Legendary Shifters (PFRPG) PDF

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Legendary Shifters is the latest volume in our series of class-focused player supplements, this time focusing on the the mercurial shifters! This base class, introduced in Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Ultimate Wilderness, was designed to be the ultimate shapeshifting character, allowing players to take a variety of forms in the blink of an eye. Legendary Shifters works to further embody this concept with a redesign of the class that gives even greater freedom to transform into whatever you wish at a moment’s notice. With an updated version of wild shape dubbed shifter shape, legendary shifters can not only take different forms more easily, but also change between their forms without hesitation! In addition, this book contains a ton of new archetypes to help your shifter take the form you want them to, from the furious Dragon Touched to the tricky and capricious Fey Shifter. The insidious Mimickin allows for transformation into regular objects, while Necromorphs are focused on both transforming into and raising the dead. And if even more variety is required, the Polymorph Savant prestige class allows for almost infinitely varied shapeshifting, with access to a plethora of different forms. Plus, tons of new feats, spells, and more! Grab this 32-page Pathfinder Roleplaying Game class supplement from N. Jolly and Siobhan Bjorknas today and Make Your Game Legendary!

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****½ (based on 5 ratings)

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Improvement over the vanilla shifter, lesser than a druid

***( )( )

Typed a long post but got error due to 30 minutes limitation. I'll just make it short here.

The legendary shifter is limited to basic beast and magical beast form, unavailable to elemental nor plant. So while you can get an ability that allows you to do chimeric animal aspects, you cannot combine beast shape with either elemental nor plant.

Elemental nexus feels like a kinetic stuck with elemental fist with less tricks but elemental body. It loses the chimeric ability so one cannot combine the elemental together, and from the wording it seems there are only the base 4 elemental available.

Dragon archetype is stuck with one elemental (scale color). The giant archetype loses the ability to change into any animals other than a giant, unlike a goliath druid who has a limited selections of animals other than giant to choose from.

Overall I would say the book is an improvement over the vanilla ultimate wilderness shifter, but feels lesser lacking in shape choices than a druid.


Finally, the Shifter we deserve.

*****

I won't go into detail on the specifics of the class as other reviewers have done a great job of summarizing everything in this PDF. Instead I just want to thank the author for providing a fun, well-balanced class that captures everything I loved about the D&D 3.0 Shifter and Master of Many Forms, updating the concepts for Pathfinder, fixing all the wonkey stuff, and delivering a martial master of shape shifting! If you were like me and was disappointed in the Ultimate Wilderness Shifter, then this class is for you. As if the base class wasn't great enough, the PDF also includes some great archetypes and a very cool prestige class. Want to play an elemental shifter? A fey shifter? You like Attack on Titan and want to play a Pathfinder version of Eren Yeager? You can do it. Want to play living objects, an ooze, or a dragon shifter? You can do it. Buy this PDF. You will not be disappointed!


*****

So if you had any issues with the old shifter, this fixes them. The change to wildshape, the unique archetypes, the new class features, they're all amazing. It's kind of awesome to see how the base of this class was taken and made into something that actually does what you'd want from the class. Five stars, easy.


Fantastic class with amazing archtypes

*****

I love shapeshifting. Back in the day I played a Master of Many forms who was one of my favorite characters ever, my favorite SoP class is the Shifter, and the entire concept of someone who can change their form to fit the occasion is awesome to me. You can imagine my delight when I heard that Paizo was making a class solely based around shapeshifting, and you could understand my disappointment when the class turned out to be a dumpster fire that was outclassed at its own job by a Wisdom-dumping Druid. Luckily, as with Kineticist before it, I can rely on Legendary Games to make it not just useable, but flavorful and fun.

The Legendary Shifter class can Wildshape (or Shifter Shape, as its now known)from level one, with a limited list for the first few levels to keep shenanigans to a minimum. The addition of bonus feats, more accessible aspects, a bite to go with the claws, and the ability to turn into a magical beast at later levels make it much more flexible than base Shifter without breaking the game. The class is fantastic at what it does, and is full of flavor, but I've gotta say it is outshined in my eyes by the incredible archetypes.

The Bound Beastmaster gains an animal companion, the ability to share aspects with it, and eventually allows your pet to shapeshift with you. Add in the fact that you give your pet your natural attack damage is icing on the cake for this neat archetype.

Dragon Touched allowes you to turn into dragon from level one (with major limitations to keep you from destroying everything), and trades natural attack damage and aspects for a breath weapon and draconic features. A minor error, Draconic Shape says it alters Shifter Shape, but the wording of the ability and the prerequisites of later feats make it obvious that it actually replaces it.

I'm usually not a fan of elemental archetypes, as they usually boil down to "trade good stuff for situational bonuses and an energy attack." Luckily, the Elemental Nexus is above and beyond all that garbage. Giving you Kineticist goodies and allowing you to become an elemental without hampering your regular Shifter Shape very much is just great, and you eventually get Expanded Element so that you're not a one-trick pony.

Fairy Shifter splices you with a Hunter, trading BAB and d10 hit dice for hunter casting. Fairy Shape cleverly prevents you from flying at level one, and being based off Charisma is a downgrade but not a major one. A solid archetype, but not one I think I'd use very much.

Giant Shifter says "Screw that!" to shapeshifting and instead gets big, to a maximum of Colossal at 20th level. Shifter's Edge is not a great option with this one, as it takes a hit to Dex when it embiggens. A fun archetype that lends itself well to martial multiclassing without being too overpowered. I wan to build one side-by-side with a Resizer from SoP to see how they compare.

A Lycanthropic Warrior is exactly what it says on the tin. Becoming a hybrid monster and gaining DR/Silver is pretty neat, and being immune to actual lycanthopy is a nice touch.

Metamorphic Genius is what the Metamorph Alchemist wishes it could be. Being Int-based and getting alchemy is well worth the hit to HD and BAB, and it really feels like a Master of Many Forms to me. A big hit with me!

Mimickin is f*cking perfect and I will fight anyone who disagrees. It literally lets you play a Dark Souls style mimic! What more could you want? Having said that you'll definitely get much better use out of it in an urban campaign than a wilderness one.

Mystically Trained is the tiniest, simplest archetype ever and I respect it for that. Trade bonus feats and trackless step for Ranger casting. Oddly, the flavor implies it affects aspects when it clearly doesn't. A holdover from an earlier version, perhaps?

Necromorph lets you be an undead abomination and animate the dead as a SLA. I love how it keeps you from going crazy with it and makes them temporary if you don't shill out the required onyx. Eventually gives you Hide in Plain Sight and the capstone is Lichdom.

Now we come to my favorite archetype in the book, the Oozeling. My favorite character from 3.0 was an Oozemaster, and ever since I've been looking to fill a slimy hole in my heart. I honestly got physically angry when I saw the Oozemorph Shifter, which actively punished you for having the GALL to play an ooze-themed character. Luckily, the Oozeling takes the Oozemorph out behind the shed and blows its brains out with a shotgun like it deserves. An oozy base form with Compression, an abundance of natural attacks, and swapping out Magical Beast forms with Oozes makes for a damn fine archetype. Another archetype that doesn't benefit much from Shifter's Edge, as the Ooze Form gives a hefty Dex penalty.

The Protean Mutant is another archetype I absolutely love, Being completely customizeable by replacing Shifter Shape with evolution points. I don't have as much to say one this one besides "I love it and I'm making my next Big Bad one."

Next we come to the Prestige Class, the Master of M- I mean the Polymorph Savant. It's great and I love it, mainly because it does what I feel all Prestige Classes should do: it gives you a viable alternative without being the end-all-be-all. Not every Shifter needs to take this class, but the ones that do will find that they can turn into pretty much anything ever.

The feats are pretty great, allowing you to shift into humanoids, key yourself off of Charisma, or synergize with other class levels you may take. The Object Form spells are there mostly to keep in line with the Mimickin, but they seem perfectly functional and a good addition to a caster's arsenal. Rounding out the PDF is a sample character, who seems decently built at a glance but I haven't really taken a good look at.

So after vomiting all these words at the poor unsuspecting review page, all I have left to say is BUY THIS. IT GOOD. DO IT.


A wonderful, wonderful class

*****

The latest entry in Legendary Games 'Legendary Heroes' line, Legendary Shifters is 32 pages long, of which things like the table of contents, back and front covers, and OGL leave twenty-five pages for the actual content. But they are twenty-five well-used pages.

Recently Paizo released their Ultimate Wilderness book. A major selling point to many was the promise of a martial class based around shapeshifting called the shifter. Many people had their own expectations of what the class would be and not quite all were met. In this PDF Legendary Games, which has already created and re-created some amazing classes like the swashbuckler, gunslinger, and kineticist, gives us their re-imagining of the shifter. And a very amazing and delightful re-imagining it is.

The class itself is still a martial class, but things are different from the start. It can wild shape starting at first level, and they are not limited to forms derived from their aspects. It lasts slightly longer than a druid's, as they add their wisdom bonus to hours-per-level duration. They can also shapeshift from one form directly to another wild shape at the cost of some of their per-day duration. The legendary shifter gets faster at shapeshifting as they rise in level, eventually doing it as an immediate action. They are normally limited to animal and magical beast forms with a size range of diminutive to huge, but some archetypes and feats give ways around that.

They still get aspects, and as they rise in level can combine two or even three of them. They can also combine their aspects with their wild shape forms or any polymorph effects, and they get a few more aspects as they level up.

Instead of just claws they can use fangs as well with all these natural weapons being primary attacks that ignore magical DR. If they use weapons, however, their natural attacks become secondary. They get more powerful over time in terms of both what types of DR they can penetrate and how much damage they do, topping out at 2d10 at level 20. Size has no effect on the damage they do: a shifter can become a dire bear or a mouse and they'll still do the same damage. The shifter can apply their natural weapon level benefits to whatever natural weapons they may possess in their wild shaped forms. I like that as it encourages the shifter to wild shape while permitting them to keep the improved natural weapons the class grants. It is unclear, however, if the Improved Natural Attack feat can be applied to the shifter's claws and fangs.

The legendary shifter still gets wild empathy and track, and defensive instinct. It provides an untyped bonus to AC and CMD, full Wisdom bonus if unarmored and without a shield, half the bonus if armored. The bonus increases every fourth level and applies against touch attacks and when the legendary shifter is flat-footed. They get woodland stride and trackless step at later levels.

The legendary shifter now gets bonus combat or wild shape feats starting at fourth level. And unsurprisingly, their keystone ability is the ability to shapeshift at will. They also gain the shapeshifter subtype and are only affected by transmutation affects when they allow it.

The basic class information is followed by an expanded list of aspects. The old ones are all here and the new aspects of Chameleon, Narwhal, Porcupine, and Shark are listed with their full benefits. Chameleon makes you stealthier, Narwhal provides a gore attack, Porcupine inflicts damage on anyone striking you in melee combat, and Shark increases the damage you inflict on wounded opponents.

Then comes the new archetypes, and here we get some truly glorious ones. The Bound Beastmaster gains an animal companion. She increases its natural weaponry damage rather than hers, though she still gets the base claw and fang damage, and over time can share both her aspects and her wild shape with her companion. Dragon Touched get a breath weapon in place of claws, improved senses and wings as they level up. They can also wild shape into a small dragon at first level. Their form is limited in several ways at first – not as many attacks and no flight speed. However it improves over time until they can finally become a huge dragon. They start out with one type of dragon they can become but eventually become capable of turning into three different dragons, gaining their breath weapons as well.

The Elemental Kineticist gains some of the kineticist class abilities including kinetic blast, though only when done as a kinetic fist. They can transform into elementals and gain a few wild talents as they grow in power. The Fairy Shifter can wild shape into fey. They can also cast druid and ranger spells up to 6th level at the cost of a reduced hit die and lowered BAB.

The Giant Shifter turns, well, into a giant. Very simple and straightforward but if you have the room and want to crush your enemies underfoot it works wonderfully.

The Lycanthropic Warrior gets fewer aspects and a smaller pool to choose new ones from. They also lose defensive instinct and gain DR/silver equal to half their character level as well as immunity to lycanthropy. They can also use a hybrid form of their base and alternate forms, with legs to walk on, hands to hold with, and they are able to talk. They also keep their gear. I think this archetype is going to be popular.

The Metamorphic Genius has a reduced BAB and hit die, and uses intelligence rather then wisdom for defensive instinct. In exchange they get alchemy and extracts as the alchemist class, together with a reduced level requirement for any transmutation extract the alchemist can normally use and extended duration on them all. And a limited number of times per day they can change the form granted by one extract either to another one permitted by it or to one granted by another extract of equal or lower level. I recall some people wanting a shapeshifting-focused warrior-like alchemist, here they get one.

The Mimickin turns you into a Mimic. No, really. You can secrete glue, turn into objects, and eventually swallow people whole. Plus you get improved Disguise and Stealth skills. The somewhat similar Oozeling turns you into an Ooze, allowing you to resume your normal form whenever you like. You can't become a magical beast but you eventually turn into a Huge ooze. You get other oozy abilities as you level up as well. These two are so bizarre people are going to love them.

Probably the simplest and shortest Pathfinder archetype I've ever seen is the Mystically Trained one. You lose your bonus feats and trackless step in exchange for ranger spells.

The Necromorph is as the name suggests undead-related. You lose your aspects in exchange for getting the ability to cast a few spells to create and control undead. You gain 'undead empathy' that can be used with mindless undead and can transform into vaguely humanoid shaped undead. You can eventually turn into incorporeal undead, though your duration takes a serious and game-balancing bite if you do. Creepily, instead of woodland stride you learn how to preserve the body of anyone you kill with a natural attack for later reanimation. You also can hide in plain sight and eventually become a lich.

Protean Mutants lose aspects but gain evolutions like a summoner's eidolon. He gains a small pool he can use even on his base form and a larger one he can use on his alternate form. The former points can be changed every 24 hours and the latter whenever he changes his form. A bizarre archetype that will be a big hit with everyone who ever loved the summoner.

Last comes the Polymorph Savant prestige class. If the legendary shifter can become animals and magical beasts, this can become just about anything. Vermin, monstrous humanoids, ooze, fey, plant, dragon, you name it. If you truly want to become anything and everything this is for you.

There are some new feats. Animal Spirit allows you to use Charisma rather then Wisdom to determine any shifter class effects. You can also add your Charisma bonus to your Will save instead of Wisdom, up to a limit equal to your shifter level. Basic Alteration allows you to become a Small or Medium humanoid with shifter shape, and to speak in all your forms. I love those two. Bestial Roots permits many of the archetypes to transform into animals like the base legendary shifter. Miniature Reach allows you to treat your natural reach as 5 feet even when size Tiny or smaller. The last three feats – Morphic Berserker, Morphic Lyricist, and Morphic Stalker – all allow you to combine levels in barbarian, bard (and I assume skald), or stalker with your legendary shifter levels to determine things like your defensive instinct bonus and how long you can rage, use bardic performance, or the bonus studied combat provides. Berserker also allows you to use Intimidate to demoralize as a free action when you active both rage and your shifter shape in the same round. Lyricist permits you to speak, spellcast, and use bardic performances while under a polymorph effect. And Stalker lets you use shifter shape as an immediate action whenever a studied target makes an attack roll against you.

There are also three new polymorph spells, object form I-III. They do what you think and turn you into an object. Sadly they don't let you become a golem or construct but statues count as objects too. The PDF ends with a sample character, Ines, who has a backstory and a fey-like love of mischief that can make her both a useful if fickle ally and a maddening antagonist as required.

In conclusion? I love this one. Good as the original shifter may be this is a wonderful improvement while still keeping with the simplicity of the original class design. Everything that needs to be explained is, and clearly. And it is just plain fun. Want to become an animal, a dragon, an undead, an ooze, a statue? There are options here for all of them and more besides. Legendary Shifter is an amazing improvement on the original class and leaves me hoping we may get a few more archetypes for the class from Legendary Games or someone else. A new Fiendflesh or Verdant shifter, perhaps? Maybe a Hagskin or something else monstrous humanoid focused?

Seriously though this one has you covered if you want martial or arcane or improved druidic/natural shapeshifting. It's like getting half a dozen new classes with the same central theme but all-new angles on it.

If you want shapeshifting action for your character or campaign, if you're just curious, maybe even if you don't think you'd ever need it, GET THIS ONE. Five stars and one of the heartiest recommendations I've ever given.



1 person marked this as a favorite.

I got this one this morning, and all I can say for now is that if you were even slightly dissatisfied with the 'official' Shifter class, you want this. You may want it even if you love the official Shifter. It is AMAZING.

Much fuller review to come later!

Silver Crusade

7 people marked this as a favorite.

And as always, it's time for my dev post on rebuilding this class.

Legendary Shifter
So how does one go about doing a rebuild? The first thing I did was give shifting at 1st level, because to me, holding a key class feature until 4th level makes anyone playing at level 1-3 not feel like they're playing the class, and that's something I really didn't like. To balance this, the forms being able to be taken earlier are limited to make sure this shifting didn't cause too many problems. In addition, the legendary shifter is not locked to their aspects, using traditional wildshape mechanics to avoid creating new mechanics where necessary. Now you have as much control over your form as a druid, as well as being able to change into magical beasts to further separate yourself from druids and hunters. Doing this helped give the class a definitive mechanical niche where others weren't already. And lastly to this first part, at 20th level, at will wild shape.

Second of all, shifting is divided into uses that can be broken up into hour long sessions. I have to thank my playtesters for this, as they were quite insistent about how this should work, and listening to them really helped make sure this class functioned properly. This is also why the shifter's claws feature has a better scaling damage boost, and why the ability to pierce magic damage reduction was made at first level, to better allow players to avoid the issues of natural attacking.

Third, bonus feats. The class needed them, they got them, and I feel it opened up the combat potential of the class as well as freeing up general feats for more utility options, which to me felt very needed. Also the alignment restrictions were dropped, which removed a bit more of the 'druid' from the class, but at the same time, I didn't feel as though they helped the class at all, instead holding it back. I'm not big on alignment based classes anyways.

Fourth, there are now class features that speed up shifting so that players can shift more quickly and jump into the fray without needing as much start up time. This helps the class feel more like you're evolving into a more adept shifter rather than the previous stagnancy in shifting speed.

Fifth, aspects are now constantly active. The limit to the aspects were removed because I didn't feel like the majority of the bonuses needed limiting. Because of this, their power didn't change, but I think being able to switch out sooner was greatly helpful. Aspects are also gained faster to help with this customization.

These were the pillars I used for this redesign, and the end product is something that I feel better encapsulates what people wanted from the class both mechanically and thematically.

Bound Beastmaster
The fact that the class didn't have an animal companion archetype seemed odd to me, so I decided to fix that. The unique aspect of this archetype beyond the animal companion is that the animal companion both receives any aspect boosts and can shift along with the legendary shifter, creating a very nice paired dynamic. If turning into a bear is nice, turning into a bear while your wolf companion does too is amazing!

Dragon Touched
Another archetype that I thought needed touched, there was quite a lot of safeguarding to keep turning into a dragon so soon from being broken as all hell, but starting small and not gaining flight until later levels certainly helps. It's less versatile in the shapes it can take, but being able to take dragon shape is a huge boost, making it a fair trade.

Elemental Nexus
Kineticist archetype, I knew you'd come! Not only can you turn into an elemental, but you also gain some kineticist powers, such as elemental defense and kinetic blast (limited to kinetic fist, sorry), but you are able to expand your element, making you able to play a chimeric elemental of your choosing.

Fairy Shifter
Now to make this archetype different, not only can you turn into fey with fey shape, this archetype is charisma based (makes sense for fey) and gains charisma based hunter casting. As a charisma based archetype, it's a bit different, but I think the variety of fey you can shift into is a nice change of pace from doing animals.

Giant Shifter
Who wants to be an animal when you can GET RIPPED?! I know a lot of people who just wanted to get big, and this is the archetype to do it. Being able to boost your size at will is very useful as well as being able to stay humanoid, making this a safer archetype for people who just want some cool stat buffs.

Lycanthropic Warrior
And of course we needed a werewolf archetype. This one was really hard to get perfect, and I'm very happy with the end result. Sure, you're more aspect limited, but the versatility of being able to take hybrid form easily overrides this, making it a suitable choice for those who like giant shifter, but still like animals.

Metamorphic Genius
What class shifts better than an alchemist? Using the most polymorph friendly class, you get extracts and an intelligence based class, allowing you to take a huge variety of forms and even speed up the use of certain extracts as you level, making you able to take new forms and use useful extracts in combat.

Mimickin
Now here's the really unique one of the book. How many of you have ever wanted to play a mimic? Because that's exactly what you can do here. Transforming into objects, swallowing people, being sticky, these were all design goals I had for this archetype which I believe I met, and I've had a lot of people from the playtest tell me that this was their favorite archetype.

Mystically Trained
Ranger casting, basically it. For those who want magic, it's a small archetype which does just that.

Necromorph
Not only can you become the undead, you can also raise them too with this archetype. The ability to take the form of undead while having them as companions makes this a very cool corpse themed archetype, and anyone wanting to do necromancy should have all the tools they need with this archetype.

Oozling
This was my take on the oozemorph, and you'll see that there's fewer issues than the original due to ooze shape and such. I'm hoping that all the kinks were worked out, and you can even take the shape of different oozes as you advance in level in case your normal ooze form can't cut it.

Protean Mutant
I love the word 'protean'. Also instead of taking different forms with this archetype, you MAKE them, as you have a number of eidolon evolution points you can use to make your own form, including taking a different base form and qualifying for evolutions as though you were any type of eidolon. Definitely for those who love to tinker, this archetype is one of my faves.

New Prestige Class: Polymorph Savant
For everyone who wanted master of many forms back, this is it. This archetype gradually increases the number of forms you can take, including vermin, monstrous humanoids, fey, ooze, plant, and dragon. It's also able to be taken by a straight legendary shifter, making it almost an alternative class for the book. With lower BAB, it's a less offensive route, but it does contain just about any form you could ever want to take.

Final Thoughts
This rebuild took a lot of time to help find the sweet spot I wanted to hit, and it was entirely worth it. The community helped shape this into a better project as well, and I thank all of my playtesters. For those who wanted a more robust shifter, I believe the legendary shifter accomplishes all that and more, so please check it out if you can.

Scarab Sages Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games

4 people marked this as a favorite.

So glad to see this one up and out. We debated whether to push forward with doing the shifter so soon after its release, but I'm glad we decided to take the plunge, as we're delighted with the final result!


N. Jolly wrote:

And as always, it's time for my dev post on rebuilding this class.

Legendary Shifter
So how does one go about doing a rebuild? The first thing I did was give shifting at 1st level, because to me, holding a key class feature until 4th level makes anyone playing at level 1-3 not feel like they're playing the class, and that's something I really didn't like. To balance this, the forms being able to be taken earlier are limited to make sure this shifting didn't cause too many problems. In addition, the legendary shifter is not locked to their aspects, using traditional wildshape mechanics to avoid creating new mechanics where necessary. Now you have as much control over your form as a druid, as well as being able to change into magical beasts to further separate yourself from druids and hunters. Doing this helped give the class a definitive mechanical niche where others weren't already. And lastly to this first part, at 20th level, at will wild shape.

Second of all, shifting is divided into uses that can be broken up into hour long sessions. I have to thank my playtesters for this, as they were quite insistent about how this should work, and listening to them really helped make sure this class functioned properly. This is also why the shifter's claws feature has a better scaling damage boost, and why the ability to pierce magic damage reduction was made at first level, to better allow players to avoid the issues of natural attacking.

Third, bonus feats. The class needed them, they got them, and I feel it opened up the combat potential of the class as well as freeing up general feats for more utility options, which to me felt very needed. Also the alignment restrictions were dropped, which removed a bit more of the 'druid' from the class, but at the same time, I didn't feel as though they helped the class at all, instead holding it back. I'm not big on alignment based classes anyways.

Fourth, there are now class features that speed up shifting so that players can shift more quickly and...

You did an amazing job on the Legendary Shifter. ***** easy, and I'll give it a real review in a day or so when I get a chance to write everything down properly.

I have to say that I think 'Mystically Trained' is the shortest archetype I've ever seen in a Pathfinder book, and one of the best in its simplicity.

I love the two feats 'Animal Spirit' and 'Basic Alteration'. Especially the latter. So simple and yet it opens up so many possibilities.

One question about the Lycanthropic Warrior archetype: when they can do a large-size version of their animal form, can they also make their hybrid form large in size as well?


I just posted my review, and I so hope it gets new buys for this. This class is amazing, with some of the best options I've seen in a while.

I would also like to know if there are any plans for a Legendary Shifters II, hopefully with a few more archetypes. Say, 'legendary' versions of the Fiendflesh and Verdant shifter? Maybe a 'Hagskin' or the like for someone specializing in monstrous humanoids?

Thank to everyone involved who made this masterpiece.

Silver Crusade

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Very much appreciate the review, and as for Legendary Shifters II, it'll depend on how well this one sells. I did try to include as many legendary versions of archetypes as I could, but for this project, I wanted to use new ideas to make sure that people who were already familiar with the shifter would have some new things with which to play. For me, I just wanted to have some cool stuff, like mimickin.

Shadow Lodge

I can't wait to get this and see what the Dragon Shifter ended up as. I really hope it got a useful breath weapon(damage wise) that can be used every 1d4 rounds but otherwise at will. :)


Dragonborn3 wrote:
I can't wait to get this and see what the Dragon Shifter ended up as. I really hope it got a useful breath weapon(damage wise) that can be used every 1d4 rounds but otherwise at will. :)

Going by my copy of the PDF it's at will, starts at 1d8 dmg + 1d8 every five levels, with the energy type depending on whatever draconic 'aspect' you chose at first level. Though you can widen it a bit when you get new 'aspects' at 9th and 14th levels.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Well I got my copy.

Shadow Lodge

Eric Hinkle wrote:
Dragonborn3 wrote:
I can't wait to get this and see what the Dragon Shifter ended up as. I really hope it got a useful breath weapon(damage wise) that can be used every 1d4 rounds but otherwise at will. :)
Going by my copy of the PDF it's at will, starts at 1d8 dmg + 1d8 every five levels, with the energy type depending on whatever draconic 'aspect' you chose at first level. Though you can widen it a bit when you get new 'aspects' at 9th and 14th levels.

That's a little disappointing. At 5d8 points of damage at level 20(which a lot of tables don't see play at) it's not even close to a level 9 Kinetic Blast(5d6 but gets bonuses) :(

Even Form of the Dragon starts at 6d8(once per spell) and reaches 12d8(unlimited uses) at Form of the Dragon III.

From what I remember of the playtest though Dragon Touched gets FotD, so maybe that increases their Breath Weapon while shifted? Hopefully?


Pathfinder Companion, Modules, Roleplaying Game Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

The breath weapon damage adds Shifter level, so it is actually 5d8+20 at 20th level -- and you can use it every round, with no cooldown.

Shadow Lodge

Hmm... not as bad as I feared. The flat bonus to damage will help a lot against energy resistance(and DR if my memory of non-true dragon options is correct).

Disappointment alleviated.


David knott 242 wrote:

The breath weapon damage adds Shifter level, so it is actually 5d8+20 at 20th level -- and you can use it every round, with no cooldown.

Agh! Sorry I forgot that when I wrote my answer.

Silver Crusade

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Dragonborn3 wrote:

Hmm... not as bad as I feared. The flat bonus to damage will help a lot against energy resistance(and DR if my memory of non-true dragon options is correct).

Disappointment alleviated.

This breath weapon was actually the source of contention during the playtest. I realized the 1d4 thing, while a staple, didn't really help the archetype, so I removed it. The damage should scale well enough that it remains useful, and it can be used as a primary attack if one wishes, which I figured would be something most people with a breath weapon would want.


Bought it and downloaded it, will put up a review at some point.


A question for the Legendary Games head honcho... What are the chances of Legendary Games creating Hero lab files for sale for the Legendary Shifter and/or other Legendary classes? The Legendary Shifter is awesome and I know my players would love to play this class and other Legendary classes but we've become addicted to Hero Lab.

Scarab Sages Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games

Player Killer wrote:
A question for the Legendary Games head honcho... What are the chances of Legendary Games creating Hero lab files for sale for the Legendary Shifter and/or other Legendary classes? The Legendary Shifter is awesome and I know my players would love to play this class and other Legendary classes but we've become addicted to Hero Lab.

I would love to offer these in HeroLab, but getting things converted and integrated to their system has become a substantial issue. There are a lot of reasons: Finding reliable converters is tricky, and even when we've gotten things done there are products we've had converted that have gotten backlogged in the onboarding queue there for quite a while. LoneWolf has focused a lot of attention recently on building out the Starfinder and 5E versions of HeroLab and they've slowed down the Pathfinder queue even more.

We've tried doing HL files ourselves and selling them on places like our own site, Drivethru, and Paizo, but history has shown that people just don't buy them in any significant numbers outside of the LoneWolf store. LoneWolf has been adding more staff, and now that their Starfinder and 5E platforms look like they are up and running, maybe the logjam will break up and things will get moving again. Meanwhile, if you know anybody interested in doing HeroLab coding, send them our way!


Jason Nelson wrote:

I would love to offer these in HeroLab, but getting things converted and integrated to their system has become a substantial issue. There are a lot of reasons: Finding reliable converters is tricky, and even when we've gotten things done there are products we've had converted that have gotten backlogged in the onboarding queue there for quite a while. LoneWolf has focused a lot of attention recently on building out the Starfinder and 5E versions of HeroLab and they've slowed down the Pathfinder queue even more.

We've tried doing HL files ourselves and selling them on places like our own site, Drivethru, and Paizo, but history has shown that people just don't buy them in any significant numbers outside of the LoneWolf store. LoneWolf has been adding more staff, and now that their Starfinder and 5E platforms look like they are up and running, maybe the logjam will break up and things will get moving again. Meanwhile, if you know anybody interested in doing HeroLab coding, send them our way!

Thank you for the quick response Mr. Nelson! Hopefully LoneWolf will staff up and start cranking out your material because it's great.

Silver Crusade

Shub-Niggurath's cousin Al wrote:
Bought it and downloaded it, will put up a review at some point.

Awesome, glad to hear it! Please let me know what you think of it, as if this does end up getting popular enough, I'd love to see what people would like to see from a second book. I have quite a few talented writers who are interested in hitting me up about a sequel at the moment.

And to anyone reviewing this, if you can, please cross post your review on open gaming store, amazon, and drivethru RPG. It helps us out and makes sure that the word is spread about this project.


N. Jolly wrote:
Shub-Niggurath's cousin Al wrote:
Bought it and downloaded it, will put up a review at some point.

Awesome, glad to hear it! Please let me know what you think of it, as if this does end up getting popular enough, I'd love to see what people would like to see from a second book. I have quite a few talented writers who are interested in hitting me up about a sequel at the moment.

And to anyone reviewing this, if you can, please cross post your review on open gaming store, amazon, and drivethru RPG. It helps us out and makes sure that the word is spread about this project.

Don't you have to buy the PDF on Drivethru to be able to post a review there?


Review is up!

EDIT: Realized I accidentally wrote "ass" instead of "all" and "S**@er" instead of "Shifter" in places, so that's fixed now. This is why you don't write reviews when sleep-deprived, it makes you seem more foulmouthed than you intend to.

Silver Crusade

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Eric Hinkle wrote:
Don't you have to buy the PDF on Drivethru to be able to post a review there?

On drivethru, yeah. It's honestly why I pick up all my stuff over there, since I can cross post the review everywhere. It might be worth asking if you can get a copy through there, since I know reviews there are really helpful.

Shub-Niggurath's cousin Al wrote:

Review is up!

EDIT: Realized I accidentally wrote "ass" instead of "all" and "S%++er" instead of "Shifter" in places, so that's fixed now. This is why you don't write reviews when sleep-deprived, it makes you seem more foulmouthed than you intend to.

Very much appreciated, and yeah, I ended up doing the latter of those two typos a lot when doing the first draft. It's just so close together. I'm seriously glad that people are enjoying this redesign as much as they are, as I did my best to see what issues people had with the class and work to make something that better encapsulated what people wanted from this concept. I went pouring over threads from people who wanted changes, seeing what they wanted, reading over other people's rebuilds, and discussing it with quite a few of them to make sure that what I put out was going to be what the concept deserved. This project involved a lot of research, as I looked up Master of Many Forms as well as Master Transmogrist (?) from 3.5 and anything else I could find that had the same concept. The original class in playtest wasn't that different from the base class, but the playtest helped push things along (totally don't use those to mine for ideas, not even a little), as it was the suggestion of others that lead to the hour duration for the class's shifting (it appears Paizo thought it was a good idea too).

In the end, Siobhan and I decided on a lot of things to make the class more unique, and the archetypes were some of the most fun design I've done in a while, especially the mimickin. It feel like there's still a lot of space to explore with this version of the shifter, and if the demand is great enough, I'll certainly be interested in making a sequel to this with a few friends who I didn't get to include initially.


Something I just noticed: the Legendary Shifter doesn't get an increasing uses of shifter shape per day, unlike the UW Shifter who gets more uses starting at level 6 and increasing every two levels from then (2 uses at 6th level, 3 at 8th, etc.). Was this intentional or did I just notice an error?

Scarab Sages Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games

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Eric Hinkle wrote:
N. Jolly wrote:
Shub-Niggurath's cousin Al wrote:
Bought it and downloaded it, will put up a review at some point.

Awesome, glad to hear it! Please let me know what you think of it, as if this does end up getting popular enough, I'd love to see what people would like to see from a second book. I have quite a few talented writers who are interested in hitting me up about a sequel at the moment.

And to anyone reviewing this, if you can, please cross post your review on open gaming store, amazon, and drivethru RPG. It helps us out and makes sure that the word is spread about this project.

Don't you have to buy the PDF on Drivethru to be able to post a review there?

You do, but if you bought it elsewhere let me know at makeyourgamelegendary@gmail.com and I can gift you a complimentary copy through their system as well, which makes you an authorized purchaser so you can leave a review.


Jason Nelson wrote:
Eric Hinkle wrote:
N. Jolly wrote:
Shub-Niggurath's cousin Al wrote:
Bought it and downloaded it, will put up a review at some point.

Awesome, glad to hear it! Please let me know what you think of it, as if this does end up getting popular enough, I'd love to see what people would like to see from a second book. I have quite a few talented writers who are interested in hitting me up about a sequel at the moment.

And to anyone reviewing this, if you can, please cross post your review on open gaming store, amazon, and drivethru RPG. It helps us out and makes sure that the word is spread about this project.

Don't you have to buy the PDF on Drivethru to be able to post a review there?
You do, but if you bought it elsewhere let me know at makeyourgamelegendary@gmail.com and I can gift you a complimentary copy through their system as well, which makes you an authorized purchaser so you can leave a review.

Will do.

And please pardon my asking again, but may I get an answer to my question about whether or not the Legendary Shifter gets more than one use of 'shifter shape' per day?

Silver Crusade

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Eric Hinkle wrote:
Something I just noticed: the Legendary Shifter doesn't get an increasing uses of shifter shape per day, unlike the UW Shifter who gets more uses starting at level 6 and increasing every two levels from then (2 uses at 6th level, 3 at 8th, etc.). Was this intentional or did I just notice an error?

That's actually correct; the L Shifter gets an increasing duration rather than additional uses. As written it the class feature, it's 1/2 level + Wis mod hours per day. Funny how the revised shifter also when to hours per day just as this was being released.


Thanks N. Jolly for setting me straight.

And I just re-posted my review for this PDF on both Amazon and DriveThru.

Scarab Sages Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games

Thanks to all three of our fantastic reviewers for taking the time to leave us your detailed thoughts! Thanks also to the fans for pushing this book into the top three most popular downloads on Paizo the last several weeks. Let's see if we can knock off the Valkyries next week and rocket to NUMBER ONE!

Silver Crusade

Eric Hinkle wrote:

Thanks N. Jolly for setting me straight.

And I just re-posted my review for this PDF on both Amazon and DriveThru.

Very much appreciated, the more we can cross post reviews, the more coverage we can get this fun project.


I just posted my review (Brainiac58) here and on Amazon. I also picked up the paperback version to go along with the PDF. Great work Jason and N. Jolly!

Silver Crusade

Player Killer wrote:
I just posted my review (Brainiac58) here and on Amazon. I also picked up the paperback version to go along with the PDF. Great work Jason and N. Jolly!

Very much appreciated; I've been having quite a few people talk to me about things they'd like to see in a Legendary Shifters 2, and with this one doing rather well, I think that's a conversation I'd be willing to have. If we do a sequel book, it's going to support the base shifter as well, at least as much as I can, as I'd like to expand things. There's a good chance I'll be doing a small conversion doc for how to use the Leg Shifter archetypes with the original shifter.


N. Jolly wrote:
Player Killer wrote:
I just posted my review (Brainiac58) here and on Amazon. I also picked up the paperback version to go along with the PDF. Great work Jason and N. Jolly!
Very much appreciated; I've been having quite a few people talk to me about things they'd like to see in a Legendary Shifters 2, and with this one doing rather well, I think that's a conversation I'd be willing to have. If we do a sequel book, it's going to support the base shifter as well, at least as much as I can, as I'd like to expand things. There's a good chance I'll be doing a small conversion doc for how to use the Leg Shifter archetypes with the original shifter.

I would buy a Legendary Shifters 2 in a heartbeat! I'd love to see your take on the Rageshaper (The Hulk is one of my favorite heroes and I'd love to play a Pathfinder version) and your take on the Fiendish Shifter (and/or possibly an Angelic Shifter). Keeping my fingers crossed for a follow to the LG!


Let me say again that if we can get a Legendary Shifters 2 with coverage of the Verdant Shifter archetype, I'd be delighted. I've been trying to figure out how to do it myself but nothing really satisfies me.

Scarab Sages Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games

We may yet revisit the class - it's certainly proven popular, in the Top Ten Downloads here at Paizo every week since its release! Right now, though, the cavalier and barbarian are next in line to get the Legendary treatment!


I really want to like this, but it really does seem overpowered. At level 1 a Legendary Shifter has 3 natural attacks each doing 1d6 + Str mod damage, all at full attack bonus (so 3d6 + 3 Str mod total).
Compare this to a fighter with a greatsword doing 2d6 + 1.5 Str mod damage. The shifter is easily out-fighting the fighter, without even needing a weapon! And this is before even considering the cool array of shapeshifting powers the shifter gets.
I prefer the way the shapeshifting works in this version, but unless I'm overlooking something I don't see why anyone would ever play a fighter next to these guys.


Archon Tom wrote:
I prefer the way the shapeshifting works in this version, but unless I'm overlooking something I don't see why anyone would ever play a fighter next to these guys.

The question always is: Is that the fault of the other class, or the fault of the Fighter class?

Silver Crusade

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Archon Tom wrote:

I really want to like this, but it really does seem overpowered. At level 1 a Legendary Shifter has 3 natural attacks each doing 1d6 + Str mod damage, all at full attack bonus (so 3d6 + 3 Str mod total).

Compare this to a fighter with a greatsword doing 2d6 + 1.5 Str mod damage. The shifter is easily out-fighting the fighter, without even needing a weapon! And this is before even considering the cool array of shapeshifting powers the shifter gets.
I prefer the way the shapeshifting works in this version, but unless I'm overlooking something I don't see why anyone would ever play a fighter next to these guys.

This is a reasonable concern, but the thing is, that's just natural attacks in general. It's not even a little difficult for any build to gain 3 natural attacks to start. There's plenty of races (such as catfolk, tiefling, ratfolk with a feat, a large swath of skinwalkers) that can gain claws very easily, along with taking traits to gain a bite attack. The idea of gaining this many natural attacks can be done without limits rather than how the legendary shifter is limited to only being able to get them in specific forms and for limited amounts of time per day.

Races that can do that don't even require class levels to do this, allowing them to be fighters and do the same thing you're stating here. You also have to consider that these natural attacks need 3 different attack rolls to connect to put out that kind of damage; this skewes them closer to average damage rather than the greatsword, which is far more swingy.

This is also considering that manufactured weapons are far more easily enhanced and can benefit from special materials. Single weapons also benefit more from power attack and deal more damage with attacks of opportunity, as well as being easier to augment with feats (taking weapon focus: greatsword is easier than taking two different weapon focuses for claws and bite, as well as feats like improved critical and such, benefiting a singular weapon more than natural attacks).

As to why anyone would ever play a fighter against this, the same question could be brought up against the majority of full BAB classes, especially things like barbarian, paladin, ranger, slayer, bloodrager, and avenger vigilante. I recognize that you may have a standard for the fighter in the sense of its power and importance, but the game design as a whole has passed it by (and yes, I am considering advanced weapon training in this statement), and having this class be held back by the fighter's power level would have resulted in a project that wasn't up to my standards or legendary game's standards.

Natural attacks are a powerful style of combat, and early they may seem overpowered, but for the most part, the numbers even out more and more as you go later into things. I won't say that the legendary shifter isn't more powerful than a fighter, as I do believe it is, but the primary selling point of the class isn't intended to be damage, it's versatility (another thing at which it beats the fighter). It's the legendary games way to try and bring others up to par rather than lowering something to a point where it's less fun to play, as seen by the rebuild of the fighter class, a class which is very much closer in line with the legendary shifter.

Sure, you can consider this power creep, but at a certain point, older content needs to be boosted to reach the standard that new content has reached (vigilante basically being rogue+++) in order to keep those older concepts as viable as they were when the game started. That's always been my intended goal, but as always, it's up to others to decide if that goal has been reached.

I appreciate your feedback here though, as it does let me know the concerns of building things like this and the possible issues that may occur because of it.


Can Paizo just link to this version of Shifter and completely make theirs obsolete? Especially since they stopped working on fixing the Shifter entirely now.

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