Issue #274 Powerplay- Touch attack spells+Improved unarmed strike?


Dragon Magazine General Discussion


In the issue,
the "powerplay" told me my monk/wizard can punch someone while using a touch attack spell.
If he hits, the target suffer the unarmed attack damage and the spell,right?

What happen if he miss?
Can I say my roll result to excel the target's touch AC,
so he "touch" the target, and my touch spell still work?

Or as my DM says, when I attack, I choose one form, melee attack or melee touch attack, not both.
When I choose unarmed attack, I must face the target's total AC, no matter their source.
If I miss, so be it. No thing happens.
Is he right? Do I break the rules?

Where can I find some evidence to convince him or myself?
Thanks in advance!

Liberty's Edge

If you are attempting to deal unarmed strike damage and deliver a touch spell, you make a single attack roll. If the attack roll exceeds the target's total AC, you deal both the spell damage and the unarmed strike damage.

You cannot discharge the spell if you fail to hit the normal AC.

However, because it is a touch spell, you retain the charge. You may try again on your next action (or if you have multiple attacks, try again the same turn). Your next attack could be a touch attack (in which case you do not deal the unarmed strike damage) to avoid missing again.

Hope that helps. If you really need clear evidence I'll go looking for it, but I'd rather not.


I would like to point out however that really what the dm says should go. If the Dm says that in his world, magic missles take the form of the zodiac sign of their caster.... then they do. If A Dm decides such things represent abuse in his game then he is within his rights to disallow them. There are no set rules for missing a target with your axe and getting it stuck in a tree (at least that I know of) but in my games it has happened. As long as things are consistant then it's fair. If after the game you can convince the DM otherwise, then keep an eye out for "quickened touch spell wizard-monks" who will surely inhabit the next forgotten temple you decide to explore.

As an aside, couldnt any touch spell attack be combined with say a grapple attack or a trip or anything else? It would seem to me that at the very least a concentration check might be in order.


As always, something like that would be up to the DM, but the grapple or trip does seem to be allowed by the rules for holding a charge. "If you touch anyone or anything while holding a charge, even unintentionally, the spell discharges."(PH141) Making a grapple or a trip attack, while unarmed at least, should discharge the spell, but should also provoke attacks of opportunity if you don't posess the requisite feats/abilities,(Improved Grab or Grapple, Improved Trip) just as it would if you tried to deliver a touch spell with an unarmed strike if you did not posess the Improved Unarmed Strike feat. In those instances, a Concentration check would probably be in order if the attack of opportunity succeeded, giving the caster a chance to lose both his spell and and his grapple/trip attempt. Success of the trip or grapple would not affect the discharge of the spell, just the intial touch attack, although the right spell could alter the outcome of your grapple or touch; i.e., chill touch possibly lowering your opponents Strength by 1, possibly lowering his Strength bonus. All of this should also apply to a bull rush, disarm(for most weapons), or overrun.

Of course, I'm not so sure on the Concentration check. The spell is already cast, and you don't have to concentrate to maintain it. Of course, a DM may rule that this falls under the "touch anything, even unintentionally rule," making the charge automatically discharge, although on who or what would also be up to the DM.

So, in short, yes, it should work. Unless your DM says no.


So here's how I've been handling this: improved unarmed strike + touch attack spell. PC makes one attack roll: if roll beats normal AC, unarmed damage+ spell damage. If roll misses normal AC and still beats touch AC then it's just spell damage (e.g. strike didn't hit square enough to be a damaging atk but still made touch contact for spell). If atk misses both, no harm done charge is still held till any contact is made. I think this is a fair ruling. However if a combatant is holding a charge and rolls a 1 the spell auto hits caster, regardless of confirmation.
With grapples I would say a concentration check is in order but if made touch spell hits.

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