonable?
GM, I took the Rich Parents as a trait (mostly because I figured an actual established professional would likely have some additional resources) would beginning with minor magical items (scrolls, wands, etc.) be reasonable?
That's fine by me.
Did my question show up on the thread for you, DM Birch?
I just read over the campaign traits for CoCT, and they are both highly specific and would drastically alter Vir's backstory as currently written.
That isn't to say that I don't want to play. I do. It just means that the backstory and much of the crunch needs to change. Is that alright? I am not completely sure if you chose us for the characters, primarily, or because we were putting in roleplaying effort.
In the interest of rebuilding the character, I do have one favor to ask. Will you please relax the original racial restrictions as long as the race is on the official PRD website? I promise I'm not trying to min-max (which was your stated concern for non-Core races, but when I was reading over the CoCT players guide thinking about traits and Summoners, I thought that a Fetchling Summoner (Shadow Caller) whose Eidolon is his shadow/imaginary best friend would be a better fit for Unhappy Childhood (Trait) than an optimistic Half Elf who wants to be a paladin. I would be happy to link are relevant information for ease of access and adjudication.
Sorry, I don't know what happened there - so thanks for nudging me.
I appreciate you all created a character for one game and I've plonked you into another. For some that means a small tweak in character and a few changes in back-story and you're good to go. If I've really thrown you a curve-ball, feel free to make radical changes and/or create a new character.
And yes, you can go with the fetchling summoner - as long as it works with the other players.
My recruitment method was as much to ensure I attracted players who want to tell a story as anything else. You've proven that element, so I am much more relaxed now. All I ask is you put the same thought into the character because I believe it really makes for better role-playing.
Just to say that after today (my time) my posting will be sporadic for the next three days. Saturday and Sunday are always my slowest days – I tend to post mostly in the evenings.
Monday is my wife’s birthday, so expect zero posts and then I’m full steam ahead again from Tuesday morning. Thanks for your patience.
Could you all do me a favour and post where you're at with regards your character. Are you complete or how soon will you complete. I hinted at starting off on Tuesday but I don't want to rush anyone. Thanks.
I'll need to tweak Walden's crunch just a bit.
I believe that Eltanin and myself are going to be tied together as Professor and student. She being framed for murder, and my association with her a reason to push the eccentric gnome out of the Academae. I have to rework my backstory slightly to center it in Korvosa as opposed to Magnimar and I'm no longer looking on going on a long journey to help combat the Bleaching.
Does our being from the Academae work? I have zero knowledge if that will impact plot points later on down the road.
The Professor will continue to be easily distracted and a bit manic, but will likely be more invested in relationships now. He will still be suffering from the Bleaching, and one of my thoughts for character development is for him to slowly get back some colour and life as the campaign (and the excitement and danger) progress.
I look forward to adventuring with you all!
I'll need to tweak Walden's crunch just a bit.
I believe that Eltanin and myself are going to be tied together as Professor and student. She being framed for murder, and my association with her a reason to push the eccentric gnome out of the Academae. I have to rework my backstory slightly to center it in Korvosa as opposed to Magnimar and I'm no longer looking on going on a long journey to help combat the Bleaching.
Does our being from the Academae work? I have zero knowledge if that will impact plot points later on down the road.
The Professor will continue to be easily distracted and a bit manic, but will likely be more invested in relationships now. He will still be suffering from the Bleaching, and one of my thoughts for character development is for him to slowly get back some colour and life as the campaign (and the excitement and danger) progress.
I look forward to adventuring with you all!
This is fine for me.
I'm ready to go.
I haven't found the time to build Galen's alias, but that shouldn't take long, just a little tinkering to backstory and I'll be ready. Tuesday should work without trouble - Monday is my wedding anniversary, so I will likely be silent that day (if I know what's good for me, and that's questionable...)
I've got a case of writer's block right now, but I'm sure I can have proper fluff up by Tuesday. All the crunch is updated, already, that was the easy part.
I believe Galen is ready to go to war.
Still selecting gear, although I have somewhat modified my background - and added it to my profile - for this campaign. I don't know why, but of all of character creation I get most hung up on gear selection. Good thing it's a 1st lvl char, or I'd be here another week... as it is, I promise I'll be set by Monday, and I think I'll be done by today. I'll post again when I take Eltanin out of the oven.
BTW, I'm hoping you, GM Birch, will cut me a little break on the recorder. Ultimate Equipment says a musical instrument weighs 3 pounds. I'm not looking to carry the flute/staff/weapon from Circle of Iron, this is just basically a hollow stick. In fact, there is only one item I'm writing about in non-standard terms.
This is the entry I've already written for Eltanin's formula book. It's mostly flavor text, with the exception of the last line - it shouldn't be a problem, although if GM birch disallows it I'll understand.
Travelling Formula Book (The Unleashed Secret, by Corelure Bale - This volume purports to reveal 'the grand secrets of alchemy' but is really just a collection of rumor and innuendo by a literate wizard who possessed precious little alchemical knowledge himself. Accounts of actual alchemical techniques, like extracts and mutagens, are described only in second-hand terms and are interspersed with anecdotes and speculations, occasionally prurient in nature. It does contain the correct technique for making alchemical throwing bombs but to someone who doesn't already have the necessary background this is almost worthless. It is little more than an advertisement for those who wish to become alchemists, but it does have one asset - each page has wide margins and large spacing, making it a somewhat useful notebook. Eltanin has effectively co-opted it as a travelling formula book, covering page after page with tidy marginalia, including her own formulae. Without her help, even another alchemist would glean useful material only with difficulty, suffering a -4 to spellcraft checks to copy a formula.) 1 lb
Done! I think. Background, appearance, gear, stats.
Just one other thing - I included no alchemical gear on the assumption that Ellie is just now recovering from her expulsion. She's had no time to think about using her real skills to benefit herself, so she's taken a job as a cook in a tavern, and found a room of her own at a local inn. (Working as trained help and renting a room with good food gives her a small net gain in wealth, which will probably become irrelevant when the adventuring starts.)
Either one of these places could become a 'base of operations' for our group. Do they need to be detailed, or shall we develop other plans?
I think I finally managed to get something remotely presentable out. Fluff is there, crunch as been alter to be more explanatory. I did use some of the information in Pathfinder Chronicles: Guide to Korvosa, specifically certain locations and the pricing for an apartment. Just an FYI, I guess.
Eltanin, I notice a few minor thing on your sheet, and I just want to mention them. They're probably unimportant and nitpicky, so I'll cut it out if you say so. Top down, the things I noticed:
Initiative: You have a +1 for init, though your Dex mod is +2, I'm not sure where the -1 comes from.
Saves:Your reflex save ought to be +4, (+2 base, +2 Dex)
Stats: You marked later that the +2 for being a Half-Elf got put into Dex. While not a problem per se, if it went into Int, while keeping all the stats the same, you'd be at 23 Point Buy, allowing you bring up your strength to 11, or do other things. Something to think about.
Attacks: You melee attack bonus for the dagger is right, but the dagger should be 1d4-1, as your strength penalty plays into your damage.
Also, don't forget that the -1 will apply to the thrown weapons also, though this will probably be counteracted by PBS.
As one last thing about attacks, don't forget your Bombs get an extra +1 to hit because of Throw Anything.
Extracts: I'm not sure where the 4 extracts is coming from. By my calculations, it should be half that. 1 as given by the table for alchemists, and another 1 for having 16 Int. If you're counting your 2nd and 3rd level extract slots, you don't actually get those until you can create 2nd and 3rd level extracts.
Feats: I'm not sure where the extra feat slot, the Scholar one, comes from. You have campaign next to it, but I'm not quite sure what that means. A campaign feat?
Skills: You may want to clarify you terminology here, and differentiate you total skill modifier from the ranks you have invested in it, because it'll get quite confusing when he get to higher levels. You may want to compile them into one single modifier, and list out the different parts, like AC, i.e.:
Craft (Alchemy) +8 (+3 Int, +1 rank, +3 class skill, +1 class bonus)
Additionally, your perception and sleight of hand modifiers seem low. Perception should be +8 (+2 Wis, +1 rank, +3 class skill, +2 Keen Senses), and SoH should be +6 (+2 Dex, +1 rank, +3 class skill).
Traits: You never actually marked down what traits you picked. You did mark the you had Dropout in the spellcraft skill, but the other one wasn't mentioned.
I think that's everything. All in all, pretty good, just have to fix a few minor things.
If what I'm doing isn't a problem, I'll be putting up crunch reviews for everyone else soonish
First up I'm NOT going to worry about the odd pound here or there. EVER.
And Wilthorn -thanks for the help.
I've reworked my character, and I welcome any feedback and/or correction. :-)
Wilthorn, seriously, thank you. Some of that stuff is me genuinely screwing up - the stat miscalculation is especially galling - but an awful lot of that comes from the forum somehow not taking all my updates. I was doing some work in the process of C&Ping from my computer files, and apparently Saving my work after each section is only partially effective.
Welp; time for another going over.
GM Birch, I may be misremembering, but did your original recruiting post say '2 Starting Feats, one regular & one campaign', or '2 starting TRAITS'? The latter makes more sense, but somehow I keep thinking it's the other way
I believe it did say 2 starting feats, but it was clarified in the discussion thread that it was an error, and should have been traits.
Gwernach!
Attacks: First off, I'm a little confused. You have Melee +1, but almost every entry has a different attack bonus. Let's run through each one:
Light Shield Bash -3 (+1 Str, -4 Non-proficency*)
Dagger +1 (+1 Str)
Mwk Battleaxe +2 (+1 Str, +1 Masterwork)
Unarmed Strike +1 (+1 Str), will provoke.
I'm a little confused at the listing of the unarmed strike, though I suppose it's for comprehensiveness more than anything.
I assume Perf Combat is Performance Combat, which I won't touch, considering I don't know the rules, and I doubt we'll be using the rules, since CoCT came out long before UC.
Defense: Your flat-footed AC should be 17. Don't forget, you still get your shield bonus when flat-footed.
Special Abilities: You have your Channel as 2d6.
Aside from that, it all looks good.
Hmmm, you must have checked while I was tweaking - a couple of those I'd corrected already :)
Unarmed strike is there because of the gauntlets from the armor. Not that my clerics go around punching people out anyways :P
I've removed Perf Combat; thanks! overlooked that one. I converted Gwernach from another dwarf cleric I have in Herolab (he's no long in 'use'). That AP was using UC+...
Fair enough.
Galen Zanderholm (Not to be confused with Zenderholm)! Not much, just some tweaks.
Traits: You still have Friends and Enemies listed as a trait, you may want to adjust this.
Special Abilities: You have variant channeling. No only does a Paladin not get channeling until level 4, but the Oath of Vengeance replaces channeling with the ability to swap LoH for Smites.
Everything else looks good.
I have a question about human ethnicities. In the Inner Sea World Guide (pg 11) it says that humans speak common and their racial tongue automatically. Does that mean that Wilthorn would speak Common and whatever human ethnic language he is?
Yes, good catch. However, being the ethnicity of most Korvosans, Chelaxian, he only speaks common, since the is no "Chelish" language. Good job catching me on it, but it turns out nothing needs to be changed, though it did motivate me to do some research.
But anyway, here's my audit for Matam and Tamat!
Stats: You technically a little short on your point buy. You're at 24 points, so you could bump Str, Dex, Con, or Wis up by 1. Probably won't matter in the long run, but worth noting.
Eidlon HP:
You have 1d10+2, but the eidolon's Con mod is only +1. Not sure where the other +! comes from. I don't think eidolons get a FCB, because they're not actually taking ranks in classes.
Ediolon Skills:
Your eidolon should have a +4 for Perception, and a +5 for Stealth, since both are class skills for eidolons.
That's pretty much it. For as much bookkeeping summoners are, you did a pretty good job making sure everything right.
I'm holding off of Professor Etiinmoor, until he's announced as done. I don't want to review someone who's still in the works.
D**** Chellish universalism! It is the pernicious root of colonialism. :-p
I completely missed the section were it specified the Eidolon's class skills. Thank you so much, Wilthorn.
What does FCB stand for?
Favored Class Bonus. The floating +1 skill rank or hit point every time you level in your favored class. It was the only thing I could think of that would give it an extra hit point.
It was just a flub. Totally an error.
Thanks Wilthorn, updated and fixed Galen per your suggested edits above. Good work auditing -- you want a job working my regular campaigns?
The weekend was not productive. Still, I should have crunch ready by tonight and be good to go for Tuesday!
A couple of things will likely be switched around - I'll likely drop the familiar just because I think Walden wouldn't be attentive enough to care for one! And maybe some other stuff too.
If you have thoughts Wilthorn, fire away!
Ok, added one final touch to my background. I'm not sure the timeline is very good - I went with the idea that Ellie has only been in Korvosa a couple of months. Too much longer would involve more massive revision of her backstory, as it would mean her family would be in closer contact (which would change the campaign a bit - I modeled the Titansglade family somewhat after the Heinlein's Howard families, and am considering detailing a campaign setting based on them.)
This final addition includes every other player character in this campaign by a cursory mention. It might be a good time to consider how we all meet, and my paragraph does give us an option.
Most importantly, I came perilously close to co-opting Professor Ettinsmoor for this idea. Professor, if you could give a look at the last vignette in Eltanin's Background and propose changes or criticism... actually, I'll make it easy for you and just post it here. Bear in mind that I WILL gladly change it with the suggestion of GM Birch or Professor Ettinsmoor, but I'll listen to anyone's criticism or commentary.
FYI, all of this was written in less than the time it took to listen to the soundtrack to Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End, which was playing as I wrote it. As a matter of curiosity, does anyone else have a favorite RP soundtrack? ...does anyone's character have a themesong?
It hadn't taken long , less than two months, for almost all of the plans she had to come to a nasty halt. Eltanin had taken to studying near Aerie Street on off days; one day a small squadron of the Guard arrested her for murder, upon the witness of a fisherman she barely knew. She managed to get word to one of her professors, a gnomish teacher of history who hadn't looked askance at Ellie's focus on alchemy and her out-of-town letters of recommendation.
Professor Ettinmoor managed to prevail upon the fisherman's conscience; the man had been coerced into accusing Eltanin by a nasty underworld character named Gaedren Lamm. He had managed to tell the professor that much, but was himself killed before he could recant.
Ellie was freed because there was no case against her, not because she had been proven innocent. The Acadamae took the position that suspicion against her was intolerable and expelled her. This unfortunately precluded her only local room and board. She deliberately refrained from involving her family; some of her hotter kin might have done something rash, and the people of Gladehome numbered little more than fifty. War on Korvosa would not end well for anyone.
Still, Ellie was in a tight spot. The money she had been sent with was good enough to keep her going long enough to find a job for herself(as a cook) and a room at an Inn (cheap enough that she has seriously considered heading for the Shingles.) Professor Ettinmoor has been helpful in some crucial ways. While getting her little closer to Lamm himself, he has begun finding people who know of Lamm as well.
The strange dark man, a messenger and subtle spy, whose shadow doesn't always move the same way he does. The tall huntsman that even the Guard comes to when they wanted someone found. The dwarf, the armorer whose sigil, a silver band in a perfect circle, seemed to give him divine power despite being a symbol of no god. And the tall golden-haired human, the man with the sword, who stands straight and seems to shoot light even in the darkness.
Ellie has scarcely met any of them, but through Professor Ettinsmoor she has given them a standing invitation to come by her Inn and chat with her after hours...
I'm good with the tie in, although it isn't the best fit for Walden.
The Professor isn't much of an organizer, nor is he typically very good with people per se. He tends to be too much in his head and a little too unobservant for that.
He might have picked a few people, or had somebody else do it for him (like a student!) but it likely wouldn't have been because he has "contacts."
It's interesting that the second last paragraph would be Eltanin's perspective of the others, whereas the Professor's would be something along the lines of, "yes, we'll need a sneaky one, and a fellow who can poke anything dangerous full of holes. Probably one of those tall, shiny like fellows. And a dwarf. Always need a dwarf for good luck."
Saw the Arcane Bond was changed, which was the signal I was looking for for a crunch update.
Stats: You're at a 22 Point Buy. Those 3 points could go a long way.
Traits: You've only got 1 trait. You may want to pick one up.
Skills & Speed: This one took me a while to figure out. You've got medium encumbrance cutting into all of your Dex and Str skills. I don't know if you want to keep this, considering we'll likely have some sort of base of operations, and you won't need to carry all of your gear at all times. You could leave it as is, or change it, either would work, I think.
Languages: You've got 7 languages, 5 beyond your two racial, but with an 18 int, I don't know where the extra one comes from.
Gear: Don't forget to mark that you have your spellbook. You'd hate to forget that, eh?
Looks pretty good otherwise.
Good point. Made a few modifications to the story that might make a better fit.
GM Birch, I may be misremembering, but did your original recruiting post say '2 Starting Feats, one regular & one campaign', or '2 starting TRAITS'? The latter makes more sense, but somehow I keep thinking it's the other way
There is ample room for confusion as in the early adventure paths, Paizo used the term feats when they meant what we have come to know as traits.
So, two traits (one should be campaign specific - from the player's guide) and as many feats as your character build dictates.
I'm going to start posting now. We can all tweak as we go along, but if you havn't picked a campaign trait, I'll assume you have - as it's what links you all - even if you agree not to know each other before the start...
Thanks Wilthorn.
The point buy was completely my error. I'd originally built Walden as a human and added the +2 to Int, then when I rebuilt him as a gnome apparently I forgot to redo all the numbers. Thanks.
The encumbrance is herolabs fault, I totally forgot to look at that. It's a result of carrying around a bunch of gold with me at the moment. I'll change it when I get home.
The other points I'm not too sure about, again, the character was built in Herolab, so I'll check them over tonight.