Supporting Roles: Commander & Centurion (PFRPG) PDF

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We shall defend our island, whatever the cost may be, we shall fight on the beaches, we shall fight on the landing grounds, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; we shall never surrender. —Winston Churchill

There are those who just participate in war and then there are those who lead these men. Amora Game Presents: Commander and Centurion.

Commander: Many train with arms and armor, some preferring to master one weapon, others picking wider selection of skills and talents. Then there are those who are put in charge of overseeing the battlefield. Commanders are dedicated to leading and directing assaults. Knowing a chain is only as strong as its weakest link, they coordinate and inspire allies to work together to strengthen that chain. A skilled commander can even turn the tide of battle, from near defeat into victory. They also learn how to handle situations beyond the battlefields, for a good commander tends to his men in times of peace as much as in times of war.

The Centurion: Most people fear the sounds of war drums in the night. For this sound foretells death and destruction, fields left to rot because there are not enough hands to bring in the harvest. But for a centurion this sound holds no fear. Men and women raised on the battlefield, capable of mastering the chaos that they name the fog of war. For this select few, the sound of the war drums is a calling that centurions cannot refuse. There duty is to take up arms to defend those that cannot defend themselves and to march proudly into that rolling thunder.

This product includes:

  • Commander base class
  • Centurion prestige class
  • 5 feats

Revised February 2013.

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Are there errors or omissions in this product information? Got corrections? Let us know at store@paizo.com.

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4.5 stars - vastly improved revised edition gets it right

4/5

This pdf is 11 pages long, 1 page front cover, 1 page editorial, 1 page SRD, leaving 8 pages of content for new class and a PrC, so let's check out the Commander!

The Commander class gets d10, 4+Int skills per level, full BAB, good will- and fort-saves, proficiency with simple and martial weapons as well as all armors and shields except tower shields. Beyond that, the class is all about commanding troops in battle and enhancing allies.

Commanders have a commanding presence aura of 30 ft around them, which expands by yet another 30 ft. every five levels and works only if the commander is not paralyzed, petrified etc. and when allies can see or hear him. Allies within the aura also gain a +1 morale bonus to initiative an fear-based saves, which scales by +1 whenever the aura-size increases, which it does by30 ft. every 5 levels.

Now tactical strike is interesting - as a standard melee or ranged attack action, the commander can perform an attack that also acts as an aid another to an ally adjacent to the foe the commander attacked. Now that the ability has been stream-lined, its wording is much clearer and more precise.

Commanders may now also give Speeches - 1 + Cha-mod times and an additional 2 times per level beyond the first. Speeches are a subset of direct orders and their benefits last for one round, which allow the commander to use aid another at range and via Perform (Oratory) versus DC 10 as a standard action. Overall, these speeches are vastly superior in their presentation to the commander's first iteration - their intended benefits are clear and unambiguous. A total of 10 different speeches are provided, with the latter ones requiring a preset number of ranks in Perform (Oratory). My only gripe is that Words of Courage grants the Diehard-feat as well as +2 to Str and Con, but does not specify whether the hit points gained from the con-increase behave like the temporary hitpoints of the barbarian rage or not- here minor clarification would be in order.

Starting at second level and every even level thereafter, the commander now gets access to tactics - these are essentially talents for the class and a total of 23 are provided. Mechanically, most of them allow the commander to add his aid another bonuses to uncommon checks - From helping with the handling of siege engines to concentration of allies to granting an ally an AoO and enhancing an ally's CMB and CMD, they are actually interesting now. Some deviate from the assist-mechanic and two in particular are interesting: One allows the commander the addition of int-mod to all saves, which is a bit powerful for my tastes. Most interesting, at least imho, is Cunning Response, which grants the commander int-mod additional immediate actions per round - which is relevant for battle cries.

Starting at 4th level and every 4 levels after that an additional time per day, the commander may activate the ability as a swift action. Once activated "Battle-Cry mode" lasts until the end of combat. When activated thus, the commander may, as an immediate action, react to himself or an ally in sight being hit by attacks, spells or spell-like abilities with issuing a battle cry - 6 are provided and allow for e.g. a 5-foot movement after killing a foe and delivering an AoO to adjacent foes, withdraw as an immediate action and move towards downed foes.

Starting at 5th level, Commanders may now grant allies access to teamwork feats they possess by either substituting the tactical strike or direct order benefits.

At 8th level, the class starts to become interesting and complex: Press the advantage allows the commander to issue multiple orders, tactics or teamwork orders to their allies with a single application of their abilities - up to 4 at once at 18th level. And yes, they may spread the benefits between allies if they so choose. perhaps the mechanically most interesting ability of the class.

At 10th level, the speeches last longer and at 14th level, he may designate an ally as field officer and lend one of his direct orders, speeches or tactics to an ally. Very cool!

We also get 5 new feats:
-At them, Men (Teamwork): Charge with an ally simultaneously at the lower initiative. + 10 ft when charging,
-Band of Brothers (Teamwork): +1 to AC and attacks when adjacent to an ally, up to + 3, stacks with shield wall.
-Extra Speeches: +2 speeches per day.
-Extra Tactics: +1 tactics.
-Hold the Line: When you or your ally are being charged by a foe, your weapons gain the brace quality and the enemy takes a -4 penalty to AC instead of -2.
-With your shield or on it (Teamwork): When holding a shield adjacent to an ally holding a shield as well, gain + 2 to saves vs. spells and fear-effects.

The pdf also provides us the Centurion-PrC (not only for commanders - the centurion just needs to have led a unit to victory, have a teamwork-feat and some moderate requirements), who gets d10, 4+Int skills per level, full BAB, medium fort and will-saves, and a teamwork-feat every odd level.

The revised centurion gets access to solo tactics and a command radius that starts at 20 ft and expands over the 10 levels to 60 ft. The allies inside this radius may benefit from his team tactician ability - granting all allies in the radius access to one of his teamwork feats for class level rounds or until he issues a new teamwork feat. This increases to 2 and 3 teamwork feats at levels 4 and 8 of the PrC respectively. At 5th level, in yet another rather cool ability, he may shape the radius of his aura to a cone or line, which is actually a rather neat idea! The capstone lets him choose an ally's initiative and allows him and allies in his aura to act normally in a surprise round.

Conclusion:
Editing and formatting in this revised version of the pdf are vastly improved - I noticed no significant glitches that would have hampered my understanding of the book. Layout adheres to a relatively printer-friendly two-column standard and the pdf comes fully bookmarked for your convenience, which is nice. Artworks are full color, ok stock - nothing to complain about at this price-point.

All right, the first iteration of this pdf was a train-wreck. to cut a long ramble short: This one isn't.
While there are already two classes out there dealing with the concept of the commander, SGG's War Master and DSP's Tactician, both are different: The War Master is slightly dated, having been created before the advent of teamwork-feats and the tactician is focused on psionics. Thus, the commander as a mundane battlefield leader has his place - especially since this iteration of the class has managed to make the expansion of the aid another action and the benefits granted both sufficiently significant and balanced to make this class a viable option. While here and there the wording could be slightly more concise, for the first time Amora Games' pdf manages to get the terminology and rules-language right in a way that is not ambiguous and as precise as the complex rules-adjustments and options that classes like these require. In fact, this revised edition not only feels much more concise, it actually brings some interesting design-ideas to the table in the way how the respective abilities are handled.

Much like Rocks Fall Games recently revised "Dark Totem Part I", this revision has just about nothing in common with its abysmal first version, getting the concepts they tried to get across RIGHT. So much so, in fact, that I'm sincerely hoping that this reflects Amora Games' new quality standard, for if it does, the announced idea of a war-campaign may actually be a very fulfilling experience. Whereas before neither class nor PrC has any reason to exist, this revision made both stand out and me actually consider playing one of the classes herein - I believe they can now be quite some fun, especially if you ever wanted to play concept-wise in the equivalent of a Bridgeburner-like elite unit.

While not yet perfect, this pdf comes at a very low price and delivers in the revised edition interesting mechanics you might wish to scavenge - at the very latest when En World's War of the Burning Sky is converted to PFRPG (they met the KS-stretch-goal, after all!) and as a DM you want to add some oomph to the Ragessian commanders. If the idea of a non-magical commander and expanding the aid another action to make strategist-style warriors work even remotely interests you, then I whole-heartedly suggest you check out this revised pdf - my final verdict will be 4.5 stars, rounded down to 4 for the purpose of this platform.

Endzeitgeist out.



In the shopping cart, and can't wait to read this!


Good to hear.
Hopefully it lives up to expectations. Please let us know what you think of it Cheapy.


A few people have asked what each class is all about.

The Commander is focused and built around the theme of Aid Another action. Giving bonus in battle for select targets and other abilities via the aid another skill check.

The centurion is a 10 level prestige class that acts as a field officer which focuses on teamwork feats and giving orders to his fellow soldiers.

So hope that answers a few of the questions we have had.


Reading this now, and plan to review later. There are a few things that make me scratch my head, but one in particular stands out.

How does the Presence category of Advanced Tactics work? Is it a standard action? Does it need to be tied to aid another or direct order? Does the attack bonus from aid another last for mCha rounds per level?


Hey Cheapy,

For Presence: When using a Presence Advanced Tactics it is a standard action to initiate per page 5 second column. It's kind of hidden in there.
It does not need to be tied to tactical strike, direct order ability, BUT it does consist of an Aid Another action. So it's the aid another bonus (+2) plus Improved Aid bonus (let’s say 16th level +3) plus commanding presence (+4 at 16th). So at 16th level using "Impressive Presence" your ally you target would get a +9 bonus for a number of rounds = to the Commander's CHA mod. Crazy bonus right?

As far as the attack bonus from performing aid another action, or given from tactical strike or direct order, only last for the duration of a standard aid another action, which is only on the next attack role against the opponent.

Here is why: if using a tactical strike this round, on your next round you may do another tactical strike against the opponent and still give it to the same ally.

It was a game balance mechanic we felt was already built into the class function.
Ex:
I’m going to peg Orc A with a ranged attack and you are next to him. I succeed, roll my damage, and designate you as the ally to benefit from tactical strike. Your next attack against Orc A, you get the +2 from another action (plus any bonus from improved aid).
On my turn again and if Orc A is still standing I can repeat the same pattern, or choose a new target etc.

Hope that helps answer your questions. If not please let me know and I will see where the wording may be confusing in the doc.
- Greg


Alright, that clears it up.

I was following the thread this spawned from pretty closely and thought I understood it pretty well then, but honestly I got through the class here and wasn't really 100% sure how it worked. I felt maybe 80% sure.


Glad we could clear it up. Hopefully you have enjoyed the class :).


Reviewed here, on DTRPG and sent to GMS magazine and NERDTREK. Combat Styles was a step in the right direction - this one is two steps back.


Endzeitgeist, which aspects of the class would you recommend focusing on if there was a rewrite? One of the aspects I like is tying it to the attack action.

My review of the class was going to be somewhat similar to yours, but I have a strong bias for these type of class options, as my publication history shows, so I was trying to look past the errors. In the end, I don't think I could give it more than 2.5 stars in good faith.


I'd try to combine both classes -retain the aid-centric ideas, add teamwork-feat-style bonuses à la centurion and offer options that actually make sense in their rules. Battle cries are a good idea, but need MASSIVE revisions. This has to compete with two 5-star classes PLUS all your archetypes and their ideas and honestly: It doesn't hold up at all. In any way. Neither idea-wise, nor design-wise.

Personally, my suggestion would be to read the respective publications carefully, reevaluate the aid-centric approach and build it from the ground back up. The class could probably be salvaged, but I'm not sure whether it would be good enough to compete with the Tactician or War Master if there were not that many glitches here. If both classes herein were combined and enough talent-chocies provided, then perhaps this could become viable.

Hope that helps. I hate rating products 1-star and will eb able to upgrade my review in the future. :(


As always great review Endzeitgeist.

Revision forth coming.


On Jan 31,2013 the revision will be uploaded
Thanks for your waiting and your continued support of the Supporting Roles.

Greg LaRose
AmoraGame.Com


Just got the updated copy yesterday! Can't wait to read through it.


I don't actually remember the framework of the original all that well, but let's see here...

Could you go into the design decision behind making Commanding Presence not working if polymorphed?

Tactical Strike: I like this one a lot. It's like Spell Combat, but for helping your allies out. Since you're your own ally, you could affect yourself with this too? How many times can this be used per round? If it's more than once, then I have some concerns about it. Namely giving 70 billion bonuses from aid another and aid-another-altering tactics on a full-attack. I can see an argument for how it doesn't work on a full-attack, but I don't see the phrase "Attack Action" anywhere, so I don't think that's the case.

At the Ready: I don't think I've seen this before, so that's pretty awesome.

Cunning Grace seems like it's a bit better than just about any other of these. Ok, maybe Cunning Maneuvers is good too. Well, a lot of the Cunning ones are.

Cunning Response: Ok...that's something I haven't seen much before. I'm not sure how useful it is, but little red flags popped up.

Targeting Shot: A bit apprehensive about this due to the power of archery already. Ensuring they can hit means they can deadly aim to their heart's content. It might be OK since you're giving up your action for the most part as tactical strike probably won't help ranged characters too much.

Lingering Speech: Little red flags. How many tactics / speeches can be active on a guy at a given time?

A number of questions too:

If I give a Direct Order (aka: ranged aid another) to an ally and choose to give the Words of Battle I speech, the ally gets +2 to whatever I aided him with and a +10 foot enhancement bonus to his base movement on a charge, right?

Words of Courage...I could see the Con bonus killing someone accidentally when it goes away.

Words of Terror: I presume I don't have to aid another an enemy to use this, right? But do I have to aid another an ally? Or is this just a standard action ability that could be its own ability, but still uses the same pool of uses?

Direct Order is a bit weird. You get it at 1st level, but you get the aid another portion at 2nd level? How do I give the speeches if I don't have the ranged aid-another?

Teamwork Order: Lasts for one round, right? That limits its usefulness by a bit, I feel.

What I do remember after reading the first take was thinking "Oh boy, this could use some work and my review won't be so good." But I'm not thinking that anymore, at least after my quick read through. I think it has a better defined niche now, and compared to the War Master is more focused on "tactics" as well as being a bit more attack oriented. Of course, I don't have the reviewer's eye that EZG has, and I look forward to reading an updated review of his, if he does one.


Quick revision to pdf just now. On to the questions :)

Q&A with Cheapy:

Could you go into the design decision behind making Commanding Presence not working if polymorphed? --- Not all allies maybe aware of the bear(polymorphed commander) giving a commanding presence. Why would a bear do that? :-) So we felt the need to cancel that.

Tactical Strike: Fixed to standard action as it should be. Since aid another is a standard action. Leader of men capstone allows for a full round attack.

At the Ready: ------ We liked that one too.

Cunning Grace seems like it's a bit better than just about any other of these. Ok, maybe Cunning Maneuvers is good too. Well, a lot of the Cunning ones are. ----- There are a few of them. We ran out of cleaver names.

Cunning Response:----- It was primarily put in as a tactic and not as a feat, so the use of Battle Cry could be used more than once a round. Our in house testers felt it would be a bit much to hand it out as a feat, so we kept it class specific.
Targeting Shot: We felt this one was okay. And proved to go well in the local LGS test. You are helping them concentrate to hit their mark at the sacrifice of you effort.

Lingering Speech: This should only apply to Speeches. This has been fixed. Similar to bardic performance lingering speech feat.

If I give a Direct Order (aka: ranged aid another) to an ally and choose to give the Words of Battle I speech, the ally gets +2 to whatever I aided him with and a +10 foot enhancement bonus to his base movement on a charge, right? ------ Clarified in new doc. Speeches are slightly different from a direct order. Direct orders is ranged aid another, while speeches are ability buffs that can be done from afar while using rules of direct order. So no. You would only get +10 foot.

Words of Courage...I could see the Con bonus killing someone accidentally when it goes away. ----- A good commander will know when to issue a good order :)

Words of Terror: I presume I don't have to aid another an enemy to use this, right? But do I have to aid another an ally? Or is this just a standard action ability that could be its own ability, but still uses the same pool of uses? ------ we have quickly clarified this. He must perform a direct order roll to deliver this speech, but no ally gains the benefit of aid another.

Direct Order is a bit weird. You get it at 1st level, but you get the aid another portion at 2nd level? How do I give the speeches if I don't have the ranged aid-another? -----this was missed in final editing. After Christina edited C&C, we did a little rearranging and this was missed on my edit. This has been fixed.

Teamwork Order: Lasts for one round, right? That limits its usefulness by a bit, I feel. --- Yes because it is an aid another action substitute which are still aid another actions. True it is limited, but the commander can reissue it again next turn. We felt it could get a bit crazy.

What I do remember after reading the first take was thinking "Oh boy, this could use some work and my review won't be so good." But I'm not thinking that anymore, at least after my quick read through. I think it has a better defined niche now, and compared to the War Master is more focused on "tactics" as well as being a bit more attack oriented. Of course, I don't have the reviewer's eye that EZG has, and I look forward to reading an updated review of his, if he does one. -------- Woohoo! We do too. I always hold my breath waiting for EZG to review. The man knows his stuff! Yes, he should have received an updated copy.


And revised my review here, on DTRPG and sent it to GMS magazine. Also posted it on d20pfsrd.com's shop since my review barely managed to come in below their word-limit.

Also, from my review I gather that Will's feedback was already incorporated in my version - great feedback as always from one of the talented crunch-designers out there.

Great job with the revision!


Wow. 4.5 rounded to 4. I will let the writers know if they haven’t already seen it.

Thank you as always for the review End!


If the feats were slightly more ingenious, if there were slightly more class options, I would have went 5- overall a great revision! :)

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