mikeawmids |
I like the new art style and layout, the whole package reminds me of the new Pathfinder modules (Dragon's Demand onwards). I also like having the magic items placed throughout the adventure, previously I would have to flip through the entire book trying to find where they were placed or if they were included in a monster's gear. I'm hoping the rest of the AP maintains the balance between dungeoneering and social interaction that was achieved here. This is a solid start to what will hopefully be a pretty awesome AP. Well done Mr. Renie. :D
Sniggevert |
Is this available in stores yet?
Feb 25th is street date.
For their monthly items, the date the PDF becomes available is the same date that stores are supposed to have and be able to start selling the product. Subscribers sometimes get their PDF early, it just depends on when their shipment goes out, is why these folks are talking about content.
MerricB |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Here's my review. I'm not the biggest fan of Pathfinder, so keep that in mind going in. Some of my problems with it may not be a problem for you.
There are spoilers (hopefully minor) for the adventure, so - as with all adventure reviews - I advise that players stay away this review! :)
Cheers,
Merric
brad2411 |
Here's my review. I'm not the biggest fan of Pathfinder, so keep that in mind going in. Some of my problems with it may not be a problem for you.
There are spoilers (hopefully minor) for the adventure, so - as with all adventure reviews - I advise that players stay away this review! :)
Cheers,
Merric
Not a bad review. In the GM Reference thread we have been discuss some of the issues we have seen in it. This is a very hard ap with some encounters that can TPK the whole group pretty easily.
Robert G. McCreary Senior Developer |
Sorry to hear that deathbydice. I'd recommend sending an email to customer service (customer.service@paizo.com) or post about this on the Customer Service messageboard, and hopefully they can help resolves this issue for you.Pretty unhappy since I re-subscribed for this ( group clamored for it, after having a go at Iron Gods and heartily disliking it ) and neither....... have the .pdf nor the hardcopy Whichseems to be out in the US by now.
Which apparently will be send in April - wtf ?
Sara Marie Customer Service Dire Care Bear Manager |
Pretty unhappy since I re-subscribed for this ( group clamored for it, after having a go at Iron Gods and heartily disliking it ) and neither....... have the .pdf nor the hardcopy Whichseems to be out in the US by now.
Which apparently will be send in April - wtf ?
The subscription was started after we had prepared and finished shipping the February New Releases which this is a part of. It defaulted to combine shipping with the next volume. Generally this is what new subscribers are looking to do since we would usually be shipping the next volume fairly soon and that saves on shipping, (though you should be able to poke through the cart during checkout and change it to ship right away). #92 which was supposed to release in March was delayed due to the strikes at the Port of Seattle which is why it is saying shipping in April.
I've gone ahead and moved this to an order to ship as soon as possible. In the future, if you are concerned or frustrated about an order or confused why it is behaving a certain way, please let us know either in the customer service forums or via email so we can address it as soon as possible for you. I wouldn't have seen this if Liz hadn't pointed it out and I would hate to see problems with orders fester when we could easily help!
Adam Daigle Developer |
3 people marked this as a favorite. |
I really love the exoskeleton template. I just might have to roll upa necromanceran entomologist soon.
Yay! I'm glad you like it. It was the sort of thing that came up one day when Rob and I were taking a break. I was talking about using raise dead on bugs and noted that making a dead bug into a zombie makes a certain amount of sense, but what if you used the skeleton template? That was enough of a spark that I knew that I had to make the exoskeleton template for such a corner case. :)
I'm also really into insects and arachnids.... so that had some influence.
Marco Massoudi |
Having paged through this, one thing that struck me straight away is that the quality of the interior art seems to have dropped significantly, when compared to other recent APs. Does anyone else feel the same way?
I thought so too at first but it is just a different art style and now that i got used to it i kinda like it.
The art is not crisp and clean like in Iron Gods but has a more rugged edge to it which is ok for a classic campaign.Having read through half of the issue and all of the spoilers for the next issues i feel my concerns for a rehash of "Rise of the Runelord" put to a rest mostly.
At least part 2 should feel a lot different, as has part 1.
So far it looks to be a very nice AP.
mikeawmids |
Having paged through this, one thing that struck me straight away is that the quality of the interior art seems to have dropped significantly, when compared to other recent APs. Does anyone else feel the same way?
I'm not too keen on the cover illustrations (specifically the NPC in the foreground, the backgrounds are fine), but the interior art is good. A little more cartoony maybe, if that's the right word to use? The use of colour is certainly more vibrant.
Nate Z |
I really have to say that I am disappointed that we don't get a picture of ALL of the new, unique animals. I understand why (limited space, art is expensive, etc), but I am a very visual person, so it helps me greatly if I can see what's being described. After all, don't want to take an exotic animal companion if it doesn't look cool. ;)
Other than that, this looks pretty solid. I love the "Giant Primer," and the "Triumian* Giants" on the inside covers.
(*I know this is wrong. Even if it is not the wrong word somehow, it HAS to be speled wrong.)
Hill Giant |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Other than that, this looks pretty solid. I love the "Giant Primer," and the "Triumian* Giants" on the inside covers.
(*I know this is wrong. Even if it is not the wrong word somehow, it HAS to be speled wrong.)
Vitruvian :-)
mikeawmids |
I'd like to know how much information on Trunau is in this book before buying it. Does this give more details about Trunau than its entry in "Towns of the Inner Sea?" A better map of the town, more info on the NPCs, pictures of the NPCs, etc.?
Most of what you just asked for is available for free in the Giantslayer Players Guide.
brad2411 |
I'd like to know how much information on Trunau is in this book before buying it. Does this give more details about Trunau than its entry in "Towns of the Inner Sea?" A better map of the town, more info on the NPCs, pictures of the NPCs, etc.?
No the towns of the inner sea write up has more.
Millefune |
Millefune wrote:I'd like to know how much information on Trunau is in this book before buying it. Does this give more details about Trunau than its entry in "Towns of the Inner Sea?" A better map of the town, more info on the NPCs, pictures of the NPCs, etc.?Most of what you just asked for is available for free in the Giantslayer Players Guide.
The Player's Guide info on Trunau is a cut and paste from most of the Towns of the Inner Sea book entry on Trunau. :(
Millefune wrote:I'd like to know how much information on Trunau is in this book before buying it. Does this give more details about Trunau than its entry in "Towns of the Inner Sea?" A better map of the town, more info on the NPCs, pictures of the NPCs, etc.?No the towns of the inner sea write up has more.
I was hoping for more, but oh well. Thanks! :)
Kevin Mack |
I'm not sure I like how the three firsts books are coming together in April, instead of one a month. Looks like they are trying to sell them in the same packaage for subscription members.
Actually it's due to the dock strike delaying certain shipments causing an unfortunate bunch up.
Arturius Fischer |
I really like it. This seems to be a good start to the new Adventure Path, but there are some weird things about it.
The Knife:
Brinya's Love seems to be an odd design. It's a neat item, definitely, and quite unique, but it has little direct use in this part of the adventure. The creatures it seems specialized in dealing with are found before it. The benefits it give are kind of counterproductive to what it's meant to fight. Unless there's more such creature's later in the path and it gets upgrades (as it is hinted in the path). Given the nature of its origin and what it was originally meant for, I think I'll retcon it in personal games to have a use of Gentle Repose instead (which will be activated and can trigger on being used on a corpse or when it kills a target). As a note: In my games, Gentle Repose counts for all Rez spell timers... including Breath of Life.
The Orc Assault:
VERY nice, but there are a LOT of fights, and the adventure as written encourages the DM to not allow the player's to rest. That's... kinda bad for lowbie characters. I mean, I know there's more common optimization, but... yowch.
The Titan's Toolbox
Yeah, it's "Giants Toolbox", but I prefer alliteration. Anyway, I love all these various new feats and items. The burning boulders and exploding decaying pigs are among my favorites. Now we have rules for launching decaying livestock from catapults! Wooo!
The Boulder Bag is great for Giants, and fairly sub-par for players, unless someone's made a PF version of a Hulking Hurler they want to use. For those of us with inclusive 3.X/PF home games, this is gonna be brutally fun. And, of course... Magic Beans!! Which brings me to...
Beanstalk is a hilarious spell I know will come in handy later. It seems rather high for something that is effectively a giant ladder, though, but I guess that's because of the duration. Will make a 'lesser' version as an alternate. I like the idea behind Thunderous Footfalls, but it's written in a confusing way. EACH time the creature moves overland adjacent to another creature? So, big 10x10 stomps by some 5x5's and they have to make anywhere from 2-4 rolls until they fall or the biggun stops moving adjacent? Eep! Probably a quick errata of 'no more than one save per target per round' should be squeezed in there. I'm sure Summoners will love this one, though!
I love the Awesome Blow feat. But it makes me question... did Brutal Throw or an equivalent get reprinted in Pathfinder?? Brutal Throw was a 3.X feat that allowed you to use your Str bonus instead of your Dex on thrown attacks. Pretty much essential for Giants. Will of Giants is a neat feat, but has to go through Iron Will to get it, requires good Wisdom, and renders both rather obsolete for lower level effects. Going to houserule that all Giants get a straight +2 bonus against such spells if they only target Humanoids. The weak ones can have that boost for free, the higher level ones can buy the feat but still get shafted with non-type-specific spells. Stone Soul will be fun, and pretty much mandatory on Stone Giants. No reason for NPC ones to take it more than once, though.
The Centered on Giants definitively answers a long standing question ("Does Anti Magic Field extend from a single point or have its radius determined based on the caster's space?") and introduces the other side's view as an optional rule.
Art:
The new art is really good, I like it. But... it's a bit too 'clean'. A rampaging horde of Orcs determined to wipe out the town and loot it and the ruins below it? Why are the pictured ones clean? The one with the three sleek-looking dogs is probably the worst offender here. The problem is that the art is TOO good and too clean. It's a running gag in our games that all the Heros look like movie stars simply because of the prevalence of Prestidigitation, and the same go for most civilized people in cities bigger than a Thorpe. The Orcs have no excuse. Fortunately, the Gryff and the various Giants are all played straight. And the Vitruvian Giants are neat!
Exoskeleton:
A solution in search of a problem. The Skeleton template already did this, it never specified that the skeleton had to be on the inside. Having said that, I really like this, and welcome the addition of it to my massive list of templates. Great for Necromancers. And here I have an entire nation of people who live and work with giant insects... so it's going to be interesting seeing this turned around on them. Also... I love insects, so any more stuff like this will always be welcome! Just one problem: Is the cost in onyx for an Animate Dead supposed to be calculated on the BASE creature's Hit Dice, or the FINAL calculated Hit Dice?
Extra Magic Item Locations:
There are plenty of new things in the back, but I approve of the items being placed where they occur in the adventure path, if they are specific and unique items. Also, enjoy the addition of the Artifact.
Giant Primer:
Hope for more of this. Liked it. Liked the origin myth, liked the explanation of why the different Giant types ARE different. Liked the reference to the Innsmouth Giants (Marsh Giants) too.
On the whole, I'm liking this start, and hoping it adds more interesting things as we go along.
I'll be honest, it's going to be DIFFICULT to get me interested in a path as much as I was Iron Gods. I figured this one would be a complete letdown. I'm happy to be wrong on this, if this first installment is any indication. While I do not like it as MUCH as Iron Gods (and there likely won't be any that does), this still will likely be on my 'favorites' list of Adventure Paths if it keeps up the current quality.
Joana |
I'm not sure I like how the three firsts books are coming together in April, instead of one a month. Looks like they are trying to sell them in the same packaage for subscription members.
Pre-existing subscribers got the first book in February. Two and three might be coming in April, or it might just be two and the double-up might be in a later month; last I saw, they weren't sure.
Roger Corbera |
Roger Corbera wrote:I'm not sure I like how the three firsts books are coming together in April, instead of one a month. Looks like they are trying to sell them in the same packaage for subscription members.Pre-existing subscribers got the first book in February. Two and three might be coming in April, or it might just be two and the double-up might be in a later month; last I saw, they weren't sure.
Ok then.
graywulfe |
Joana wrote:Ok then.Roger Corbera wrote:I'm not sure I like how the three firsts books are coming together in April, instead of one a month. Looks like they are trying to sell them in the same packaage for subscription members.Pre-existing subscribers got the first book in February. Two and three might be coming in April, or it might just be two and the double-up might be in a later month; last I saw, they weren't sure.
Also, I believe the reason for this is not a Paizo decision. Rather, I believe, this is largely a result of the West Coast Dock wrokers strke and the subsequent fall out.
Adam Daigle Developer |
Hey there! Sorry about missing this post.
Those look like errors to me (at least in some parts).
Storm Soul should have only cloud giant as a prerequisite.
Storm Warrior should probably be a combat feat.
Omitting druids from casting beanstalk kinda looks like an oversight. I'd totally allow it in my games.
The Golux |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I may be in the minority, but I really liked the magic item appendix for organization purposes and for having new things in every book. That said, I guess using the pages for other things could be useful, if it feels like you don't need as many new items for a particular volume. Still, I found a lot of the new items that may not have been "necessary" interesting, and I liked being able to find everything in one place.
Renegade Paladin |
1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Okay, I'm not going to spoiler this deliberately because seriously players should know:
Liz Courts Community Manager |
How about you don't? That is nonsense, bad encounter design, and designed to TPK the entire party within the first session with no significant chance to fight back; players should know the adventure does that before wasting their time making a cohesive party to start with.
If the GM running that particular encounter wants to change it to suit their party better, they are welcome to. Maybe they don't want to change it. Either way, that decision is in their hands, and spoiling it isn't a very nice thing to do. Nothing's going to stop somebody from clicking on the spoiler tag if they *really* want to know, and using the tags is just a polite thing to do for people playing in the campaign.
Renegade Paladin |
I will, but I want to finish playing through the book first.
Marco Massoudi |
Is anyone here interested in a character creation guide that doesn't get specific on plot points, but does allow a PC group to take advantage of the items and appropriately face what is thrown at them?
I read your other recent posts, which got some flag for being spoilery and found them entertaining, even if i didn't agree with everything. ;-)
For instance, you suggested some races which are more powerful than the basic ones and in the case of "Strange Aeons" (which i am gamemastering atm) discouraged to be taken in the players guide. ;-pJust put it in spoilers and i'll read it. :-)
Piccolo |
I will try to put it in spoilers, but this would be my first time, and I don't really know how. To be frank, I don't care about the races bit. Most of the so called "more powerful" races are merely specialized into certain classes, but really weak for everything else. I don't think it makes much difference, and I only use Pathfinder races, not 3rd party.
After playing through the whole campaign, I personally found it boring after the first 2 books. Giants are really simplistic to run, and they die fast once the PC's adapt properly. But the players seemed to enjoy romping through all the encounters at high speed. I got rid of the campaign later.
The first 2 adventures are really nasty, especially the first. To survive, the players will need to think defensively a LOT, and increase their endurance (toughness etc). Perception skill was totally needed to have high in the first book. Climb was painfully essential later on in the campaign, so getting class access or having Spider Climb on is very nice.
Because of a certain 2 handed weapon later on in the campaign, you really do need a Fighter, standard version. This is because Fighters get Armor Training, and can get rid of the ACP and then take Acrobatics as a class skill to get close to giants without taking attacks of opp. Mithril full plate is perfect. I thought a standard Orc was best, given their ferocity and +4 Strength. I did negate the Wisdom penalty and give him a free Endurance feat though.
We also found that a elf Wizard Evoker with the Admixture School from the APG was freakishly handy, as he could take out frost and fire giants with ease. The fancy magic item for the Wizard in the later campaign really wasn't needed, so I instead replaced it with a Manual of Intelligence. Also, because the campaign has you in the middle of the mountains, with noplace to sell gear, we came up with a solution. First the Wizard took the spell Secret Chest, and eventually bought a Portable Hole as a party item. Then he used Teleport to get to a city and back with the loot. Giant armor is massive, and sucks up a lot of space! So the Wizard could craft on the go, he used the Portable Hole or inns at the biggest city to craft in. He got himself a Ring of Sustenance and his familiar one, so that they could craft magic items really fast via the Valet archetype. However, he found that using Will save spells was pretty nasty on giants and was Reflex save spells, as did the party Bard.
We also had a Ranger specialized against giants. He would use a bow and just cut loose, with the Bane (giant) and Holy enchantments on it, as well as infinite ammo. I think the party Bard did the same with his heavy crossbow. I think I had used the ARG to modify the Ranger elf to get a bonus to Strength instead of Intelligence, and give him a penalty to Int and not Con, then take the woodsy knowledge skills instead of elven magic.
Because giants can do some really nasty damage in a heartbeat if they get through your AC, everybody concentrated on upping their AC and hit points. Note that this means a Barbarian is basically screwed, so don't take one! They are already down 2 points for raging, another 3 for heavy armor lack....they rarely use shields...
We did have a Cleric, because hp seems to be an issue when the giants actually connected. Most handy in the early books though. Not many nasty conditions to remove in the campaign though, and there was some undead but not much.
Stealth was painfully essential, to the point of absolute. Invisibility was super handy with the frost giants, but the teamwork feat where you take the BEST Stealth result in the party if everyone has it instead of the WORST Stealth check was soooo useful!