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Is there a black hole in the submissions room at Paizo?


Dungeon Magazine General Discussion

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Contributor

Can anyone please tell me what is going on at Paizo regarding submission proposals??????? I sincerely hope I'm not the only one that has been waiting an extremely long time to hear back from the editors. I have half a dozen proposals sent to them over the past 6 months that seem to be getting sucked into a vortex in the mail room.
I've recieved the response many other writers have probably also received about them being swamped with stuff with the new year. But, man, we're almost in April!
I hate to sound so... whiney (yes, I admit it!), but it's hard to keep plugging away like they tell you to when after half a year you haven't heard anything.
Are any other writers experiencing this, too? PLEASE, Paizo throw me a bone!

I still love you guys!


Steve Greer wrote:

Can anyone please tell me what is going on at Paizo regarding submission proposals??????? I sincerely hope I'm not the only one that has been waiting an extremely long time to hear back from the editors. I have half a dozen proposals sent to them over the past 6 months that seem to be getting sucked into a vortex in the mail room.

Are any other writers experiencing this, too? PLEASE, Paizo throw me a bone!

I still love you guys!

Steve -

You're not alone. And yes, it's frustrating... to be honest my husband is half ready to strangle me for my daily angst attack over my submissions. On the other hand, waiting means they haven't yet said no. A number of the published writers on these boards have assured me that this is normal, and I'm going to take them at their word. Seeing your post makes me quite nervous though, since, unless I'm mistaken, you belong to that group (Fiend's Embrace, right?).

I recently received my first rejection (from Dragon), and it set me back. But I have some new ideas and as soon as I'm comfortable doing so I'm going to write them up and send them.

I have a hard time plugging away not having heard anything too, but at least they haven't said 'no' to everything. Three queries and 4 campaign workbook articles still to hear something on, here's to hoping at least one gets a 'yes' or 'we'd like to see more'

- Ashavan

PS - If you've figured out a way to deal with the anxiety, please pass it along, as my husband would be indebted to you.

Marathon Voter 2013, Marathon Voter 2014

I generaly hear back from dragon at least once a month regarding the various queries and proposals I send thier way... This week I sent my first ever adventure proposals to Dungeon... I certainly hope I am still not waiting to hear back 6 months from now ;-)

Dark Archive Contributor

Steve Greer wrote:
PLEASE, Paizo throw me a bone!

The really easy way to find out about your proposals is to email us directly and ask. Don't be shy. We get tons of emails asking about outstanding proposals. :)

Of course, if you've already done that, feel free to keep bugging Jason (or James, or Jeremy, or whomever you were dealing with). Sometimes he's slow in the email response. Even to me! ;D

Dark Archive Contributor

Koldoon wrote:
I recently received my first rejection (from Dragon), and it set me back. But I have some new ideas and as soon as I'm comfortable doing so I'm going to write them up and send them.

Feel free to send them in right away! :) Don't let one (or two, or twenty) rejections get you down. Chances are it had nothing to do with you as a writer and everything to do with our needs. :)

Koldoon wrote:
I have a hard time plugging away not having heard anything too, but at least they haven't said 'no' to everything. Three queries and 4 campaign workbook articles still to hear something on, here's to hoping at least one gets a 'yes' or 'we'd like to see more'

Well I can't talk for those slow-pokes over at Dungeon, but we do an article proposals meeting at least once a month, where we sit down and go through all the queries and proposals. Feel free to send a polite email to Jason regarding the status of your outstanding proposals.

Koldoon wrote:
PS - If you've figured out a way to deal with the anxiety, please pass it along, as my husband would be indebted to you.

There ain't no cure for the waitin'-for-responses blues. Even I get 'em, and I only sit about 10 feet away from Jason and James. ;D

Contributor

Thanks, Mike. I feel slightly better ;)
I hope James or Jeremy can add their own 2-cents on behalf of the Dungeon staff.
Koldoon, I guess I'm a patient guy and I have a plentiful supply of pain killers. They make me happy! Seriously, though, I just keep writing, and writing, and writing, and writing, and writing... you get the picture. That's all I can suggest for the anxiety.
(Steve Greer does not condone the use of perscription drugs without the direction of a physician for those of you that may take that for anything other than a joke :D)


Personally, I blame that Mona fellow. I've heard reports from reliable sources that he walks around the office with a Dread Tharizdun costume on whilst wielding a Tentacle Rod that he uses to lash out randomly at the staff, who he calls, "Fuel for the Fires of the Dark Lord's Hate."

Is it any wonder, then, that they don't get around to looking at submissions?

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

Heh. Indeed.

The truth is that the editorial staff of Dragon has about one more full-time body on it, which means that they can afford to spend 40 more hours a week working on non-critical (meaning "something other than current issue emergencies") issues than can the Dungeon staff. That means the Dungeon staff sometimes goes more than a month before reviewing all of the queries sent to it.

On the positive side, it also tends to mean that tons of people hear back from us within a relatively similar period of time.

--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dragon & Dungeon


Mike McArtor wrote:
Steve Greer wrote:
PLEASE, Paizo throw me a bone!

The really easy way to find out about your proposals is to email us directly and ask. Don't be shy. We get tons of emails asking about outstanding proposals. :)

Of course, if you've already done that, feel free to keep bugging Jason (or James, or Jeremy, or whomever you were dealing with). Sometimes he's slow in the email response. Even to me! ;D

The problem is that we (or at least I) don't want to develop a reputation for being a bother. We know you get tons of those emails, and I'm sure many of them don't wait the month you request for queries, or the two months for a manuscript under revision... But when we do find out the Dungeon staff is backed up, how long should we be waiting before we ask again? And what about Campaign Workbook articles, for which there is little guidance - how long should we let those sit?

I don't want to get a reputation for being a nag about my proposals, but I also get really nervous when my proposal has been sitting for four months without a reply. I waited the month, and I was fine and completely understood that the holidays could get in the way. I waited another month and was assured that my proposal had been received and they'd get to it as soon as they could. I've now waited for two more months... should I be worrying? Should I bug Jeremy and James (again) with another request about the status? I don't want to push them - I'd hate for them to just say no because they're sick of hearing from me. I'm not in a rush, and I want my queries to get a fair look, so I don't want to push the process along and sacrifice that. At the same time, they're good ideas, they're MY good ideas, and I'd really love for them to see some good development - or simply scavenge what I can for use in yet more queries.

Personally, it's been good for me to hear that Steve has going through the same thing. Reminds me that I'm not alone in waiting.

- Ashavan


Mike McArtor wrote:
Feel free to send them in right away! :) Don't let one (or two, or twenty) rejections get you down. Chances are it had nothing to do with you as a writer and everything to do with our needs. :)

They're Dungeon queries, not Dragon queries... and I need to make sure I've got a good mix of villians, puzzles, and game balance before I send them out. I'm not waiting until *I'm* ready, but until the idea is well enough thought out that it might have a chance of getting through the first cut.

As for Dragon queries... believe it or not, these are harder for me. My writing skills don't shine in a paragraph that is trying to be too full of information.

- Ashavan

Contributor

Koldoon wrote:


The problem is that we (or at least I) don't want to develop a reputation for being a bother. We know you get tons of those emails, and I'm sure many of them don't wait the month you request for queries, or the two months for a manuscript under revision...

Ashavan - I bug Mike about outstanding articles roughly once a month. However, I've also managed to work up what I consider to be a very good working relationship with Mike in a fairly short period of time. Also, I never send an e-mail that's just me trying to find out about a past submission. I always try to include something else - either a new submission (if I have one), or at the very least another query. I don't think it matters much to Mike, but doing it that way at least makes me feel better about it. It started at first because I didn't want to seem like too much of a pest to Mike. Now, though, it just seems to be part of the cycle of e-mails he and I go through with the various queries and submissions.

I don't know if any of that helps at all. It has reminded me, though, that I have a bunch of outstanding articles I wanted to get done for Mike this weekend. ;)

John/Z


Steve Greer wrote:
Can anyone please tell me what is going on at Paizo regarding submission proposals??????? I sincerely hope I'm not the only one that has been waiting an extremely long time to hear back from the editors.

Trust me, you're not.

I have found myself coming up with new proposals to send in just to find out about the old ones from November, December and January (and now soon - February)....

The last few I sent with a little note asking that someone (anyone) just hit me back with an email to say they got it. "It's crap of course, but we got it." I'm still waiting. I figure if I drown them in submissions they'll seek revenge by asking me write a fifth of them over a long weekend. Or worse to stat and then review all the characters for that epic level adventure I sent them. The horror, the horror.

Erik Mona wrote:

The truth is that the editorial staff of Dragon has about one more full-time body on it, which means that they can afford to spend 40 more hours a week working on non-critical (meaning "something other than current issue emergencies") issues than can the Dungeon staff. That means the Dungeon staff sometimes goes more than a month before reviewing all of the queries sent to it.

On the positive side, it also tends to mean that tons of people hear back from us within a relatively similar period of time.

Mr. Mona, as to the position that needs filling over at Dungeon (Email Monkey I believe is the job title) - do you pay in product? - 'cause I'm deathy allergic to peanuts. ;) I could even forward you a character she--err resume - yeah, resume... with my stats--err...um...uh--qualifications.

GGG


It seems that I'm not alone in this situation. I have also been waiting over a year for a yes/no on an adventure from Dungeon. And though I hate being a pest every month, emailing them on a statis report, it seems that it is the only way to get any information.
After the one rewrite during this period, I have not heard anything concrete back yet and am in the situation that I am forgetting areas of the adventure already!
It has been nearly 18 months since proposal submission now, with one re-write inbetween. I have had good experiances with editoral staff in the past, but i think that writers would sleep easier at night if they knew why some decisions took so long.
True, Dungeon need not answer to the whims of their writers (and I don't think we expect them too). But sometimes we just need to be loved ;)


I read a post on EN World by, I think James Jacobs, that said that if Dungeon got no more submission for a year and a half, that they'd have enough material to fill that year and a half, so there is a big back-log of stuff.

My suggestion would be to then expand the magazine to include one more adventure...

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Woontal wrote:
It has been nearly 18 months since proposal submission now, with one re-write inbetween.

Woah... shoot me an email at dungeon@paizo.com, Woontal, and remind me which adventrue this is that we're sitting on. There's a lot out there that are several months waiting, but once something hits the 1 year mark without a decision... that starts to look like lazy editor syndrome.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Delglath wrote:

I read a post on EN World by, I think James Jacobs, that said that if Dungeon got no more submission for a year and a half, that they'd have enough material to fill that year and a half, so there is a big back-log of stuff.

My suggestion would be to then expand the magazine to include one more adventure...

It's true... assuming that all the adventures we've greenlit as of today come in, and assuming that they're all publishible, we won't be in trouble until May of 2006. Of course... that won't happen. Some of the writers will flake or vanish from the face of the earth, others will turn in adventrues that aren't as good as we hoped. And once in a while, someone'll come up with an idea that's either SUPER AWESOME or fits in perfect with an earlier issue's theme, in which case we squeeze it in there early.

As for expanding the magazine to include one more adventure... that'd be cool, but then I'd have to work 14-hour days and by the end of a month or two I'd be living in the crawlspace above my desk, catching my dinner with string and paperclips bent into crude hooks...


James Jacobs wrote:
As for expanding the magazine to include one more adventure... that'd be cool, but then I'd have to work 14-hour days and by the end of a month or two I'd be living in the crawlspace above my desk, catching my dinner with string and paperclips bent into crude hooks...

That still beats any given job in retail.

Gx3

Contributor

Well, I did manage to see a little light at the end of the tunnel recently. Nothing more than a mention of a writer's meeting in the next few weeks, but hey that's better than "Stop bugging us!"

Woontal, you've been waiting a year?! Oof-ah! I hope there's no more room in that crack your material fell between! Geez!

I agree, we do need to just be loved. I call for a "Dungeon Magazine Show The Writers Some Love" article! (Or just e-mail us.)


James Jacobs wrote:
As for expanding the magazine to include one more adventure... that'd be cool, but then I'd have to work 14-hour days and by the end of a month or two I'd be living in the crawlspace above my desk, catching my dinner with string and paperclips bent into crude hooks...

Right, so we can expect an extra adventure in each issue from now on then?

Delglath "I'm a typical Dungeon reader with high-expectations" Torquann.


Steve Greer wrote:
Well, I did manage to see a little light at the end of the tunnel recently. Nothing more than a mention of a writer's meeting in the next few weeks, but hey that's better than "Stop bugging us!"

Oooo, Mr. Greer if you can elaborate, please do.

G
G
G

Contributor

Heh! GGG, I would love to, but that really was the extent of the response I got! No paraphrasing or in-a-nut-shell on my part.


Steve Greer wrote:
Heh! GGG, I would love to, but that really was the extent of the response I got! No paraphrasing or in-a-nut-shell on my part.

Black hole - A region of spacetime from which nothing, not even light, can escape because gravity is so strong.

- The Universe in a Nutshell by Stephen Hawking.

-g3


I sent in one Dungeon submission, and heard back from Master James Jacobs very quickly--and he took the time to detail in an email why my adventure needed work. I really appreciated that, since you rarely see that with other editors. And no, I'm not kissing up. And I'll have your car waxed by Saturday, Mr. Jacobs! :>

Seriously, I work as a freelance writer, and waiting a *year* to hear back from editors isn't unheard of. Once I sell my fantasy novel and make millions, I promise to name names and point fingers.

Marathon Voter 2013, Marathon Voter 2014

sell fanatasy novel... make millions... :::choke:::snort:::laugh:::

thats a good one.

Contributor

My dreams are much more modest and realistic. I plan on selling my fantasy novel and making thousands. :-p

-Amber S.


cwslyclgh wrote:

sell fanatasy novel... make millions... :::choke:::snort:::laugh:::

thats a good one.

I know, I know: but if it wasn't for delusion and denial, I'd never get out of bed in the morning.


Medesha wrote:

My dreams are much more modest and realistic. I plan on selling my fantasy novel and making thousands. :-p

-Amber S.

Mine are even more realistic. I plan on completing my fantasy novel and making my partner read it.


Medesha wrote:

My dreams are much more modest and realistic. I plan on selling my fantasy novel and making thousands. :-p

-Amber S.

My dreams are even more modest than that. All I want to know is whether they received my submission. Nevermind accepting it - is it physically or virtually present.

To quote:
The Waiting (Part 1)
An editor should reply to your query within one month of its receipt, and probably a good deal sooner. If you have not heard back after a month, please feel free to contact us again and ask for an update. The simple truth is that sometimes a submission gets misplaced, so we're happy to hear from you after four weeks of waiting.

Now I realize that they have enough new stuff to fill up the mag until two May's from now. I also realize that there is A LOT of work necessary to produce the solid magazine that is Dungeon (and the Adeventure Path book as well). And while I don't want to see anyone have to resort to living under their desk like those folks at EA, I do have to point out that the above quote was taken from (what I believe is) the most up to date submission guidelines By the Dungeon Staff.

As for the millions - That happens after the movie deal with Peter Jackson.

Just make the check out to "Cash,"
I hope it's at least Three Gs.

Contributor

Iskander wrote:
Mine are even more realistic. I plan on completing my fantasy novel and making my partner read it.

I've already accomplished that bit, so I had to move on to grander dreams. :-)

-Amber S.

Contributor

Great Green God wrote:
Medesha wrote:

My dreams are much more modest and realistic. I plan on selling my fantasy novel and making thousands. :-p

-Amber S.

My dreams are even more modest than that. All I want to know is whether they received my submission. Nevermind accepting it - is it physically or virtually present.

To quote:
The Waiting (Part 1)
An editor should reply to your query within one month of its receipt, and probably a good deal sooner. If you have not heard back after a month, please feel free to contact us again and ask for an update. The simple truth is that sometimes a submission gets misplaced, so we're happy to hear from you after four weeks of waiting.

Now I realize that they have enough new stuff to fill up the mag until two May's from now. I also realize that there is A LOT of work necessary to produce the solid magazine that is Dungeon (and the Adeventure Path book as well). And while I don't want to see anyone have to resort to living under their desk like those...

You go, Medesha!

Well spoken, GGG. Too bad we can't make them stick to that like getting pizza in 30 minutes or less or it's free. I think this is more like a statement of their good intentions. You know, like, "This year I'm going to the gym at least 3 times a week," or "This is the year I quit smoking." You know what they say about good intentions and the road to hell...


I know it has the wording "should get back" to the author of the submission so my case won't hold up in court but still...

Ah well, I guess I could always get back to that fantasy novel I've been writing. :)

GGG


Great Green God wrote:

I know it has the wording "should get back" to the author of the submission so my case won't hold up in court but still...

GGG

Methinks that if I was in the position of the ladies and gents at Dungeon methinks that I would be very busy all the time as well. It falls upon us to be tolerant and patient...sure, sometimes I like the walls with frustration, chew on the wallpaper a little, and perhaps even the once was seen with plaster between my teeth...but don't we all at one time or another?

Paizo Employee Publisher, Chief Creative Officer

We finished the Great Dungeon Adventure Meeting at approximately 6:40 PM this evening. Of the dozens and dozens of proposals that arrived over the course of the last three months or so, we decided to give the green light to something like eight or nine adventures. Young Jeremy Walker has the final tally, and will begin contacting authors as soon as tomorrow.

With the process fresh in my mind (but with many of the details regarding specific queries already forgotten), I thought I'd share some thoughts about what makes a good adventure and what, alternatively, tends to turn us off.

The most important piece of advice that I can offer is to try to blow our socks off. You've got two pages, which isn't a lot of space. Assume that we read about a dozen of these things a week, and try to go for an idea that sets your adventure out from the crowd.

The easiest way to make this impact is to choose a really exciting setting for the adventure. Think about locations that DMs will enjoy imagining and weaving into their campaigns. Even if your adventure doesn't work for a dozen other reasons, a submission centered around a novel location will grab our attention. If an editor gets fixated on seeing, for example, a dungeon built inside a melting glacier, he's going to argue passionately for it.

Try to make the editorial staff passionate advocates for your adventure.

Often, we will request changes to the basic premise but insist upon the preservation of a specific element that caught our attention in the first place. If you want to sell more ideas to us, try to aim for these attention-grabbing elements. The chance of an adventure getting into the magazine is directly related to the number of times we think 'oh, cool" while reading the query. Aim for getting us to say it out loud.

Let it be heard: We need Eberron proposals like we need an administrative assistant. Which is to say: desperately. :)

Pay careful attention to what we've printed over the last year or so. We strive to avoid repeating major monsters or themes within 20 issues or so, so be mindful of the archive. Unfortunately, the depressing side of this from the freelancer's point of view is that we've currently got scheduled at least two dozen adventures, and you can't repeat major elements from those, either.

There is a certain element of luck involved.

If you're turned down, keep submitting. Don't let rejection get you down. We now commonly publish authors who have flooded our mailboxes with queries and ideas before we ever asked for an article in return. Some of them now justly enjoy strong reputations as favorite contributors by the staff and by the readers.

Learn from the misfires. Keep trying.

--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dragon and Dungeon


Erik Mona wrote:
The most important piece of advice that I can offer is to try to blow our socks off.

That's disgusting! There's no chance in Hell or the Abyss that I'm about to get down on my hands and knees and do that!

Erik Mona wrote:
Think about locations that DMs will enjoy imagining and weaving into their campaigns.

I thought Dungeon was a PG-13 rated magazine?

Erik Mona wrote:
Try to make the editorial staff passionate advocates for your adventure.

Hmph, last time I tried that, you put a restraining order on me!

Erik Mona wrote:
If you want to sell more ideas to us, try to aim for these attention-grabbing elements.

And when I tried that, you had me charged with indecent exposure!

Erik Mona wrote:
Let it be heard: We need Eberron proposals like we need an administrative assistant. Which is to say: desperately. :)

But... Eberron sucks...

Erik Mona wrote:
Pay careful attention to what we've printed over the last year or so.

You actually expect us to BUY the magazine? Sheesh!

Erik Mona wrote:
If you're turned down, keep submitting. Don't let rejection get you down.

Well again, you really should let people know that there is a limit, I mean, I really wasn't expecting that restraining order after you told me this.

Erik Mona wrote:
Learn from the misfires. Keep trying.

That's what my wife said. Didn't work for her either...

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Card Game Subscriber

I just wanted to say thank you for the update. It is refreshing to see an editor with the hands-on approach, taking time out of the day to keep the masses up to date on what is happening.

With luck, one of my proposals made the cut. If not, there are new days and new ideas. Patience, perseverance, and my stubborn-minded ways keep me in the game. There are no doubts that my work will pay off someday. I think of it as a matter of "when" not "if". Hopefully that does not come across as arrogance.

Thank you again for the update. :)

Brian Patterson aka d20monkey


Delglath wrote:
That's disgusting! There's no chance in Hell or the Abyss that I'm about to get down on my hands and knees and do that!

And you weren't expecting a restaining order?

GGG


Erik Mona wrote:
Let it be heard: We need Eberron proposals like we need an administrative assistant. Which is to say: desperately. :)

Well hell, I'll just have to re-write all those beholders in that one submission into a-um warforged. Yeah, floating multi-eyed warforged with like ten or eleven wands. And those doppelgangers? They were changlings in disguise. I can see it all now.

You want Eberron - hell you want Star Wars adventures I can adjust. Hmm, floating mult-eyed wookies with force powers - oh yeah, I'm so there!

That of course means buying another source book (looks at three shelving units of unboxed game matierial) - yeah, like who's going to notice. ;)

GGG

Contributor

Despite years and years of DMing, I've never gotten the "trick" of writing prepared adventures. Feedback like this is enormously helpful. Thanks, Erik!

-Amber S.


Erik Mona wrote:
We finished the Great Dungeon Adventure Meeting at approximately 6:40 PM this evening. Of the dozens and dozens of proposals that arrived over the course of the last three months or so, we decided to give the green light to something like eight or nine adventures. Young Jeremy Walker has the final tally, and will begin contacting authors as soon as tomorrow.

Are they only proposals or also the full 198 page submissions that you have green lighted? Some of us are looking for the good news regarding to already completed and submitted manuscripts as well.

Contributor

I'll be crossing my fingers (and toes!). It's good to hear something from you guys, Erik. Thanks for the update. Hmmmm... I hope the one I submitted that takes place partially in the Underworld of Hades makes the cut. Its got Cerberus in it, man!

Contributor

Woontal wrote:


Are they only proposals or also the full 198 page submissions that you have green lighted? Some of us are looking for the good news regarding to already completed and submitted manuscripts as well.

We have also determined the status of all the manuscripts we have received, so emails concerning those will go out with all the rest.

Speaking of email, our email server is still down (as of 5pm PDT today) so all those emails will have to wait at least another day.

Thank you all for waiting so patiently for news on your submission.

One final caveat, this meeting concerned only submissions that we had received up through about three weeks ago. If you sent us your submission after that, a final answer on it will probably have to wait until our next submissions meeting. Our eventual goal is to have one of those a month, but for quick reference, the meeting previous to the one we just had took place before Christmas last year, so please continue to be patient.


Erik Mona wrote:
Let it be heard: We need Eberron proposals like we need an administrative assistant. Which is to say: desperately. :)

Well then, if you need an admin assistant that badly, I'll put in my CV. Of course you'll have to put up with my horrific accent, tirade of 'cobbers', 'diggers', 'gdays' and 'flamin gallahs' all the time....

Contributor

Erik Mona wrote:
Of the dozens and dozens of proposals that arrived over the course of the last three months or so, we decided to give the green light to something like eight or nine adventures. Young Jeremy Walker has the final tally, and will begin contacting authors as soon as tomorrow.

In case anyone is extremely curious, the final tally for accepted adventure proposals was eleven.

Contributor

Jeremy Walker wrote:

Speaking of email, our email server is still down (as of 5pm PDT today) so all those emails will have to wait at least another day.

Thank you all for waiting so patiently for news on your submission.

Acchhh! Cramps! (Sweat breaking out on my forehead) I don't know if I can cross my fingers and toes that long. Man!

Well, at least 11 accepted proposals is better than 8 or 9. I'll have to consult the oddmakers here in Vegas... Hmmmm... Its not looking good.


Jeremy Walker wrote:
Erik Mona wrote:
Of the dozens and dozens of proposals that arrived over the course of the last three months or so, we decided to give the green light to something like eight or nine adventures. Young Jeremy Walker has the final tally, and will begin contacting authors as soon as tomorrow.
In case anyone is extremely curious, the final tally for accepted adventure proposals was eleven.

Jeremy -

I don't suppose there's any word on Campaign Workbook submissions? I know a lot of us are waiting to hear on those as well, and was hoping you might be able to tell us whether those were looked at also.

Thanks!

- Ashavan


Steve Greer wrote:


Well, at least 11 accepted proposals is better than 8 or 9. I'll have to consult the oddmakers here in Vegas... Hmmmm... Its not looking good.

Steve -

I know what you mean... knowing an answer is coming also means knowing some rejections are on the way. Even if one or two of my queries made the cut, I know others of mine didn't.

Good luck everyone.

- Ashavan

Contributor

Koldoon wrote:


I don't suppose there's any word on Campaign Workbook submissions? I know a lot of us are waiting to hear on those as well, and was hoping you might be able to tell us whether those were looked at also.

Campaign Workbooks are a somewhat different animal. We didn't look at those in the previous meeting, and we tend to look at those on more of an individual basis in any case.

That being said, I do have a bunch of emails to send out about campaign workbook proposals as well, I just haven't had a chance yet (between deadlines and email server problems). Still, answers are coming.


Eberron adventures, eh? No problem!

I have this great idea--called SHARN CITY. It's about all these rough characters, lots of dames and master inquisitives running about. And it's all in black and white, with bits of colour here and there, you know, for emphasis, and...

(Hook comes across screen, pulls poster off by neck)


I recently started looking for back issues of Dungeon and seeing what kind of deals I can get on Ebay. I recently won a copy of #44 and decided that the Editorial would be particularly fitting for this conversation and those looking to submit to Dungeon.

(I hope I am not breaking any copyrights by posting this and if so, I am sincerly sorry)

"I'm Ted James Thomas Zuvich(1), a fairly regular contributor to DUNGEON(R) Adventures. My published adventures include "Courier Service" (issue #27), "The Siege of Kratys Freehold" (issue #33), and "Old Man Katan" (issue #41). Barbara asked me to write this because she thought you would be interested in what I went through to get me latest adventure published.

"I first submitted a proposal for "A Hot Day in L'Trel" in September 1987 [edit: issue #44 was the Nov/Dec 1993 issue], under the unremarkable title of "Fire!" Barbara requested a copy of the completed manuscript. I panicked. I didn't have a completed version of the manuscript, but I hurriedly typed one up, scratched together a map, and sent the package in. A month later, I got back a manuscript covered in red ink, and a long letter containing a list of susggested revisions.

"That first letter was the beginning of a long series of revisions. How many rewrites, exactly? I'm not sure. I did at least two rewrites every year, from 1987 to 1993--at least six that I sent in. I playtested more than ten versions, and "L'Trel" was even part of an informal tournament at one point.

"Why bother? Mainly because I really liked the idea behind "L'Trel." The adventure was just too ambitious for a totally inexperienced writer to pull off. Secondly, I never quite got a full rejection. Barbara never sent me a letter saying, "I never want to see this again." Once, however, she suggested I put "L'Trel" aside for a while and focus my energy on something else(2). So I did, and it worked. After I'd sold two modules, I asked Barbara if she wanted to see "L'Trel" again. She did(3). I sold two more adventures before "L'Trel" was finally accepted in late 1992, making it the longest-gestating module published in DUNGEON Adventures (so far).

"Persist(4). If your first idea doesn't work out, try another one. Sooner or later, your fire will start.

Ted James Thomas Zuvich

(1) At first we though Ted was two people: Ted James and Thomas Zuvich. Later, we realized he is triplets.
(2) That WAS a full rejection.
(3) What else could I do? By that time, Ted was like family.
(4) Well, Maybe not as hard as Ted did. I'm not sure I could go through this again."

Anyway... just thought you all would like to see that some things never change.

Sean Mahoney


Interesting. "Old Man Katan", "A Hot Day in L'Trel" and "Courier Service" were some of my favourite adventures in Dungeon and ones which I stole several ideas from for use in my own games (I've only ever run one module and it didn't work out... but I steal plenty of material from them).

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